Topic: 24/96 best bang for the buck recorder?

[su6oxone]

I've owned the R-09 and R-09HR and would highly recommend the R-09HR.  It doesn't have the greatest build quality or materials but it makes great recordings, is easy to use, and has the line-in jack on the side instead of the top (I found that more convenient when stealthing).  However, if I were to buy a small recorder today, I would most likely get the M10 which seems to be a very solid and well built device. 

[rastasean]

Let us know which one you would recommend.

I think it is between the m10 and the r09hr.   They're both excellent.  guysonic says the r09hr sounds slightly better for recording music.  I'm willing to suffer some inconvenience for better sound quality (though in this case, they're both excellent, so that isn't a trade-off).  I'd still like to hear some comps.

For value, the r09 used is very good, as long as the jacks are solid (knock on wood, mine has been okay).

Yeah, I think it is between these two as well.

To speak on the 09hr's positive side, edirol CONTINUES to release firmware updates whereas sony never will for the d50 or m10. Just a couple weeks ago, firmware 3.0 was released for the 09hr; most of the new features may not apply to tapers but it is nice to see they haven't forgotten about the recorder.

firmware aside, I think both will work more than adequately for almost anyone. I would call either recorder a win-win.

[it-goes-to-eleven]

A few people have reported m10 issues that needed service.  I haven't heard how that went, but I'm curious.  I remember internal battery issues, and a loose switch or knob.

[rastasean]

Yes, there have been issues with the clock resetting every time the device is turned on. I do remember someone inquiring how lose the gain knob should be since he thought it was quite lose. Some people are living with resetting the clock and others may return the unit.

When things are mass produced for a very affordable price, quality will suffer and a few bad units will escape into the homes and hands of poor consumers. This is why it is important to buy your unit from an authorized retail store, so you can work with them and the manufacture on a replacement unit.

Has the OP decided on a recorder yet?

 

[weroflu]

thanks for narrowing it down to the sony or roland.

i will probably go with sony

one more question...

do any of you also use these recorders as music players? most of my music library is in lossless wma format, i suppose it would be too good if the sony also played wma
lossless. but it kind of sucks to have to get yet another  gadget just to play wma files. i suppose i could go back and convert to wav but it is too much of a hassle.

[rastasean]

thanks for narrowing it down to the sony or roland.

i will probably go with sony

one more question...

do any of you also use these recorders as music players? most of my music library is in lossless wma format, i suppose it would be too good if the sony also played wma
lossless. but it kind of sucks to have to get yet another  gadget just to play wma files. i suppose i could go back and convert to wav but it is too much of a hassle.

neither the 09hr or the m10 play wma files. Most people here don't care for that format and we mostly listen to flac files. once again, these two recorders don't play those files either.

[weroflu]

i stupidly converted everything to wma some years ago. but i guess i could just convert everything to flac in a day or two on a powerful desktop.


http://pro.sony.com/bbsc/ssr/product-PCMM10/B/


just checked out the sony site, apparently the m10 will play .wma files, not sure if this includes wma lossless though...

[weroflu]

just thinking out loud.

someone should make a little rubber/foam slide-on jecklin for the sony. something like two mousepads glued together and cut to a circular shape and then a little slit cut perfectly to the thickness of the m10 so it will just stick on with friction.

 i think people would buy it. i know the spacing is wrong, but it would provide 'some' separation, and who knows, with the right material/thickness it could even approach some real jecklin results. i offer this idea freely to humanity.

[aaronji]

I think it is between the m10 and the r09hr.   They're both excellent.  guysonic says the r09hr sounds slightly better for recording music.  I'm willing to suffer some inconvenience for better sound quality (though in this case, they're both excellent, so that isn't a trade-off).  I'd still like to hear some comps.

guysonic's preference was mostly based on the R09HR having an 88.2 kHz sampling option, if I recall correctly...But I think he said he'd choose the M10 for recording at non-88.2 rates.  And I think he was pretty unequivocal (as willndmb mentioned) about the M10's mic in.

