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Author Topic: Marantz 671 in the field...  (Read 35326 times)

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Offline Nick's Picks

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Marantz 671 in the field...
« on: October 25, 2005, 08:05:25 AM »
hey now...
ok, i've had a chance to use it, and get a feel for its layout and operations.  a couple of quick observations.

1.  best LCD level meeters i've ever seen.  not only are the segmens off or on, there or not...but they are also light and dark...like a segment can be very BOLD, and then fade away w/the transiant.  and you can witness what you hear.  its very cool.  Also there is a floating peak hold (for a second) and a numeric value peak that you can reset.  very similar to a dap1 function wise, but these are better.  the blue/gray backlight is soooo visiable from a distance.  very high contrast. 

2.  menu is a little overly complicated, but a little time w/the manual and getting all of your presets customized and then you are all set.  its not bad...but not as easy as the R4.

3.  the removable plate is great.  all hardware swtiches for things like attenuation, roll off..etc, can be set and then secured so no stupid "ID" mistakes can be made.

overall, my 24/44.1 pull of STS9 (on archive...link in kickdown section) is very nice.   Though...the m248 front end I was using doesn't sound as enveloping as the ACM 660 did to my ears.  Makes me even hornier for the mod to materialize for this thing...and the caps we are waiting on are even better than what Doug uses in the 660, so it should be unbelievable.

I definately like it thus far.  more so than the FR2 ...simply for the single gain controll.  I did not like the Fostex double gain action.  not nearly as user friendly as the V2/3's trim pots just because they are located on different places on the box.

And...its not that big.  Smallest "all in one" box i've seen...other than the SD units and 660.  Much smaller than the R4/FR2. 
if you can stealth a DAP1, then you can smuggle this in easy. 


FWIW...the only CF card I have used in it is the Kingston Elite 45x.  I will be trying the DE, but expect it will fail as it did w/the 660.  I also plan to pick up a microdrive...since they are cheap.  and i'll be goofing w/it to see how much resolution it can handle before heat kills it.
the 660 worked w/the Kingston, SanDisc and Hitachi/ibm Micros.
« Last Edit: October 25, 2005, 08:08:13 AM by Nick's Picks »
LMA recordings and what-not


Live music: hauling around a Marshall stack whose output will get squeezed through a single SM57, then mangled by a Guinness-soaked mixer and shoved through suspicious-smelling power amps into a pair of grungy cabinets whose best days were before they left the factory, all of which are under the control of an engineer who would much rather be at home watching television.

Offline Chuck

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Re: Marantz 671 in the field...
« Reply #1 on: October 25, 2005, 01:12:14 PM »
Thanks for the info and +T Nick.

Just as I was thinking... the ACM 660 wouldn't be so bad... you come along with my reason to wait...
Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one.

Microphones: (2) Microtech Gefell M300, (2) AKG C 480 B comb-ULS/ CK 61/ CK 63, (2) CAD GXL1200 (cardioid and sub-cardioid capsule & electronics mod), (2) Audix M1290-o, (2) Micro capsule active cables w/ Naiant PFA's, (2) Naiant MSH-1O, (2) Naiant AKG Active cables, (2) Church CA-11 (cardioid), (2) CAD C9, (1) Nady SCM-1000 (mod)
Pre-amps: Naiant littlekit v2.0, BM2p+ Edirol UA-5, Church STC-9000
Recorders: Tascam DR-680, iRiver iHP-120 (Rockboxed & RTC mod), Denon DTR-80p

Recordings on the LMA: http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/ChuckM
Recording website & blog: http://www.timebetweenthenotes.com

Offline RDunn

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Re: Marantz 671 in the field...
« Reply #2 on: October 25, 2005, 03:08:11 PM »
I've now used my "stock" 671 twice at shows (Allman Brothers 9-30-05 & Railroad Earth 10-14-05) and was very happy with the recordings.... and at how easy it is to use in the field.  In both cases I ran Schoeps MK4 > KC5 > CMC6 > Lunatec V3 > 671 @ 24/48.  Since the V3 was on loan from a buddy, the next run of shows I'll be using the same mics with a Lunatec V2 and using the line in on the 671.  I'll report back with more info after the Project Object show on 11-1.

