Become a Site Supporter and Never see Ads again!

Author Topic: Considering Picking Up A Tascam DR-44WL To Compliment My M10  (Read 8033 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline rockphantom

  • Trade Count: (1)
  • Taperssection Regular
  • **
  • Posts: 116
  • Gender: Male
I am considering buying a Tascam DR-44WL as a backup to my trusty M10.
I was also intrigued by the idea of running the DR-44WL in tandem with the M10 in hopes of producing 3 sources for one show.
I have several sets of mics I could use with the DR-44WL that have been collecting dust for a while. Taping with 2 recorders would breathe new life into these neglected mics.
My main concern is that when running both recorders simultaneously, instead of producing one excellent capture with my M10 and CA-14s/Ugly 2 preamp,
I'd produce 3 crappy captures because I wouldn't be able to dedicate my attention to one recorder while dealing with an unpredictable concert environment.
I should mention that I have a friend who I usually drag to shows. I could always have him tape with the DR-44WL and OKM-II R omni mic,  while I tape with my M10/CA-14 rig.

Any feedback would be appreciated!
« Last Edit: May 09, 2016, 09:27:20 PM by rockphantom »
Deck: Sony PCM-M10 Preamp: Church Audio Ugly 2 Mics: CA-11 Cardioids,CA-14 Cardioids
FS: Soundman OKMII Rock Binaural FS: CA-14 Omnis.

stevetoney

  • Guest
  • Trade Count: (0)
Re: Considering Picking Up A Tascam DR-44WL To Compliment My M10
« Reply #1 on: May 09, 2016, 08:42:03 PM »
I say do it.  I've been saved by having two rigs rolling at one time in a couple of different ways, but the main thing is that one rig acts as the backup to the other so if one has drop outs, battery issues, etc. you've got a backup.  9 times out of 10 you never need the backup so you ask yourself whether it's worth it, but the one time you're saved makes it all worthwhile.

As far as your comment about attending to two decks once the show starts, I'm not really seeing how that should be an issue.  The time is in setting up a second rig but once the show starts, assuming you've already hit REC, setting levels right around -12db is all you have to do.  Forget about it after that. 

I assume that your comment relates to making sure your levels are set properly...maybe you like to ride at 0db, but I stopped doing that and thus worrying about my levels going over a LOOOONG time ago when digital recorders started coming standard with 24 bit file formats.  Now just set your levels between -12db and -6db when the show starts and you should be good for the rest of the night. 

Sure, I check now and then to make sure everything is still good, but rarely do I need to tweak my levels after setting them at the start of a show.  Course, then you normalize your levels to 0db in post processing. 

(FWIW, I'm not sure if you're aware of this, but back in the 16bit days, we needed to check levels alot because the sound suffered if you didn't run levels 'hot' so they were peaking right around 0db, but nowadays the 24bit files have so much resolution that running hot isn't necessary.  Little if any sound quality is lost if you run with lots of headroom.  Yes, there's a small tradeoff in that, when you normalize by 6 to 12db in post, you're raising the noise floor by that amount.  But almost all of us consider that a worthwhile tradeoff because recorders and preamps are so quiet nowadays that this isn't an issue for most people, especially if you're recording amplified music in an inherently noisy environment.)

Hope this helps.
« Last Edit: May 09, 2016, 08:53:20 PM by tonedeaf »

Offline nulldogmas

  • Trade Count: (6)
  • Taperssection All-Star
  • ****
  • Posts: 1626
    • How I Escaped My Uncertain Fate
Re: Considering Picking Up A Tascam DR-44WL To Compliment My M10
« Reply #2 on: May 09, 2016, 08:49:17 PM »
I say do it.  I've been saved by having two rigs rolling at one time in a couple of different ways, but the main thing is that one rig acts as the backup to the other so if one has drop outs, battery issues, etc. you've got a backup.  9 times out of 10 you never need the backup so you ask yourself whether it's worth it, but the one time you're saved makes it all worthwhile.

I'm a big fan of a backup recording as well — I've been saved this way three times in the last few months. It's also useful for comparing mics with identical input and placement.

