Author Topic: MG N-Box signup thread (Read 22839 times)

Myco · « **on:** March 02, 2010, 12:47:55 PM »

After speaking to JD, we've decided that it may help to get this done if it was known how many people may be interested in buying one of these, if it existed yet. If the builder/s involved knew how many of us want one of these then maybe it would provide a little incentive to create one.

If you would be interested in buying a N-box for Microtech Gefell capsules please post your interest here in this thread.

Count me in as #1

Thanks!

JD · « **Reply #1 on:** March 02, 2010, 01:10:43 PM »

I'd want one for sure, probably would get two of them just to run two different pairs of caps.

boa · « **Reply #2 on:** March 02, 2010, 01:16:12 PM »

I'm in for whenever it comes to fruition.

OOK · « **Reply #3 on:** March 02, 2010, 02:36:58 PM »

I know JD has talk about this for a while. if anyone has the ability JD can do this... If it can be built he will, if it can't he won't waste his time... or let it flounder like some other well known projects..

Be optimistic...

Sign Me up OOK

bhtoque · « **Reply #4 on:** March 02, 2010, 02:43:32 PM »

Me too.

JAson

Todd R · « **Reply #5 on:** March 02, 2010, 02:50:48 PM »

Well, I have Gefells and love active setups, so I'll at least sign onto the thread.

That said, I'm probably more in the 10-25% chance I'd get one. It'd depend on the price, my taping activity when it rolls around, and my overall level of sluttiness.

Having already sold the m20 caps (which would turn out to be a major mistake if this box happens), I'll be still holding onto my Milab vm44-links, and I'm not sure the level of taping I'm doing these days justifies spending a lot more to get active-style hypers.

Still, beyond the current MG user base, I'd imagine that a active/n-box type rig for gefells would make them much more popular around here.

dactylus · « **Reply #6 on:** March 02, 2010, 06:04:57 PM »

I would definitely be in for a MG Nbox...

Chomps · « **Reply #7 on:** March 02, 2010, 06:20:57 PM »

Yes Yes and YES

dave w · « **Reply #8 on:** March 02, 2010, 06:33:42 PM »

So, I owned my Gefells for 12+ years, and the week after I sell them this long talked about fantasy actually takes a real step towards reality? AAARRRGGHH.

edtyre · « **Reply #9 on:** March 02, 2010, 07:44:20 PM »

From what i understand, the current N-box can be used to run the MG caps with a custom active cable
that has to be built from scratch (no parts to buy like the schoeps one) everything has to be made.
Shit....if this puppy ever gets made i'll buy a set of actives and some MG caps. Whats stopped me before
from running these is no actives for the MG's.

An Nbox will be a sought after piece of gear if you have the option of running schoeps, MG and AKG
caps just by changing to a different set of active cables for each brand of mic caps.

Colin Liston · « **Reply #10 on:** March 02, 2010, 08:11:23 PM »

I am in!

manitouman · « **Reply #11 on:** March 02, 2010, 08:48:10 PM »

Thanks Dave for pointing me to this thread...Sign me up!

I've even expressed interest in helping out with a monetary investment. I don't know just how much is involved with the development of one of these but I wouldn't mind plunking down a few Benjamin's to get this going

JD · « **Reply #12 on:** March 03, 2010, 03:30:22 AM »

Quote from: edtyre on March 02, 2010, 07:44:20 PM

From what i understand, the current N-box can be used to run the MG caps with a custom active cable
that has to be built from scratch (no parts to buy like the schoeps one) everything has to be made.

That's what Bill and I had talked about, If the voltages were the same as the schoeps, it would mostly be a matter of making custom cabling and plug ends. If they were different then some re-designing would be required.

From what I can vaguely recall, Bill had said that a three conductor wire would be needed for each cap and a small circuit would be needed at the cap to, I think, compensate for the capacitance of the added wire? Don't remember the exact details as this was some time ago.

Getting the custom plug made should not be a problem, I deal with machine shops on a regular basis. The design I have in my head right now would involve having about 6 or 7 small parts machined and a small circuit of some sort. The first couple of prototypes would be a little costly, but once the design is hammered out and the CNC code is written, the price of the parts would be considerable less, especially if the could be made in batches of say 25 or 50 at a time.

I gave allot of thought about the plug design tonight and am pretty sure I know how to go about everything. The only thing I am not real sure of is how much room would be needed for the circuitry.

