Topic: Rode NT4?

[Javier Cinakowski]

Here is what I have been able to gather. (Note: NT4, NT6, NT5 and NT55 all share the same capsules)

The rode NT5 were originally manufactured at 797audio in China.  In the last decade Rode has been manufacting all of their mics (so they claim) in their own factory in Austrailia.

As you may know, Studio Projects is manufactured at 797audio and the similarity between the C4 and NT5 is remarkable when you have them side by side.

The C4 and NT5 capsules are nearly identical by looking at them.  Internally they are not the same as they have significantly different frequency response and sound.

I have treid every combination of these two microphones.  C4 caps on NT5 body, NT5 caps on C4 body.  They all perform and function as if they were meant for each other.     

My favorite combination is the C4 hyper on the Rode body. 
The C4 card has a more pronounced presence peak making it a bit more ideal for distance recording compared to the Rode card.  The Rode omni is nothing short of amazing and was impressive enough I sold my C4 omni pair....

I now use all of the capsules with my Rode NT6 pair:

Rode Cards
SP C4 Cards
SP C4 Hypers
Rode Omnis 

[Javier Cinakowski]

Even though the C4 hyper happens to work for the NT4, it isn't the best option.  XY with hypers can't be much better than XY with cards for concert taping....

There are some nice Mid-Side mics you could score used that would better fit taping shows....

[DSatz]

> XY with hypers can't be much better than XY with cards for concert taping....

Begging your pardon, but you should definitely try it before passing judgement. Especially when the angle between capsules is 90 degrees for both patterns, as it would be with the Røde NT 4, there's quite a considerable difference.

--best regards

[moooose]

thank you !

[page]

Begging your pardon, but you should definitely try it before passing judgement. Especially when the angle between capsules is 90 degrees for both patterns, as it would be with the Røde NT 4, there's quite a considerable difference.

--best regards

Especially since the angle is fixed, having that tighter pattern yeilds more stereo seperation (for better or worse).

[Javier Cinakowski]

No pardon nessesary, I've been down the path of xy hypers....

I do respect the option of using a hyper xy/90 in favor of a card, I even suggested using the C4 hyper. I just don't think either of them are ideal...

Many of us respect Mr. Williams "StereoPhonic Zoom," and I assume we can use his theory as an evaluation guideline?
Lets also assume that concert recording from a distance would render a typical SRA of ±30-50. Every venue I tape at has less than a ±50 SRA (OTS or FOB). Obviously a higher recommended SRA would apply to stage lip or direct micing techniques...

A hyper XY@90°'s SRA of ±60 is certainly better than the ±90 of the card, but you could do much better with near-coincident pair....

Additionally, many cheaper hypercards have a weak bass response which can benefit from a wider spacing....

[SmokinJoe]

A friend of mine (WheresJerry) got an NT4 for his first mic.  He just isn't one of those people big on experimentation and wanted something "point and shoot".  Some people want to try different capsules and setup configurations... others don't.  Anyway, I've been quite impressed with his pulls from the NT4.  There is a particular show on the archive... http://www.archive.org/details/ratdog2007-08-11.ratdogvibes2007-08-11

Using the battery in the mic instead of phantom power makes the recorder batteries last longer... an important consideration for weekend festivals.  And FWIW, I have run it NT4 > R09 without an external preamp, and it works.  You can't do that with an LSD2.

[carpa]

So, if I understand well, the x-y 90 degrees confiuration of nt4 should work fine for a close miking, and hyper capsules on the same nt4 body would do best at a certain distance.
If it'so, how would you call it a riht distance for both situations? I.e., 1 mt or 1mt and half could be a close mikin for a piano, or there is a better position?
And, talkin about hyper, which is the minimum distance you advice?
thank you.
As I read here on TS there are sure other possibilities like Church audio mics. About these products I have a couple of questions: are they available only in USA or they can be ordered from Italy also?
Other question: I read they are great mikes for stealthing, thing which can be of primary importance for some people but not for me, as I record my own piano recitals. Given that I don't need the stealth option, how do they compare with NT4 in terms of sound performance and noise level (I've read that little mikes have more noise than biggger ones) for classical music? I specify that I perform classical music as I seee that here on TS most people tape loud rock shows, which is a different thing.
thank you for your replies.
c

[Javier Cinakowski]

The first part of your question can best be answered by reading this paper:
http://www.microphone-data.com/pdfs/Stereo%20zoom.pdf
It isn't really about the distance, it is more about the angle (typically the further away from the source you are the less angle there will be)

The second part of your question I will leave to someone else.....

