Topic: What do you use as a DAC?

[nedstruzz]

Checking to see what others use to go from their DAW via firewire or USB to their system/speakers? 

[Nick's Picks]

in my DAW...
I use a turtle beach audio-advantage micro USB thumb "sound card" that outputs a toslink (16bit ony, and it resamples at that) > Edirol MA-15D digital powered monitors.  the DAC in those speakers is "eh", but much better than running line out from the sound card.

For my needs, it is completely "good enough".  I might at some point upgrade the sound card to something a little better and 24bit.  I keep telling myself that I should get new monitors, but then I listen to them and am so impressed by what they do (and for how little I paid on eBay for them) that I dont think it a wise investment...right now.

In the big system, which streams from the network and can also act as my "workstation" if needed (and sometimes I do use this) is a Perpetual Technologies P1 digital correction engine (DSP, upsample, downsample, raw..etc) > P3 DAC (24/192).  I chose this particular unit based on 3 factors.
1. excellent reviews
2. "future uprade" to DSD input via proprietary DIN input.  i'm sure it will never be used..., but the idea  that the DACs chips are based on DSD and not solely PCM is a plus in my book.
3. the stupidly cheap price that I was able to obtain this kit for.

can't complain.
If I were to "do it right" , I'd get myself an Apogee Mini-DAC w/USB input and powered monitors.  That would be reference qual. for the DAW, IMO.

[twatts (pants are so over-rated...)]

I've been doing some searching around for a USB DAC.  Here are a few things I've found:

http://www.audiophileproducts.com/fubar2  (16/48)
http://www.cryo-parts.com/usb_dac.html  (24/192)

But this is my dream machine:  http://www.benchmarkmedia.com/dac1pre/

Terry

[muj]

studio: lavry blue

home pc: kingrex ud-01 and psu

[TNJazz]

Tascam DM4800 via Firewire at the moment.

[audBall]

I've had the mytek stereo96 for about 2 years now and have absolutely no future plans of switching it out.  It has no problems "telling it like it is".  Lots of input options (on the 'newest' revision).

The headphone amp is nice too.

[OFOTD]

I've had the mytek stereo96 for about 2 years now and have absolutely no future plans of switching it out.  It has no problems "telling it like it is".  Lots of input options (on the 'newest' revision).

The headphone amp is nice too.

Amen!    I tried out a few different DAC's before I bought my Mytek.  Without doubt one of the best taping related purchases i've made in a while.  Had mine for less than a year now and can't imagine ever having or needing to switch.

[nedstruzz]

Great response guys thank you!!

So in terms of two channels via firewire or USB it looks like people prefer the Apogee ADC or the Benchmark.  For the extra $500 for the Benchmark what more are you getting than from the Apogee?  Just a different sound?

I wish Mytek had a firewire or USB version? 

[audBall]

I wish Mytek had a firewire or USB version? 

I got to typing before I read your post fully.  There is not a Mytek version that accepts FW/USB that I know of. 

[fozzy]

not firewire or USB but i use the following

Office: generic pci card w/ spidif out > coax > Lucid DA9624 > AKG K240

Just putting this together at the moment
Home: Audiophile 2496 PCI > coax > Benchmark DAC1 > AKG K701
Home: Audiophile 2496 PCI > coax > Benchmark DAC1 > PS Audio HCA2 > B&W 600S3

[Nick's Picks]

I"ve had the benchmark and the Apogee.
they are both awesome...and complete "chocolate vs. vanilla".  I like the Apogee overall a bit better as it offered more resolution and transparency.
the Benchmark has a slight coloration to it...in a very musical way.

[nedstruzz]

Cool, good to know!  Thanks Nick!

I think I like the Apogee a bit better as it now has a firewire interface and will allow direct connection of any digital device right to the DAW.  This way I can use it as an ADC but also to transfer old DAT's direct to the computer.  Plus at $500 less its a great price. 

[Jhurlbs81]

..also looking to upgrade my DAC.  I am also looking at the apogee, benchmark and mytek.  Leaning towards the apogee right now myself.  I can feed it an optical toslink from my iMac right?

Thanks
Jesse

[nedstruzz]

I can feed it an optical toslink from my iMac right?
Thanks
Jesse

It does have an optical input but Apogee told me that Firewire or AES would create the least amount of jitter issues. So far it looks like B&H has the best price at $895, all else seem to be at $985 or $1050. 

I've also been looking at the Apogee Rossetta AD/DA rack mount with Firewire.  There are a few on ebay now for under a grand. 