I'll make some rough sketches up when I have some free time. When/if I am confident that someone with the know how is committed to designing the electronics, I will have the sketches drawn up on auto-cad at work and send them out for pricing quotes.

ashevillain · « **Reply #13 on:** March 03, 2010, 09:07:40 AM »

*Off topic - If someone could ever do something like this for the Audio Technica 405x series I'd be all over it!

spcyrfc · « **Reply #14 on:** March 03, 2010, 09:42:17 AM »

dont own geffels, but i like the idea, and would be in for a box depending on price.

ShawnF · « **Reply #15 on:** March 03, 2010, 12:54:18 PM »

I'm interested enough to follow this closely. Actual purchase would hinge on the price.

dbindc · « **Reply #16 on:** March 03, 2010, 01:22:54 PM »

I seem to remember someone posting a few years back - Oleg I think, that it was possible to use MBHO capsules on Gefell bodies. Think they are both 21mm, similar threads and single connecting pin. I always wanted to try it but could never convince the only taper I know with MG200's to let me test it. Anyhow if this is true I wonder if it would be possible to use the MBHO colettes as a vehicle to send signal to this proposed MG box.

JD · « **Reply #17 on:** March 03, 2010, 01:30:36 PM »

Quote from: dbindc on March 03, 2010, 01:22:54 PM

I seem to remember someone posting a few years back - Oleg I think, that it was possible to use MBHO capsules on Gefell bodies. Think they are both 21mm, similar threads and single connecting pin. I always wanted to try it but could never convince the only taper I know with MG200's to let me test it. Anyhow if this is true I wonder if it would be possible to use the MBHO colettes as a vehicle to send signal to this proposed MG box.

I tried this with Otheronek's MBHO bodies and my gefell caps, the threads are close but not close enough. Forcing the two together would probably result in threads being damaged.

yug du nord · « **Reply #18 on:** March 03, 2010, 06:23:04 PM »

Quote from: spcyrfc on March 03, 2010, 09:42:17 AM

dont own geffels, but i like the idea, and would be in for a box depending on price.

ingsy · « **Reply #19 on:** March 03, 2010, 08:04:56 PM »

::wishes he never sold his MGs::

count me in.

it-goes-to-eleven · « **Reply #20 on:** March 03, 2010, 08:11:41 PM »

How do we know this isn't going to sound spitty?

bish · « **Reply #21 on:** March 03, 2010, 09:27:46 PM »

Count me in i would love that !!

jlykos · « **Reply #22 on:** March 04, 2010, 08:09:38 AM »

As with Todd, it would depend on price. Also, I have been so accustomed to running full bodies for so long that I don't know what the actual benefit would be to run actives. Finally, I would not want anything that would cause the cable to be hard-wired to the capsule. If I can remove the capsules, fine, but hard-wiring is a deal breaker for me.

Myco · « **Reply #23 on:** March 04, 2010, 09:27:07 AM »

Quote from: jlykos on March 04, 2010, 08:09:38 AM

As with Todd, it would depend on price. Also, I have been so accustomed to running full bodies for so long that I don't know what the actual benefit would be to run actives. Finally, I would not want anything that would cause the cable to be hard-wired to the capsule. If I can remove the capsules, fine, but hard-wiring is a deal breaker for me.

The capsules would screw on just like on a normal microphone body and would be removable. The main advantage would be a reduction in overall size and allow you to use your gefell's in less than open taping situations, at least as far as I understand it.

below are some pix of a Nbox with Schoeps capsules attached.

dactylus · « **Reply #24 on:** March 28, 2010, 09:48:27 AM »

bip bip

dactylus · « **Reply #25 on:** April 03, 2010, 09:11:38 AM »

Any new developments?

JD · « **Reply #26 on:** April 03, 2010, 12:35:16 PM »

Quote from: dactylus on April 03, 2010, 09:11:38 AM

Any new developments?

I received Myco's JK Lab box last week, Haven't really had the time to play with it yet. I did take the cover off on the inside, and I must say, I am amazed at how little circuitry is in that box. Looks to be a small shrunk-wrapped battery of some sorts, and just a dozen or so caps and resistors. Most of the circuit looks to be for the stepped pot that is a variable HPF. Almost looks too simple.

My plans for this box are as follows.

