Topic: When to use what config?

[atxwolfattack]

Hey guys,

so up until recently, i haven't bothered with using any of the microphone configurations, but i have been advised by a few people to check out the different configs and possibly start using them instead of just pointing straight at the stacks like i normally do.

I run the church audio cardiods, which are somewhere between cardiods and hyper-cardiods, so from what i have read about, it seems like DIN at 90 degrees and 20cm spacing would be good for me?

i posted a while back when i put together my homemade mic stand setup, here is the post with some pictures....

http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,80942.msg1076529.html#msg1076529

As you see, i normally just point my mics just like that, straight ahead, or at the stacks, haha. My main question is, say i am not in the center of the venue, say its like a 100 ft wide venue, and i am about 30 feet from the left wall. Something like this.... (my little text picture will possibly get totally messed up when i post this)

               |                                    STAGE                                 |               
               |                                                                              |       
               |                                                                              |                               
               |                                                                              |         
               |                                                                              |     
               |                                                                              |                           
               |                                                                              |                       
               |                \      /                                                      |                   
         (Wall)                 mics                                                      (Wall)




Would i still go ahead and run my mics at DIN pointing 90 degrees out? I really don't know a ton about how sound waves work and what not, but it seems like to me that if you are not set up right in the center, then the audio picked up by one mic might have come a little more linear from the stack to the mic while the other might have picked up audio bouncing off the wall. If that makes any sense. Any help will be greatly appreciated.

-Josh

[drewloo]

Josh,

If you're happy w/ the recordings you're getting don't change anything simply because someone else feels you should.  That said, I personally prefer a recording captured via DIN or ORTF much more than A-B (mics pointed strait ahead) recordings, the exception being that split omni's sound great A-B.  Perhaps at your next show you could experiment a little by changing the mic configuration to something more like ORTF or DIN for the opening band and then run your standard config. for the main act and see what sounds better to you. 

You might want to try something like Kindguy said to you in an earlier thread:

What if you cut 2 pieces of aluminum. Drill a hole through both. Mount on same screw. Then you can make the tbar swivel for din ect....Could also throw in a spacer between bars for XY.

or use a shorter piece of alum. because it looks like your piece of alum. might be a little too long for true DIN or ORTF.  But basically just experiment when you can, keep notes on what you changed, and most importantly have fun.   BTW, w/ regards to how to run at various venues I tend to agree w/ Nick here:

well...thats sort of a lot of questions covering the whole range here.

what config you use depends on what you like.  they all sound different..and some work more universaly than others.

for a general "will this sound good in this venue from this location" situation, a general answer is DIN.
its more forgiving than XY/ORTF.  but doesn't sound as nice as either of those configs if the acoustics are good and your in the sweet spot...or close to the stage (lip) or something.

not sure that helps much...

when you're off angle.  Its more of a situation where you adjust gain on the weak side to compensate. 
thats what I do any way.

this is all just IMO...of course

[stevetoney]

I'm getting into this too and listening to different configs.  I've referred to the following writeup quite a bit to explain some of the basic differences between what to expect from the different configs.

http://www.oade.com/Tapers_Section/faq-mic.html

Hope this helps a little.

[Church-Audio]

Hey guys,

so up until recently, i haven't bothered with using any of the microphone configurations, but i have been advised by a few people to check out the different configs and possibly start using them instead of just pointing straight at the stacks like i normally do.

I run the church audio cardiods, which are somewhere between cardiods and hyper-cardiods, so from what i have read about, it seems like DIN at 90 degrees and 20cm spacing would be good for me?

i posted a while back when i put together my homemade mic stand setup, here is the post with some pictures....

http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,80942.msg1076529.html#msg1076529

As you see, i normally just point my mics just like that, straight ahead, or at the stacks, haha. My main question is, say i am not in the center of the venue, say its like a 100 ft wide venue, and i am about 30 feet from the left wall. Something like this.... (my little text picture will possibly get totally messed up when i post this)

               |                                    STAGE                                 |               
               |                                                                              |       
               |                                                                              |                               
               |                                                                              |         
               |                                                                              |     
               |                                                                              |                           
               |                                                                              |                       
               |                \      /                                                      |                   
         (Wall)                 mics                                                      (Wall)




Would i still go ahead and run my mics at DIN pointing 90 degrees out? I really don't know a ton about how sound waves work and what not, but it seems like to me that if you are not set up right in the center, then the audio picked up by one mic might have come a little more linear from the stack to the mic while the other might have picked up audio bouncing off the wall. If that makes any sense. Any help will be greatly appreciated.

-Josh

I dont know where to find this Jerseyboy guy but what ever the hell he is doing is what you should do. I find just pointing the mics on a 15-20 degree splay at 10 inches of separation works well in most cases. If your doing a proper concert with a good PA point the mics and left and right house PA and you have a good recording.

[stevetoney]

I find just pointing the mics on a 15-20 degree splay at 10 inches of separation works well in most cases. If your doing a proper concert with a good PA point the mics and left and right house PA and you have a good recording.

For the most part, this has always worked well for me too.  I guess it depends on what you're after.  For example, I know that I can probably pull great sounding recordings regardless of what technique I've used, especially if the source sounds great.  However, for me, now that I'm getting into this on a deeper level, I AM curious about the subtle differences that are obtained from the different mic'ing techniques. 

For example, just as Josh has queried, IS there gonna be a subtle, but maybe slightly 'better' technique for off-axis taping in larger venues than just pointing at the stacks because for me, my taping goal is to reproduce what I am hearing at the show as accurately as possible.  If one technique can achieve that goal better than others (even if the difference is very slight), then I'd like to hear about people's knowledge and experiences.

[atxwolfattack]

I find just pointing the mics on a 15-20 degree splay at 10 inches of separation works well in most cases. If your doing a proper concert with a good PA point the mics and left and right house PA and you have a good recording.

For the most part, this has always worked well for me too.  I guess it depends on what you're after.  For example, I know that I can probably pull great sounding recordings regardless of what technique I've used, especially if the source sounds great.  However, for me, now that I'm getting into this on a deeper level, I AM curious about the subtle differences that are obtained from the different mic'ing techniques. 

For example, just as Josh has queried, IS there gonna be a subtle, but maybe slightly 'better' technique for off-axis taping in larger venues than just pointing at the stacks because for me, my taping goal is to reproduce what I am hearing at the show as accurately as possible.  If one technique can achieve that goal better than others (even if the difference is very slight), then I'd like to hear about people's knowledge and experiences.

Yeah, does anyone have any advice for off-axis taping? Like in the little picture i made.

[Chuck]

When off axis,  as you say, (mostly WAY off axis), I generally go with PAS (Point At Stacks). The problem with running something like DIN or ORTF, off axis, is the image is compromised anyway. I just point them at the stacks and adjust the L/R levels as needed.