Topic: NiMH Rechareables/PMD660

[d5]

I just purchased a couple sets of Maha Powerex NiMH 2500 mAh batteries. I tested them in a PMD660 against the regular alkalines I had been using and the increase was pretty good. With Energizer alkalines I was able to get 4:24 of record time and with the Powerex's I was able to get 7:04. I'm using a 4GB CF card, so at 16/44.1, I can fill up the card before having to change batteries. The 7:04 time was on the 2nd charge cycle, so I expect a slight increase on future charge cycles.

One odd thing about the PMD660 and rechargeables... with some rechargeables, the body is slightly longer and the positive post is slight shorter. The 660 battery compartment has little tolerance for this. When I first tried the Maha's, the 660 would NOT power on because the batteries weren't making contact (almost impossible to see). I ended up placing a paper shim behind each of the 4 positive contacts to get it to work.

Both tests were done with the PMD660, 16/44.1 stereo, with JW mod AKG 461's, phantom power on, attenuation on, normal meter lights on

[aberg]

That's impressive with those powerex's.... I think I might need to pick up a set for my R-1.

I can get 4.5hrs with a set of 2100mah nonamers on it, so with some nice powerex's... 5+!!

[Nick's Picks]

you gatta love 7 hours on 4 AAs in a tiny little 660 that sounds FUCKING BAD ASS
love that box.

[tfs8271]

One odd thing about the PMD660 and rechargeables... with some rechargeables, the body is slightly longer and the positive post is slight shorter. The 660 battery compartment has little tolerance for this. When I first tried the Maha's, the 660 would NOT power on because the batteries weren't making contact (almost impossible to see). I ended up placing a paper shim behind each of the 4 positive contacts to get it to work.

Both tests were done with the PMD660, 16/44.1 stereo, with JW mod AKG 461's, phantom power on, attenuation on, normal meter lights on

Ok, I'm getting the same thing with the longer bodies. What do mean by placing a paper shim (pictures) behind each + contact? I just purchased a 6V battery (7.2 Ah) with a charger and was going to make a battery pack with a 5V regulator. I haven't been able to get that much recording time from my NiMH batteries which is why I purchased it. I have two sets of 2500mAh, a set of 2300mAh and a set of 2000mAh and a LaCrosse charger but I seem to get about 2 hours max....I'm running 16/44.1, phantom on, attenuation @ -20dB, matters @ peak only. I have charged my NiMH a few times from my last recording so I think they have a little more capacity than originally. Should I just hook my 660 up and dummy run it in the living room to see how long they will run. Should I go with the battery pack (Doug advised against having one and said to just use the AAs) or return it tomorrow?

[F.O.Bean]

def dummy run them first to get MAX recording tim, I do this w/ ANY new battb setups I get

[d5]

What do mean by placing a paper shim (pictures) behind each + contact?

see below... about the thickness of a business card should do.

I also shaved a little plastic off the rests inside the battery compartment that support the positive side of the battery. You can see this in the picture; the jagged plastic on each side of the positive contact. I was real careful doing this, making sure to only take off a sliver and making sure not to let any drop inside the 660.

... I seem to get about 2 hours max....I'm running 16/44.1, phantom on, attenuation @ -20dB, matters @ peak only. I have charged my NiMH a few times from my last recording so I think they have a little more capacity than originally. Should I just hook my 660 up and dummy run it in the living room to see how long they will run.

It's possible that you're only getting 2 hours because only 2 of the 4 batteries are making contact. The 660 battery compartment is apparently wired (2 in series) in parallel with (2 in series) and will power up and work with only 2 batteries installed ...go figure.

[tfs8271]

What do mean by placing a paper shim (pictures) behind each + contact?

see below... about the thickness of a business card should do.

I also shaved a little plastic off the rests inside the battery compartment that support the positive side of the battery. You can see this in the picture; the jagged plastic on each side of the positive contact. I was real careful doing this, making sure to only take off a sliver and making sure not to let any drop inside the 660.

... I seem to get about 2 hours max....I'm running 16/44.1, phantom on, attenuation @ -20dB, matters @ peak only. I have charged my NiMH a few times from my last recording so I think they have a little more capacity than originally. Should I just hook my 660 up and dummy run it in the living room to see how long they will run.

It's possible that you're only getting 2 hours because only 2 of the 4 batteries are making contact. The 660 battery compartment is apparently wired (2 in series) in parallel with (2 in series) and will power up and work with only 2 batteries installed ...go figure.

Thanks so much. Before your reply I used a sliver of heavy stock paper and bang it worked. I got about 3 hours before I ran out of memory (still can't bring myself to deleting my first show off it - Mule 10-21 Warfield - even though I have downloaded it and stored on dvd). Then I deleted that, listened to ~ 30 minutes on it. Set it back up and got about another 2.5 hours on the batteries. I'm taking the battery pack back to the store and I'm getting more 2500mAh batteries instead. Much easier for traveling.