One other thing I use my 671 for is to transfer DAT tapes to CD.  This is SO much easier than dealing with a Windoze box for recording.

RD

PS There's a bit torrent still running for the RRE show if anyone wants to check out the recording....
http://bt.etree.org/details.php?id=18955
Schoeps MK4 > KC5 > CMC6 > Sound Devices 744T

Offline F.O.Bean

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Re: Marantz 671 in the field...
« Reply #3 on: October 25, 2005, 04:45:42 PM »
Im def wanting this thing BADLY, looks like the perfect back end to my v3 ;D

I can sell my hosa boxes and move on to the pmd-671 for dat transferring as well, since i was going DAT>Hosa OLD-276 > JB3

nicks review above cemented the deal

come on tax time!
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Offline esteyes

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Re: Marantz 671 in the field...
« Reply #4 on: October 25, 2005, 07:14:43 PM »
well i am convinced that the 24 bit is worth it. as for listening, i use AudioDVDCreator to burn 24bit to dvd that is listenable on d*mn near any dvd player. $40 program and it works nicely (altho i think you need nero to burn). i have been in pro audio, installed high end car audio, as well as spending 8+years in charge of amp and processor development at DEI. i run a pair of $6.5k Mirage speakers powered by Adcom monoblocks 1000+ watts each and have access to Krell, Crown, my old Macintosh tube 275's, and a multitude of other amps. i strill have a very nice turnatble plus records as well as multiple DAT (6) and Beta-PCM (sony/nakamichi), still have my Nak CR7A cassette deck as well as a few RxR decks. all working and used weekly.

_my_biggest limitation is that i am running older sennheisers (K3U preamp + all the caps: MKE-2's, ME20's, ME40's, ME80's, as well as the LONG guns the ME88's) that do not have the upper frequency response like the AKG 460's that i have (unfortunately i have the CK8X extended bass response short shotguns and only one CK61 card cap). STILL, despite all the years of loud sound and the limitations of the mics, i like the 24bit versions of what i have recorded. i can compare the M1 16bit DAT that is patched into the 671, but i know that is an unfair comparison as it is just using the 671 A>D and then truncating the 671 digi-out. you would have to do the switcheroo thing between sets or something.

neil in san marcos

i am off to Mule tonight, but since they are only doing a single set, i am reluctant to do a mid set word length switcheroo in order to do an A/B comparison tomorrow - just too d*mn lazy...
Neil Sturtevant
San Marcos, CA
AKG 451's + CK1/CK8/CK9
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Offline Chuck

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Re: Marantz 671 in the field...
« Reply #5 on: October 25, 2005, 08:47:31 PM »
If you did two recordings, with the same exact gear, one 24/96 and one 16/44.1, then dithered the 24/96 down to 16/44.1. Which would sound better? The recording that was originally made in 16 bit? Or the one dithered to 16 bit?

This will be important when 24 bit recordings are the norm. If recordings originally made at 16 bit sound better then 24 bit recordings that are dithered, 16 bit will continue to thrive until 16 bit CD's are displaced by the next audio format.
Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one.

