Topic: field recording newbie: SD MixPre or not?

[soundgeezer]

Hi everyone!

Disclaimer: I'm a complete newbie when it comes to sound recording, so please be gentle if I happen to ask a somewhat ignorant question here.

In January, I'll be heading on an 11-day trip to India with Chris Watson to capture wildlife sounds. Ideally, I'd like to grab a good mix of both individual animals and overall environmental stuff. (I'm posting some mic questions elsewhere on this board.)

At the moment, I only own a Marantz PMD620 recorder, which has no phantom power, etc. I'm looking for an upgrade, since I also think the mics I'll end up investing in will need phantom power no matter what.

My question: Buy a Sound Devices MixPre to boost everything or go with something like a Fostex FR-2LE instead? My biggest issue is to have the least noise possible when recording, so good pre-amps are important to me. One day I'll invest in an SD 702 or similar, but for now - with a smaller budget?

Thanks for any help!

[fmaderjr]

My question: Buy a Sound Devices MixPre to boost everything or go with something like a Fostex FR-2LE instead? My biggest issue is to have the least noise possible when recording, so good pre-amps are important to me. One day I'll invest in an SD 702 or similar, but for now - with a smaller budget?

I've been criticized about my distaste for the FR2-LE, but though most seem to love it, I don't think many use it for environmental sounds. I was disappointment by the gain it provided when I was recording stuff that was not loud.

On the other hand, I love the MixPre and it is a very good low noise preamp. I think going Mics > MixPre > 620 line in would give much better results for your application than Mics > FR2-LE. The MixPre should work fine with the 620, but the Sony M10 would probably be even better for you (better battery life and lower noise if you need to add any gain the the recorders internal preamp). Since the 620 costs more new and is very good for someone who wants to record loud concerts without a battery box, if you wanted to you might be able to sell it for what it would take to buy a new M10.

[su6oxone]

There used to be a taper here who taped a lot of nature stuff using a MixPre, I forget his username and haven't seen him post in months, but he spoke very highly of the MixPre for such a use.  You could also consider getting a Marantz PMD-661, which is also an all in one box like the FR2LE that provides phantom via XLR inputs.  For your use, you might want to consider one of the Oade brothers' mods.  You just missed a used 661 'ambient mod' in the yard sale not too long ago. 

[yug du nord]

The MixPre has very low noise and a ton of gain......  so I think it would probably be great for nature recording.  And it uses only two AA batteries, so powering in "the bush" or where ever is pretty easy.  But I've also heard that the Oade Super Mod (I think) is designed for nature recordists....  and Oade Mods ROCK! 

[rastasean]

Frank (fmaderjr) and I have different opinions on the 2le but who cares. that's why there are a lot of recorders to chose from. I'll just say that multiple recordings have been made with them and they turn out well.

I saw and replied to your mic post. Since you're looking at a mic that doesn't require phantom power, maybe you can see how much gain the recorder you have now will be enough.

If you have a large budget, I like what Frank said. Get the mixpre and the m10. Nothing wrong with that.

The member su6oxone is referring to is digifish_music and he hasn't been active on this board in many months.

[fmaderjr]

Frank (fmaderjr) and I have different opinions on the 2le but who cares. that's why there are a lot of recorders to chose from. I'll just say that multiple recordings have been made with them and they turn out well.

And reading posts on this board is great for helping someone choose one. Rastasean has convinced me the FR2-LE is a very good recorder (I probably got a dud) but I do suspect that for environmental sounds a MixPre would work out better due to much higher gain.

If you want to go for an all in one for environmental recordings, you could also consider an Oade Supermodded FR2-LE or Marantz PMD661. My guess would be that the 661 would provide more gain, but you could run it by Doug Oade & see which he would  recommend.

I just received an Oade ambient modded 661 (very similar to the supermod) that I bought in the yard sale and it seems like a great, easy to use recorder. It'll be some time until I have a chance to test it out thoroughly but you can check out this thread here to see how much the previous owner jb63 liked it.
http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=138805.0

[moooose]

Personally I did a lot of nature recordings with AT3032 > SD MixPre > Sony D50. IMHO the MixPre is just excellent: very (very!) quiet, lot of gain, built literally like a tank, small, with a led meter you can see even in the brighter sunlight.
A good thing about a combo MixPre + a pocket recorder with good built in mics is the modularity: for a quick point & shoot you use just the recorder, for better results the whole chain.