First I want to do a blind comparison of this box verses the gefell bodies and see how there compare.
second, I want to try make some frequency graphs of the comps and see how they compare.
Then, I will attempt to reverse engineer the circuit, and take it to someone with the know-how to suggest improvements.

FYI, the JK Labs box is as follows:

--one channel in via 4 pin plug(should be able to just double everything for two channels)
--1/4" TRS out (wired to two XLR's)
--has a 3.5 mini out
--has no on/off switch (inside the unit it says to remove the cap when not in use)
--has no gain
--has a 6 position rotary switch for 6 different base roll-offs (I am assuming one is unity)
--runs on one 9V and is marked as having a 350 hour battery life!!!!
--has a current draw of 1.5 mah
--the box measures 1 1/4" X 2 3/8" X 4 3/8" (there is a lot of unused space inside, so I'm guessing a two channel unit would be somewhere around 50% larger)
--there looks to be a battery pack of some sort permanently wired inside. I kind of remember Bill telling me that his R-boxes had something like twelve watch batteries in series to make a polarization voltage??? for the caps, and that there was almost no current involved so the batteries would literally last for many years, I'm guessing that is the case here as well)

All Good Things in all Good Time.

Myco · « **Reply #27 on:** April 03, 2010, 12:41:28 PM »

Thank you for all of your efforts Jamie!

dactylus · « **Reply #28 on:** April 03, 2010, 02:51:00 PM »

Quote from: Myco on April 03, 2010, 12:41:28 PM

Thank you for all of your efforts Jamie!

^^

I second that emotion! Thank you Jamie!!

daspyknows · « **Reply #29 on:** April 10, 2010, 03:18:55 PM »

I have one of the original two RBoxes Bill built. That is the schematic used for the NBox. The RBox was an evolution of a box built for Nak 700's. Between Bill and Nick there is little doubt in my mind that a kick ass box will be built. As long as there is enough interest to justify the development this will happen.

Nick just lent me an NBox to travel with it to record Clapton Winwood in Europe. Slick design.

Myco · « **Reply #30 on:** April 11, 2010, 12:34:31 PM »

I was thinking that maybe this circuitry could be made to fit into some strong, but non-metallic, housing to limit the chances of it being picked by wands and such? Just a thought.

dactylus · « **Reply #31 on:** April 12, 2010, 03:27:56 PM »

Quote from: Myco on April 11, 2010, 12:34:31 PM

I was thinking that maybe this circuitry could be made to fit into some strong, but non-metallic, housing to limit the chances of it being picked by wands and such? Just a thought.

^
Sounds like a good idea to me, something like the lightweight, seemingly indestructible plastic that "cigar caddies" are made of would make a great MG-J(amie)box...

it-goes-to-eleven · « **Reply #32 on:** April 12, 2010, 04:05:34 PM »

Plastic! Didn't I see you in The Graduate? It is truly amazing nobody has ever thought of that before!

And, heck, why don't we also remove the shielding from the mic cables!

dactylus · « **Reply #33 on:** April 12, 2010, 04:14:29 PM »

Quote from: Freelunch on April 12, 2010, 04:05:34 PM

Plastic! Didn't I see you in The Graduate? It is truly amazing nobody has ever thought of that before!

And, heck, why don't we also remove the shielding from the mic cables!

^

Oh, I see now, that was post 6 666 for you...

nic · « **Reply #34 on:** April 12, 2010, 04:38:41 PM »

just a FYI for those looking to build one of these boxes.

I used to own a JK Labs ECMS-23 for the MGs and I remember a conversation Jon and I had with regards to the cables/caps.
at some point in production of the caps, MG changed the length of the center pin on the caps that plugs into the bodies. I do not remember what serial # range the change occurred at but you need to be careful if you have m20, m21, etc to make sure the pin is the same length (or the active cable has play in the connection to accommodate slightly different length pins).
what Jon told me was pretty much of your caps are relatively close to each other serial # wise you should be fine interchanging the caps on the active cables but if there was a wide difference in serial #s to closely compare the caps to see if 1 pin stuck out further than the other.

if I remember correctly the difference in length was maybe 1mm or so but I can not vouch exactly for that #...