Microphones: (2) Microtech Gefell M300, (2) AKG C 480 B comb-ULS/ CK 61/ CK 63, (2) CAD GXL1200 (cardioid and sub-cardioid capsule & electronics mod), (2) Audix M1290-o, (2) Micro capsule active cables w/ Naiant PFA's, (2) Naiant MSH-1O, (2) Naiant AKG Active cables, (2) Church CA-11 (cardioid), (2) CAD C9, (1) Nady SCM-1000 (mod)
Pre-amps: Naiant littlekit v2.0, BM2p+ Edirol UA-5, Church STC-9000
Recorders: Tascam DR-680, iRiver iHP-120 (Rockboxed & RTC mod), Denon DTR-80p

Recordings on the LMA: http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/ChuckM
Recording website & blog: http://www.timebetweenthenotes.com

Offline F.O.Bean

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Re: Marantz 671 in the field...
« Reply #6 on: October 25, 2005, 08:56:37 PM »
i would bet the 'live' recording would sound better, but who knows, i think it all sounds good

nickspicks-didnt you say that these can be powered via 9.6v as well as 12v ???

NIMH packs will prolly be what i use, either 9.2v or 12v, that still means that i have to sell all of my 7.2v packs, 12 x 3000mah packs tho :'(
Schoeps MK4's & MK41's ->
Schoeps | NBob 250/05 KCY's ->
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DarkTrain Right Angle Stubby XLR's ->
Tascam DR-70D's ->
128gb & 64gb SanDisk Extreme Pro SD Cards

FiiO E10K DAC/HP Amp & E11K HP Amp ->
Sony MDR-7506 Cans & SA-VA15 Speakers | Monster iSport Victory Earbuds

http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/diskobean | http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/Bean420 | http://bt.etree.org/mytorrents.php

Offline thegreatgumbino

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Re: Marantz 671 in the field...
« Reply #7 on: October 25, 2005, 08:59:02 PM »
If you did two recordings, with the same exact gear, one 24/96 and one 16/44.1, then dithered the 24/96 down to 16/44.1. Which would sound better? The recording that was originally made in 16 bit? Or the one dithered to 16 bit?

This will be important when 24 bit recordings are the norm. If recordings originally made at 16 bit sound better then 24 bit recordings that are dithered, 16 bit will continue to thrive until 16 bit CD's are displaced by the next audio format.

Damn good question!  I'll bet Skalinder and Nick have some thoughts on this.  Knowing Skalinder, he's probably already run the comps to very as well!   :laugh:
It’s not what you look like when you’re doin’ what you’re doin’, it’s what your doin’ when you’re doin’ what you look like your doin’…express yourself. - Charles Wright

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Offline it-goes-to-eleven

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Re: Marantz 671 in the field...
« Reply #8 on: October 25, 2005, 09:35:17 PM »
Keep in mind that many 24 bit A/Ds are dithering in order to produce 16 bit output. The V3 uses ANSR dithering. The Minime UV22HR.

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Offline F.O.Bean

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Re: Marantz 671 in the field...
« Reply #9 on: October 25, 2005, 09:37:33 PM »
Keep in mind that many 24 bit A/Ds are dithering in order to produce 16 bit output. The V3 uses ANSR dithering. The Minime UV22HR.


for sure, but dont you think a 'live' dither would be better? granted, you could use the UV22HR after the recording in wavelab4/5, i dunno, def an interesting question
Schoeps MK4's & MK41's ->
Schoeps | NBob 250/05 KCY's ->
Schoeps VMS02IB | Naiant +60v PFA's ->
DarkTrain Right Angle Stubby XLR's ->
Tascam DR-70D's ->
128gb & 64gb SanDisk Extreme Pro SD Cards

FiiO E10K DAC/HP Amp & E11K HP Amp ->
Sony MDR-7506 Cans & SA-VA15 Speakers | Monster iSport Victory Earbuds

http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/diskobean | http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/Bean420 | http://bt.etree.org/mytorrents.php

Offline Brian Skalinder

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Re: Marantz 671 in the field...
« Reply #10 on: October 25, 2005, 09:47:59 PM »
I'll bet Skalinder and Nick have some thoughts on this.  Knowing Skalinder, he's probably already run the comps to very as well!   :laugh:

If I can find a "spare" V3 one of these days, I would like to run a 24-bit v. 16-bit comparison of just the V3, and then also compare ANSR v. the algos used in the dither comp.

