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Author Topic: Team classical recording  (Read 106155 times)

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jnorman34

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Re: Team classical recording
« Reply #75 on: September 19, 2009, 07:13:06 PM »
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I took a shot at doing a live video performance yesterday at Octoberfest in Mt. Angel, Oregon, in the wonderful St. Mary's historic church. My video recorder conked out on me, so i made the video part using my little panasonic FX100 point and shoot camera. i recorded the audio with an ORTF pair of KM184s>Lexicon U42s>IBM T61 Thinkpad running Reaper. The performers are RoseWynde, flute and harp duo.

I edited the video in Ulead DVD factory to remove the audio from the original video clip and add in the Reaper audio files. In Reaper, i inserted reafir to do some noise reduction, and boosted the audio level a little bit. otherwise, the reverb is just the natural reverb of the church (which is a huge cruciform church). i will try to upload a shot of the church, and will include a link to the video on YouTube (i dont know how to embed the youtube video, but if someone will tell me how, i will do that.)

here is the link to the Video:
http://redirectingat.com/?id=690X1299&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DVskXkH01Q4Q

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Re: Team classical recording
« Reply #76 on: September 20, 2009, 07:12:46 PM »
Super nice job. Love the lush recorded ambiance, perfectly tuned to the sparse nature of this music. There's nothing like great sounding real spaces.  Capturing the feel of performers in those ambiances is really rewarding.

After checking out the sweet 'Ricola' horn in your photo  ;D, I noticed the vertical cylindrical forms attached around the bases of the fluted columns.  Tube traps? Speakers? if so, PA for voice only?
musical volition > vibrations > voltages > numeric values > voltages > vibrations> virtual teleportation time-machine experience
Better recording made easy - >>Improved PAS table<< | Made excellent- >>click here to download the Oddball Microphone Technique illustrated PDF booklet<< (note: This is a 1st draft, now several years old and in need of revision!  Stay tuned)

jnorman34

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Re: Team classical recording
« Reply #77 on: September 20, 2009, 07:25:34 PM »
thanks gb - yep, that is a hella space with amazing natural reverb.  and yes, those are speakers for the PA - did not notice what kind.

Offline guosh86

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Re: Team classical recording
« Reply #78 on: September 22, 2009, 06:28:15 AM »
sounds great! i'd kill for a space like that...

great musicians + great space + great recording =  :happy:


on a side note, i got the jecklin disk done and did a choir recording with it  ;D thanks gb for all the help!

Offline Brian Skalinder

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Re: Team classical recording
« Reply #79 on: September 22, 2009, 10:53:48 AM »
i got the jecklin disk done and did a choir recording with it  ;D thanks gb for all the help!

Nice disk!  How'd the recording turn out?
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Offline guosh86

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Re: Team classical recording
« Reply #80 on: September 22, 2009, 11:31:01 AM »
hey brian!

turned out pretty good. interesting how it sounds though. here's a short snippet... let me know what you think!

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Re: Team classical recording
« Reply #81 on: September 22, 2009, 01:27:43 PM »
guosh86 -- I like it!  I admit, though, I'm partial to baffled omnis v. split.  I like the sound on the sample you provided.  How does it sound "interesting" to you?  Tough for me to tell what you mean, since I'm not familiar with the performance group, recording space, other recordings you've made before, etc.
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Offline guosh86

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Re: Team classical recording
« Reply #82 on: September 22, 2009, 01:54:55 PM »
i felt it was interesting because i had a small threading issue with the right mic flange - it was probably an inch further away from the disk than the left side. thus, at times i felt i got quite a different sound from my left and right channel. i felt the imaging on the left was much better, whereas the right side was rather hazy - it was sounding a little like my usual omnis, rather roomy

in the end i compensated by turning up my pre levels on the left a little to balance with the right side. strangely it still turned out fine! right now i'm curious as to how it would sound if i get my mics equidistant from the disk... and i might find out soon. might be recording a guitar ensemble tomorrow!

