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Author Topic: tascam DR701d or DR70d  (Read 7942 times)

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Offline voltronic

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Re: tascam DR701d or DR70d
« Reply #15 on: June 18, 2016, 04:00:07 PM »
My thinking is this: if you really want an upgrade from what you're doing without much uncertainty, then you should get something that others have used successfully for the same or similar applications.  There is a huge amount of experience out there to draw in for all of the gear in this conversation... except the 701D.  I'm not saying that in and of itself would make it a bad choice, but it is still kind of an unknown quantity.

I see that you're trying to record from closer distances than I was imagining.  If that's the case and you won't be using very high gain, than the cheaper Tascsm units would be fine.  But it's quiet ambiances you're looking for requiring high gain, then you'll want the pro equipment.
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Offline myotis

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Re: tascam DR701d or DR70d
« Reply #16 on: June 18, 2016, 05:07:15 PM »
My thinking is this: if you really want an upgrade from what you're doing without much uncertainty, then you should get something that others have used successfully for the same or similar applications.  There is a huge amount of experience out there to draw in for all of the gear in this conversation... except the 701D.  I'm not saying that in and of itself would make it a bad choice, but it is still kind of an unknown quantity.

I see that you're trying to record from closer distances than I was imagining.  If that's the case and you won't be using very high gain, than the cheaper Tascsm units would be fine.  But it's quiet ambiances you're looking for requiring high gain, then you'll want the pro equipment.

Thanks again, but I think your earlier comments have made me pause a little with my plans. I hadn't really considered an SD MixPre approach,  but it may well be the best long term option.  I think I will do what you suggested, save up a bit more, and see what crops up second hand. This will also give me some time to see how the 701 builds it reputation. It doesn't sound as if there is anything obviously wrong with it, but as you say, it doesn't seem to have a lot of users around at the moment.

Cheers,

Graham

Offline F.O.Bean

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Re: tascam DR701d or DR70d
« Reply #17 on: June 19, 2016, 01:43:12 AM »
The 70d caught on here like wildfire for a time because it offers 4xlr inputs with phantom power in a small case and initially could be had for under $200.  I am not sure if the market was saturated before the 701 came out, if cardgate scared other buyers or if the 701 is just still priced too high for TS members because I only remember one member buying a 701. 

That HDMI feature is useless unless your DSLR outputs time code via HDMI. 

Whether the 70d is good enough for your song bird recording, I think you would want input from someone who has used it for that purpose. 

What parabolic dish and microphone would you be using?  I doubt any of us have a dish, but maybe someone here could do a sample ambient outdoor recording?  Would that help?  Can you make a dish or do you have to buy one?

Please check but I believe BH photo has a 30 day return policy if the 70d doesn't work for you.



I live very close to some woods, and birds/cicadas are VERY active around here! In fact, my neighbor across the street killed a 4'+ Copperhead snake last week, because his back yards goes into the woods! If I have time to setup this morning, I'll do so with my MK41>PFA>70d and mk4>VMS02IB>70d setups and post a sample, so you can hear the 70d preamps compared to the VMS02IB preamps 8)

As for the 70d/701d choice, if you need the HDMI and other features of the 701d, then its worth it! I would like the 701d's just to cascade them when necessary! BUT, I don't run a camera and don't plan on it anytime soon, so having [2] 70d's is perfect for ME >:D 8) Other than wanting to cascade the 70d's, they do what I need them to and sound great, so IMO, you can't go wrong with either! Now needing an external preamp or not is a whole nother debate/issue ;D It depends on what mics you run and how much gain you need! You might need an external preamp, or you might not! Just have to wait and see and test it out for yourself!

