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Author Topic: Van den Hul introduces 2.9 mm balanced cable -"The Orchid" (Tunnel Technology)  (Read 17180 times)

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cshepherd

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Van den Hul has been talking about this cable for almost a year now.  We saw a sample at CES, but were finally able to listen to The Orchid this weekend when our 1m rca's arrived.  Van den Hul has hit a sonic and visual homerun with their latest creation.  Quite possibly the best sounding interconnect they've produced yet.  It is extremely open up top, it has great bass that boogies and a very full sounding midrange.  Compared to the Atlas Navigator All Cu, The Orchid has a more realistic sound that brings you closer to the music.  Dale and I listened to music Saturday night til dawn on the Sonneteer Byron cdp and Orton Integrated amp (30 wpc solid state).  Speakers were the Neat Petite mk. III stand mounts (6" driver/ribbon tweeter) with Van den Hul's The Breeze (tweeters) and Harmonix CS-120 (drivers) for speaker cables.  The Orchid was stunning all night long, no matter what we played.

The Navigator All Cu is an awesome interconnect, edit: but The Orchid is better.  For now, I'd like to retract that statement and go with "different".  I think it's too early to tell if one is clearly better than the other.  I'll be commenting on specific traits after we spend some more time with the interconnect.  It's going to require more listening and cable swaps to see a clear picture.  The Navigator All Cu and The Orchid are both really good.  Sorry for jumping the gun on that claim.  (end edit)  The Orchid has the size, weight and convenience of an active cable with the sonic benefits traditioinally only gained with 7mm-8mm heavy duty audiophile cables (edited for grammer 5.13.06).  Do we sound excited.  We are.

Prices:
$225 (.6m set) / $440 (1m set) / $1420 (3m set) / $1890 (4m set)
edit:  those are msrp's...We'll be able to show a little Eugene Hi-Fi love on those prices.

We ordered a 4m and .6m demo set today.  I think the 3m sets should be seriously considered at these prices.  My 4m mic cables almost always have extra cable coiled up at the bottom of the stand.  If your stand doesn't go above 8 ft., a 3m set will get the job done. 

If all goes well, the inaugural run with these cables will be for Wilco in Calgary on 6/28 (GA) and Edmonton on 6/29 (lower balcony, center).  Our goal is to make it back to Eugene for Widespread Panic on July 11th where we'll be doing a direct comparison (1st set/2nd set) with the Navigator All Cu cables.

Technical information on The Orchid can be found here:  http://www.vandenhul.nl/cable/orchid.htm  It's conductor is Matched Crystal OFC with a very dense and pure silver coating, insulated with Van den Hul's patented Linear Structured Carbon.  The solid core conductor also employs a PTFE (Teflon) dialectric.

We had the opportunity to meet A.J. Van den Hul (founder) at CES this year.  It turns out he is a field recording hobbiest as well.  We spoke for 15 minutes or so about field recording experiences and techniques.  The all-carbon xlr, The Second, has been his favorite microphone cable up to this point.  However, it was clear that their attention and excitement was focused on The Orchid, repeatedly mentioning how great the dynamics are and how versatile it is with regards to various applications.  Below is a rundown of A.J.'s recording rig.

~crackpot


A.J. Van den Hul's recording rig:
   1. The microphones used were B&K type 4190 with B&K amplifiers type 2669. Special custom designed acoustic couplers were used. We applied the lowest number of microphones possible; in many recordings not more than four. All microphone powering was done by external batteries.

   2. For all analog and digital signal routing we used our well-proven Linear Structured Carbon ® cable The SECOND ®. Over 200 meters were used for all analog and digital connections.

   3. The mains was filtered and stabilized at exactly 220 Volt 50 Hz. Each mains cable again had its own filter.

   4. The mixing console used is custom built and contains broadband opamps.

   5. The decision was made to work exclusively at 96 kHz samplerate with 24 bit resolution (DVD standard). Recording was done on two Nagra-D recorders.