Gutbucket · « **Reply #35 on:** April 12, 2010, 06:17:13 PM »

Quote from: Todd R on March 02, 2010, 02:50:48 PM

..I'm probably more in the 10-25% chance I'd get one. It'd depend on the price, my taping activity when it rolls around, and my overall level of sluttiness.

^^^
I'm in this boat too.

JD · « **Reply #36 on:** April 12, 2010, 11:41:54 PM »

Quote from: nic on April 12, 2010, 04:38:41 PM

just a FYI for those looking to build one of these boxes.

I used to own a JK Labs ECMS-23 for the MGs and I remember a conversation Jon and I had with regards to the cables/caps.
at some point in production of the caps, MG changed the length of the center pin on the caps that plugs into the bodies. I do not remember what serial # range the change occurred at but you need to be careful if you have m20, m21, etc to make sure the pin is the same length (or the active cable has play in the connection to accommodate slightly different length pins).
what Jon told me was pretty much of your caps are relatively close to each other serial # wise you should be fine interchanging the caps on the active cables but if there was a wide difference in serial #s to closely compare the caps to see if 1 pin stuck out further than the other.

if I remember correctly the difference in length was maybe 1mm or so but I can not vouch exactly for that #...

Good to know, thanks for posting.

I was just looking at some gold plated spring contacts that had a 2 1/2 mm range, so it shouldn't be a problem if they are set so that they cover both pin lengths.

dactylus · « **Reply #37 on:** May 08, 2010, 09:34:16 AM »

May bump,,,

bhadella · « **Reply #38 on:** May 20, 2010, 10:04:52 AM »

Getting the itch for gefell hypers and would prefer an n-box to full bodies.

dactylus · « **Reply #39 on:** May 20, 2010, 08:12:16 PM »

Quote from: bhadella on May 20, 2010, 10:04:52 AM

Getting the itch for gefell hypers and would prefer an n-box to full bodies.

4CH Gefell: Nbox + full bodies

Chilly Brioschi · « **Reply #40 on:** May 21, 2010, 03:41:11 PM »

I'll take one if the box is cedar.
I've always liked the look of real wood.

Seriously, if it is adaptable to the MBHOs, I'm in.
And I mean the 4pin mini-DIN actives...

Thick steel is my actual preference for construction.
I don't care if it beeps a wand, I don't want it "wookified"

it-goes-to-eleven · « **Reply #41 on:** May 21, 2010, 03:50:06 PM »

Quote from: 6o6 on May 21, 2010, 03:41:11 PM

I don't care if it beeps a wand, I don't want it "wookified"

It will be hemp, tie-dye, and you'll like it!

jlykos · « **Reply #42 on:** May 21, 2010, 08:05:11 PM »

I want mine made out of solid gold to match the decor in my gold house.

perks · « **Reply #43 on:** May 21, 2010, 09:08:27 PM »

Did I hear the prototype was encased in a unicorn horn? or am I making that up. My memory isn't what it used to be ;-)

manitouman · « **Reply #44 on:** June 07, 2010, 12:13:32 AM »

I want mine made out of chia pet pottery. Talk about stealth!

it-goes-to-eleven · « **Reply #45 on:** June 07, 2010, 12:47:29 PM »

I want mine vajazzled in swarovski crystals.

Myco · « **Reply #46 on:** June 07, 2010, 02:38:48 PM »

I want go-go gadget utilities built in like Inspector Gadget. Maybe like a grappling hook to reach up to those balconies where I couldn't get a seat, or expandable legs or something.

Scooter123 · « **Reply #47 on:** June 18, 2010, 11:03:18 AM »

I want mine made out of real corinthian leather.

dactylus · « **Reply #48 on:** June 18, 2010, 11:05:37 AM »

I just want mine in hand...

Myco · « **Reply #49 on:** June 18, 2010, 01:05:35 PM »

J.D. is the main contact on this guys. I don't think we are close yet to getting these done, but it is being discussed.

jlykos · « **Reply #50 on:** June 18, 2010, 03:43:30 PM »

Quote from: Myco on June 18, 2010, 01:05:35 PM

J.D. is the main contact on this guys. I don't think we are close yet to getting these done, but it is being discussed.

Good, thanks for the update. I was wondering whether to get the yellow or white gold bookshelves for my gold house. I will hold off on the purchase until I can get a look at the shade of my gold MG NBox.

