Topic: Earthworks SR77 problems...

[joeshambro]

So last night I ran my 77's for the first time at the Mayer/Counting Crows show.  Front row stack, mics ORTF at 17 feet up.

The tape has come out extremely - extremely- thick in the mid-lows, the lows also feel like they're distorting.  

Any ideas?

I posted a clip at:

http://webpages.charter.net/jshambro/sr77wtf.wav

Extremely disappointed, because I was expecting these kind of low bass problems to disappear when I upgraded mics.  I basically expected a much more solid low end, and much better clarity.  MUCH better.

So it's either down to these ideas for me:

1) Maybe the FOH mix sucked.  I couldn't hear it all that well because the subs were on the ground at face level.  Looking at the frequency analysis it's pretty well flat.

2) The Edirol UA-5 needs to be retired.

3) I screwed up somehow?

Any ideas are more than helpful...

[scb]

>> Front row stack, mics ORTF at 17 feet up.<<

i think that's the problem

[nickgregory]

way too close to the stacks....

[Wes]

the stacks are designed to produce a sound at a certain distance away.  try putting your ear right up against you speaker and then listen from about 5-10 ft. away.  Which sounds better?

[creekfreak]

hmmmm....I did a stack tape of the dead off a huge relay tower at Vernon downs. My mics where about 10ft from the stack and the tapes came out fantastic (not using earthworks though, some mk4's).....distortion....wonder if the mics couldn't handle the SLP's that close.....

[nickgregory]

hmmmm....I did a stack tape of the dead off a huge relay tower at Vernon downs. My mics where about 10ft from the stack and the tapes came out fantastic (not using earthworks though, some mk4's).....distortion....wonder if the mics couldn't handle the SLP's that close.....

it depends alot on the individual show/mix.  I have taped that close before with no problems, and then I have taped the same band at a different venue where I got alot of bass distortion....it is very hit or miss

[creekfreak]

hmmmm....I did a stack tape of the dead off a huge relay tower at Vernon downs. My mics where about 10ft from the stack and the tapes came out fantastic (not using earthworks though, some mk4's).....distortion....wonder if the mics couldn't handle the SLP's that close.....

it depends alot on the individual show/mix.  I have taped that close before with no problems, and then I have taped the same band at a different venue where I got alot of bass distortion....it is very hit or miss

true, and its not like the dead  have a heavy bass mix either

[scb]

>> hmmmm....I did a stack tape of the dead off a huge relay tower at Vernon downs. My mics where about 10ft from the stack and the tapes came out fantastic (not using earthworks though, some mk4's).....distortion....wonder if the mics couldn't handle the SLP's that close.....<<

but front row stack can also be 3 feet, depending on the setup of the venue.  I can't listen to the clip from work, so I don't know about distortion or not, but my guess is that distortion wasn't the problem, jsut no highs.  I'm guessing that as close as joe was, the speakers he was catching were only mids and lows.  he probably just missed out on the highs by being a few feet too close (or high).  that close, you're runing the risk of not getting all frequencies...

[greenone]

I'll echo the closeness not necessarily being the problem. Taped Blues Traveler at the Pickle Barrel in Killington VT a few years back...real weird place to try to tape. Ended up clamping  to the rail literally INCHES from the right speaker stack. The tapes sound great but I couldn't listen to them for a week because my ears were ringing so much...

[joeshambro]

Thanks for the tips guys...

I definately think I was too close... after listening more and more I think that the FOH mix for Mayer (the band that sounded the worse) wasn't well suited for being taped that close (very bass/mid heavy).  During the Crows set, though, it didn't sound nearly that bad and the tape is very listenable with a small EQ drop around 32-63hz, and a slight rising boost around 2khz-16khz.  Just helps get the rumble out.

Another thing I'm also considering -- I decided to do the show last minute (free tix,  why not) and my shockmounts hadn't arrived yet, so I'm wondering if the vibration from the stacks (and mainly the subs, which were just a few feet away) were coming through on the tape muddying it up.  If so,  definately an endorsement for using shockmounts..  


All in all I think the Earthworks are great mics, I don't think I could've gone up in quality unless I'd spent 3X what I'd spent on these...  

[Lee]

other than the obvious (closeness)... do yall think the SPL's that close would've screwed up the chip in the UA-5 with the earthworks connected?

don't higher SPLs=more phantom power required?  If the earthworks draw more than the chip in the UA-5 is rated for, might this cause distortion and possibly frying the unit?  

Correct me if I'm wrong here.... I ran ew's into a UA-5 for a while but never recorded anything incredibly loud.

[wbrisette]

wonder if the mics couldn't handle the SLP's that close.....

The SR77 mics can handle up to 145 dB SPL. I doubt the stacks were producing this sort of sound level. However, some things to check would be:

1) Can you hook your rig up at home and record clear sounding tapes when playing your stereo?

2) Try another preamp. I haven't ever used the Edirol, so I don't know what it is suppose to sound like (I doubt like your tapes, but I'd check out another preamp anyhow).

3) Cables. Make sure both shield and ground are soldered together on the XLR cables. This can cause similar problems at times (I was bitten by this one).

I would normally suggest trying to lower the mic signal, but the sound clip doesn't sound like it's overdriving the preamp, just more of a muddy sound.

Wayne