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Author Topic: Oddball microphone technique (OMT) - part 2  (Read 9580 times)

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Offline rocksuitcase

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Re: Oddball microphone technique (OMT) - part 2
« Reply #90 on: April 05, 2018, 06:08:30 PM »
But to emphasize GB's commentary- don't sweat the EQ stuff much, It's truly all to taste. And ALWAYS be judicious, less is more is generally the case with tonal balance EQ.
One thing To add on a tangent- I like to listen to the two channel "rough mix" 3 different ways before I decide if/how to EQ- over computer monitors using both Audacity and foobar2000, headphones, and in my car. So silly, but my car audio system is the most revealing of the three.
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Offline heathen

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Re: Oddball microphone technique (OMT) - part 2
« Reply #91 on: April 05, 2018, 06:32:34 PM »
One thing To add on a tangent- I like to listen to the two channel "rough mix" 3 different ways before I decide if/how to EQ- over computer monitors using both Audacity and foobar2000, headphones, and in my car. So silly, but my car audio system is the most revealing of the three.
I try to do that as well.  My primary headphones (Beyer DT880 600 ohm) are on the bright side, so if I rely just on them the end result can sound dull on any other system.  So, in this case, I made some rough mixes and compared them through my main rig (Monitor Audio Silver 10s, Simaudio Moon 240i).  In this case I wasn't comparing different EQs, but different ratios of omnis to AT cards.
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Offline kindms

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Re: Oddball microphone technique (OMT) - part 2
« Reply #92 on: April 05, 2018, 06:42:55 PM »
One thing To add on a tangent- I like to listen to the two channel "rough mix" 3 different ways before I decide if/how to EQ- over computer monitors using both Audacity and foobar2000, headphones, and in my car. So silly, but my car audio system is the most revealing of the three.
I try to do that as well.  My primary headphones (Beyer DT880 600 ohm) are on the bright side, so if I rely just on them the end result can sound dull on any other system.  So, in this case, I made some rough mixes and compared them through my main rig (Monitor Audio Silver 10s, Simaudio Moon 240i).  In this case I wasn't comparing different EQs, but different ratios of omnis to AT cards.

thats pretty much what i do. I fly by the seat of my pants if and i mean IF i do any EQ. I just go with what sounds right to me vs. any real concept or philosophy. You can tweak all day every day. I figure go with my gut and get it done.
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Offline Gutbucket

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Re: Oddball microphone technique (OMT) - part 2
« Reply #93 on: April 05, 2018, 07:32:22 PM »
I fly by the seat of my pants if and i mean IF i do any EQ. I just go with what sounds right to me vs. any real concept or philosophy. You can tweak all day every day. I figure go with my gut and get it done.

I do that then rationalize it and make long posts justifying to myself here.  ;)
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Offline heathen

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Re: Oddball microphone technique (OMT) - part 2
« Reply #94 on: May 15, 2018, 10:59:48 PM »
Nothing really groundbreaking here compared to other setups in this thread, but I think this effort came out okay. 

Here's a link to the setup: http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=151303.msg2264778#msg2264778

Here's a link to the recording: http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=186458.0

As always, input is very much appreciated.
Mics: Core Sound TetraMic | AT4031s | AT AE5100s | AT853s (C/SC) | Line Audio CM3s | DPA 4061s | CA-14 omnis | Studio Projects CS5
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Offline kuba e

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Re: Oddball microphone technique (OMT) - part 2
« Reply #95 on: May 17, 2018, 05:55:13 AM »
Thank you for recording and photos. It is sounding very good, I like it a lot. Please, do you have recordings from others to compare (single pair mics)?
« Last Edit: May 17, 2018, 05:57:52 AM by kuba e »

Offline heathen

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Re: Oddball microphone technique (OMT) - part 2
« Reply #96 on: May 17, 2018, 08:34:53 AM »
Thank you for recording and photos. It is sounding very good, I like it a lot. Please, do you have recordings from others to compare (single pair mics)?
If you mean others from the same show, there's this: https://archive.org/details/GarajMahal2018-05-11
Mics: Core Sound TetraMic | AT4031s | AT AE5100s | AT853s (C/SC) | Line Audio CM3s | DPA 4061s | CA-14 omnis | Studio Projects CS5
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Offline Gutbucket

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Re: Oddball microphone technique (OMT) - part 2
« Reply #97 on: May 17, 2018, 09:17:22 AM »
Thanks heathen, sounds good.  Interesting to compare the two recordings partly because they aren't a straight comp, made from quite different perspectives, one from out in the audience the other on stage, and also represent a quite different level of investment cost. The portrayal of the audience and room sound is quite different.  I don't have time to download and play with them today, but if I did it would be interesting to see how close I could get the two in terms of frequency response after some EQ adjustment.  That wouldn't effect differences in perspective, spatial balance, and mix balance, but is a good way to really understand the essence of the differences other than the spectral differences which strongly dominate any initial listening impression. 

musical volition > vibrations > voltages > numeric values > voltages > vibrations> virtual teleportation time-machine experience
Better recording made easy - >>Improved PAS table<< | Made excellent- >>click here to download the Oddball Microphone Technique illustrated PDF booklet<<

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Re: Oddball microphone technique (OMT) - part 2
« Reply #98 on: May 17, 2018, 09:45:24 AM »

^^
Thanks for sharing the links heathen!