Myco · « **Reply #51 on:** June 19, 2010, 10:42:52 AM »

Quote from: jlykos on June 18, 2010, 03:43:30 PM

Quote from: Myco on June 18, 2010, 01:05:35 PM
J.D. is the main contact on this guys. I don't think we are close yet to getting these done, but it is being discussed.

Good, thanks for the update. I was wondering whether to get the yellow or white gold bookshelves for my gold house. I will hold off on the purchase until I can get a look at the shade of my gold MG NBox.

Go for the yellow gold to accentuate your "bling" factor. Homies don't do white gold.

page · « **Reply #52 on:** June 19, 2010, 12:15:44 PM »

Quote from: nic on April 12, 2010, 04:38:41 PM

just a FYI for those looking to build one of these boxes.

I used to own a JK Labs ECMS-23 for the MGs and I remember a conversation Jon and I had with regards to the cables/caps.
at some point in production of the caps, MG changed the length of the center pin on the caps that plugs into the bodies. I do not remember what serial # range the change occurred at but you need to be careful if you have m20, m21, etc to make sure the pin is the same length (or the active cable has play in the connection to accommodate slightly different length pins).
what Jon told me was pretty much of your caps are relatively close to each other serial # wise you should be fine interchanging the caps on the active cables but if there was a wide difference in serial #s to closely compare the caps to see if 1 pin stuck out further than the other.

if I remember correctly the difference in length was maybe 1mm or so but I can not vouch exactly for that #...

Didn't he also make a version of his box that was powered off of incoming P48 (so it didn't require any batteries in the box itself) or was that just for one of the other mic sets?

Every now and then I get the hankering to pick up a set of MGs. Every now and then....

dactylus · « **Reply #53 on:** June 20, 2010, 12:51:12 PM »

Quote from: page on June 19, 2010, 12:15:44 PM

Quote from: nic on April 12, 2010, 04:38:41 PM

Every now and then I get the hankering to pick up a set of MGs. Every now and then....

^
I can't imagine you having any regrets in fulfilling that hankering.

page · « **Reply #54 on:** June 20, 2010, 02:55:37 PM »

Quote from: dactylus on June 20, 2010, 12:51:12 PM

Quote from: page on June 19, 2010, 12:15:44 PM
Quote from: nic on April 12, 2010, 04:38:41 PM

Every now and then I get the hankering to pick up a set of MGs. Every now and then....

^
I can't imagine you having any regrets in fulfilling that hankering.

Other then my wallet.

I'd have to borrow a pair for a bit before dropping the beyers. We'll see, all in good time.

dactylus · « **Reply #55 on:** July 20, 2010, 09:45:41 AM »

^^^ July MG N-Box bump ^^^

Myco · « **Reply #56 on:** July 20, 2010, 10:29:05 AM »

I sent an email to Jamie looking for an update, but I haven't heard anything from him since mid-June.

bhadella · « **Reply #57 on:** September 07, 2010, 10:37:31 AM »

It's getting close to my birthday. Daddy wants a gefell nbox!!!

Myco · « **Reply #58 on:** September 07, 2010, 10:54:41 AM »

Don't think this is going to happen. I spoke with Jamie and he said that it would take more effort to make these than their is interest in having them made.

We only had a few people who were definite in wanting these and to have the electronics set up and have the boxes machined it would have been too cost prohibitive.

dactylus · « **Reply #59 on:** September 07, 2010, 12:09:25 PM »

Quote from: Myco on September 07, 2010, 10:54:41 AM

Don't think this is going to happen. I spoke with Jamie and he said that it would take more effort to make these than their is interest in having them made.
We only had a few people who were definite in wanting these and to have the electronics set up and have the boxes machined it would have been too cost prohibitory.

Nuts!!

I wonder if Jon at Naiant would be interested in tackling this once he investigates the AKG actives project?

...damn, damn, damn...

page · « **Reply #60 on:** September 07, 2010, 02:38:48 PM »

Quote from: dactylus on September 07, 2010, 12:09:25 PM

Quote from: Myco on September 07, 2010, 10:54:41 AM
Don't think this is going to happen. I spoke with Jamie and he said that it would take more effort to make these than their is interest in having them made.
We only had a few people who were definite in wanting these and to have the electronics set up and have the boxes machined it would have been too cost prohibitory.

Nuts!!

I wonder if Jon at Naiant would be interested in tackling this once he investigates the AKG actives project?

