Topic: first time concert shooting advice

[Jimna]

im catching DBT thursday in harrisburg.  ive been reading till the wee hrs on how to use the new camera (rebel XT w/ 24-70 f2. but still feel completely confused and lost on which situation to use which setting.  i do know i cant expect the first time out to render the best pics in the world, but hope some are worth while. 

so do i just want to run in the Av mode?  or is manual mode (M) what i want to do, keeping my f # low and shutter speed high? 

also the day after, friday, my wife is graduating from grad school.  why i have your attention what would people recommend in this situation?  its in a large performing arts building.  BJ gave me his 2cents on this, but any other opinions are welcome here too, as this is much more important to me than the concert.  this night is a huge moment for my family and i cant get it back, so no fucking this up!


one last newb question; does anyone here use the auto focus?  or is everyone here using the manual focus?  i took pics of my kid last night using the AF that after close inspection were slightly out of focus.  not sure if i could do any better manually but i figured any advice on this would be good to know as well.  all the reading ive been doing has nothing on the matter, maybe for obvious reasons, i dont know.


thanks
jim

[Sanjay]

For concerts what I do is this:

Get as close as you can, obviously, I feel that the closer you are the less light falloff will occur before it reaches your lens, maybe I'm wrong and that's not scientific I just feel that way.
Always shoot in Manual, AV mode will not account for the situation and will often try and over expose the shot.  Start with 2.8 and a shutter speed of around 1/200th depending on the light, then gradually work it up or down.  Remember you can always half correct underexposed shots, but if you blow out the image with too much brightness you can't correct that.

Zoom in on the shot to check focus, when focus starts to go you've gotten the shutter speed usually too slow (around 1/60th).  Shoot in RAW, you can always work better afterwards with that.  I don't know what your ISO capabilities are, but depending I would say keep your ISO at 800 or above, if it starts to look ridiculously grainy, lower the ISO.  The Truckers have an open photo policy, so take your time, you have all show.  I use autofocus, but then again my lenses focus more or less correctly.  Try setting a static focus point and using that instead of letting it autoselect for you.  IF that doesn't work read in your manual on how to calibrate a lens for a camera.

Now following those guidelines depending on the lighting you are going to get different results.  These were shot at two different shows, each at 1/200th of a second, same ISO, the worse one was at 1.8 and more wide open than the better one.  Point being, sometimes it's a crapshoot and don't be disappointed if your results aren't that good.  Some clubs like the 9:30 club I can't get a good shot if my life depends on it (but this weekend I will)

good lighting: f2.8 1/200th of a second


bad bad lighting f1.8 1/200th of a second


For your wife's graduation it will be very much the same method as a concert, except you might be able to go to f3.5 and keep the shutter speed around 1/400th or higher.  Test it out on people who aren't important.

[spreetaper]

I myself shoot mainly AUTO (ISO 800-1600) and usually the following lenses listed below

I usually use Tv and i adjust from 1/30 to 1/300 or so accordingly through shows where needed
since your almost always shooting in low light if not very low light the aperture will take care of itself usually as low as it can go 2.8/1.8/1.4 depending on the lense
last but not least I actually do both up front and from the taper section/just front of board area
then again I am 6' 8 and can see over just about everybody with ease from anywhere in a venue most of the times
this also allows me to take shots just about no one else can.. like looking directly eye level at the keyboard player and his/her hands

to finish I am certainly an amateur and always learning new things and will probably be doing more manual focus in the future
but for now I am happy with my results
plenty of samples in the rig pictures section..

24-70mm f2.8
70-200mmf2.8
50mm f1.8
85 f1.8
50mm f1.4   

[Jimna]

great advice, thanks.  i think ill be following this recipe to the T.  very nice pics sanjay!  i can only hope for something that crisp.  hopefully the concert tomorrow will be a good lesson for me to pull better pics at graduation. 

i never realized how deep photography is, but man i really like it.  i feel slightly obsessed this last week...

[jdawg]

I may see you at the show, going to try and make it.  I second Sanjay's advice. I always shoot in manual mode, most recently using the 85 1.8.  I tend to stop it down to 2.0 for a little more depth. So in your case, keep it on 2.8, and manually set the ISO. My 40D handes iso1600 with no problem, the XT may be a little more sensitive to noise when set that high. Then just adjust the SS until the exposure looks good. I also use AF - with a custom selected point, rather than the camera selecting multiple points to focus on. Again, not sure how much flexibility the XT gives you on selecting the focus point. If I do make it out, I'll give you more pointers there!