I found the comparison of onstage DPA 4006a omnis vs onstage DPA 4015c wide-cards interesting too.  One recording was made on 5/10 and the other on 5/11.  Same band, same taper.  I was very surprised at how much more I liked the omni recording vs  the subcards.  It is a shame that for what we do the omnis often have to take the backseat to the directional mics to avoid all of the "extraneous noise" surrounding the performance.
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Offline Gutbucket

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Re: Oddball microphone technique (OMT) - part 2
« Reply #99 on: May 17, 2018, 12:00:08 PM »
I found the comparison of onstage DPA 4006a omnis vs onstage DPA 4015c wide-cards interesting too.  One recording was made on 5/10 and the other on 5/11.  Same band, same taper.  I was very surprised at how much more I liked the omni recording vs  the subcards.

Can you describe what it is you like so much more about the omni recording?
musical volition > vibrations > voltages > numeric values > voltages > vibrations> virtual teleportation time-machine experience
Better recording made easy - >>Improved PAS table<< | Made excellent- >>click here to download the Oddball Microphone Technique illustrated PDF booklet<<

Offline Gutbucket

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Re: Oddball microphone technique (OMT) - part 2
« Reply #100 on: May 17, 2018, 12:35:25 PM »
^ Thanks for pointing me to these recordings.  I don't have a strong preference for either of these two.  Both are nice - I find myself liking some things about one more than the other and vice-versa.  In general, I like the spatial depth, overall smoothness and solid bottom of the omnis, and like the more distinct imaging and up-front presentation of the subcards.  I say this from comparing the same numbers played both nights.  If forced to choose a favorite, I'd probably give the nod to the subcards.

It's exactly this kind of "wanting the best of both" that makes multi-microphone combinations like OMT attractive to me (among other reasons).  Sure, really good 2 channel stereo recordings can have a clean minimalist purity and beauty to them which cannot be matched via mic combination techniques, but will always be more of "take what you get, like it or not" kind of thing.
musical volition > vibrations > voltages > numeric values > voltages > vibrations> virtual teleportation time-machine experience
Better recording made easy - >>Improved PAS table<< | Made excellent- >>click here to download the Oddball Microphone Technique illustrated PDF booklet<<

Offline heathen

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Re: Oddball microphone technique (OMT) - part 2
« Reply #101 on: May 17, 2018, 01:01:01 PM »
FWIW I'm pretty sure Scott ran both omnis and subcards on 5/11.  I definitely remember seeing two pairs of mics on the stand.  I have no idea how to get in touch with him (met him for the first time that night), but maybe someone who does could cajole him into posting his other 5/11 recording for you guys...?
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Re: Oddball microphone technique (OMT) - part 2
« Reply #102 on: May 18, 2018, 01:35:55 PM »
Nothing really groundbreaking here compared to other setups in this thread, but I think this effort came out okay. 

Here's a link to the setup: http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=151303.msg2264778#msg2264778

Here's a link to the recording: http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=186458.0

As always, input is very much appreciated.
I listened to most of the LMA 5-11 recording this morning at work over cheap PC speakers. I liked the openness of tone and the balance of instruments seemed more distinct than I typically get out of these Logitechs.
Great job both recording and Post.
Thanks for sharing
« Last Edit: May 18, 2018, 01:37:50 PM by rocksuitcase »
music IS love

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Mics:         AKG460|CK61|CK1|CK3|CK8|Beyer M 201E
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Offline heathen

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Re: Oddball microphone technique (OMT) - part 2
« Reply #103 on: May 18, 2018, 02:04:43 PM »
Thanks, that means a lot to me.

To be honest, if I hadn't gone with XY on the center pair I might have scrapped the omnis entirely because of how much crowd noise the omnis picked up.  The XY pair on their own, though, was just too narrow of an image for my taste so I kept the omnis in the mix. 
Mics: Core Sound TetraMic | AT4031s | AT AE5100s | AT853s (C/SC) | Line Audio CM3s | DPA 4061s | CA-14 omnis | Studio Projects CS5
Pre: CA9200
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Offline Gutbucket

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Re: Oddball microphone technique (OMT) - part 2
« Reply #104 on: May 18, 2018, 03:03:52 PM »
The XY pair on their own, though, was just too narrow of an image for my taste so I kept the omnis in the mix.

That's a good indication that you are doing OMT right!  Sort of like the inherent balance of a three leg stool.

I didn't listen to the entire recordings, but of what I did I prefered the portrayal of the audience reaction in yours.  More open, natural, less muffled, more spatially correct to my ear.  That's not necessarily with respect to the level balance of the audience, but at least for what I listened to the balance was in no way unacceptable.
musical volition > vibrations > voltages > numeric values > voltages > vibrations> virtual teleportation time-machine experience
Better recording made easy - >>Improved PAS table<< | Made excellent- >>click here to download the Oddball Microphone Technique illustrated PDF booklet<<

 

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