Yeah the two batteries was probably what happened, because one show I turned my recorder on with freshly charged batteries and the bar indicated that I had only a half power rating.

John Thanks a million....if you're ever in Chico the beer is on me...or soda if you don't drink.

[d5]

....if you're ever in Chico the beer is on me...or soda if you don't drink.

glad it worked! beer is fine!

[vox humana]

I had the same problem with my Oade-modified 660. All I did was shave down the ridges with a chisel and everything works. No need to put paper behind the + terminal.

I wrote Doug Oade about this and he suggested that the batteries needed to be conditioned. Since I'd been using some of these batteries already, that seemed unlikely. Thanks for steering me to a simple solution.

The 660, btw, is working very well with Neumann KM 100s & 184s recording classical choral and pipe organ. Very clean and quiet recordings. Now I'm looking forward to using it without being tethered to an AC outlet! Thanks!

[spyder9]

you gatta love 7 hours on 4 AAs in a tiny little 660 that sounds FUCKING BAD ASS
love that box.

I concur Nick.  I gave your Ratdog recording another listen.  Jezuz, does that preamp in that puppy sound like a V3 or what?  Silk!   

[chucky]

If in a pinch grab the nearest wook by his dreads and rip those doses out his mouth.

[tfs8271]

If in a pinch grab the nearest wook by his dreads and rip those doses out his mouth.

Gel tabs work the best, until they get wet  .

[chucky]

Gel tabs work the best, until they get wet  .

Good call, you might even want to grab his heady nug jug, pack yourself a bowl,
and run the stem behind all four.

[Chuck]

you gatta love 7 hours on 4 AAs in a tiny little 660 that sounds FUCKING BAD ASS
love that box.

I concur Nick.  I gave your Ratdog recording another listen.  Jezuz, does that preamp in that puppy sound like a V3 or what?  Silk!   

I also just love that recording. It's sublime 
I'm really hoping for that same sound from the ACM PMD 671.

[Nick's Picks]

fwiw, I think this tops ratdog.
www.nickspicks.com/mp3/phil2006-02-22set2t06.flac
waste a disc and give that a listen...at concert volume.

[aberg]

fwiw, I think this tops ratdog.
www.nickspicks.com/mp3/phil2006-02-22set2t06.flac
waste a disc and give that a listen...at concert volume.

Are you still running 140s > pmd660?

[Nick's Picks]

nope.
i was running pelusos and an lsd.  i'm now down to just the lsd.  its such an amazing sounding mic, and it is very "soundfieldesque" w/the ACMod behind it.  totaly enveloping 3D soundstage.  I love it.

[tfs8271]

+T that sounds killer, can't wait to hear it with headphones! Wait, what happens at 6:22 of the track?

When are going to put the whole thing up for download?

[tooldvn]

you gatta love 7 hours on 4 AAs in a tiny little 660 that sounds FUCKING BAD ASS
love that box.

No offense intended, but I am always seeing people refer to the 660 as tiny, and maybe thats relative to your own frame of reference.  But let me be a voice of reason to others who might be reading this thread and thinking about the 660 as "tiny"...  I owned a 660 for 3 months and sold it because I was very unhappy with the size.  The hand holding it in the promo pics (edit :not NicksPicks, which I just noticed, his is more like the actual size.) must be from a giant, because it does NOT fit in your hand that way. (I'm a big guy too, and it looked nothing like the photo in my hands).  Take a look at this photo of it from tfs7821's rig.  Notice the size of it next to a cassette tape.  I did not buy it for its primary function to be stealthing, I was going to use it mainly to capture sbd feeds,  but I had thought about maybe using it as a stealthing deck as a bonus. Long story short, MT came out and solved all problems.

I'm not saying that it can't be stealthed, because there are a few people on this board who routinely do.  As far as I know though, the shows they stealth are not of the security ass-raping flavor, just of the no patdown low key stealth kind.  I'm just sayin, it would be a huge hassle to get it in a show where the ONLY available stealth space is your crotch. It would require really baggy pants and a favorable draw in who was administering your patdown. It can be done, no doubt, but more of a PITA than its worth to me.

/rant 
 
Sorry to hijack the thread for a minute there, just had to get that off my chest ;-)

-dvn

[tfs8271]

I'm just sayin, it would be a huge hassle to get it in a show where the ONLY available stealth space is your crotch. It would require really baggy pants and a favorable draw in who was administering your patdown.