[Jimna]

I may see you at the show, going to try and make it.  I second Sanjay's advice. I always shoot in manual mode, most recently using the 85 1.8.  I tend to stop it down to 2.0 for a little more depth. So in your case, keep it on 2.8, and manually set the ISO. My 40D handes iso1600 with no problem, the XT may be a little more sensitive to noise when set that high. Then just adjust the SS until the exposure looks good. I also use AF - with a custom selected point, rather than the camera selecting multiple points to focus on. Again, not sure how much flexibility the XT gives you on selecting the focus point. If I do make it out, I'll give you more pointers there!

awesome!  looking forward to meeting ya.  the hands on advice will be much appreciated, i excel at this type of learning.  i dont know about the XT's ability to handle ISO at 1600, but it can do it.  i also can pick my focus point too. 

so is f/2.8 slow?  i see lots of f/1.8 and 1.4 on your lenses. 

i hope the crowd is cool to leave my stand and shoot....

[jdawg]

so is f/2.8 slow?  i see lots of f/1.8 and 1.4 on your lenses. 

i hope the crowd is cool to leave my stand and shoot....

It's all about getting more light in there so you can increase that shutter speed while maintaining a respectable noise level (iso). Shooting in these local bars/clubs, yes, you'll want to have something faster
than 2.8. I'm also a fan of prime lenses, no zoomin' for me, too many other settings to worry about. I find it best to just move around and work on composing the shot that way. Highly recommend the Canon 85 f/1.8.

[Sanjay]

2.8 isn't slow, it's pretty much the standard for concert and other low light photography.  Sometimes though it doesn't cut it, heck sometimes a 1.4 won't cut it.

The rule is the lower the f stop number, the faster the lens.  The lenses you see with 1.8 and 1.4 are prime lenses, they don't make any zooms that I know of that are lower than 2.8.  So for the moment you're fine, you've got a great zoom at the lowest f stop available.

In the future you might want to consider picking yourself up a 1.8 prime.  The 50mm 1.8 for Canon is an exceptional lens, perfectly sharp and with your camera actually makes it about 75mm focal length.  It's also very cheap at around $100.  That would be  a good purchase for you for later.

[BJ]

one last newb question; does anyone here use the auto focus?  or is everyone here using the manual focus?  i took pics of my kid last night using the AF that after close inspection were slightly out of focus.  not sure if i could do any better manually but i figured any advice on this would be good to know as well.  all the reading ive been doing has nothing on the matter, maybe for obvious reasons, i dont know.

thanks
jim

if the focus isn't working, you might need to take it to a local shop and have it cleaned.  That camera is a few years old, but i have only used it once in over 6 months (April 12th for my sons B-Day).  I'll go look at those pics to see if the AF was off.  I had it in my bag as a backup, but never really found an opp. that I needed a backup.  I never noticed the AF not working, so it could just be the contacts need cleaning, not sure.  I would assume that the contacts on the lens are clean as they are brand new.

If you have problems that concern you...talk to me...I dont want to sell something you aren't happy with.

BJ

[cgrooves]

one last newb question; does anyone here use the auto focus?  or is everyone here using the manual focus?  i took pics of my kid last night using the AF that after close inspection were slightly out of focus.  not sure if i could do any better manually but i figured any advice on this would be good to know as well.  all the reading ive been doing has nothing on the matter, maybe for obvious reasons, i dont know.

thanks
jim

if the focus isn't working, you might need to take it to a local shop and have it cleaned.  That camera is a few years old, but i have only used it once in over 6 months (April 12th for my sons B-Day).  I'll go look at those pics to see if the AF was off.  I had it in my bag as a backup, but never really found an opp. that I needed a backup.  I never noticed the AF not working, so it could just be the contacts need cleaning, not sure.  I would assume that the contacts on the lens are clean as they are brand new.

If you have problems that concern you...talk to me...I dont want to sell something you aren't happy with.

BJ

+T

[Jimna]

indeed, plus t for the honesty and willingness to take it back but thats not necessary, BJ.  at this point i would blame user error first.  hell who knows what i was doing, but the pics i took yesterday seem fine.  tonight will be the first real test.  but no worries, i really like this camera so far and couldnt be happier with it, thanks again.


i agree that more glass might be a good idea down the road, sanjay.  i really need the wife to score that big job so i can have my long desired sugar mama.  thanks for the reassurance on my lense though, makes me feel better about the decision.  so is a prime lens a type not a brand?

[BJ]

a prime lens means it doesn't zoom.  50mm is a prime(fixed)  24-70 is a zoom.

[cgrooves]

Jimna-

Pick up that canon 50mm 1.8 lens when you get an extra $85. 
It's a 'no brainer' purchase, IMO.

[Jimna]

a prime lens means it doesn't zoom.  50mm is a prime(fixed)  24-70 is a zoom.

i see, thanks for the clarity.

Jimna-

Pick up that canon 50mm 1.8 lens when you get an extra $85. 
It's a 'no brainer' purchase, IMO.

seems like good advice.  i used to spend that much cash on blank DATs over a few months...

[Jimna]

thanks for everyones help.  whatcha think for a virgin on my cherry breaker night out?  http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,103637.new.html#new