As for live dither/resampling v. post, without any testing, I'm gonna go with...both.  If you're dithering only and not resampling in post, I'll say live because you're doing less destructive processing.  Then again, dithering in post allows you to select you preferred dither algo.  Benefits to both sides, I think.  And I'm sorry to say I've never tested.  Curious on anyone else's thoughts, as mine are purely hypothetical.

Offline MattD

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Re: Marantz 671 in the field...
« Reply #11 on: October 25, 2005, 09:51:36 PM »
I'd guess it depends on how the computational dithering is implemented. One advantage doing it in post has is that the algorithm could incorporate some kind of look-ahead mechanism.
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Offline TenoRichards

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Re: Marantz 671 in the field...
« Reply #12 on: October 26, 2005, 02:11:43 AM »
Ok, I'm set to order. (BTW, y'all are right, Doug is very cool. Not a lot of interaction so far, but what I have gotten from him in recc's has been personable and professional, not to mention knowlegable).

I thought I would make an invitation for one of your guys on the East Coast to help me out AND benefit yourself, if you are considering getting one of these units. I live in Berlin, and already have a person who will be my intermediary, but thought it might benefit someone here. What I'm looking for is help to get it thru customs as a "used" item. My timeline is:

I'll order late today (Wed)
Doug Ships on Thur
You play w/ it for weekend.
I'd LIKE to have it by Wednesday a.m. in Berlin, but could live w/out it until Friday 11/4

Again, this is a stock pmd671, for which I will run my mic2496 into until it will be +modded in December when Doug starts to mod these items.

Any takers? email me your address (preferably eastcoast , due to time contraints) asap at TenorichardsATyahooDOTcom
dpa 4060's>BBox>acm modded pmd671 or Edirol r-09
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Offline noahbickart

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Re: Marantz 671 in the field...
« Reply #13 on: October 26, 2005, 04:13:02 AM »
If you did two recordings, with the same exact gear, one 24/96 and one 16/44.1, then dithered the 24/96 down to 16/44.1. Which would sound better? The recording that was originally made in 16 bit? Or the one dithered to 16 bit?

This will be important when 24 bit recordings are the norm. If recordings originally made at 16 bit sound better then 24 bit recordings that are dithered, 16 bit will continue to thrive until 16 bit CD's are displaced by the next audio format.

The conventional pro-audio (and Taper) wisdom is that a dithered version preserves the quality of the high bit rate source better than simple truncation. However there was a recent artice in Stereophile (http://stereophile.com/features/705dither/) that seems to sugest that the oposite can also be true. I have a feeling that the answer will vary depending on Mics, Position, Room, etc.

I know Scott Gordon has a prefered dither algorithm for each of the mk caps, perhaps he can comment.

-Noah
Recording:
Capsules: Schoeps mk41v, mk4v, mk22, mk3 & mk8
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Offline Nick's Picks

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Re: Marantz 671 in the field...
« Reply #14 on: October 26, 2005, 07:36:14 AM »
well.....

there is a lot here to ponder.
there is what i call "good 16bit" and not so good.  same for 24bit .
i'll take good 16bit over run of the mill 24.

all things being equal, then i like 24bit.

mastering "live" 16bit vs. dithering...as mentioned many of our favorite a/ds are doing a dither on the fly as they are full time 24bit devices.

then you have the "upsample" on playback issue.  a good sounding upsampling system can render 16bit audio *almost* identicle to 24bit.  I could not tell the difference some times, but could others.
I've proven to myself w/my stereo that raw 24bit sounds the best.  so thats why I went w/the 671.
LMA recordings and what-not


Live music: hauling around a Marshall stack whose output will get squeezed through a single SM57, then mangled by a Guinness-soaked mixer and shoved through suspicious-smelling power amps into a pair of grungy cabinets whose best days were before they left the factory, all of which are under the control of an engineer who would much rather be at home watching television.

 

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