I'll try to get samples posted before I leave for Phish/St. Paul, Minny here in the next couple of days! I'm probably leaving at like 2am on my bday, 6.21.2016! Anyone else doing the tour opener on 6.22.2016? It's my 20th year seeing Phish this year, so my buddy and I are making the trip west and meeting phriends from Cali >:D 8) ;D :D It'll be my 93rd show, and my best phriends 184th show >:D Anyway, I'll try to record the morning sun coming up when the birds are most active and loudest around here, with minimal car and other sounds going on, here in the next morning or two so yinz can hear the VMS vs. 70d preamps!
« Last Edit: June 19, 2016, 01:52:21 AM by F.O.Bean »
Schoeps MK4's | MK41's ->
Schoeps | NBob 250/05 KCY's ->
Schoeps VMS 02IB | Naiant +60v/Low Noise PFA's ->
DarkTrain Right Angle Stubby | GakCable XLR's ->
Sound Devices MixPre-6 | Tascam DR-70D ->
128gb | 64gb SanDisk Extreme Pro SDXC-I

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Offline myotis

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Re: tascam DR701d or DR70d
« Reply #18 on: June 19, 2016, 03:39:45 AM »

I live very close to some woods, and birds/cicadas are VERY active around here! In fact, my neighbor across the street killed a 4'+ Copperhead snake last week, because his back yards goes into the woods! If I have time to setup this morning, I'll do so with my MK41>PFA>70d and mk4>VMS02IB>70d setups and post a sample, so you can hear the 70d preamps compared to the VMS02IB preamps 8)


I would certainly be interested in hearing this :-)

Cheers,

Graham

Offline aaronji

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Re: tascam DR701d or DR70d
« Reply #19 on: June 19, 2016, 08:08:23 AM »
Bear in mind that there are a lot of options in addition to the MixPre, either other pre-amps or all-in-ones, that may fit your needs.  I would try to find some people doing similar types of recording (I think there is a big nature recording group on Yahoo; at least there used to be) and see what they are using and why.  In general, taperssection might not be the best place to look for advice for this application.  Almost all of us record live music, often loud, and a lot of the conventional wisdom here doesn't even apply to soft acoustic music, let alone bird songs.  Take this thread as an example; the closest thing to relevant experience that anyone has claimed is, "I'm a taper and my neighbor killed a snake."  I am not saying that there is nothing of value for you here, only that it should be taken with a grain of salt...

Offline myotis

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Re: tascam DR701d or DR70d
« Reply #20 on: June 19, 2016, 08:50:55 AM »
  In general, taperssection might not be the best place to look for advice for this application.  Almost all of us record live music, often loud, and a lot of the conventional wisdom here doesn't even apply to soft acoustic music, let alone bird songs. 

I asked here because, apart from DSLR/Video forums where the focus seems to be on recording the spoken word, its the only place I have seen much discussion on  these recorders. And its the shape and usability with a DSLR that is attracting me to one.

I realised there was a focus on music here, but I was interested in comparisons between the 70 and the 701, rather than specific advice on my application, I mentioned it just to give a feel for where my interests lie. 

I am familiar with the yahoo group and the WSRS forum, and the recorders that are being used, and they are often similar to the models mentioned here, the Sony M10, Roland R05,etc, even zoom 4Ns, plus the Olympus LS10,11, which I'm not sure gets mentioned here.  The top end are using Nagra, Uher and Sound Devices, but they seem to be rarely mentioned.

If I was primarily looking for a recorder for wildlife and natural soundscapes, these would indeed be the places to go, but I think I have been given some valuable advice and plenty to to think about, from asking here.

So I appreciate everyone's efforts :-)

As an aside, on the Yahoo group, the Zoom f8 is mentioned (by an SD dealer) who is using the F8 for wildlife, and comments on how quiet the pre-amps are on the Zoom.

Cheers,

Graham
« Last Edit: June 19, 2016, 09:21:55 AM by myotis »

Offline F.O.Bean

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Re: tascam DR701d or DR70d
« Reply #21 on: June 19, 2016, 09:43:25 AM »

I live very close to some woods, and birds/cicadas are VERY active around here! In fact, my neighbor across the street killed a 4'+ Copperhead snake last week, because his back yards goes into the woods! If I have time to setup this morning, I'll do so with my MK41>PFA>70d and mk4>VMS02IB>70d setups and post a sample, so you can hear the 70d preamps compared to the VMS02IB preamps 8)


I would certainly be interested in hearing this :-)

Cheers,

Graham

OK, just did some super quiet recording of the birds and nature around 6:30am this morning[6.19.2016]! These are the RAW untouched files, just FLAC'd@Level 8 with TLH! I ran the mk41s with all four gain modes[LOW/MID/HIGH/HIGH+PLUS] of the DR70D, just so yinz could all hear the internal preamps with some quiet mics 8) ;D

Both setups were in Rycote INV6-HG Shocks, with Movo WS80 screens on! The mk41s were ran in DINa, and the mk4s ran ORTF! Tascam 70D run with v1.13 FW!

