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Author Topic: Serv4U XLR248HD phantom/pre (Burr Brown) - Beachtek DIY knockoff?  (Read 5926 times)

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Offline sunjan

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Just stumbled on this phantom/pre.
Would it be any good for taper use?

The manufacturer seems to be a home/DIY business, they don't have a website except their Ebay store:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=180308508454

Listed for $165 BIN.
It's nearest competitors are Beachtek DXA-6HD ($399), or juicedLink CX231 ($299).

The XLR248HD is a two channel, microphone preamplifier XLR adapter with built-in 48 volt phantom power supplies. This adapter is designed to easily attach two professional, balanced microphones or wireless systems to DV camcorders. The XLR248HD gives you all the benefits of using balanced audio devices for clean audio as well as control over the signal levels and gain of 40dB to ensure the best possible sound recording.The XLR248HD is very easy to set up and use. Its rugged construc­tion ensures years of use and its compact size fits neatly under the camcorder - can also be mounted to any standard tripod. Since the adapter is using Burr Brown  INA163UA precision very low-noise, low-distortion, mon- olithic instrumentation amplifier powered with  + 14V  , it is silent and  ensure superb audio .
Input Level MIC setting:             -40 dBu typical
LINE setting:                                 +4 dBu typical
Output Level                                 +18dBu
Frequency Response                 20Hz to 20 KHz (+/- 1dB)
THD+N                                            Less then 0.03%  @  1kHz +4 dBu output
Sig to Noise Ratio                       90 dB  @  -10dBu   
Phantom Power Dual regulated 48 volt power supplies
Current to 14 mA (direct short)
Battery Type One standard 9 volt alkaline battery
Dimensions 6.25” L x 2.5” W x 1.25” H
Weight 12 oz



« Last Edit: March 09, 2009, 05:02:47 AM by sunjan »
Mics: A-51s LE, CK 930, Line Audo CM3, AT853Rx (hc,c,sc),  ECM 121, ECM 909A
Pres: Tinybox, CA-9100, UA5 wmod
Recorders: M10, H116 (CF mod), H340, NJB3
Gearbag: High Sierra Corkscrew
MD transfers: MZ-RH1. Tape transfers: Nak DR-1
Photo rig: Nikon D70, 18-70mm/3.5-4.5, SB-800

Offline Todd R

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Re: SERV4U XLR248HD phantom/pre - Beachtek DIY knockoff?
« Reply #1 on: March 06, 2009, 11:01:41 AM »
Yep, I saw that a month or so ago on ebay.  If I can sell off some of the gear I'm sitting on, I was thinking about picking one up.

I need to send the seller/maker some questions about it though.  I'm not sure I can remember all I was thinking was important, but a few things I'd like to know:
-what is the max input level for the mic inputs in dBu?  (specs only show nominal)
-what is the max input level for the line inputs in dBu?  (specs only show nominal)
-assuming the mic inputs would get overloaded recording loud PA music, is the phantom power active when you have the XLR248HD set to line inputs (which hopefully can take a hot enough signal)?
-what is the expected battery life when using phantom power on, and using typical condensor mics (say ~3-4ma per mic current draw)?  Or better yet, what is the total 248HD current draw under these conditions?
-can the XLR248HD use the new rechargeable lithium-polymer 9v batteries (working voltage ~7.2-7.8v)?

Overall, it definitely looks interesting, esp since it uses the same Burr-Brown instrumentation amp as the Lunatec V3 (IIRC anyway).  I'd probably want to mod it to provide an output other than the 3.5mm TRS pigtail, but it does look interesting.
Mics: Microtech Gefell m20/m21 (nbob/pfa actives), Line Audio CM3, Church CA-11 cards
Preamp:  none <sniff>
Recorders:  Sound Devices MixPre-6, Sony PCM-M10, Zoom H4nPro

Offline Todd R

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Re: SERV4U XLR248HD phantom/pre - Beachtek DIY knockoff?
« Reply #2 on: March 06, 2009, 02:23:20 PM »
Ok, I asked those questions, and this is the reply I got (edited a bit for readability).  The seller also included his cell number, if anyone is interested in talking to him directly, pm me for the number.

Quote

Hi Todd
The XLR248HD was never tested for extreme conditions using hot mic on input [I had asked him about high SPL concert recording conditions].  The original purpose of the 40dB preamp was to boost for low signal level condenser mics or dynamic mics.  Phantom power is switchable and it could be turned on with the line input selected.  Current draw with full load is just under 100mA and operating voltage range is 5v to 12v.  Best nominal voltage is 8 to 9v, but I did use lithium-poly batteries and they worked ok.

