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Author Topic: 5d mkII For the Canon folk  (Read 10164 times)

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stirinthesauce

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5d mkII For the Canon folk
« on: September 19, 2008, 09:39:03 PM »
God damn do I want this!!!!!!

They hit a grand slam here

http://www.usa.canon.com/consumer/controller?act=ModelInfoAct&fcategoryid=139&modelid=17662
Quote
High Performance for High Expectation
Canon's update to the wildly popular full frame EOS 5D is here, and it's better than ever. The EOS 5D Mark II has a stunning 21.1-megapixel full-frame CMOS sensor with DIGIC 4 Image Processor, a vast ISO Range of 100-6400 (expandable to ISO L: 50, H1: 12800 and H2: 25600), plus EOS technologies like Auto Lighting Optimizer and Peripheral Illumination Correction. It supports Live View shooting, Live View HD videos, and more. It can shoot up to 3.9 fps, has 9 AF points plus 6 AF assist points, a new 98% coverage viewfinder, a 3.0-inch Clear View LCD (920,000 dots/VGA) and a rugged build. Full-frame shooters rejoice!


Offline bluntforcetrauma

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Re: 5d mkII For the Canon folk
« Reply #1 on: September 19, 2008, 11:39:21 PM »
I really dont understand the full frame sensor. I use the 40D crop sensor, but i guess i dont understand the math.

at 21.1 megapixies, is that a good enough trade off for the 3.9 fps?

stirinthesauce

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Re: 5d mkII For the Canon folk
« Reply #2 on: September 20, 2008, 12:00:07 AM »
I really dont understand the full frame sensor. I use the 40D crop sensor, but i guess i dont understand the math.

at 21.1 megapixies, is that a good enough trade off for the 3.9 fps?

I had the 20d (same 1.6x crop sensor as the 40d, just less mp).  I have the 5d, which is 12.8mp of full frame bliss.  Night and day difference.  The the high iso noise performance is leaps and bounds better that the 1.6x crop.  Also, your not cramming all those mp's onto a tiny sensor.  Less hot pixels, better IQ all around.  Now that there are 21.1 mp on a full frame sensor, quality is encrouching on medium format.

4fps (essentially what 3.9fps is) is plenty fast.  I was worried moving down from 5fps when I went from the 20d.  I was looking at the 40d.  In the end, I went with the 5d and the 3fps (what the 5d is) is more than enough.  I don't shoot sports though.  Still more than enough for concerts.  However, I am primarily a landscape photog (where I make my money) and portrait shooter.  The 5d was and never will be intended for sports.  There is the mkIII for that.  It is for the landscape and wedding photographer that demands high IQ pics on a full frame sensor, for those that doen't want to lug around a beast like the mkII or mkIII.  A compact full frame camera. 

Canon has done it again.

once you go full frame, there is no going back.

stirinthesauce

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Re: 5d mkII For the Canon folk
« Reply #3 on: September 20, 2008, 12:03:44 AM »
36.0mm x 24.0mm  5dmkII sensor size

22.2 x 14.8mm     40d sensor size



Offline bluntforcetrauma

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Re: 5d mkII For the Canon folk
« Reply #4 on: September 20, 2008, 12:39:49 AM »
so i guess the 40D will be my back up.

I am by no means a photographer , i cant even use my name and photographer in the same sentence.  But i am trying.  Technology really does help.  I am still having trouble with shots coming out a bit yellowish, yes i am shooting inside schools, no not guns, but the i do use the 580ex flash, and i capture pics of kids at school.  I need the fps because i shoot special population of kids.  I opened a company called BENTPHOTO, inc.  Basically most of my kids are bent, where cropping is essential.  BENTPHOTO, Inc falls under my other company All-Star therapy, inc.  I also have other trademarks and Inc as an off shoot of the All-star therapy, inc.  which i specialize in the facilitation of function for infants, toddlers, and elementary school kids.  So i figure why not take some photos of there progress and enjoying life, working hard.  I also have INCREASEDTone studios, inc where we have the kids express themselves thru art, music.  We also have a band IncreasedTone, working on the first couple of songs> like just say no to BOTOX.  As i digress more that is why i also need to know how to put up a web site for all of this, i do have a domain name but no content.

stirinthesauce

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Re: 5d mkII For the Canon folk
« Reply #5 on: September 20, 2008, 11:11:07 AM »
so i guess the 40D will be my back up.