Stereo Files:
1S12 are mk41>PFA>70d preamps on LOW Gain@MAX[5 o'clock], 24/96 BWAVs, MIC IN/Phantom ON
1S34 are mk4>VMS02IB>70d and on LOW Gain@MAX[5 o'clock], 24/96 BWAVs, LINE IN

2S12 are mk41>PFA>70d preamps on MID Gain@HALF[12 o'clock], 24/96 BWAVs, MIC IN/Phantom ON
2S34 are mk4>VMS02IB>70d and on LOW Gain@MAX[5 o'clock], 24/96 BWAVs, LINE IN

3S12 are mk41>PFA>70d preamps on HIGH Gain@HALF[12 o'clock], 24/96 BWAVs, MIC IN/Phantom ON
3S34 are mk4>VMS02IB>70d and on LOW Gain@MAX[5 o'clock], 24/96 BWAVs, LINE IN

5S12 are mk41>PFA>70d preamps on HIGH+[PLUS] Gain@[9-10 o'clock], 24/96 BWAVs, MIC IN/Phantom ON
5S34 are mk4>VMS02IB>70d and on LOW Gain@MAX[5 o'clock], 24/96 BWAVs, LINE IN

https://www.mediafire.com/folder/cg27iq66upn17/Tascam_DR-70D_%26_Schoeps_VMS02IB_Preamp_COMP!_Birds_%26_Nature_Samples_%5BSchoeps_mk4_%26_mk41%5D

EDIT: In a few hours, I'm visiting relatives down the road, and they live on a busy street! I'm going to run the newer v1.14 FW to try out and do some more samples of some louder noises like traffic passing by, which is only about 20'-30' from my Gram's front porch, so it should be a good contrast to the birds and nature stuff I recorded earlier and posted above! Can you tell I haven't taped a show in 4 months lol :P ;D But I really want to try out the fw v1.14 before I run it live for Phish in 3 days! Might just keep running the v1.13 until I can get back from Phish/Minnesota and test out the v1.14 FW really good before using it "live" :)
« Last Edit: June 19, 2016, 10:06:19 AM by F.O.Bean »
Schoeps MK4's | MK41's ->
Schoeps | NBob 250/05 KCY's ->
Schoeps VMS 02IB | Naiant +60v/Low Noise PFA's ->
DarkTrain Right Angle Stubby | GakCable XLR's ->
Sound Devices MixPre-6 | Tascam DR-70D ->
128gb | 64gb SanDisk Extreme Pro SDXC-I

http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/diskobean | http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/Bean420 | http://bt.etree.org/mytorrents.php

Offline johnmuge

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Re: tascam DR701d or DR70d
« Reply #22 on: June 19, 2016, 09:47:34 AM »
I recorded peeper frogs using Nevaton MCE400's mounted on my glasses into the DR70d on the high gain setting if you would like to check it out. I started the recording at my house and walked up the street to the vernal pond so there are birds singing on the way.  It was for a inland wetlands project.  A We Transfer link :

       https://we.tl/MfnN1WiI1W
> AKG c480b(ck61,ck63) Naiant Couplings-PFA / Beyer MC930 / Milab VM-44 link / Nevaton MCE400
 > Littlebox w/output xformers / Tinybox w/ dual output                                                                                                                                                              > Tascam DR-680, DR70d / Sony M-10 / Oade ACM Marantz PMD660