I've stealthed it Fillmore West and yes easily stealthed shows (no pat down). I crotch it with a big gut and 501s tight , no baggies on this old timer. The only thing I need to do is re-adjust it before the gates and I tuck it in the underware...remember that, if I ever sell this 660!   

The great thing is it's an all in one rig...can't say the same for the MT

[Nick's Picks]

its pretty tiny, imo.  show me something else that is in this class and smaller.
its slightly smaller than a standard brick.

as for the 6:22 mark, that is where my batteries died, which is why I was not going to seed it.
but, if anyone wants to hear the rest, and the full first set w/the Peluso hypers, just PM me and i'll make it available

[Kevin Straker]

One odd thing about the PMD660 and rechargeables... with some rechargeables, the body is slightly longer and the positive post is slight shorter. The 660 battery compartment has little tolerance for this. When I first tried the Maha's, the 660 would NOT power on because the batteries weren't making contact (almost impossible to see). I ended up placing a paper shim behind each of the 4 positive contacts to get it to work.

Both tests were done with the PMD660, 16/44.1 stereo, with JW mod AKG 461's, phantom power on, attenuation on, normal meter lights on

Ok, I'm getting the same thing with the longer bodies. What do mean by placing a paper shim (pictures) behind each + contact? I just purchased a 6V battery (7.2 Ah) with a charger and was going to make a battery pack with a 5V regulator. I haven't been able to get that much recording time from my NiMH batteries which is why I purchased it. I have two sets of 2500mAh, a set of 2300mAh and a set of 2000mAh and a LaCrosse charger but I seem to get about 2 hours max....I'm running 16/44.1, phantom on, attenuation @ -20dB, matters @ peak only. I have charged my NiMH a few times from my last recording so I think they have a little more capacity than originally. Should I just hook my 660 up and dummy run it in the living room to see how long they will run. Should I go with the battery pack (Doug advised against having one and said to just use the AAs) or return it tomorrow?

Any way to do a similar shimming to the 671 battery sled? I"m really unhappy with the internal AA's>

[tfs8271]

One odd thing about the PMD660 and rechargeables... with some rechargeables, the body is slightly longer and the positive post is slight shorter. The 660 battery compartment has little tolerance for this. When I first tried the Maha's, the 660 would NOT power on because the batteries weren't making contact (almost impossible to see). I ended up placing a paper shim behind each of the 4 positive contacts to get it to work.

Both tests were done with the PMD660, 16/44.1 stereo, with JW mod AKG 461's, phantom power on, attenuation on, normal meter lights on

Ok, I'm getting the same thing with the longer bodies. What do mean by placing a paper shim (pictures) behind each + contact? I just purchased a 6V battery (7.2 Ah) with a charger and was going to make a battery pack with a 5V regulator. I haven't been able to get that much recording time from my NiMH batteries which is why I purchased it. I have two sets of 2500mAh, a set of 2300mAh and a set of 2000mAh and a LaCrosse charger but I seem to get about 2 hours max....I'm running 16/44.1, phantom on, attenuation @ -20dB, matters @ peak only. I have charged my NiMH a few times from my last recording so I think they have a little more capacity than originally. Should I just hook my 660 up and dummy run it in the living room to see how long they will run. Should I go with the battery pack (Doug advised against having one and said to just use the AAs) or return it tomorrow?

Any way to do a similar shimming to the 671 battery sled? I"m really unhappy with the internal AA's>

First try to adjust the contacts or shave the plastic close to the contacts. Caaarrefullllll

[tooldvn]

I'm just sayin, it would be a huge hassle to get it in a show where the ONLY available stealth space is your crotch. It would require really baggy pants and a favorable draw in who was administering your patdown.

I've stealthed it Fillmore West and yes easily stealthed shows (no pat down). I crotch it with a big gut and 501s tight , no baggies on this old timer. The only thing I need to do is re-adjust it before the gates and I tuck it in the underware...remember that, if I ever sell this 660!   

The great thing is it's an all in one rig...can't say the same for the MT

Haha you don't double bag? ;-)   (2 pairs of undies, deck inbetween the two)   Once you get it inside, I'm guessing you wear it on its strap and just wear a button down or jacket over it so you can reach inside and get it rolling/check levels etc?

Thats cool though, just wouldnt do for my crotching/super pat-down needs...  I don't have as big a gut as I used to, and I'm definitely not prepared to have my pants falling down or cinched up with a belt all night... maybe when I was younger, but now I'm trying to delicately balance my comfort at shows too.

True, it is all in one and I do really like how the ACM mod sounds,  definite +'s over the MT alone,  but my external pre&a/d + the MT is smaller together than the 660.   Much as people hate Len, and I'm certainly no fan of his customer service,  the mic2496 really is quite decent at both those functions and (comparitively) tiny for stealthing. Plus the MT rig is 24/96 as opposed to 16/48 for the 660.  Now if it could just break that 2gb barrier... 

