Topic: Sony PCM-M10 audio recorder - NEW

[Artstar]

For sure the mics will be cut-down. I doubt preamp will be.

I'm going to speculate that it has been. Looking at the specs, signal to noise ratio is 87dB as opposed to 93dB and THD is 0.03% as opposed to 0.01%. That suggests the preamps have been downgraded somewhat or it's the same preamps but just the byproduct of miniaturisation.

The internal mics don't seem to report much on their frequency response beyond their upper and lower limits. It would be nice to see just how flat the curve is. Otherwise, in terms of SPL, the M10 seems to have the upper hand there with 123dB compared to the D50's 120dB.

Cross-memory recording.

Something which would have been nice with the D50 but I'm happily using an 8GB MS-HC in it so that's sorted that out for me.

2xAA batteries mean battery life will probably be less than the D50.

Perhaps but depending on how much current it consumes at its lower voltage compared to the D50, I doubt it would be anything significant to be quite honest. Running time is not proportional to voltage requirements but rather current requirements.

Anyway, I'm excited. Sounds like good value recorder for the masses.

It does look tempting but I'd need to probably test one out before I decide to dive in. If the sound is at least comparable to the MZ-RH1 I used to have, then it may wind up replacing my D50 after all since it's a good compromise between sound and size. Listening back to my RH1 recordings, the D50 has left me a little spoiled in that regard and I've preferred it over my old RH1 in a big way. Otherwise, I'll persist with wearing long thick material shirts to hide the massive lump on my belt!

[illconditioned]

^^ should be interesting to hear the M10.  If it is anything close to the D50, it will be a great portable.  I'll probably end up with both, the D50 for planned music recording, and the M10 to keep in my bag for impromptu recording.  I think anything equal to or better than minidisc is fine.  After that the limiting factor is the mics.

 Richard

[fmaderjr]

Listening back to my RH1 recordings, the D50 has left me a little spoiled in that regard and I've preferred it over my old RH1 in a big way.

Everyone's ears are different, but I know I wouldn't be able to tell the difference. The RH1 sounds fabulous (even in Hi-SP mode). I'd still like to get a D50 sometime for it's features and battery life (and no Sonic Stage), but I wouldn't be expecting to hear any difference in sound, let alone a big one. When done right my RH1 recordings sound as good as my Korg MR-1/MixPre ones.

I think anything equal to or better than minidisc is fine.  After that the limiting factor is the mics.

I'm with Richard.

[SClassical]

If we are planning to use external preamp and mics the only thing to worry about the quality of the A/D converter?

From my understanding the only time to worry about the preamp quality is when you plug in basic mic that has a 3.5" connector into the mic-in jack. If running professional mics (that uses XLR and runs on P48) with an external preamp into the line-in of the D10 all we need is the good A/D. If you're not adjusting the mic level on the D10 you don't really care about a noisy internal preamp. Correct me if I'm wrong.

[Todd R]

You're wrong -- just kidding.

Maybe it is just semantics about what you mean that it just needs to have a good A/D stage, but even going line-in, the recorder will have some type of analog circuitry (e.g., op amps) to get the line input level to the correct level for the A/D converter chip to use.  That analog circuitry as well as the A/D chip itself can affect the signal quality.

The external preamp you're talking about using would probably have a greater effect on your resulting recording, but you'd still want to have a good analog front end, as well as A/D conversion, inside the M10.

That said, I think the analog front end and particularly the line-in is very good on the D50, so I think it works great with an external preamp, which is how I use mine.  Hopefully the M10 will have an analog front end that is on par with the D50.

[prof_peabody]

Looks interesting.

[mloewen]

OK  I went ahead and preordered my M-10. I was gonna hold off but I couldn't wait.

[koops]

Anyone know if the digital limiter is the same one as in the PCM D50?  Also, are there any audio samples on the web at all?  I've had the fortune to use a few portable recorders in the past (Microtrack, R1, H4, H2, R09), mainly for on-location recording, and the lack of a decent limiter is my main issue.  If the mics are as good as these other recorders and the limiter is taken from the D50, I'm definately gonna get one.

[dogmusic]

Now available: PCM-M10 microphone frequency response. The pdf is attached below.

Looks like there's a choice of microphone angles.

Here is the site:

http://pro.sony.com/bbsc/ssr/cat-audio/cat-recorders/product-PCMM10%2FB/

[tekdroid]

Looks like there's a choice of microphone angles.

Ah, so those mini-domes are movable.
Great news.

[Kevin T]

Are they ? or did they just re angle the whole unit ?

[JasonSobel]

Looks like there's a choice of microphone angles.

Ah, so those mini-domes are movable.
Great news.

Are they ? or did they just re angle the whole unit ?

are you guys interpreting the 0 degrees, 90 degrees, and 180 degree lines on the frequency chart to mean that the mics are moveable?  I don't think that is what it's saying at all.  The graph is just showing the frequency response for sound coming from different angles.  based on the graph, it looks like the internal mics are mostly omni in the lower frequencies, but much more directional (cardiod?) in the upper frequencies.

[su6oxone]

are you guys interpreting the 0 degrees, 90 degrees, and 180 degree lines on the frequency chart to mean that the mics are moveable?  I don't think that is what it's saying at all.  The graph is just showing the frequency response for sound coming from different angles.  based on the graph, it looks like the internal mics are mostly omni in the lower frequencies, but much more directional (cardiod?) in the upper frequencies.

I think you're right, the description says the mics are omnis and so it wouldn't make much sense to have them 'swivelable.'

[aaronji]

are you guys interpreting the 0 degrees, 90 degrees, and 180 degree lines on the frequency chart to mean that the mics are moveable?  I don't think that is what it's saying at all.  The graph is just showing the frequency response for sound coming from different angles.  based on the graph, it looks like the internal mics are mostly omni in the lower frequencies, but much more directional (cardiod?) in the upper frequencies.

It says on the Sony site that the mics are omnidirectional...I figured that the decreased response at the higher frequencies was a result of the recorder's relatively large body blocking higher frequencies off-axis.  I read somewhere (not sure where, though) that a perfect omni would have an infinitesimally small diameter, and that, as the diameter increases, the frequency at which off-axis sound is rolled-off decreases.  It looks from the photos like the mics don't face straight ahead, so even 0 degrees is essentially off-axis.  That would explain the graph, assuming I am not missing something!

[mloewen]

Guitar center now says for preorder due in stock  10/15/2009