Topic: Ideas for a type of recorder

[cherise64]

Well I sold all my gear back in 2000 and now looking to get back into it... to hard not recording anymore after doing it for years.....
I just purchase a 3 pack of Nakamichi cm300... thinking of running cards and 1 shotgun cap for arena shows
Anyway, what are some good ideas on recording machines now. ... when I left, DAT was still popular. ... I have looked at the Marantz pmd670 with recording on sd card..... a good option or something else??. ... but then that reduces stealth shows .... please help !

[twatts (pants are so over-rated...)]

Lots of love for the Sony PCM-M10 right now...

Terry

[caymanreview]

the 670 is only 16bit isnt it? i have a 671 and it does 24bit. rock solid all in one recorder. i have used it almost exclusively for the past 6-7 years until lately. I run an Oade ACM mod'd one. sounds fantastic

[Gutbucket]

Consider a 4-channel recorder for running 3-microphone configs.  That will allow you to tweak the resulting recording to perfection by mixing the 3 channels afterwards by ear, instead of having to mix down to 2-channels live using the Nak mixer by guess.

Four channels also comes in handy for recording 'standard' two channel configurations plus a soundboard feed if available, or for a running a second two-channel setup for comparison purposes.

Kudos for your mention of running a 3-mic configuration.   I've suggested using a single center shotgun or supercardioid between spaced omnis (or in this case cardioids) for years.  And it leaves one channel of a 4-channel recorder free for SBD if available.

Just let me know if you'd like some suggestions for optimizing that 3-mic configuration you mention for specific scenarios.  What you describe turns the old 3-mic Nak technique inside-out (one shotgun between two spaced mics, as opposed to two shotguns with an omni between them in the center) and is a variant on the multichannel technique I prefer.  As a general guideline, you'll want to use more spacing between the two cardioids than you probably think you'd need - at least twice as much as you would use between them if not using a center microphone.  Depending on the spacing you'll also probably want more angle between them as well.  If constrained to using a standard-length short stereo mic-bar, don't hesitate to point the cardioids fully 180 degrees apart, directly away from each other, facing to either side.  As the spacing between them is increased, begin to narrow that angle.  At the opposite extreme with all three mics facing directly forward, a spacing of 5' or more between the two outer cardioids is appropriate.

[cherise64]

Thanks guys for the info... i really have no idea on what kind of reCorder to get... ! I didn't know the 670 is only 16 bit..... gutbucket - any info you can offer would be awsome. .. i guess I was going to find the nak mixer that went 3 plug in down to 2 outputs for the mics... I never have ran a 3 mic before but remember there were a few guys that did it at dead shows but I never got to talk to them ..  I am old school NAK so kinda excited to try a 3 mic run.... what is there for 4 channel recorders ... only problem is I don't have a $$ pocket... anymore info woukd be appreciated! !

[Jonmac]

Thanks guys for the info... i really have no idea on what kind of reCorder to get... ! I didn't know the 670 is only 16 bit..... gutbucket - any info you can offer would be awsome. .. i guess I was going to find the nak mixer that went 3 plug in down to 2 outputs for the mics... I never have ran a 3 mic before but remember there were a few guys that did it at dead shows but I never got to talk to them ..  I am old school NAK so kinda excited to try a 3 mic run.... what is there for 4 channel recorders ... only problem is I don't have a $$ pocket... anymore info woukd be appreciated! !

The Zoom H6 is excellent for 4 channel recording.

[danlynch]

I would suggest getting into the yard sale and buying someone's Edirol/Roland R-44.  I'm not selling mine because I'm installing it into a new venue, but the reality is that the deck has been literally flawless for me and I've had it since 2009.  The decks are now going for some ridiculously low price like $450 and that's between one-third and one-half of its original price.   It seems like a lot of people are moving up to 8 channels, so the four channel decks are now readily available for way less than they are worth.

[2manyrocks]

I'm not familiar with these mics, but aren't they battery powered?  Couldn't you run the two cards via XLR to 1/8 stereo adapter into the 1/8 stereo input of the Tascam Dr60dmkii ($124.99 after rebate at adorama unless the sale has stopped) and run the hyper via XLR into one of the XLR inputs.  The 1/8 stereo input is ganged.  The two XLR inputs on the 60d are individually adjustable.  Downside is the case is about the size of a block of butter.  You'd want to power it via usb with a cell phone battery. 

[rocksuitcase]

I would suggest getting into the yard sale and buying someone's Edirol/Roland R-44.  I'm not selling mine because I'm installing it into a new venue, but the reality is that the deck has been literally flawless for me and I've had it since 2009.  The decks are now going for some ridiculously low price like $450 and that's between one-third and one-half of its original price.   It seems like a lot of people are moving up to 8 channels, so the four channel decks are now readily available for way less than they are worth.

seconded on the R44. it seems to be the most ironclad of the original 4 track recorders.

[cherise64]

Still searching for some ideas ! ... the marantz seems to be about the only thing in my price  range. .   Is there a big difference between 16 bit and 24 bit?

[rocksuitcase]

check out the Marantz PMD 661's, they are 2 ch, 24 bit, handle XLR in and 1/8 inch in. Uses SD cards and generally been a good unit for me.

If you have listening capabilities that make it worth it, 24 bit has a significant advantage, and I feel I can "hear the difference" between 16 & 24 bit recordings although some do not.

[YYZ]

  The Tascam DR 40 is the least expensive recorder with phantom inputs. I have a pair of DR 40s & 2 sets of mics, plus a DR--05 I use with an AT822 x/y outboard mic. Just in case I also have a Zoom H2. With this rig I can record up to 14 channels. I can place one or more recorders on stage if the band allows, plus still grab a soundboard. It's even possible for set up my DR-05 (w/ AT822) center, with split omni mics (SP C4) into my DR-40s and place them on stage w/o any wires. (I use small kick-drum mic type of stands). I just mix the recordings later, using the technique I learned here: http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,103031.msg1373822.html#msg1373822  .... A Marantz or Roland recorder almost certainly has better on board mics & pre amps, and something like the Zoom H6 makes the tedious aligning of tracks unnecessary, but the costs for these units is a factor, and nothing beats location, location, location for recording anyways. (consider that a DR 40 & a $300 pair of mics costs about the same as a Zoom H6 w/o any extra mics).
  Ultimately your style of recording should dictate your choice of recorders. If you plan to only record from near the soundboard/back of the room, then I'd want a multi-track & probably a pre amp of some sort. However, if you think on-stage recording could be a viable option (and it does sound the best imo), consider using one or more portable rigs like the DR 40, or Zoom, Roland or Marantz models. If you go for the nicer model, a 2nd recorder is still very handy to have, and the DR 40 is the cheapest. Hope this gives you some ideas.