[spyder9]

Try crotching a JB3, an AD20, and a PS2.      The walk is no fun.  But I have beaten heavy patdowns.     Lay those 3 boxes out on a table, and you'll find they take up more volume than a 660.

This 660 should be a piece of cake to crotch and easier to walk with.  All plastic body should clear the wands.  The only issue I have:  its an 1 1/2 inches longer than the AD20, which might require buying baggier pants.   

FWIW, My gut is small and  I use a wastebag for my stealth gear.


Just my 2 cents.  Take it for what its worth.   

[phr]

I don't think you can solve the short cell problem by bending the contacts around since they'd just bend back.  I hadn't really thought about shaving the plastic.  Really, the paper shim method works fine, I used a slice of a business card folded over for 2 layers.  I'm using Sanyo 2500 mah NiMH cells which last about 7 hours (no phantom).  Energizer L91 lithium AA cells (around $2 each and non-rechargeable) should last a few hours longer, if you're in some setting that demands it and is worth the expenditure.  There are also 2700 mah NiMH cells out now but I don't have any yet.

I'm pretty interested in the Edirol R09 when it comes out.  It's about 1/4th the size of the 660 and has better features.  It should be very stealthable.  I would not buy an MT under any circumstances--the non-removable battery is totally useless for the type of recording I do (festival-like events, 30 hours of recording in 3-4 days).  Also there's another thread about an MT battery catching on fire.  I sure wouldn't want that to happen while stealthing with the rig in my underwear .

I've been wanting to get around to finding the connector plug to make a very small external battery pack (e.g. from a 9 volt cell) to power the 660 for very short periods (like 1 minute).  That would allow recording nonstop while changing out the internal cells, and still not having to deal with a bulky external pack connected up to the unit the rest of the time.

[Nick's Picks]

the connector is found at radio shack, not sure of the tip size.  just bring in the stock  AC cable and match it up.
a 5v VR (though it only outputs 1amp current) is also available there for under $2.  You could make your little "temp DC" pack from that.

though....
you could also buy a 7.2v RC battery (with said voltage regulator, if it works) and run one for a long time.  that would be a nice outboard pack on the cheap.

[aberg]

What do mean by placing a paper shim (pictures) behind each + contact?

see below... about the thickness of a business card should do.

I also shaved a little plastic off the rests inside the battery compartment that support the positive side of the battery. You can see this in the picture; the jagged plastic on each side of the positive contact. I was real careful doing this, making sure to only take off a sliver and making sure not to let any drop inside the 660.

... I seem to get about 2 hours max....I'm running 16/44.1, phantom on, attenuation @ -20dB, matters @ peak only. I have charged my NiMH a few times from my last recording so I think they have a little more capacity than originally. Should I just hook my 660 up and dummy run it in the living room to see how long they will run.

It's possible that you're only getting 2 hours because only 2 of the 4 batteries are making contact. The 660 battery compartment is apparently wired (2 in series) in parallel with (2 in series) and will power up and work with only 2 batteries installed ...go figure.

I thought I'd give this paper shim thing a try on my new 660 (bought july 06) but i can't fit any paper (even thin stuff) in there... have they changed the design to fix this battery problem?

[d5]

I thought I'd give this paper shim thing a try on my new 660 (bought july 06) but i can't fit any paper (even thin stuff) in there... have they changed the design to fix this battery problem?

I wouldn't be surprised if they did fix the problem as there were quite a few posts on transom.org about this. This site is geared more for journalists, which is the market that Marantz was aiming for with the 660. A vice president of Marantz Professional actually posted there regarding the early brickwalling/resistor issues, so they do take notice.

http://talk.transom.org/WebX?128@397.hFqDaQ7eNXF.1@.eeb41d8

How does yours compare visually to the pic earlier in this thread?

Also, are you having problems with rechargeables batteries? The typical problems are either; 1) the deck doesn't power on at all -or- 2) it doesn't stay powered nearly as long as it should (< 3 hours) and this depends on which batteries in the sled aren't making good contact.

[Jammin72]

I'm in the same boat... I can't figure out how you're going to fit any type of shim in there.  I'm getting at least 4 hours of runtime on a single set of 2500maH AA NiMH's but haven't tested beyond that.  I'm hot swapping just to be sure so far.  I really need to set up a good test to find out.  Maybe battery compartment revisions came along with the new boards?!

[tfs8271]

I'm in the same boat... I can't figure out how you're going to fit any type of shim in there.  I'm getting at least 4 hours of runtime on a single set of 2500maH AA NiMH's but haven't tested beyond that.  I'm hot swapping just to be sure so far.  I really need to set up a good test to find out.  Maybe battery compartment revisions came along with the new boards?!