...damn, damn, damn...

I wonder what "cost effective" works out to for about 20 boxes and spare parts for another 15 or so (in case some stuff breaks later and they have to be serviced).

Myco · « **Reply #61 on:** September 07, 2010, 02:51:15 PM »

Quote from: page on September 07, 2010, 02:38:48 PM

Quote from: dactylus on September 07, 2010, 12:09:25 PM
Quote from: Myco on September 07, 2010, 10:54:41 AM
Don't think this is going to happen. I spoke with Jamie and he said that it would take more effort to make these than their is interest in having them made.
We only had a few people who were definite in wanting these and to have the electronics set up and have the boxes machined it would have been too cost prohibitory.

Nuts!!

I wonder if Jon at Naiant would be interested in tackling this once he investigates the AKG actives project?

...damn, damn, damn...

I wonder what "cost effective" works out to for about 20 boxes and spare parts for another 15 or so (in case some stuff breaks later and they have to be serviced).

I guess the original electrical engineer, Bill, is not interested as he is too busy these days. We only had about 12 "definites" which may turn into only 6-9 actual sales. We would probably have to foot the bill to have another electrical engineer do the schematics, so this could be too expensive unless we had more people commit and maybe lay out some $$ up front. We just didn't see this as being a viable project in the current economic situation.

schoepsnbox · « **Reply #62 on:** September 07, 2010, 07:02:07 PM »

There is still hope for this project...I've had the brass colettes machined for both the MG caps and the akg's..just have to keep bugging Bill till he decides he has some free time to work on it with me..Don't loose the faith

Myco · « **Reply #63 on:** September 07, 2010, 10:26:18 PM »

Wow, that's kinda good news. I actually had given up hope. I'm still in if this eventually does happen.

manitouman · « **Reply #64 on:** September 08, 2010, 12:40:24 AM »

Count me in as well for the MG box. I'm even willing to put up a few bucks if it helps it along. Taken off the top of the cost of my unit of course

page · « **Reply #65 on:** September 08, 2010, 08:33:32 AM »

I'd pick up MG caps if there was a box, but I'm not going back to bodies now that I have >75% of that sound in a remote cap already anyway. Correct, it's not Gefell, but it works and that's the trade off.

But if there was a box, I could have cake and eat it too...

I think the cost effectiveness is also driven by spare boxes to sell over the 18-24months after the initial distribution, and spare parts. If someone had the capital up front, that would be an option to allow for service later, and extra parts made to satisfy fabrication scale realities.

dactylus · « **Reply #66 on:** September 08, 2010, 10:37:20 AM »

I'm very happy with the Milab VM-44 Links, but it would be great to run the Gefell M20 and M21 caps in an active setup...

willndmb · « **Reply #67 on:** September 08, 2010, 07:57:52 PM »

Quote from: schoepsnbox on September 07, 2010, 07:02:07 PM

There is still hope for this project...I've had the brass colettes machined for both the MG caps and the akg's..just have to keep bugging Bill till he decides he has some free time to work on it with me..Don't loose the faith

dactylus · « **Reply #68 on:** November 07, 2010, 11:22:28 AM »

dactylus · « **Reply #69 on:** December 10, 2010, 04:54:23 PM »

My m21 caps are bored.

Help Me Rhonda, Help, Help Me Rhonda...

Myco · « **Reply #70 on:** December 10, 2010, 06:48:36 PM »

Yes Virginia, there is a Santa Claus.

dactylus · « **Reply #71 on:** December 11, 2010, 04:22:27 AM »

Quote from: Myco on December 10, 2010, 06:48:36 PM

Yes Virginia, there is a Santa Claus.

^
I hope the gefell actives happen sometime in the next decade or two...

page · « **Reply #72 on:** December 11, 2010, 02:41:44 PM »

Quote from: dactylus on December 11, 2010, 04:22:27 AM

Quote from: Myco on December 10, 2010, 06:48:36 PM
Yes Virginia, there is a Santa Claus.

^
I hope the gefell actives happen sometime in the next decade or two...

I guess deep down inside, I do too.

dactylus · « **Reply #73 on:** December 13, 2010, 08:03:19 AM »

The release of the Milab VM-44 Link hyper capsule appears imminent:

http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=114343.msg1825860#msg1825860

I'd still like to see the Gefell actives make the scene!!