Offline F.O.Bean

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Re: tascam DR701d or DR70d
« Reply #23 on: June 19, 2016, 09:51:35 AM »
I recorded peeper frogs using Nevaton MCE400's mounted on my glasses into the DR70d on the high gain setting if you would like to check it out. I started the recording at my house and walked up the street to the vernal pond so there are birds singing on the way.  It was for a inland wetlands project.  A We Transfer link :

       https://we.tl/MfnN1WiI1W

Thanks! Did you use the EXT 1/2 input or the XLR inputs?
Schoeps MK4's | MK41's ->
Schoeps | NBob 250/05 KCY's ->
Schoeps VMS 02IB | Naiant +60v/Low Noise PFA's ->
DarkTrain Right Angle Stubby | GakCable XLR's ->
Sound Devices MixPre-6 | Tascam DR-70D ->
128gb | 64gb SanDisk Extreme Pro SDXC-I

http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/diskobean | http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/Bean420 | http://bt.etree.org/mytorrents.php

Offline johnmuge

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Re: tascam DR701d or DR70d
« Reply #24 on: June 19, 2016, 10:02:07 AM »
I used the XLR inputs with phantom power on.
> AKG c480b(ck61,ck63) Naiant Couplings-PFA / Beyer MC930 / Milab VM-44 link / Nevaton MCE400
 > Littlebox w/output xformers / Tinybox w/ dual output                                                                                                                                                              > Tascam DR-680, DR70d / Sony M-10 / Oade ACM Marantz PMD660

Offline F.O.Bean

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Re: tascam DR701d or DR70d
« Reply #25 on: June 19, 2016, 10:07:06 AM »
Thanks! DL'ing now 8)
Schoeps MK4's | MK41's ->
Schoeps | NBob 250/05 KCY's ->
Schoeps VMS 02IB | Naiant +60v/Low Noise PFA's ->
DarkTrain Right Angle Stubby | GakCable XLR's ->
Sound Devices MixPre-6 | Tascam DR-70D ->
128gb | 64gb SanDisk Extreme Pro SDXC-I

http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/diskobean | http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/Bean420 | http://bt.etree.org/mytorrents.php

Offline myotis

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Re: tascam DR701d or DR70d
« Reply #26 on: June 19, 2016, 12:52:31 PM »

OK, just did some super quiet recording of the birds and nature around 6:30am this morning[6.19.2016]! These are the RAW untouched files, just FLAC'd@Level 8 with TLH! I ran the mk41s with all four gain modes[LOW/MID/HIGH/HIGH+PLUS] of the DR70D, just so yinz could all hear the internal preamps with some quiet mics 8) ;D


Many thanks for this.

I need to spend more time listening to these, but it was very useful to hear these, I thought the ones without the pre-amp sounded OK, until I heard how much quieter the ones with the pre-amp were.   Though, I doubt I will ever be able to afford mics as good as schoeps.

Cheers,

Graham

I will be interested to hear what those with a better ear than I have to say.

Offline 2manyrocks

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Re: tascam DR701d or DR70d
« Reply #27 on: June 19, 2016, 01:27:02 PM »
Dpa 4060s are low noise and relatively affordable.  Not sure I'd take schoeps out in the woods, plus the dpa's are so small to carry. 


Offline myotis

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Re: tascam DR701d or DR70d
« Reply #28 on: June 19, 2016, 01:35:53 PM »
Dpa 4060s are low noise and relatively affordable.  Not sure I'd take schoeps out in the woods, plus the dpa's are so small to carry.

The DPA 4060s certainly seem to crop up a lot, and something I would consider some day. Meanwhile, I have just bought a pair of balanced primo em-172 capsules, so a long way away from DPA !!

Cheers,
Graham

Offline 2manyrocks

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Re: tascam DR701d or DR70d
« Reply #29 on: June 19, 2016, 09:54:46 PM »
I gave the 70d a try with dpa 4061s mounted to a trash can lid this afternoon at a colony of purple martins.  Using the original firmware, gain set to high and pots @ 3\4, I feel like there was more noise than acceptable.  May give this another try with some different mics.  The trashcash can lid seems to isolate or focus the sound.  Finding this more of a challenge than first expected. 

Am reminded that setting the gain out to the camera on the 70d is not as easy as on the 60d, IMO. 

 

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