You should be getting more time than 4 hours with freshly charged 2500mAh NiMH. How do you have your meters configured? Should be peak only for max battery life.

Edit: Do you use the light or do you carry a light? I have noticed reduced battery life when using the light.

[d5]

I'm in the same boat... I can't figure out how you're going to fit any type of shim in there.  I'm getting at least 4 hours of runtime on a single set of 2500maH AA NiMH's but haven't tested beyond that.  I'm hot swapping just to be sure so far.  I really need to set up a good test to find out.  Maybe battery compartment revisions came along with the new boards?!

One time I got about 3 hours from 2500 maH AA NiHM's which i assumed was due to running on only 2 batteries, but after the fix, I can get about 7 hours consistently. 4 hours sounds like you have no issues, but why not just set it up and run it to see?

Edit: I rarely use the light

[Jammin72]

I'm in the same boat... I can't figure out how you're going to fit any type of shim in there.  I'm getting at least 4 hours of runtime on a single set of 2500maH AA NiMH's but haven't tested beyond that.  I'm hot swapping just to be sure so far.  I really need to set up a good test to find out.  Maybe battery compartment revisions came along with the new boards?!

You should be getting more time than 4 hours with freshly charged 2500mAh NiMH. How do you have your meters configured? Should be peak only for max battery life.

Edit: Do you use the light or do you carry a light? I have noticed reduced battery life when using the light.

I bring a wind up flashlight so I prolly use the light for all of 10 seconds.  I have my Meters set to "Normal"  Being able to watch the bouncing lights makes me feel better from a distance to make sure things are going OK

when the RiData crapped out during the Umphrey's set on Friday Night what gave it away was the Meters... they Froze in Place, the record time however kept incrementing.  Odd indeed.  I'm ordering a Second SanDisk!

I'm not too stressed about the batteries.  I'm counting on 4 hours of run time and then doing a swap to be safe.   I've got 4 sets of 2500 maH batteries so I'm fairly well covered.

I do want to run a real run-time test to see what i'm getting with those batteries without any shims.

[tfs8271]

Doug mentioned to me that if you run the meters "NORMAL" you will drain the batteries faster. Therefore, I only run "Peak" only and get the ~7 hours runtime. If you do a test run try the time difference between "Normal" and "Peak" meters to see the difference.

I'm in the same boat... I can't figure out how you're going to fit any type of shim in there.  I'm getting at least 4 hours of runtime on a single set of 2500maH AA NiMH's but haven't tested beyond that.  I'm hot swapping just to be sure so far.  I really need to set up a good test to find out.  Maybe battery compartment revisions came along with the new boards?!

You should be getting more time than 4 hours with freshly charged 2500mAh NiMH. How do you have your meters configured? Should be peak only for max battery life.

Edit: Do you use the light or do you carry a light? I have noticed reduced battery life when using the light.

I bring a wind up flashlight so I prolly use the light for all of 10 seconds.  I have my Meters set to "Normal"  Being able to watch the bouncing lights makes me feel better from a distance to make sure things are going OK

when the RiData crapped out during the Umphrey's set on Friday Night what gave it away was the Meters... they Froze in Place, the record time however kept incrementing.  Odd indeed.  I'm ordering a Second SanDisk!

I'm not too stressed about the batteries.  I'm counting on 4 hours of run time and then doing a swap to be safe.   I've got 4 sets of 2500 maH batteries so I'm fairly well covered.

I do want to run a real run-time test to see what i'm getting with those batteries without any shims.

[aberg]

I've been running 2500mah nimh powerex's with the meters set to normal. My last show I taped was the Allmans and I recorded for probably 2h45min, and then listened to about 2h worth on the way home, and then the batteries died. I imagine if I had used peak only for the meters, the batteries would have lasted longer. In any case, it's enough for me, and I think visually, the battery bay is a little different. There's virtually no wiggle room for the contacts and the batteries are in there pretty tight. I would be surprised if 2 of them weren't making contact.

[Jammin72]

Doug mentioned to me that if you run the meters "NORMAL" you will drain the batteries faster. Therefore, I only run "Peak" only and get the ~7 hours runtime. If you do a test run try the time difference between "Normal" and "Peak" meters to see the difference.

I'm in the same boat... I can't figure out how you're going to fit any type of shim in there.  I'm getting at least 4 hours of runtime on a single set of 2500maH AA NiMH's but haven't tested beyond that.  I'm hot swapping just to be sure so far.  I really need to set up a good test to find out.  Maybe battery compartment revisions came along with the new boards?!

That would make sense as most LED's have a current draw of about 10 mil  (I think).  I remember reading that Nick was getting 7 hours with them set to "Normal" Phantom Power on...