[Jhurlbs81]

It does have an optical input but Apogee told me that Firewire or AES would create the least amount of jitter issues. So far it looks like B&H has the best price at $895, all else seem to be at $985 or $1050. 

Can anyone else confirm this to be the case?  The non-FW version is much cheaper...

[twatts (pants are so over-rated...)]

Took me a while to remember this guys name...  http://www.scott-nixon.com/

Terry

[OFOTD]

If you don't need USB or FW please do yourselves a favor and at least look at the Mytek.   For me personally I felt that its sonic qualities were head and shoulders above the DAC1.  Really defined difference in sound for units that are at or near the same price point.  The Mytek can be found in the $900 - $1000 range.

I can't comment on the Apogee as I am not a fan of the Apogee sound like many others here are.   I do think that another one of the positives in the Mytek's favor is the outstanding quality of the headphone amp.    It has multiple connections as well other than USB/FW





EDIT TO ADD:

Here's a link to the Mytek listening tests.  Most all sample are in FLAC and available for download.     http://www.mytekdigital.com/compare/listening_tests.htm     The listening test includes comparisons to the Apogee PSX-100 as well as the Benchmark DAC1

[nedstruzz]

I think the non firewire is $800 so only $95 cheaper. 

Oh just found $715 at B&H

[StuStu]

I also highly recommend the Mytek.

[nedstruzz]

The Mytek sure sounds good.  If they had a firewire version I'd be sold. 

[audBall]

The Mytek sure sounds good.  Once I listen to one I'll be sold. 

fixed that for you 

[nedstruzz]

The Mytek sure sounds good.  Once I listen to one I'll be sold. 

fixed that for you 

Here's a link to the Mytek listening tests.  Most all sample are in FLAC and available for download.     http://www.mytekdigital.com/compare/listening_tests.htm     The listening test includes comparisons to the Apogee PSX-100 as well as the Benchmark DAC1

[carlbeck]

I have a Bel Canto DAC-1 right now & it is pretty good for the money, sounds natural & organic. I used to have a Benchmark & it was a great DAC/Pre but a little bright for my tastes. I also had a Electrocompaniet ECD-1 that was balls to the wall as close to analog as I have ever had but I sold it when I sold off my "big" system.

[Chilly Brioschi]

Like Mics and your Pre, I think that it's a matching game.

Benchmark DAC-1 > JoLida 502B > Mission M52s (sand filled and spiked) sound pretty good to me.
The same DAC/Amp into Von Schweikert VR-1s w/ a Velodyne SPL1200 can be bright with some sources.

Overall the Benchmark seems to bring the clarity, the JoLida the warmth and soundstage

[airbladder]

I use a Ray Samuels Audio Emmeline "The Predator".  It's USB and a good portable/headphone amp option.  I like using it with my laptop.  It's so small it can go any place my laptop and headphones go.   

[Gutbucket]

I've had the mytek stereo96 for about 2 years now and have absolutely no future plans of switching it out.  It has no problems "telling it like it is".  Lots of input options (on the 'newest' revision).

The headphone amp is nice too.

Does the headphone amp have enough current to properly drive Senn HD650s?   

I could use the little 24 bit USB>SPDIF converter out of the laptop. It currently feeds a Panasonic SA-XR55 and sounds amazingly good. Really love the Mytek samples I've heard.

[MattD]

Does the headphone amp have enough current to properly drive Senn HD650s?  

Absolutely. It works quite well with my HD600s.

[audBall]

^^ Yep, you should'nt have any problems driving the Senn's. 

from website:
Built-in 0.5A high current drive, hi-speed headphone amplifier

[Gutbucket]

Thx.
Very tempting, that Mytek DAC.

[jmz93]

I got curious after reading these posts, and started thinking about adding a DAC to the computer playback and also the regular stereo setup.  What I can't get straight in my head is the difference between oversampling DAC's (not to mention cd players) and NOS  or non-oversampling DAC's.  Why would you oversample something many many times, bumping the resulting sampling frequency up to 176K or 192K? What does that actually do to the sound, considering, for the sake of an example, a 44.1K CD-quality source?  What do all those extra 1'S and 0'S do to the resulting sound?

[MattD]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oversampling

The answer I remember from my signal processing class is the third one: oversampling improves S:N. That one is also probably the most applicable in a DAC.