Yes, there have been issues with the clock resetting every time the device is turned on. I do remember someone inquiring how lose the gain knob should be since he thought it was quite lose. Some people are living with resetting the clock and others may return the unit.

Any idea if anyone ever returned one due to the clock thing?  Curious what Sony's take on it was (and if they offered a remedy)...

i offer this idea freely to humanity.

Humanity thanks you!

[it-goes-to-eleven]

i offer this idea freely to humanity.

Humanity thanks you!

I think that was mentioned early on, when folks first complained about the separation.. can't believe it hasn't been done yet...  of course I'd never buy one, since they're too easy to make. You could probably make one with a coaster and a few napkins if you're board before a show.

And while I do recall guysonic liking the 88.2 sampling, I also recall him saying the r09hr sounds better line in.

[Ozpeter]

I guess it depends on how you define 'bang for buck' but the new Zoom H1 is perhaps the cheapest recorder that does 24/96.  So that's the buck, but I'm not sure whether the bang has yet been adequately tested by People Who Know.

[aaronji]

And while I do recall guysonic liking the 88.2 sampling, I also recall him saying the r09hr sounds better line in.

I searched out the original post (http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=130924.msg1722494#msg1722494) and it appears to me that neither of us were quite right in our recollection...Rereading it, it seems that the preference was for the R09HR line-in compared to the M10 mic-in, due mostly to some roll-off on the M10 (below 20 Hz) and the 88.2 kHz sampling on the HR. 

It's not clear if that roll-off is also present on the M10's line-in.  It also seems that this choice wasn't really motivated by how they compared sound-wise, as he really didn't record much with the M10 ("After doing most all the intentioned M10 deck electrical bench testing, and one urban ambient recording") and apparently no music...

[Gutbucket]

i offer this idea freely to humanity.

Humanity thanks you!

I think that was mentioned early on, when folks first complained about the separation.. can't believe it hasn't been done yet...  of course I'd never buy one, since they're too easy to make. You could probably make one with a coaster and a few napkins if you're board before a show.

..or a CD case from the merch table, which was the first thing I tried when toying with a simple mic baffle back in '06 for the original R-09 internals.  Details are here (1st two posts in the thread): Small ball baffle for internal mics.  The CD case / green foam ball gave way to the simple but effective cardboard cut-out. 





You'd think some manufacturers would offer a simple snap-on baffle as an option just like they do windscreens, since it would benefit most any recorder with internal omni's used for typical musician's practice applications for which these machines are primarily targeted, but as Freelunch notes it's easy enough to roll you own.

Viva humanity!

[Gutbucket]

Forgot to mention that Guysonic's own Sonic Studio DSM mics can be powered directly by the M10 but not the 09HR (I think, correct me if I'm wrong).  That is a distinct advantage if using his DSM mics and aiming for a small-as-possible rig.  Makes no difference if running other mics, but should be taken into consideration as a bias on the overall recorder recommendations.

If you're reading this, thanks for the bench testing Guy!

[fmaderjr]

I guess it depends on how you define 'bang for buck' but the new Zoom H1 is perhaps the cheapest recorder that does 24/96.  So that's the buck, but I'm not sure whether the bang has yet been adequately tested by People Who Know.

Ozpeter, I know that you know more than I do about recording from reading your posts, but why the love for Zoom recorders? They do have good internal mics, but I think they leave a lot to be desired for someone who is going to use externals. For one thing the fact that most of them will distort if set to low and you have to turn the levels below 100 to keep the meters under 0 dB is a critical flaw (and I think I read that the H1 does have this flaw). Even though the music may need to be very loud for this to be an issue, I wouldn't want to have to worry about it.

IMO, the H1 is not enough cheaper than good small recorders to possibly give the most bang for the buck.