Topic: mic config advice needed

[TimSmith]

Hi all!

I have a show in a few days and have been thinking that maybe I should try some different config than usual.

I have CA-14 cards & omnis and the options are: something "DINish" with cards - roughly 90 deg. and 15 cm. spacing (that's what I usually use) and something "HRTFish" with cards or omnis (mics just above my ears). I've been wondering mainly about HRTF with cards: how does this config compares to DIN? Will it give me more "you-are-there" feel with headphones (which I really like about omnis) and better stereo separation?

Also, as I remember, when cards are used far from sound source and are not pointed directly at it, some frequencies may suffer (highs and lows). Is that right? So if the ambient (=room sound and crowd) allows, is it better to use omnis instead to get more natural sound?

And finaly about the hall I'm gonna tape in. It's 6000 seated venue. I'll be sitting close to the front of sbd (see the picture). The hall sounds really good (I've been there on the balcony several times before), probably I'll be cool with omnis even from that distance?



Any thoughts?

[Church-Audio]

ca-14 omni and call it a day. I would wear them above your ears.

[RemotelyLocated]

I'm curious to know what'll happen if you use omnis out there with a bunch of audience around you. Or will room reverberation turn it all into mush?

Understand, I'm NOT asserting any of this will happen--I'm learning, too--just wondering how you isolate music/aud when you're out there and not close to the stage, with omnis.

[Church-Audio]

I'm curious to know what'll happen if you use omnis out there with a bunch of audience around you. Or will room reverberation turn it all into mush?

Understand, I'm NOT asserting any of this will happen--I'm learning, too--just wondering how you isolate music/aud when you're out there and not close to the stage, with omnis.

Its all about the direct verses reflected sound ratio and that changes depending on where you are in the room. Generally speaking the closer you are to a source the louder it will be and when you take into account the absorption coefficient of the surfaces of the room. You get more direct sound than you do reflected partly because some of that energy is absorbed in the room surfaces / people ect. Thats pretty much always the case when you are close to the source. The further you get back the more likely that ratio will change and you will get more "reflective" sound in your recording.  This also changes depending on the frequency content of the reflections and if there are any nodes in the room that actually reinforce this on a group of frequencies. Like what happens to bass in an arena it rolls around at 100hz to 150hz usually.

[TimSmith]

how you isolate music/aud when you're out there and not close to the stage, with omnis.

Nohow. And that's the main problem and risk. 

[Church-Audio]

how you isolate music/aud when you're out there and not close to the stage, with omnis.

Nohow. And that's the main problem and risk. 

Its about the ratio again how loud will the show be in relation to the audience ? If its a loud rock band you might be able to get away with it. If its a quiet band that requires a ton of gain maybe not.

So getting close to the source with omni mics is very important to getting a good sounding recording if you want more direct and less reflected or less audience noise.

[TimSmith]

how you isolate music/aud when you're out there and not close to the stage, with omnis.

Nohow. And that's the main problem and risk. 

Its about the ratio again how loud will the show be in relation to the audience ? If its a loud rock band you might be able to get away with it. If its a quiet band that requires a ton of gain maybe not.

So getting close to the source with omni mics is very important to getting a good sounding recording if you want more direct and less reflected or less audience noise.

I know that of course. I mean that omnis pick up all the talkers around you better than cards and it's always a gamble with them.
It will be loud blues-rock show with some acoustic songs, but I'm sure the most of the audience will not be breathing during the quieter parts. 

[Church-Audio]

how you isolate music/aud when you're out there and not close to the stage, with omnis.

Nohow. And that's the main problem and risk. 

Its about the ratio again how loud will the show be in relation to the audience ? If its a loud rock band you might be able to get away with it. If its a quiet band that requires a ton of gain maybe not.

So getting close to the source with omni mics is very important to getting a good sounding recording if you want more direct and less reflected or less audience noise.

I know that of course. I mean that omnis pick up all the talkers around you better than cards and it's always a gamble with them.
It will be loud blues-rock show with some acoustic songs, but I'm sure the most of the audience will not be breathing during the quieter parts. 

Part of the audience dies when they play quiet? lol I think you will be fine. I like some audience in the mix my self because its a LIVE SHOW... not a studio mix

[TimSmith]

Just finished mastering the recording. Glad I went with omnis. Rich and natural sound, acoustics in the hall are great indeed.

Here are some samples of how it sounds:

[Church-Audio]

Just finished mastering the recording. Glad I went with omnis. Rich and natural sound, acoustics in the hall are great indeed.

Here are some samples of how it sounds:

Glad you like them people like you are the reason I make mics. thank you

Chris

[RemotelyLocated]

Thanks for sharing your samples, Tim. Always nice to hear how something turned out, and it sure seems like you made the right call.