I am by no means a photographer , i cant even use my name and photographer in the same sentence.  But i am trying.  Technology really does help.  I am still having trouble with shots coming out a bit yellowish, yes i am shooting inside schools, no not guns, but the i do use the 580ex flash, and i capture pics of kids at school.  I need the fps because i shoot special population of kids.  I opened a company called BENTPHOTO, inc.  Basically most of my kids are bent, where cropping is essential.  BENTPHOTO, Inc falls under my other company All-Star therapy, inc.  I also have other trademarks and Inc as an off shoot of the All-star therapy, inc.  which i specialize in the facilitation of function for infants, toddlers, and elementary school kids.  So i figure why not take some photos of there progress and enjoying life, working hard.  I also have INCREASEDTone studios, inc where we have the kids express themselves thru art, music.  We also have a band IncreasedTone, working on the first couple of songs> like just say no to BOTOX.  As i digress more that is why i also need to know how to put up a web site for all of this, i do have a domain name but no content.

by no means is your 40d a 2nd rate camera.  It is a fabulous camera!  Not trying to say that at all up top. 

I remember you talking in other threads about the special needs children you work with.  As for the yellow looking shots, are you shooting raw or jpeg?  You can fix the white balance if your shooting raw.  In door with the flourescent lights will reek havoc on your shots if your shooting jpeg.  Shoot raw and play with your white balance settings.

The 5dmkII may be louder than your 40d (shutter slap wise).  Then again maybe not.  I know my 5d is loud, but the slap was bit smoother sounding than my old 20d.  Surprisingly, I shot with my old 350d the other day and it is quiet.

I digress......

Back to 5d mkII discussion.....


I want one ohhh so bad.  Maybe in a year or so when used bodies start popping up for a price I can swing, this will be my route.  I am in love with my 5d.  Can't imagine playing with mkII.

Offline bluntforcetrauma

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Re: 5d mkII For the Canon folk
« Reply #6 on: September 20, 2008, 11:17:58 AM »
so i guess the 40D will be my back up.

I am by no means a photographer , i cant even use my name and photographer in the same sentence.  But i am trying.  Technology really does help.  I am still having trouble with shots coming out a bit yellowish, yes i am shooting inside schools, no not guns, but the i do use the 580ex flash, and i capture pics of kids at school.  I need the fps because i shoot special population of kids.  I opened a company called BENTPHOTO, inc.  Basically most of my kids are bent, where cropping is essential.  BENTPHOTO, Inc falls under my other company All-Star therapy, inc.  I also have other trademarks and Inc as an off shoot of the All-star therapy, inc.  which i specialize in the facilitation of function for infants, toddlers, and elementary school kids.  So i figure why not take some photos of there progress and enjoying life, working hard.  I also have INCREASEDTone studios, inc where we have the kids express themselves thru art, music.  We also have a band IncreasedTone, working on the first couple of songs> like just say no to BOTOX.  As i digress more that is why i also need to know how to put up a web site for all of this, i do have a domain name but no content.

by no means is your 40d a 2nd rate camera.  It is a fabulous camera!  Not trying to say that at all up top. 

I remember you talking in other threads about the special needs children you work with.  As for the yellow looking shots, are you shooting raw or jpeg?  You can fix the white balance if your shooting raw.  In door with the flourescent lights will reek havoc on your shots if your shooting jpeg.  Shoot raw and play with your white balance settings.

The 5dmkII may be louder than your 40d (shutter slap wise).  Then again maybe not.  I know my 5d is loud, but the slap was bit smoother sounding than my old 20d.  Surprisingly, I shot with my old 350d the other day and it is quiet.

I digress......

Back to 5d mkII discussion.....


I want one ohhh so bad.  Maybe in a year or so when used bodies start popping up for a price I can swing, this will be my route.  I am in love with my 5d.  Can't imagine playing with mkII.

No i know iyou did not mean that the 40D was not a good camera.  I was just stressing that even with good gear i suck at photos right now.
the better the equipment the better i can shoot.  Also I have trouble shooting in " P" mode with RAW ---I can seem to get a sharp enough focus on the subject.

Do you adjust the white balance in post like in photoshop, or can I adjust white balance in like iphoto--which allows you to do so>

might be wrong thread to ask those questions--sorry

stirinthesauce

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Re: 5d mkII For the Canon folk
« Reply #7 on: September 20, 2008, 12:53:11 PM »
so i guess the 40D will be my back up.