i posted this up on gearslutz too, and one comment was that it sounded like cardoids! i'm not sure how the jecklin should sound, my recordings certainly don't sound like what i heard from the takacs quartet early string quartets cd (well, duh. they're a string quartet and i'm recording a choir  ;D but i still felt quite a bit of tonal difference). don't get me wrong though, i'm quite happy with the results of my first test of the disk. sounded realistic to me when i was monitoring with my IEMs... i walked up to the disk to have a listen at times, and it seemed really accurate

any tips of placement though? i've read that the jecklin has a recording angle of 45, so i'd be capturing a soundstage of approximately 90 degrees. however, i also read that it has to be placed closer than other techniques. whats your experience though? i'm really new to this and i'd like to maximize my recordings!

also, i've got a clip of a song that had the choir walk in from the back of the room and take up positions along the middle aisle, kind of a surround effect. sounds great on earphones... i could upload it if you're interested.

this is the room i recorded in... a really small chapel, 2nd floor of an art museum. nice and cosy  :)

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Re: Team classical recording
« Reply #83 on: September 22, 2009, 05:21:12 PM »
Curious if you got a chance to listen with your IEMs while positioning the disk and playing with the mic spacing.  Personally I really learn a lot about how the configuration works by doing that.  Another great way to learn exactly how your configuration responds is to set it up and do the classic 'walk around' test: make a quick recording of yourself walking all the way around the rig in a circle, stopping and announcing your position at intervals along the way (an easy way is announcing the clock face numbers- 12:00, 1:00, 2:00 etc, might use tighter 30 minute increments for better angular resolution the front stage).  It can be useful to repeat the walk at several different distances from the mics so you get a feel for how things change with distance.  That way you get a good feel for the recording angle, imaging qualities, tone and sense of depth for various mic'ing distances.  Just remember to announce the distance at the beginning of the track so you don't get mixed up when you listen.  I've setup and done this in the parking lot of a nearby church, to assess various A-B spacings, mic angles and the effect of sphere attachments on the mics, and got some odd looks in the process. 8)  If you get a chance to do it before or after the session in the actual room then all the better.

I look forward to listening to your sample tonight. I'd love to hear the 'choir walk' clip too if you get a chance.
« Last Edit: September 22, 2009, 05:23:59 PM by Gutbucket »
musical volition > vibrations > voltages > numeric values > voltages > vibrations> virtual teleportation time-machine experience
Better recording made easy - >>Improved PAS table<< | Made excellent- >>click here to download the Oddball Microphone Technique illustrated PDF booklet<< (note: This is a 1st draft, now several years old and in need of revision!  Stay tuned)

Offline guosh86

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Re: Team classical recording
« Reply #84 on: September 23, 2009, 12:30:11 PM »
hey gb!

i've seen that test being done on youtube actually. haven't had a chance to try it out yet though, my room's really small and cluttered so there isn't much space to move around. i'd like to try it at the venue though, would really help my decisions in mic placement. problem is that i'm rarely allowed into the venues before the performers arrive  >:(

i can imagine it looks really odd though, but then again they'd probably figure that out when i whip out my furry jecklin!  ;D   

usually i setup in the hall in the midst of the soundcheck and commit one of the most basic mistakes... i judge the sound of the ensemble from where i am setting up (eg. in one of the corners of the hall) and see how realistic it is. now i feel i should walk around and locate the sound that i wish to capture before i place my mics

i'm never happy with the sound i capture though, i always feel it is missing a little something... clarity, tone, maybe a little magic dust. i'll have to figure something out in the next recording session i have, but its probably more to do with my technique than anything. gear would definitely make a difference, but as brian has pointed out to me, it'd be more beneficial for me to maximize the potential of what i have before an upgrade in gear would make any sense. i'm sure i can get good results with what i have, i just haven't found out how yet!