If I were home for more than 3 hours a day before I have to knock out testing would be a lot easier... 

You should be getting more time than 4 hours with freshly charged 2500mAh NiMH. How do you have your meters configured? Should be peak only for max battery life.

Edit: Do you use the light or do you carry a light? I have noticed reduced battery life when using the light.

I bring a wind up flashlight so I prolly use the light for all of 10 seconds.  I have my Meters set to "Normal"  Being able to watch the bouncing lights makes me feel better from a distance to make sure things are going OK

when the RiData crapped out during the Umphrey's set on Friday Night what gave it away was the Meters... they Froze in Place, the record time however kept incrementing.  Odd indeed.  I'm ordering a Second SanDisk!

I'm not too stressed about the batteries.  I'm counting on 4 hours of run time and then doing a swap to be safe.   I've got 4 sets of 2500 maH batteries so I'm fairly well covered.

I do want to run a real run-time test to see what i'm getting with those batteries without any shims.

[Jammin72]

OK official Test Results.  Newer Version Board.  Set to NiMH... Meters on Normal. Just a hair under 5 hours. No change in battery meter indicator within +/- 10 minutes.  So this tells me that the battery meter is useless for my applications and to hot swap batteries every 4 hours the way that I use the machine.  This is using 2500 maH Powerex fully charged batteries.

I'm going to run it one more time to confirm.

[aberg]

That's not bad... I can handle just shy of 5 hours.

[saxophoner]

What do mean by placing a paper shim (pictures) behind each + contact?

see below... about the thickness of a business card should do.

I also shaved a little plastic off the rests inside the battery compartment that support the positive side of the battery. You can see this in the picture; the jagged plastic on each side of the positive contact. I was real careful doing this, making sure to only take off a sliver and making sure not to let any drop inside the 660.

... I seem to get about 2 hours max....I'm running 16/44.1, phantom on, attenuation @ -20dB, matters @ peak only. I have charged my NiMH a few times from my last recording so I think they have a little more capacity than originally. Should I just hook my 660 up and dummy run it in the living room to see how long they will run.

It's possible that you're only getting 2 hours because only 2 of the 4 batteries are making contact. The 660 battery compartment is apparently wired (2 in series) in parallel with (2 in series) and will power up and work with only 2 batteries installed ...go figure.

i just tried your business card trick and it seems to be working, letting it run the whole mem card, about 3 hours worth, batts should definetly work the whole duration yes?  they are 2500maH energizer rechargables.  my worry is that the paper might catch fire or smolder? 
also, the battery level indicator on the 660, mine shows the whole batt with a line cutting through it, does this mean half batt pwr left or does it always look like that?

thanks

[d5]

i just tried your business card trick and it seems to be working, letting it run the whole mem card, about 3 hours worth, batts should definetly work the whole duration yes?  they are 2500maH energizer rechargables.  my worry is that the paper might catch fire or smolder? 
also, the battery level indicator on the 660, mine shows the whole batt with a line cutting through it, does this mean half batt pwr left or does it always look like that?

thanks

I still have the paper shims in and it's been a year and a half... no issues. you should easily get 3 hours from a set of 2500 mah energizers.

The battery meter only has 2 segments. If you're using Ni-MH batteries, make sure the battery type preset is set correctly. if it's set for alkalines the meter will incorrectly indicate half charge fairly quick.

[nem]

I think the "newer" models have fixed the battery sled issue

only problems I've had have been my own fault, and its probably best to not keep the deck in a closed leather bag when you're using internal presets along with the 48v phantom power in a room with no air circulation and high temps for 6+ hours...

asides from that, I have filled a 4gb card with everything on, and still had battery life left to play about 30 minutes of the show on the ride home. YRMV

[agave]

my 660 does get warm .. but never had a problem with it along those lines .. the energizers 2500mAh rechargeables fit tight with no shimming requiered & i have one of the 1st warm acm's from Doug

[NOLAfishwater]

I personally would rather be able to monitor the levels. Usually I just run one set of batteries on the 1st set and another on the 2nd set. For festival season, I just bought a 5V Lithium Ion battery pack that puts out 44WattHours. That should be able to allow me run all day.



$99

Key Features:
High capacity. Most Digital Cameras/Video Camcorder's standard batteries only have 5Wh~10Wh capacity. This battery has 44Wh (Watt-Hour) capacity. For reference, an AA battery has about 2.7Wh capacity (1.8Ah at 1.5V). This may help calculating your expected run time.