[RebelRebel]

'There are a number of circumstances where oversampling may, in theory, provide benefits. One thing of note is that there is a significant difference in the accuracy of the math required to do synchronous sample rate conversion and asynchronous sample rate conversion. An example of synchronous sample rate conversion is the type used in modern AD and DA converters. The sample rate is “multiplied” by an integer amount 2, 4, 8, or 16 times the original frequency.Asynchronous sample rate conversion is used to go between two frequencies that are not an integer multiple of each other, and requires much more complex computing to do well. (like going from 96 to 44.1).Converter technology has evolved over time to the present day to utilizing a “low bit” converter (2-4 bits) operating at a very high sample rate, then “doing math” on the output to trade-off more bits for a lowert (output) sample rate. The result is an accuracy that cannot  be achieved with older converter technology that operates at the output sample rate, and eases the requirements for the input/output filters(unlike the implementation in earlier designs which caused undesirable side effects such as high-frequency roll-off and phase distortion) Asynchronous sample rate conversion is a convenient way to bypass the issue of “tying” two devices together that are communicating digital audio data, but if not done well can degrade the quality of the signal.  If done properly at the appropriate time, “oversampling” can actually help achieve audio quality that cannot be achieved by any other means.

[tapjunkie]

Cambridge just came out with a D/A that has USB for $450 and sells for $399.  I have seen it on line, but not heard it.

[J.T.L]

Mac > optical > Grace m901

[NOLAfishwater]

this forum had some unknown DACs

http://www.coemaudio.com.au/Sources/DACs/181/

[twatts (pants are so over-rated...)]

Depending on your usage, the SlimDevices can be perfect for you.  Its not USB, but uses Ethernet and software player.  BurrBrown DAC.  24/96.  And it can be had for pretty cheap.  Anybody try the Transporter???  I think for that money I'd go with a Mytek or Benchmark and put the rest into a Tube Amp...

Terry

[leehookem]

my Mytek just arrived

audiophile 2496 > Mytek Stereo 96 > Sony MDR-7506

[twatts (pants are so over-rated...)]

my Mytek just arrived

audiophile 2496 > Mytek Stereo 96 > Sony MDR-7506

Nice!!!  Congrats!

Terry

[leehookem]

thanks.  it makes a WORLD of difference. 

[NOLAfishwater]

Was looking for the Benchmark, but they don't last long on Gearslutz. So, I just picked up a LUCID DA9624 used. If I don't like it, I will sell it here in the YS.

[noahbickart]

Musical Fidelity x-24k found used on audiogon for ~$200

-Noah
Powerbook g4 (dedicated server)> Firewire Audiophile> MuFi X24k> SonoSilence One Passive Pre> Marantz MA500 monoblocks> JMLab Tantal 507 + BIC Sub.

[bobbygeeWOW]

FWIW,

I use a Bel Canto 1.1 (or is a 1.0..?) fed from a Squeezebox spdif output that I'm very happy with.

A friend runs a Transporter, and I must say does sound good.
When A/B'ed with Mytec the other night via transporter's digi out, we all agreed the Mytec certainly sounded better, though I wouldn't attempt to quantify that observation.

One day we'll A/B the 1.1, Mytec, and a Stello DAC if we can all get together sometime..

 -Cheers!

[NOLAfishwater]

One of the main reasons I went with the LUCID is because I was told it was more transparent than the others. Plus I ended up paying $300 less for the LUCID than the Benchmark.

[Nick's Picks]

I've heard the Lucid you speak of.  its a nice unit.  rack mount, right ?
very clean sounding.

[leehookem]

fozzy runs a Lucid on his setup at work.  he upgraded his home set up to a Benchmark.

[edtyre]

Mac > USB > Empirical Audio Off Ramp Turbo > AES > Grace 902

Grace works great as a dac, headphone amp and passive preamp for my amp and speakers (2 channel)
Got my cable box and dvd player routed thru there as well. Bought the Off Ramp used on ebay for cheap
good quality solution for getting USB into a DAC that doesn't have it. The Grace's built in USB is 16/44.1

[sygdwm]

I've heard the Lucid you speak of.  its a nice unit.  rack mount, right ?
very clean sounding.

dont think so. iirc, they are tiny. twoodruff has one. ive seen it, but i dont think he's allowed to use it anymore.

[Weirdness]

Lavry Black DA-10 here.  Surprised that it's not more popular around here actually.  Not as pretty as the Benchmark but I wouldn't trade back after hearing both. 

[NOLAfishwater]

I've heard the Lucid you speak of.  its a nice unit.  rack mount, right ?
very clean sounding.

dont think so. iirc, they are tiny. twoodruff has one. ive seen it, but i dont think he's allowed to use it anymore.

zing!