   6. The AD conversion for the Nagra-D recorders was performed by the dCS 904 converter. For the Sony 2500 backup DAT recorder we used a strongly upgraded dCS 900 AD converter.

   7. The conversion from 96 kHz 24 bit DVD to 44.1 kHz 16 bit CD-standard was done with the dCS 972 digital to digital converter.

   8. Monitoring was done using the dCS Elgar DA converter. We furthermore used the Sony MDR-CD3000 headphones and the Tannoy 800 A active.

   9. All mains plug polarities were optimized using our POLARITY CHECKER to minimize ground leakage currents.

  10. Each piece of music is an original recording without cuts or editing.

The aim of all these technical exercises was to sonically come as close as possible to what I recall as the best of analog. A kind of sound common around the mid-seventies without rumble or noise and with higher dynamics and strong spatial impressions. The digital to digital conversion from 96 kHz 24 bit DVD to 44.1 kHz 16 bit CD-standard using the dCS 972 allowed us to retain a lot of the original sound quality that was available during the very lively recording sessions.
« Last Edit: May 13, 2006, 12:43:02 PM by cshepherd »

cshepherd

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A few more pics...the blue cable (Mic Hybrid) is a 6 mm dia. and the brown cable (The Second) is a 7 mm diameter.  I should also say that even if the mic cables are not a possiblity for someone, the shortie xlr pre amp cables for $225 are a no brainer, IMO.

~crackpot
« Last Edit: May 10, 2006, 01:36:06 AM by cshepherd »

cshepherd

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I don't have any splitters that are of the same quality as the Navigator and Orchid.  Using an inferior quality splitter would show relative differences, but neither recording would be an accurate representation of the cable's sound due to the splitter cable's influence.  Widespread is playing at the Cuthbert, Eugene's outdoor half-shell ampitheatre on July 11th. That will likely be the first comp tape we'll be able to make, which will be a full rig cable swap at set break. 

Chris
« Last Edit: June 26, 2006, 05:23:48 AM by cshepherd »

cshepherd

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I understand where you are coming from.  We're not expecting anybody to get out their credit card sight unseen.  We'll be doing everything we can to accurately highlight how good this cable is for our community.  I think the technology is really interesting.  They use a single solid core conductor and use one of the screens for the second conductor.  They also claim the core is virtually unbreakable.  I would gladly take this sound in an 8mm cable and haul the weight.  That it's only 2.9mm and is so incredibly lightweight is amazing.  Performance like The Orchid's has, to my knowledge, never been available in such a small wire.  It's got taping rig written all over it.  I would sacrifice a round trip flight,  hotel rooms and a few shows to pay for it.  Seriously, I'd spend at least $1000 to fly to Atlanta to see Panic at the Fox for two nights.  The cables are expensive, but so is travel, so are rigs, so are tickets.  Getting the goods always takes sacrifice. 

Chris
« Last Edit: June 26, 2006, 05:24:18 AM by cshepherd »

Offline F.O.Bean

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chris-id ideally like to hear a comp w/ star quad vs. orchids and the military-grade silver-clad copper cables we all use ala leegeddy/toddr/hyperconductors vs. orchids :)
Schoeps MK 4V & MK 41V ->
Schoeps 250|0 KCY's (x2) ->
Naiant +60v|Low Noise PFA's (x2) ->
DarkTrain Right Angle Stubby XLR's (x3) ->
Sound Devices MixPre-6 & MixPre-3

http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/diskobean
http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/Bean420
http://bt.etree.org/mytorrents.php
http://www.mediafire.com/folder/j9eu80jpuaubz/Recordings

cshepherd

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I thought some folks might enjoy pics of The Orchid mic cables that came in this week.  I've been hauling a full Sonicase bag for years.  This is by far the lightest, smallest package I've ever taped with.  Granted, the V2 is staying at home.  The bag is a The North Face "Kanga".  It holds the 722 in its padded bag, two padded mic bags, two AT 8410a shock mounts and the cables.  It also holds the 722 charger in an outside pocket.  I'll be doing a 'slight modification' to allow side entry for the mic cables.  We're leaving Monday for the Wilco shows in Calgary and Edmonton. 