Ultra light weight design.
Compatible with
Devices which require 5V, 8.4V or 11V power supply, such as network routers, BiX Pocketsize USB or Firewire hard drives, BiX Slim USB or Firewire Optical Drives.
Compatible with following Cameras/video cameras: Sony, JVC, Panasonic, Fuji, Olympus, Nikon, Casio, Kodak, HP, Minolta.....
as well as most cameras or devices which require 5 to 12 volt power supply.
No memory effect. Can be recharged at any time regardless of the amount of discharge.
Built-in batery gauge which displays power level of the battery pack.
AC quick charger included. Temperature and over-voltage/current protection.
Universal camera cable included. Compatible with most all digital cameras/video cameras or equipment.
Can also be used as an external power supply for any device such as portable Radio, CD/VCD/ DVD player etc...which requires 5 to 12 volt power input

[bobbygeeWOW]

As a data point, with the shim trick I get I dunno, 5 hours or so anyway from my rechargables, which is about the length of a 4 Gig CF card at 16 bit/48KHz. Battery sled using 4 D cells (like the ones for D7/D8's) lasts for ever and a day.

[NOLAfishwater]

My 4GB CF card can hold 6:26 of 44.1 and I can listen to it on my headphones for fine tuning and check levels the whole time using the 5V external battery pack. It really kicks ass.

[d5]

I just purchased a couple sets of Maha Powerex NiMH 2500 mAh batteries. I tested them in a PMD660 against the regular alkalines I had been using and the increase was pretty good. With Energizer alkalines I was able to get 4:24 of record time and with the Powerex's I was able to get 7:04. I'm using a 4GB CF card, so at 16/44.1, I can fill up the card before having to change batteries. The 7:04 time was on the 2nd charge cycle, so I expect a slight increase on future charge cycles.

Both tests were done with the PMD660, 16/44.1 stereo, with JW mod AKG 461's, phantom power on, attenuation on, normal meter lights on

I purchased the Powerex's in late 2005 and was initially able to about 7 hours out of them fresh out of the charger. After a year and a half and roughly 100 charges on them, their capacity was reduced to about 3.5 hours fresh out of the charger and even less for an actual show. I'm a little surprised and disappointed that they wore out so quickly, but I ended up replacing them with a new set of Powerex 2700's.

With the 2700's I was able to get 7:24 from the first charge in an ACM PMD660. Same testing as above; 16/44.1 stereo, JW mod AKG 461's, phantom power on, attenuation on, normal meter lights on. Also using the same charger, a Maha MH-C401FS.

[spcyrfc]

just got my 660 and love it.

now for power, i guess in all good conscience i cannot continue to run alkalines, so im looking into rechargables.  Seems that the Maha Powerex 2700's are the way to go.  any suggestions on charger - online, batteries with a charger got close to $100 on the sites i was viewing - i hoping there is a cheaper way.... sites or charger suggestions??

i looked at the lacrosse charger listed over at Oade, but still, a bit rich for my blood

thanks for the Adv

luke

[NOLAfishwater]

The LaCrosse charger is money. It is the best charger out there and will preserve your batteries for longer. It is well worth the money you will spend on it.

[d5]

I agree that investing a good charger is worth the money. My 2 year old Powerex 2500's died after about 2.5 hours in the middle of a show resulting in cuts in 2 songs. You have to be able to trust your batteries.

[tfs8271]

I don't even bother with NiMH batteries anymore. None of them hold a good charge after a while so I only use them for my kids toys & my camera. I found the universal battery to be more trust worthy......

http://www.batterybarn.com/pr2310.htm

Expensive but well worth it in my opinion.

[elwoodblues]

I agree that investing a good charger is worth the money. My 2 year old Powerex 2500's died after about 2.5 hours in the middle of a show resulting in cuts in 2 songs. You have to be able to trust your batteries.

I agree, the charger is where to put your money.  I got a decent sony that came with 4 AA's and 2 AAA's at costco for 30 bucks and the charger has a memory refresh to keep them from not taking a complete charge after 20 or 30 charges, it was a steal in my eyes.  The way I look at it is, so what if I have to replace them even once a year  or every 6 months in extreme cases, its as much  $$ as alkalines for 2 or 3 shows and your not filling up landfills with your batteries. 

[drewloo]

Yeah I also learned the hard way that those good ol' NiMH AA's only last around a year, maybe year and a half.  The first couple of times I ran out of juice I thought I grabbed some batteries that weren't fully charged but then realized that the capacity on the 'go-to' Maha powerex 2500's was significantly diminished.   I'd like to get one of the chargers that can analyze each battery and displays the actual total capacity left.

[spcyrfc]

tfs,
what sort of runtime can you get on that batterybarn batt?

thanks for the advice on chargers, i guess iffin i go nimh ill get the lacrosse and maybe save some $ on batts for a while and see how the cheapo NiMH batteries work out.