[carpa]

Somebody in an italian forum said that not many people know that the microphone cable supplied with the rode nt4 which ends in a 1/8 stereo minijack has got resistors (I just report this but I don't know anything of this technical stuff) which contribute to loose a part of the signal.
What do you think about this? And what does it happen if one substitutes the cable?
c

[xpander]

You're talking about the pad.

Here Rob Danielson shows how to remove it:
http://www.uwm.edu/~type/audio-reports/Rode_NT-4_Cable_Mod/NT-4_CableMod-index.htm

Basically you get more sensitivity.

[Eigenklang]

I removed the resistors, that little mod is great for our little recorders.

Modded NT4 & D50 is a really nice combo - its not quite cheap but for my personal taste the entrance to the real world of recording.

[carpa]

Thank you for the link. In case I'll buy a Roden4 I'll have the mod done. But, as it is sort of a pad, wouldn't it prove convenient to leave the cable as it is and use another one, just to have a chance in case of situations in which the spl could be very very high?

Why, at your opinion, there is such a pad (and there is not in the balanced cable)?
thank you
c

[DSatz]

carpa, it makes sense that Røde would do this. Any device with a 1/8" mini-jack microphone input can safely be assumed to be a consumer item. There are several problems that typically come up when connecting professional microphones to consumer recording devices. I'm not using the words "professional" and "consumer" to indicate quality or value; as a practical matter the industry standards for those two types of equipment are separate, and equipment of the one type won't necessarily work with equipment of the other type without some amount of "translation." Pad resistors can be one useful form of "translation."

When connecting professional condenser microphones to consumer recording equipment, three problems must be considered: (a) professional microphones have balanced outputs while the inputs of consumer recording equipment are unbalanced; (b) professional condenser microphones require a form of external powering which by convention, is built into professional recording equipment (while if there's any powering built into consumer recording equipment, it's almost always an incompatible type of powering); and (c) professional condenser microphones can put out signal levels (voltages) that are too strong for consumer recording equipment. Consumer microphones generally put out lower voltage levels, sometimes only 1/20 or less of what professional condenser microphones may put out for the same sound levels.

When the input of a recording or amplifying device is confronted with higher signal voltages than it was designed to handle, the result can be a very nasty kind of distortion called "clipping." Turning down the record level control very often doesn't help when this occurs--the "clipping" (overload distortion) occurs in the very first active stage of the circuitry, before the level control has any say over the device's behavior. As a result, you end up just turning down the level at which you're recording a hopelessly distorted signal.

This all can be illustrated with numbers--the sensitivity and overload specifications of various pieces of equipment--but for now I'm just trying to explain what's basically going on. Anyway, the "pad" built into the cable reduces the likelihood of this type of overload, which is a fairly common problem when professional condenser microphones are used with consumer recording devices.

--best regards

[digifish_music]

Thank you for the link. In case I'll buy a Roden4 I'll have the mod done. But, as it is sort of a pad, wouldn't it prove convenient to leave the cable as it is and use another one, just to have a chance in case of situations in which the spl could be very very high?

Why, at your opinion, there is such a pad (and there is not in the balanced cable)?
thank you
c

I believe Rode have stopped padding their 1/8" connector cable, I had mine apart a couple of weeks ago to steal the XLR connector off it (to swap it with the bulkey XLR connector on the XLR-to-Stereo-XLR cable as it wouldn't fit in my blimp) and it was free of any resistors.

digifish