[soundgeezer]

Thanks everyone for the valuable feedback so far. The trend definitely seems to be going the MixPre direction (something which I was leaning towards in the first place). Even if I do end up buying a 702 in a year or two, it sounds like there'll always be people interested in buying the MixPre at that time...

I'll definitely check out other recorders like the M10 as well, considering I bought the PMD620 for radio journalism work at the time.

[oleg]

Hi everyone!

Disclaimer: I'm a complete newbie when it comes to sound recording, so please be gentle if I happen to ask a somewhat ignorant question here.

In January, I'll be heading on an 11-day trip to India with Chris Watson to capture wildlife sounds. Ideally, I'd like to grab a good mix of both individual animals and overall environmental stuff. (I'm posting some mic questions elsewhere on this board.)

no matter what look for setup which will give you ability to monitor MS recordings
I will say that investing 1100 usd in mix pre + fostex  while you can buy tascam 680 for 800 it is a very bad desision
other way around it would be going with laptop and usb pre from sound devices , not the best way for rain season  but could work
also there are allot of used 722 and 702 you can buy  use it for a job and sell it later

[fmaderjr]

Hi everyone!

Disclaimer: I'm a complete newbie when it comes to sound recording, so please be gentle if I happen to ask a somewhat ignorant question here.

In January, I'll be heading on an 11-day trip to India with Chris Watson to capture wildlife sounds. Ideally, I'd like to grab a good mix of both individual animals and overall environmental stuff. (I'm posting some mic questions elsewhere on this board.)

no matter what look for setup which will give you ability to monitor MS recordings
I will say that investing 1100 usd in mix pre + fostex  while you can buy tascam 680 for 800 it is a very bad desision
other way around it would be going with laptop and usb pre from sound devices , not the best way for rain season  but could work

You don't need a Fostex with a MixPre-just a small recorder like an M10 or even his 620. A MixPre + M10 would be way more convenient to lug around than a SD USBPre + a laptop. I wouldn't even consider doing that.

Why even consider a 680? He isn't looking to do multichannel work. And would a 680 be low enough noise for environmental recordings without a MixPre? I wouldn't have thought so.

[kirk97132]

I thought the 680 and the 702/722/744 had about the same noise floor and close to the same preamp specs?  But yes why even bring up the unit Oleg when it was not in the discussion at all?

[soundgeezer]

Yep, I already have the Marantz PMD620 and am not necessarily looking to replace it just yet (if not necessary). I'm just looking for a "step up", some boost, some gain, etc. - and phantom power for certain mics. Like I said, ideally my Xmas list has an SD 702 on it, but realistically I think the MixPre is more my range at the moment.

I've only heard good things about the MixPre and get the feeling - even if I fork out for a 702 in a while - it won't be money flushed away...

[oleg]

Hi everyone!

You don't need a Fostex with a MixPre-just a small recorder like an M10 or even his 620. A MixPre + M10 would be way more convenient to lug around than a SD USBPre + a laptop. I wouldn't even consider doing that.

Why even consider a 680? He isn't looking to do multichannel work. And would a 680 be low enough noise for environmental recordings without a MixPre? I wouldn't have thought so.

when you have 3-4 mics  you better use it for ambiance  to get differnt angles .
and why to invest in shit when might be in near future he will make more tracks and would need bigger recorder .
680  preamp are better then most of the small recorders i heard .
to work with laptop and excellent mic pre  its better then work with shity recorder and have less weight , that what we call professionality .
people shoot with dslrs - why? because it the easiest way - no, because it the cheapest way to get grate picture for cheap , the same analogy .

[kirk97132]

SO let me get this straight, I ask why you bring up a recorder that is not even in the discussion and you cite "professionality"  Yeah......ok riiiight......even with a language difference aside, you make zero sense.  Whatever............

[oleg]

SO let me get this straight, I ask why you bring up a recorder that is not even in the discussion and you cite "professionality"  Yeah......ok riiiight......even with a language difference aside, you make zero sense.  Whatever............

cause... the original person who started this topic was talking about to change his recorder
or maybe because there are other options then invest 650 in mix pre while for 150 more you get much more
or maybe you are not get what i say
and don't bulshit with language , you get it or i have to explain you  word by word?

[fmaderjr]

cause... the original person who started this topic was talking about to change his recorder
or maybe because there are other options then invest 650 in mix pre while for 150 more you get much more

But he wanted it for nature recordings. He doesn't need 8 channels, but he does need a lot of quiet gain. I can't see how the 680 could even compare to the MixPre plus an M10, R-09HR, etc. for this purpose.