+t's for the help

[Krispy D]

not a good deal, but not bad either...

http://cgi.ebay.com/LaCrosse-Technology-BC-900-AlphaPower-Battery-Charger_W0QQitemZ260162231509QQihZ016QQcategoryZ3202QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem

[tfs8271]

tfs,
what sort of runtime can you get on that batterybarn batt?
+t's for the help

Never have done a full test on it. Most I've run is about 5-6 hours at a festival and it still had two lights running. I go to High Sierra and there are plenty of plugs to be found.

I guess I just feel more secure with the battery pack by seeing the lights during run time.

[NOLAfishwater]

I do have to agree with Krispy D about an external power source. For the money that you would spend on batteries + La Crosse charger you coud get this:


It is small, 11 Watt hours and is only $49.95
http://www.bixnet.com/misihicabapa.html 

or a step up from that

Here is the next step up: 26 Watt hours and is $69.95 
http://www.bixnet.com/5v7libapa.html

or the 44 Watt Hour model for $99.00 this is the one I bought
http://www.bixnet.com/mumiexbapaki1.html

I chose external batteries b/c of the fact that you don't have to worry about changing them and you can take them to festies and run all day on the one that I bought.

[Krispy D]

Yup^^I only run the internals for Stealthyness...

[spcyrfc]

my mind gets all bent trying to calculate run times from watt hours?

NOLA have you pushed that batt to its limit?  how many hrs does it yield?

those do look nice, light and plenty stealthy for me cause ill be flying the 460's anyways

also how is the cycle life on these babies? 

[stevetoney]

my mind gets all bent trying to calculate run times from watt hours?

NOLA have you pushed that batt to its limit?  how many hrs does it yield?

those do look nice, light and plenty stealthy for me cause ill be flying the 460's anyways

also how is the cycle life on these babies? 

All day at a festival generally means at least 10 hours for a day.  I think it will last longer though.  I have just bought a used Power Runner for the same purpose.  I don't know anyone that's anal enough that they'd run their recorder all day long just to run the batteries down in order to say...yeah, it last 15 hours vs. 16 hours...and then during a festival actually time it so that you know you're at the 14.5 hour mark and ready to change. 

Rather, what you want to do is have options for hot swapping.  I think the best situation is to have one of these ultra long life batteries AND a nice collection of the cheap energizer 2500 mah rechargeables. 

Yeah, it would be nice to have those Powerex's, but frankly if they're that expensive then there's no doubt in my mind that I'd go with one of these battery packs and just use the shorter life rechargeables as the standard for normal taping.  These give plenty of life for a whole show, or just do what I do and swap a new set of rechargeables at each setbreak and then you never have to worry about running out of juice for a normal night when you're only taping one or two bands over the course of 3 or 4 hours recording time. 

I think I have about 20 niMHs, so it's no big deal to keep a fresh set of batteries in my box.  (Yeah, I know you're supposed to fully drain them every so often for max life...but that's not my goal during a show...i can worry about that at home.)

Finally, I rather like the external power option because I personally find it a pain in the arse taking the back cover off to change batteries all the time.  The downside of the external power supply though is that I've had a situation where it came unplugged during a show, which caused a drop-out of course.  But I've solved that by getting into the habit of positioning my gear inside my bag during the show that that can't happen...I suppose I could also use a small square duct tape applied durng the show if that ever became an issue.

HOpe this helps.

[tfs8271]

The downside of the external power supply though is that I've had a situation where it came unplugged during a show, which caused a drop-out of course.  But I've solved that by getting into the habit of positioning my gear inside my bag during the show that that can't happen...I suppose I could also use a small square duct tape applied durng the show if that ever became an issue.

I use a strip of gaff tape across the plug on the box and the battery. Just make sure you don't cover up the serial #....It will come off when you remove the tape.

[stevetoney]

my mind gets all bent trying to calculate run times from watt hours?

NOLA have you pushed that batt to its limit?  how many hrs does it yield?

those do look nice, light and plenty stealthy for me cause ill be flying the 460's anyways

also how is the cycle life on these babies? 

You got my curiosity up, so over the weekend I did some testing...

Four 2500mah energizers
5 hrs 14 min 20 sec using AKG-483, 16/44.1, light off, meter regular (not peak)

Power Runner Model 2300
18 hrs 52 min 46sec (using same setup)

[Javier Cinakowski]

Power Runner Model 2300
18 hrs 52 min 46sec (using same setup)

wow!

I just got 2 duracell and 4 batteryspace 2700's .   5+hrs aint bad for AA's IMO.  I love the pmd660. 

[stevetoney]

Power Runner Model 2300
18 hrs 52 min 46sec (using same setup)

wow!

I just got 2 duracell and 4 batteryspace 2700's .   5+hrs aint bad for AA's IMO.  I love the pmd660. 

Totally agreed!