The cables in the pics are 4m long.  Van den Hul is now using Neutrik's silver pin xlr connectors.  They used to use the gold plated pin version. 

Chris
« Last Edit: June 25, 2006, 10:12:00 PM by cshepherd »

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nice chris, id also like to see more pics of the bag setup :)
Schoeps MK 4V & MK 41V ->
Schoeps 250|0 KCY's (x2) ->
Naiant +60v|Low Noise PFA's (x2) ->
DarkTrain Right Angle Stubby XLR's (x3) ->
Sound Devices MixPre-6 & MixPre-3

http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/diskobean
http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/Bean420
http://bt.etree.org/mytorrents.php
http://www.mediafire.com/folder/j9eu80jpuaubz/Recordings

cshepherd

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nice chris, id also like to see more pics of the bag setup :)

Here's a better picture of the bag.  The cables wind up and store in the front compartment before plugging into the 722. 

Chris
« Last Edit: June 25, 2006, 10:13:14 PM by cshepherd »

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you been leaving the v2 at home chris ???

thats a nice bag :)

i have my portabrace cs-7+rm deluxe stored in my kelty redwing backpack, i wanted to ideally just tote the PB bag, but i have too much shit to mjust haul the PB bag, id have to get another rmdeluxe if i wanted to just tote the pb bags, but then it would be as big as the pb+kelty bag,. and i already had the kelty bag, so im happy w/ my bag setup as is :)

i have too many clamps/tbars/accessories to just tote the pb anyway

i do love the ar-7 tho, made so perfectly for the 722 its scary, plus the way the pb sits in my kelty, it makes the kelty sit upright just perfectly, and the padding and the internal frame on the kelty is sweet, i walked 18 miles into coventry w/ my taping gear and it didnt hurt me as bad as i thought it would ;) plus for rain protestion, the pb+kelty cant be beat, im afraid of no condidtions w/ that setup

i tell you what tho, that NF bag is sick ;D

how expensive would a 1 meter pair of the orchids run me ? what about if i got just the cable and had someone put the neutrik ends on it ???
Schoeps MK 4V & MK 41V ->
Schoeps 250|0 KCY's (x2) ->
Naiant +60v|Low Noise PFA's (x2) ->
DarkTrain Right Angle Stubby XLR's (x3) ->
Sound Devices MixPre-6 & MixPre-3

http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/diskobean
http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/Bean420
http://bt.etree.org/mytorrents.php
http://www.mediafire.com/folder/j9eu80jpuaubz/Recordings

Offline F.O.Bean

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nevermind, saw prices in your post w/ neutriks already attached

and +T for the sweet setup ;)

you wanna sell the v2 ;)
Schoeps MK 4V & MK 41V ->
Schoeps 250|0 KCY's (x2) ->
Naiant +60v|Low Noise PFA's (x2) ->
DarkTrain Right Angle Stubby XLR's (x3) ->
Sound Devices MixPre-6 & MixPre-3

http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/diskobean
http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/Bean420
http://bt.etree.org/mytorrents.php
http://www.mediafire.com/folder/j9eu80jpuaubz/Recordings

cshepherd

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When Dale and I were doing sound for a local band, we were using the V2 between the sax's microphone and processor.  I got a chance to use the internal pre's on the 722 quite a bit.  I've got a shortie xlr set of The Orchid for the V2, but we're taping from the 4th row, dfc in the pit in Edmonton >:D and I know the Sonicase bag would be a total PITA down there.  My gut tells me I'm not going to miss the V2 down front, but we'll see.  The 722 pre's remind me of the ad1000 sound in a 24 bit kind of way.

It will be a while before I even think about selling the V2, though. 