Offline Gunner

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Taperssection Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 17
Re: Considering Picking Up A Tascam DR-44WL To Compliment My M10
« Reply #3 on: May 09, 2016, 09:42:08 PM »
You should also consider getting a Tascam DR-2d which is similar size than the Sony m10, and you can run 2 pair of mics at the same time

Offline lsd2525

  • Trade Count: (18)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *****
  • Posts: 3397
  • Gender: Male
  • Eschew obfuscation
Re: Considering Picking Up A Tascam DR-44WL To Compliment My M10
« Reply #4 on: May 09, 2016, 09:59:53 PM »
I've been eyeing the 44 just because of the wi fi remote capabilities
Mics: SKM184's; ADK A51s; AT4041; Superlux S502; CK91 active w/homebrew BB; AT853; Naiant X-X; Nak 300's
Recorders: M10; DR-60D; DR-701D

Offline 2manyrocks

  • Trade Count: (12)
  • Taperssection All-Star
  • ****
  • Posts: 1664
Re: Considering Picking Up A Tascam DR-44WL To Compliment My M10
« Reply #5 on: May 10, 2016, 08:26:13 AM »
I have the 22wl.  It is nice to be able to see the meters on a 8 inch tablet instead of the little screen on the tascam.  WiFi range seems to be limited to about 25 feet I guess.  Anyway, not really further than a few rows back from stage in my experience. 

Haven't tried it but there are nano routers that can be powered with a 5v cell phone battery.  Might possibly use one as a repeater to extend the range of the built in wifi.

Battery life on the 22wl is not like the m10.  It is enough to get by.  That would be something to check on the 44.

Offline Life In Rewind

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Taperssection Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 883
    • www.rovingsign.com
Re: Considering Picking Up A Tascam DR-44WL To Compliment My M10
« Reply #6 on: May 10, 2016, 08:48:47 AM »
I've been eyeing the 44 just because of the wi fi remote capabilities

There were a few early adopters - but the TASCAM wi-fi controlled recorders never really caught on around here.

I recall the few that tried them - had issues with the wi-fi app...maybe more trouble than its worth? (for 25 feet of range???)

Seem like kind of a turd of a product...

Unless you knew you had a slew of shows where wi-fi control is essential - I think most would never use this feature, beyond setting it up once and saying "Coooolllll...." >:D

Why not get a the DR-70D? You can probably shop one up for less than a DR-44WL. 4 XLR channels - so you won't get distracted running multiple recorders...

Offline lsd2525

  • Trade Count: (18)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *****
  • Posts: 3397
  • Gender: Male
  • Eschew obfuscation
Re: Considering Picking Up A Tascam DR-44WL To Compliment My M10
« Reply #7 on: May 10, 2016, 09:05:37 AM »
I've been eyeing the 44 just because of the wi fi remote capabilities

There were a few early adopters - but the TASCAM wi-fi controlled recorders never really caught on around here.

I recall the few that tried them - had issues with the wi-fi app...maybe more trouble than its worth? (for 25 feet of range???)

Seem like kind of a turd of a product...

Unless you knew you had a slew of shows where wi-fi control is essential - I think most would never use this feature, beyond setting it up once and saying "Coooolllll...." >:D

Why not get a the DR-70D? You can probably shop one up for less than a DR-44WL. 4 XLR channels - so you won't get distracted running multiple recorders...

I actually picked up a 70D about a month ago when it was on sale at Adorama. Still haven't taken it out of the box. Still rockin' the DR60 and M10. Need to take it for a test-spin.
Mics: SKM184's; ADK A51s; AT4041; Superlux S502; CK91 active w/homebrew BB; AT853; Naiant X-X; Nak 300's
Recorders: M10; DR-60D; DR-701D

Offline 2manyrocks

  • Trade Count: (12)
  • Taperssection All-Star
  • ****
  • Posts: 1664
Re: Considering Picking Up A Tascam DR-44WL To Compliment My M10
« Reply #8 on: May 10, 2016, 09:53:32 AM »
I think that hits the issue dead on because the 44wl is about $200 and the 70d was recently $222.  The 44wl only allows 2 external mics vs 4 on the 70d. 