I cannot guarantee the XLR248 HD will work ok for your application.  But what I can do is give you 30 day money back guarantee so you be able to test in extreme conditions. As long the unit is returned to me in undamaged condition, I will give you your money back less S and H charges

Thanks,
JAREK ROMANOWSKI
ELECTRONIC SERVICE FOR YOU

Based on his feedback, this looks like it might be a good, low-cost option.  It uses nice Burr-Brown op amps (same as the Lunatec V3), has a low current draw, should work on rechargeable li-ion 9v batteries, and can provide phantom power when selected to line in.  I wouldn't imagine any condensors would overload the 4dBu nominal input level of the 248HD when set to line in, and 14ma of total phantom power availability is pretty good -- should work for most condensors save Earthworks.
Mics: Microtech Gefell m20/m21 (nbob/pfa actives), Line Audio CM3, Church CA-11 cards
Preamp:  none <sniff>
Recorders:  Sound Devices MixPre-6, Sony PCM-M10, Zoom H4nPro

Offline illconditioned

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Re: SERV4U XLR248HD phantom/pre - Beachtek DIY knockoff?
« Reply #3 on: March 06, 2009, 02:27:32 PM »
Ok, I asked those questions, and this is the reply I got (edited a bit for readability).  The seller also included his cell number, if anyone is interested in talking to him directly, pm me for the number.

Quote

Hi Todd
The XLR248HD was never tested for extreme conditions using hot mic on input [I had asked him about high SPL concert recording conditions].  The original purpose of the 40dB preamp was to boost for low signal level condenser mics or dynamic mics.  Phantom power is switchable and it could be turned on with the line input selected.  Current draw with full load is just under 100mA and operating voltage range is 5v to 12v.  Best nominal voltage is 8 to 9v, but I did use lithium-poly batteries and they worked ok.

I cannot guarantee the XLR248 HD will work ok for your application.  But what I can do is give you 30 day money back guarantee so you be able to test in extreme conditions. As long the unit is returned to me in undamaged condition, I will give you your money back less S and H charges

Thanks,
JAREK ROMANOWSKI
ELECTRONIC SERVICE FOR YOU

Based on his feedback, this looks like it might be a good, low-cost option.  It uses nice Burr-Brown op amps (same as the Lunatec V3), has a low current draw, should work on rechargeable li-ion 9v batteries, and can provide phantom power when selected to line in.  I wouldn't imagine any condensors would overload the 4dBu nominal input level of the 248HD when set to line in, and 14ma of total phantom power availability is pretty good -- should work for most condensors save Earthworks.

Can you ask him what the internal voltages are for the INA163 chip?  In particular, does he step up the 9v input voltage (to something like +/-15V) or use it raw?  That will make a difference for sound quality.

Otherwise this looks like a nice unit.  I'm thinking it would be great as a front end to a Sony PCM-D50 or Edirol R09.

  Richard
Please DO NOT mail me with tech questions.  I will try to answer in the forums when I get a chance.  Thanks.

Sample recordings at: http://www.soundmann.com.

Offline sunjan

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Re: SERV4U XLR248HD phantom/pre - Beachtek DIY knockoff?
« Reply #4 on: March 06, 2009, 05:10:04 PM »
I'm thinking it would be great as a front end to a Sony PCM-D50 or Edirol R09.

Agree, it would make a neat stealth combo. Can't beat the form factor (or the price!). Now, I just wonder if it delivers soundwise.

My guess is that the seller started out his business by picking up a Beachtek, took it apart and reverse-engineered it. Smart fella!
Here's a used one he just sold last year:
http://cgi.ebay.ca/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=180312128625
« Last Edit: November 09, 2009, 05:32:31 PM by sunjan »
Mics: A-51s LE, CK 930, Line Audo CM3, AT853Rx (hc,c,sc),  ECM 121, ECM 909A
Pres: Tinybox, CA-9100, UA5 wmod
Recorders: M10, H116 (CF mod), H340, NJB3
Gearbag: High Sierra Corkscrew
MD transfers: MZ-RH1. Tape transfers: Nak DR-1
Photo rig: Nikon D70, 18-70mm/3.5-4.5, SB-800

Offline Todd R

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Re: SERV4U XLR248HD phantom/pre - Beachtek DIY knockoff?
« Reply #5 on: March 06, 2009, 06:17:54 PM »

Can you ask him what the internal voltages are for the INA163 chip?  In particular, does he step up the 9v input voltage (to something like +/-15V) or use it raw?  That will make a difference for sound quality.

Otherwise this looks like a nice unit.  I'm thinking it would be great as a front end to a Sony PCM-D50 or Edirol R09.

