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Author Topic: Off-center setup/config for specific room  (Read 2876 times)

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Offline Gutbucket

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Re: Off-center setup/config for specific room
« Reply #15 on: January 16, 2018, 05:46:46 PM »
If this isn't a single recording event, but rather a place you plan to record somewhat regularly, I'd start by trying a few standard 2-channel setups in that position to see if one of them works to your satisfaction.  That will also help in figuring which direction to head from there if are all lacking.  Try a coincident setup, your generally prefered near-spaced setup, and spaced omnis if you can do that.  Use the "point the whole array at the auditory center  technique" for each of them, listen and compare.
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Offline Moke

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Re: Off-center setup/config for specific room
« Reply #16 on: January 16, 2018, 06:43:45 PM »
And to represent the scientific wild ass guess technique,....
https://archive.org/details/DaveAlvin2004-01-10_pasadena

Wide room, with wide PA. Stage is hard right to the front of room.  There was a PA on a stick at the hard right of stage, and another like 35' to the left (out of aural range). 
I wanted to capture some PA, but not all PA, as that would have made everything incredibly off balance.
So, I opted for this mashup of angles, like 45º on left mic, and right mic like 5º to the left as well. I think I explained it in the link.

And to add to that bit of mania, the producer did not want my presence up front with a mic stand. So, I ran a mic stand on this indoor arbor structure, that was over first row, and parallel to the stage. I strapped my mic stand on top of that arbor structure, and extended outwards towards the stage center.

clusterfuck?
it actually worked.
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Offline jefflester

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Re: Off-center setup/config for specific room
« Reply #17 on: January 16, 2018, 08:15:55 PM »

I would go with AB cards pointed straight at the stage left (right if facing the stage) PA speakers.

Alternately I would space cards around 25cm and point the right mic dead ahead at the stage left speaker and the other at the middle of the stage - so sort of a narrow angle DIN arrangement turned a little towards the middle of the room.
As an initial cut (and without getting all OMT), I'd go with one of these approaches. Probably the latter but with hypers instead of cards.

In this photo, I'd guess your taping position would likely be where there appears to be a video camera (red arrow). In front of the mix position (guy in grey t-shirt above everybody manning the board).

« Last Edit: January 16, 2018, 08:17:36 PM by jefflester »
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Offline heathen

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Re: Off-center setup/config for specific room
« Reply #18 on: January 16, 2018, 10:01:01 PM »
In this photo, I'd guess your taping position would likely be where there appears to be a video camera (red arrow). In front of the mix position (guy in grey t-shirt above everybody manning the board).
That's exactly right.
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Offline Cheesecadet

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Re: Off-center setup/config for specific room
« Reply #19 on: January 17, 2018, 09:11:58 AM »
https://archive.org/details/stevekimockandfriends2017-12-16.ecm19b.flac

Here is my recording from the other side last month. Mics at din in front of soundboard directly in line with stage left PA.

What show are you planning on recording?

Here is a stage plot drawing of how I was set up this night:

https://ia800100.us.archive.org/30/items/stevekimockandfriends2017-12-16.ecm19b.flac/stevekimockandfriends2017-12-16.ecm19b.pic03.jpg
« Last Edit: January 17, 2018, 09:24:43 AM by Cheesecadet »
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Offline heathen

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Re: Off-center setup/config for specific room
« Reply #20 on: January 17, 2018, 09:27:31 AM »
Thanks Cheese...that doesn't sound off-center like I would have expected!  Did you have the gain set to the same level for both channels?

I'm planning on doing Jazz is Phish this weekend.  (Hopefully a board patch will be available, but this is something I've been wondering about for a bit so I figured I'd start the thread anyway.)
Recordings on LMA: https://archive.org/search.php?query=taper%3A%22Lucas+Lorenz%22
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Offline Gutbucket

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Re: Off-center setup/config for specific room
« Reply #21 on: January 17, 2018, 09:59:52 AM »
Nice drawing!

Stereo image sounds well balanced Left/Right.
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Offline Jimna

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Re: Off-center setup/config for specific room
« Reply #22 on: January 17, 2018, 01:00:23 PM »
You don't have a choice, the SDB is the only safe place to setup and I think the venue will ask you to move if your out in the middle.  My best tapes there have been setup by the SBD, pulling two channels stage mics and 2 channels sbd. 
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Offline heathen

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Re: Off-center setup/config for specific room
« Reply #23 on: January 17, 2018, 01:06:27 PM »
My best tapes there have been setup by the SBD, pulling two channels stage mics and 2 channels sbd.
Did you use two different recorders for the on-stage mics and the sbd feed?
Recordings on LMA: https://archive.org/search.php?query=taper%3A%22Lucas+Lorenz%22
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Offline Jimna

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Re: Off-center setup/config for specific room
« Reply #24 on: January 17, 2018, 01:12:40 PM »
Nope, R4 or Dr680
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Re: Off-center setup/config for specific room
« Reply #25 on: January 17, 2018, 01:23:56 PM »
So did they let you hook your on-stage mics up to the lines that run from the stage to the sbd?
Recordings on LMA: https://archive.org/search.php?query=taper%3A%22Lucas+Lorenz%22
Mics: Core Sound TetraMic | AT4031s | AT AE5100s | AT853s (C/SC) | Line Audio CM3s | DPA 4061s | CA-14 omnis | Studio Projects CS5 Pre: CA9200 Decks: Zoom F8 | Roland R-05 | Tascam DR-2d

Offline Jimna

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Re: Off-center setup/config for specific room
« Reply #26 on: January 17, 2018, 01:28:06 PM »
No need and never asked, you run your own cables along the wall to the stage.  I took a set of 50' xlrs.
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Re: Off-center setup/config for specific room
« Reply #27 on: January 17, 2018, 01:35:06 PM »
Without wading through everyone else's responses another consideration, which I often request if I show up early enough, is to set mics up on stage and occupy a couple of empty house snake channels.  No need to schlep cables about since they are already run and it allows you to safely set up in the SBD cage and perhaps even politely ask for a board feed for a matrix.   :guitarist:

I have done this a couple of times but did this for the Pimps of Joytime years back.  I just set up the mics where I saw fit (OMT) and mixed it with the SBD later. 

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Offline Gutbucket

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Re: Off-center setup/config for specific room
« Reply #28 on: January 17, 2018, 01:46:28 PM »
Nice one!
musical volition > vibrations > voltages > numeric values > voltages > vibrations> virtual teleportation time-machine experience
Better recording made easy - >>Improved PAS table<< | Made excellent- >>click here to download the Oddball Microphone Technique illustrated PDF booklet<<

Offline DATBRAD

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Re: Off-center setup/config for specific room
« Reply #29 on: January 18, 2018, 08:54:34 AM »
When I'm in similar off center positions taping off a stereo (or 2 stack array) I use A/B and choose between cards and hypers based on distance. With both mics mounted parallel on the bar, 6" or so apart, I aim them at the center of the stage. By doing this both mics will get the same basic signal from primarily the closest stack. But, because of the slight time delay between the mics, there is just enough of a difference between channels to give a limited illusion of stereo, not ideal but better than just pointing directly at one stack, IMO.
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