Tascam claims a 65 foot range for the 44wl.  That was not my experience with the 22wl.  It worked reliably up to about the first few rows, but going further away, it would disconnect.  I could get a signal further away, but it wasn't reliable in my experience. 

In my testing, the 22 preamps weren't in the ballpark with the m10. And I do not recommend the 22wl at all because of my experience with the recording quality. 

 The preamp in the 44 are different, but how do they compare to those on the 70d which are better known on TS? 

When you get into this price range, might as well get a behringer xr12 mixer for $249.99, pair it with a good external router, and record 100 feet away.  http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1095114-REG/behringer_x_air_xr12_12_input.html

The four XLR channels record down to a 2 track mix on the USB.  It's primarily designed as a live sound mixer, but the point is to compare what you can get for $249.99 these days.  If 110v power and the option to record from the stage are available to you,  it's something to think about.
« Last Edit: May 10, 2016, 11:07:32 AM by 2manyrocks »

Offline Life In Rewind

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Taperssection Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 883
    • www.rovingsign.com
Re: Considering Picking Up A Tascam DR-44WL To Compliment My M10
« Reply #9 on: May 10, 2016, 11:23:04 AM »

When you get into this price range, might as well get a behringer xr12 mixer for $249.99, pair it with a good external router, and record 100 feet away.  http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1095114-REG/behringer_x_air_xr12_12_input.html

The four XLR channels record down to a 2 track mix on the USB.  It's primarily designed as a live sound mixer, but the point is to compare what you can get for $249.99 these days.  If 110v power and the option to record from the stage are available to you,  it's something to think about.

For sure...Im just plain in love with my XR-18!

Offline rockphantom

  • Trade Count: (1)
  • Taperssection Regular
  • **
  • Posts: 116
  • Gender: Male
Re: Considering Picking Up A Tascam DR-44WL To Compliment My M10
« Reply #10 on: May 10, 2016, 12:42:07 PM »
Thank you all for your feedback. I'm still on the fence regarding the DR-44WL.
If the preamp isn't as good as the M10, then it is not worth buying, IMO.

I likely won't use the Wi-Fi feature at all.
If Sony plans to release a direct successor to the M10, I'd rather wait for that before making a purchasing decision.
The M10 will be hard to beat!
Deck: Sony PCM-M10 Preamp: Church Audio Ugly 2 Mics: CA-11 Cardioids,CA-14 Cardioids
FS: Soundman OKMII Rock Binaural FS: CA-14 Omnis.

Offline 2manyrocks

  • Trade Count: (12)
  • Taperssection All-Star
  • ****
  • Posts: 1664
Re: Considering Picking Up A Tascam DR-44WL To Compliment My M10
« Reply #11 on: May 10, 2016, 01:46:32 PM »
Yes, I think you want to check on the 44wl preamps before buying.

XR18 ability to record 18 channels via USB into a PC for $699 is a pretty amazing value, especially compared to a $499 focusrite pro 40  firewire interface that's only 8 channels.  I'm surprised Gutbucket hasn't already bought one to run 18 channels all at once in some previously unheard of mic configuration.

Offline Life In Rewind

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Taperssection Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 883
    • www.rovingsign.com
Re: Considering Picking Up A Tascam DR-44WL To Compliment My M10
« Reply #12 on: May 10, 2016, 02:35:49 PM »
Yes, I think you want to check on the 44wl preamps before buying.

XR18 ability to record 18 channels via USB into a PC for $699 is a pretty amazing value, especially compared to a $499 focusrite pro 40  firewire interface that's only 8 channels.  I'm surprised Gutbucket hasn't already bought one to run 18 channels all at once in some previously unheard of mic configuration.

The other 18 channel Behringer (X Air X18) is more like $499 - but has a more traditional mixer form factor...and a few less features (no ultranet, TRS Aux outs...etc) - but still a pretty solid value.

Offline acidjack

  • Site Supporter
  • Trade Count: (37)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *
  • Posts: 5845
  • Gender: Male
Re: Considering Picking Up A Tascam DR-44WL To Compliment My M10
« Reply #13 on: May 10, 2016, 02:58:22 PM »
Thank you all for your feedback. I'm still on the fence regarding the DR-44WL.
If the preamp isn't as good as the M10, then it is not worth buying, IMO.

