Topic: Differences in Cables?

[travelinbeat]

So what's the difference between all of the brands?  I know lots of people use products made by people on the board.. but what is the real difference between go-to bands like Hydra, Kind Kables, Neutrik, etc?  I can understand why it'd be ill-advised to use no-name / Rat Shack cables, but what's the difference in these brands (and other similar ones)?

[OFOTD]

1. Build Quality
2. Build Quality

and

3. Build Quality


There is a reason people pay more for certain cables than others.   It isn't just the wire used or the type of techflex or what have you but the quality of the cables made.   

I use HiHo cables because I KNOW that the last thing I have to worry about in the field are my cables.  No worries of a solder joint coming undone and no worries the hot glue in some stubbies is going to melt. 

You get what you pay for with the cable builders around here.

[travelinbeat]

do you have a link for HiHo? Google is confused....

[jlykos]

This is a dangerous question and has been covered ad nauseum in this forum.  Do a search if you want to see some of the opinions expressed on both sides of the debate.

There are other considerations, IMHO, the most significant being the quality of the wire itself, its geometry, the presence of a shield to protect against RF interference, and the connectors used.

If your question is about the cables sold by people on this site, I would think that build quality is the main difference, as most of the wires and connectors themselves are very similar, being silver-covered copper with Neutrik connectors.  If you look outside the site at some of the other options like Zaoella, Audio Magic, and Moon Audio (I think I am the only person who uses these on this site), you will see many more differences.

[H.A.V.E.]

The other points I see hear are great- some other quick pointers

shielding- Foil offers 100% interference rejection, but can break after a while if setting-up and breaking down, as in portable/stage applications- best suited for permanent studio installation.  Braided copper offers around 95% usually, but can withstand heavy physical usage all day long- great for portable applications, or if moving around a lot in the studio.

construction materials , such as die-electric material, can affect noise-ratio and performance specifications, such as capacitance, measured in pF/ft.

Another thing to consider is conductor configuration.  For an instrument/guitar cable, for instance, there really are only a single conductor plus a ground conductor (braided shield can double as ground) required, so a coaxial cable, like Canare GS6, is great, IMHO.  However, some prefer a twisted pair for an unbalanced cable- partly subjective opinion.  A microphone cable (and some instrument outputs) is a balanced cable, and requires two conductors plus the ground.  Canare L4E6S is a quad configuration for balanced lines- two pairs of conductors, each twisted and then soldered together at the connectors.  This configuration further increases rejection of Radio and Electro-magnetic interference, as it helps distribute exposure.  For this reason, Canare L4E6S makes an excellent balanced line, IMHO.

Neutrik makes very well-constructed, durable connectors, with great performance.  Gold contacts are especially resistant to oxidation with exposure to the elements, so is particular good for outdoor and stage/portable applications.  Silver contacts are great for studio use.

[Nick's Picks]

IMO, all of the board members "home brew" cables, mine included...are identical.  we use the same wire, the same connectors, the same parts.

[OFOTD]

IMO, all of the board members "home brew" cables, mine included...are identical.  we use the same wire, the same connectors, the same parts.

-T   

The above statement is complete and utter bullshit.   I think its been pretty obvious over the last 1-2 years of the differences of the "home brew" cables around here.  They may all have similar wire, they may all have the similar techflex but I can assure you they are NOT anywhere close to identical.   Again I go back to build quality.  That alone separates most of the "home brew" cable makers from one another.   

Most of the "home brew" cable makers use different cable stock from job to job.  Typically whatever is cheapest by the spool on ebay.  Others (HiHo Silvers as just one example) use the same wire from the same spool.  Gumbino bought enough wire to use for his customers current and future needs. Not just enough to get through the month.   That way you know your wires are consistently the same.  Others not so much.   Call it peace of mind.   

As far as the same connectors, yes they are the same brand and model typically but some builders tear them up, scratch them up and even in cases on this board re-used connectors from old cables for new orders.

So the only thing most have in common is that they are "home brew" but to call them identical is just false by a wide margin.

Remember you get what you pay for.  If you get your cables on the cheap then most likely they were built cheap.   I go back to my first post

I use HiHo cables because I KNOW that the last thing I have to worry about in the field are my cables.

[Teen Wolf Blitzer]

 

Jeese dude.  Way to slam folks who make cables.  I myself have everyone's home brew cables (with the exception of Nick-You're next I pr omise Nick!)       I can say they have all performed awesome.  Not one issue with any of them.  Ever.  I disagree with your post.  If it was all about just the soldering Busman would be the best as he is a master.  JMO.