excuse the rant, got a little carried away  ;D

i got the choir walk track here: https://www.yousendit.com/download/ZW9EYkJtcWZubVZjR0E9PQ
basically what they did was they started with a solo soprano in the middle of the stage, joined later on by another soprano as the rest of the choir walked in from the back of the room in 2 files, turning towards the audience in the chairs as they sang.

apologies though, i was messing around with my T+ UA-5, as i accidentally turned the left channel down. started recording a little late, and raised the height of the mics for the actual performance. personally i felt the rehearsal placement was better, but thats life isn't it?

cheers,
guo

jnorman34

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Re: Team classical recording
« Reply #85 on: September 25, 2009, 10:18:14 PM »
hi guys - as we all know, trying to record live performances of classical music with audiences present, often mixed in with passing truck noises, HVAC issues, etc, can be a very problematic affair, and rife with heavy background noise in the tracks.  what kind of noise reduction plugins are you using, and how are you compensating for the various effects that noise reduction has on the overall EQ of the result?

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Re: Team classical recording
« Reply #86 on: September 26, 2009, 03:08:48 PM »
I've been using iZotope RX (I use it standalone, but it also can be used as a plugin in many audio editors) since May.  There is a thread on it in the computer section.

I love it.

Jeff

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Re: Team classical recording
« Reply #87 on: September 26, 2009, 03:32:55 PM »
I've played around with the tools available in Samplitude (my version also included the Cleaning & Restoration suite) and have gotten some good results reducing HVAC rumble and other background noise, impulse de-clicking for fabric rubbing against mic noises, and spectral editing for coughs, squeaks, candy wrappers and that one especially loud clapper that always seems to sit nearby.  Not sure how comparable it is to Izotope RX and I haven't had the time to get into it deep enough to really commit to applying it.. just enough to know that it works well when applied properly.  I'm holding off on committing to applying those modifications until I have my playback system really well sorted.
musical volition > vibrations > voltages > numeric values > voltages > vibrations> virtual teleportation time-machine experience
Better recording made easy - >>Improved PAS table<< | Made excellent- >>click here to download the Oddball Microphone Technique illustrated PDF booklet<< (note: This is a 1st draft, now several years old and in need of revision!  Stay tuned)

Offline guosh86

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Re: Team classical recording
« Reply #88 on: September 29, 2009, 06:47:00 AM »
been using the waves x-noise and z-noise

i find z-noise pretty effective, as it has eq built-in where i can adjust the eq on the spot to keep the sound as similar as possible (though with pretty poor speakers, i'm not really that sure and don't dare to tinker around too much)

however, the guys who i work with in the studio aren't very impressed by the waves restoration bundle. its probably not the best value for money, and there are probably better plugins to use. i forgot exactly what they were recommending, but i'll ask the next time i go down.

so far i've only had to use the noise reduction for the inherent noise of my equipment, extracting the noise from a quiet track and then reducing it by a certain measure. haven't experimented with removing all the other background noises yet though. i take it as part and parcel of a live performance  ::)

curious as to how it works too though

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Re: Team classical recording
« Reply #89 on: January 27, 2010, 04:12:28 PM »
tap, tap, tap..

Pretty quiet in here, but then a low noise floor is fitting for the team classical thread I suppose.

A last minute posting.. I'm not familiar with these works, which will be performed tonight in a benefit for Haiti.  If any of you are familiar with them, can you tell me what dynamics I might expect? With a full 125 piece orchestra I suppose I should prepare for full scale symphonic range regardless, but I suspect much of the material may be more mornful and heartwrenching than bombastic:

Barber: Adagio for Strings
Elgar: Nimrod from Enigma Variations
Beethoven: Leonore Overture No. 3
Tchaikovsky: Symphony No. 4
musical volition > vibrations > voltages > numeric values > voltages > vibrations> virtual teleportation time-machine experience
Better recording made easy - >>Improved PAS table<< | Made excellent- >>click here to download the Oddball Microphone Technique illustrated PDF booklet<< (note: This is a 1st draft, now several years old and in need of revision!  Stay tuned)

 

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