I likely won't use the Wi-Fi feature at all.
If Sony plans to release a direct successor to the M10, I'd rather wait for that before making a purchasing decision.
The M10 will be hard to beat!
Your best use case for it is for SBDs, I'd say, in which case you could be standing pretty close to the SBD and operate it via WiFi while operating the M10 as normal. In that case I think the preamps matter a little less.
Mics: Schoeps MK4V, MK41V, MK5, MK22> CMC6, KCY 250/5, KC5, NBob; MBHO MBP603/KA200N, AT 3031, DPA 4061 w/ d:vice, Naiant X-X, AT 853c, shotgun, Nak300
Pres/Power: Aerco MP2, tinybox v2  [KCY], CA-UBB
Decks: Sound Devices MixPre 6, Zoom F8, M10, D50

My recordings on nyctaper.com: http://www.nyctaper.com/?tag=acidjack | LMA: http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/acidjack | twitter: http://www.twitter.com/acidjacknyc | Soundcloud: https://soundcloud.com/acidjacknyc

Offline F.O.Bean

  • Team Schoeps Tapir that
  • Trade Count: (126)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *****
  • Posts: 40690
  • Gender: Male
  • Taperus Maximus
    • MediaFire Recordings
Re: Considering Picking Up A Tascam DR-44WL To Compliment My M10
« Reply #14 on: May 11, 2016, 01:16:44 AM »
Operating two separate decks has NEVER been an issue for me, especially if you know the recorder well! So just keep playing around with your new deck[whatever you end up getting as a 2nd deck] and it'll just be second nature to check levels on both decks ;) And record in 24Bit like Tonedeaf said, and you wont have to monitor levels nearly as much, since getting close to 0db doesn't matter in 24bit, like it used to in 16bit ;) So you can set levels conservatively and worry a LOT LESS ;D And IMO, the 44Wl is a waste of money, since you can only use 2 of the channels with external mics/preamps/etc!

I agree with LifeInRewind about the 70d! You can run both sets of your mics straight into the 70d preamps if you wanted/needed to, and can run your M10 as a backup to whatever mics/preamp you want to, with the correct Radio Shack splitter! I split the signal of my VMS02IB preamp with just some Radio Shack RCA splitters, and can EASILY run an M10/R5/DR2D/etc as a backup to my 70d very easily from splitting the output of my VMS02IB! You could do the same with one of your setups and always have the M10 backup in case anything happens to your 70d source ;) I ran my old M10's as a backup to my 70d for over a year, and I never needed to use the backup M10 source EVER {**knocks on wood**] ;D

I mean yeah the 22/44WL are cool and all, but you can only use 2 channels of your own external gear/mics/preamps/etc, and HAVE to use their internal mics if wanting to do 4 channel! And is it really that hard to personally walk up and check levels at the show? LOL! You should be near your gear anyway unless you are going to bathroom or getting a drink, or are at a festie! It would be AMAZING to check levels while you were taking a piss or getting a drink, but it sounds to me like the WiFi range is that capable just yet, so if you have to be within 25 ft or so to use the WiFi, then its kinda pointless IMO! Certainly not a deck tailored to our needs! But if you only want to do 2 channel, then the 22WL would be pretty cool to play around with! However, we already know the preamps in the 70d sound pretty kickass and it can do REAL 4 channel recording, without having to use internal mics on 2 of the channels :P ;D So its really up to you and your needs and wants ;)
Schoeps MK 4V & MK 41V ->
Schoeps 250|0 KCY's (x2) ->
Naiant +60v|Low Noise PFA's (x2) ->
DarkTrain Right Angle Stubby XLR's (x3) ->
Sound Devices MixPre-6 & MixPre-3

http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/diskobean
http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/Bean420
http://bt.etree.org/mytorrents.php
http://www.mediafire.com/folder/j9eu80jpuaubz/Recordings

 

RSS | Mobile
Page created in 0.091 seconds with 43 queries.
© 2002-2024 Taperssection.com
Powered by SMF