  Richard


I asked and he replied that he is generating +/- voltage for the INA163 using the same DC-DC converter circuit he is using to develop 48v phantom power.  He didn't specify what voltage it was at though, presumably +/-12v or +/-15v -- I don't see why if he's going the route of the DC-DC converter he'd stop at +/- 5 or 6v.

If I can get my AKG blueline stuff sold, I'll definitely pick one of these up to try it out with my Sony D50.  For the first time in six years or so, I may need to revert to ebay to get this stuff sold. :-\
Mics: Microtech Gefell m20/m21 (nbob/pfa actives), Line Audio CM3, Church CA-11 cards
Preamp:  none <sniff>
Recorders:  Sound Devices MixPre-6, Sony PCM-M10, Zoom H4nPro

Offline DSatz

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Re: SERV4U XLR248HD phantom/pre - Beachtek DIY knockoff?
« Reply #6 on: March 08, 2009, 07:14:17 PM »
Todd R, when the inputs to a mike preamp overload but the microphones themselves aren't near their own overload point, switching the preamp to line levels is often a poor alternative from a signal-to-noise standpoint. Sometimes you would get better results with in-line resistive attenuators at the inputs of the preamp, leaving the preamp set for "mike in."

This varies case by case and should be worked out by actual measurement--but if for example you are only overloading the preamp by, say 6 - 8 dB on peaks, then a 12 dB pad will fix that problem. The mike-to-line stage may amplify signals by (say) 40 dB--and if so, should you take that gain out of the picture by using line inputs, suddenly you'll need to make up that gain somewhere after the line input which your mikes are now underdriving by more than 30 dB. So you're amplifying a noisy signal, and boosting that noise along with the signal.

If the extent of the overload is more severe--if it's 20 or 30 dB, for example--then it gets silly to pad the microphone signal down so far just so that you can boost it up again. And in that situation, all other things being equal there would also be less of a noise penalty for using the line inputs as you suggest.

For any pair of microphones and any pair of microphone inputs, if you know the sensitivity of the mikes in mV/Pa and the overload point of the inputs in mV, you can determine the sound pressure level that would cause those mikes to overload those inputs. And if you know the maximum SPL for the microphones, you will then know whether that sound pressure level is within the range that those microphones can handle or not. That's important information to have for any microphone/preamp or microphone/recorder combination.

For example, with a few simple measurements and a bit of listening through headphones for distortion on steady tones (which is very easy to hear), I determined that no matter how loud a sound may be that I'm trying to record, my Schoeps microphones simply cannot overload the inputs of my Lunatec V3 preamp as long as my levels are set properly in the first place (not quite reaching 0 dBFS on the loudest peaks). It's one thing that I never have to worry about, and I'm grateful for it.

With other recorders or preamps, and/or other microphones, though, that wouldn't always be the case. If I was going to record with a setup that could have this problem, I would sure as hell keep a pair of in-line pads in my kit bag--and with some combinations of microphones, expected sound pressure levels and recorders or preamps, I would plug them in "pre-emptively."

--best regards
« Last Edit: March 08, 2009, 07:22:14 PM by DSatz »
music > microphones > a recorder of some sort

Offline shaggy

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Re: SERV4U XLR248HD phantom/pre - Beachtek DIY knockoff?
« Reply #7 on: March 08, 2009, 07:49:52 PM »
This thing DOES look really interesting for a D50 set up.  You can even slam it on the bottom of the D50 to make it one integral unit!

Offline JM Charcot

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Re: Serv4U XLR248HD phantom/pre (Burr Brown) - Beachtek DIY knockoff?
« Reply #8 on: March 10, 2009, 05:51:34 AM »
did someone order it already?

Curious about the tests..

Kind regards,

JM.

Offline dogmusic

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Re: Serv4U XLR248HD phantom/pre (Burr Brown) - Beachtek DIY knockoff?
« Reply #9 on: October 31, 2009, 03:18:19 PM »
did someone order it already?

Curious about the tests..

Kind regards,

JM.

I'm also interested. Anybody try this pre?

Also, would this be better than a Beachtek DXA-10?
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Offline Chuck

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Offline printguy

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Re: Serv4U XLR248HD phantom/pre (Burr Brown) - Beachtek DIY knockoff?
« Reply #11 on: November 01, 2009, 08:11:32 AM »
Looks like a version of the ad I see on almost every page at TS: http://www.juicedlink.com/index_files/CX_camcorder_XLR_microphone_adapter_audio_mixers.htm

Wouldn't a LittleBox do the same job better?
• CA-11 or CA-14 > Naiant TinyBox > Tascam DR-1
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