Edited to add.  I was incorrect.  I do not have any darktrains or goodcookers either.  But I'd bet they are equally as good.  Also wanted to point out Matt doesn't make cables anymore...does he?  At least he's rarely on this board. 

[Nick's Picks]

you think millspec cable comes from various manufacturers?
no.  it all comes from Alpha cable.  its all made from the same stock.

I get different wire all the time.  It all sounds the same, its built differently..some have double sheilds, some have thin crappy shields.  I get my wire from the same person all the time because I the product is consistent..., and also there is various options I can get (thickness, teflon tape vs teflon coating).

I'm not trying to de-rail anyone here.  but the wire itself is all made the same.
19 strands of silver coated oxy free copper from Alpha cable, made for the JAN (joint army/navy) market.

[OFOTD]

Jeese dude.  Way to slam folks who make cables.  I myself have everyone's home brew cables (with the exception of Nick-You're next I pr omise Nick!)       I can say they have all performed awesome.  Not one issue with any of them.  Ever.  I disagree with your post.  If it was all about just the soldering Busman would be the best as he is a master.  JMO.

Calling it like I see it.  

Its not just about soldering but its about cable strain relief, its about properly seating the techflex so that it doesn't come unraveled, its about making something more than a hack job, its a whole lot of things that very few actually care about when they build cables.  Those people that really care about making a quality product are few and far between.

At some point on this board people need to be honest about some things and calling the cable makers products identical is just bullshit.   Truth.

 

[Nick's Picks]

didn't mean to say the product was identical, just the materials.
and i'm honest about it.

for example: stubby's.  I hate them.  I dont make them as well as some of the others.  they are a PITA, and a point of failure, IMO.
I'll make them when people want them, and they get more refined as I go..., but give me a plain ol right angle neutrik *any day*.

[Chuck]

There are (arguably)  four measurable properties that all cables share: impedance, resistance, inductance and capacitance. Member H.A.V.E. mentioned Canare L4E6S "quad" cable. This cable is designed to provide better RF interference than typical 2 conductor plus sheild microphone cable. But, there is a trade-off. L4E6S has higher capacitance than typical microphone cable. That's the way it is with cables. Some are better at doing one thing than another. There are many other variables to consider with cables as well. What solder is used? What connectors and dressing are used? These things all add to the actual or perceived value of one cable builders product over another.

[Teen Wolf Blitzer]

^ good post.     I will add I have not gotten any hack jobs from the folks I've bought from.  Apparently others have.  That's a shame.  My favorite out of all my cables?  Matt's shorties (4 pair) and my Segue's.  Todd was/is the man. 

[jeromejello]

i have had 5 sets of silver cables made from several folks on here.  3 were not so great - and had issues ranging from cosmetics to functionality.  all 3 of these were stubby sets and only one pair was from someone that was building cables as a business (the other 2 were hobbyists).

the other 2 were both great sets of cables.  roger (goodcooker) made a sweet pair of beldin 8410a with the adjustable r/a on the pre end.  these are super nice, but are my backups.  rob (darktrain) made me a set with stubbies that are easily some of the best work that i have seen.  i wouldn't hesitate about either of these cables in any field circumstance.

the comment above about hot glue has me extremely baffled.  i can tape in some serious heat situations (think all day outdoors in the Florida summer) and would never think that this would be a weak point.  my guess is that the heat it would take to melt the glue would have already fried my other gear and my brain.

while i don't own any gumbino's hiho silvers, i did contemplate them from the excellent pictures and reviews - but when it was time for me to get some - i found the price and build time too great for my needs.

finally i have a set of mini starquads that i think are from oade and they are awesome, and used to own a set of regular starquads from from oade.  both of these were purchased second hand and are/were affordable and durable.

** edit to add: this list was only mic cables & interconnects... ed (deadheaded) from kind kables made me a very nice power cable for my mp-2, and fozzy did a wonderful job shortening my at853's to a manageable length **

[Todd R]

^ good post.     I will add I have not gotten any hack jobs from the folks I've bought from.  Apparently others have.  That's a shame.  My favorite out of all my cables?  Matt's shorties (4 pair) and my Segue's.  Todd was/is the man. 

Thanks Mark -- though I'm feeling like I should have my wife call the mortician.