Chris

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When Dale and I were doing sound for a local band, we were using the V2 between the sax's microphone and processor.  I got a chance to use the internal pre's on the 722 quite a bit.  I've got a shortie xlr set of The Orchid for the V2, but we're taping from the 4th row, dfc in the pit in Edmonton >:D and I know the Sonicase bag would be a total PITA down there.  My gut tells me I'm not going to miss the V2 down front, but we'll see.  The 722 pre's remind me of the ad1000 sound in a 24 bit kind of way.

It will be a while before I even think about selling the V2, though. 

Chris

so youre happy w/ the 722 pre's ?? i have only ran v3>analog>722 the two times i ran it live

kinda like a ad1k in 24-bit ehh? thats a good thing :) wonder how the pre's will sound w/ the 480's ??? im dying to try them out, im gonna run a comp between sets next weekend if kyle will loan me eitehr his v2 or sax :) set 1: pre>722 set two: mics>722, im PSYCHED to hear the difference :)
Schoeps MK 4V & MK 41V ->
Schoeps 250|0 KCY's (x2) ->
Naiant +60v|Low Noise PFA's (x2) ->
DarkTrain Right Angle Stubby XLR's (x3) ->
Sound Devices MixPre-6 & MixPre-3

http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/diskobean
http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/Bean420
http://bt.etree.org/mytorrents.php
http://www.mediafire.com/folder/j9eu80jpuaubz/Recordings

cshepherd

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First recording made with The Orchid is now available for download.  We did a real time digital audio transfer instead of the usual firewire method.

Wilco
Calgary, Alberta
MacEwan Ballroom
June 28th, 2006
Wednesday Night

Source:
fob/dfc 30 ft. from stage / 8 ft. stand / 90 degrees (pointed at the stacks)
Neumann km 184's > Sound Devices 722 @ 24/88.2
using Van den Hul "The Orchid" mic cables
AT 8410a shock mounts and Vibrapod isolation feet (under the mic stand) were used to isolate the mics from vibrations.
recording by Chris & Dale Shepherd

http://bt.etree.org/details.php?id=26869

Chris

Offline JasonSobel

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First recording made with The Orchid is now available for download.  We did a real time digital audio transfer instead of the usual firewire method.

Wilco
Calgary, Alberta
MacEwan Ballroom
June 28th, 2006
Wednesday Night

Source:
fob/dfc 30 ft. from stage / 8 ft. stand / 90 degrees (pointed at the stacks)
Neumann km 184's > Sound Devices 722 @ 24/88.2
using Van den Hul "The Orchid" mic cables
AT 8410a shock mounts and Vibrapod isolation feet (under the mic stand) were used to isolate the mics from vibrations.
recording by Chris & Dale Shepherd

http://bt.etree.org/details.php?id=26869

Chris

thank you for posting that, Chris.  I'm wondering why you went through all the trouble with a real-time S/PDIF transfer, letting it all "warm-up" for an hour and using vibraprods and such and such, instead of transfering via firewire.  when you copy data via firewire (or USB, for that matter), the digital file is an exact copy.  while all the extra stuff you did may have reduced S/PDIF jitter, you can't get better than an exact copy.  so why take the time and effort if there won't be any improvement?  just curious?

thanks again,
Jason

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I see where Chris is coming from, but I'd like to hear this after multiple transfers.  Once in the way he did the above mentioned seed (real time), and a second time done "as normal" via firewire/usb without all the bells and whistles.  This would be a true "comp" for the items he mentioned (vibrapods, warming up equipment, etc...), at least from a transfer process.

Hell...several transfers could be done: with/without vibrapods, with/without "warming" equipment, and any combination thereof.  Personally, none of this stuff would make a difference for me as my playback system would not support the minute improvement (if any) by performing said bells and whistles.

Not diggin', as from one geek to another, bells and whistles are keen, I just don't have equipment to support such adjustments.
Socks are overrated.

 

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