I am by no means a photographer , i cant even use my name and photographer in the same sentence.  But i am trying.  Technology really does help.  I am still having trouble with shots coming out a bit yellowish, yes i am shooting inside schools, no not guns, but the i do use the 580ex flash, and i capture pics of kids at school.  I need the fps because i shoot special population of kids.  I opened a company called BENTPHOTO, inc.  Basically most of my kids are bent, where cropping is essential.  BENTPHOTO, Inc falls under my other company All-Star therapy, inc.  I also have other trademarks and Inc as an off shoot of the All-star therapy, inc.  which i specialize in the facilitation of function for infants, toddlers, and elementary school kids.  So i figure why not take some photos of there progress and enjoying life, working hard.  I also have INCREASEDTone studios, inc where we have the kids express themselves thru art, music.  We also have a band IncreasedTone, working on the first couple of songs> like just say no to BOTOX.  As i digress more that is why i also need to know how to put up a web site for all of this, i do have a domain name but no content.

by no means is your 40d a 2nd rate camera.  It is a fabulous camera!  Not trying to say that at all up top. 

I remember you talking in other threads about the special needs children you work with.  As for the yellow looking shots, are you shooting raw or jpeg?  You can fix the white balance if your shooting raw.  In door with the flourescent lights will reek havoc on your shots if your shooting jpeg.  Shoot raw and play with your white balance settings.

The 5dmkII may be louder than your 40d (shutter slap wise).  Then again maybe not.  I know my 5d is loud, but the slap was bit smoother sounding than my old 20d.  Surprisingly, I shot with my old 350d the other day and it is quiet.

I digress......

Back to 5d mkII discussion.....


I want one ohhh so bad.  Maybe in a year or so when used bodies start popping up for a price I can swing, this will be my route.  I am in love with my 5d.  Can't imagine playing with mkII.

No i know iyou did not mean that the 40D was not a good camera.  I was just stressing that even with good gear i suck at photos right now.
the better the equipment the better i can shoot.  Also I have trouble shooting in " P" mode with RAW ---I can seem to get a sharp enough focus on the subject.

Do you adjust the white balance in post like in photoshop, or can I adjust white balance in like iphoto--which allows you to do so>

might be wrong thread to ask those questions--sorry

I either usd canon's digita photo professional (comes bundled with your software) or photoshop.  Lately just photoshop cs3.

I only shoot in raw.

Your camera is more than adequate.  Practice practice practice makes perfect.  Hell, I'm thinking about picking up a 20d (again) as a backup or travel camera.  That camera still produces top notch pictures and I've blown up shots to 16x20 with no pixelation.  You can still get shit shots from a top notch camera.  Great shots from not so great cams, if you know what your doing. 

Offline lefty

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Re: 5d mkII For the Canon folk
« Reply #8 on: September 22, 2008, 03:01:55 PM »
i've been anticipating this camera for about a year now.  if the mkII sets the high ISO standard like the 5D did, then i'm on board and can't wait to get one.  looking forward to seeing the photos :)

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Re: 5d mkII For the Canon folk
« Reply #9 on: October 06, 2008, 03:56:21 AM »
I have been shooting with Canon digitals for 6 years now (EOS-1D, 1DmkII, 1Ds and 5D, which I use 95% ot the time) and just asked the boss to get me couple of Nikon D700 bodies next. Why? Because D700 is faster than 5DmkII, has better sensetivity, better LCD screen, intervalometer for stop motion video, built in flash, dust cleaner, 51 focus points.

I was also waiting for 5DmkII before my desicion, but I do not see much improvement. I am not impressed with 21MPix sensor, because there are no lenses which can resolve well enough for that. Already when 5D originally came out a major photograpy site made a real life comparason to 1DsMkII at 16 MPix and concluded that 5D at 12 MPix was just as sharp as 1DsMkII at 16 MPix. Tha fact is that it is impossible to get midformat sharpnes with 35mm format lenses, even diffraction starts to show if you close the aperture to smaller than f11. It is not the number of pixels in the file, but what information there actually is which matters.

5DmkII is a major letdown. 5D has been my favourite camera for 3 years, but yes, they are new kids in the block now, from old families.

Maybe I should not write this here, as I am not "Canon folk", but I am not "Nikon folk" either, neither "Minolta folk" or "Olympus folk" even though I have used all those professionally for 30 years. We should not attach ourselves too much to a certain brand but get the best there is at the moment.

I do understand the lens problem, more or less have to stick to one brand, but I am lucky enough to be able to replace everything every now and then. That said, I have been happily working with Canons for 6 years, and the new Canon models are not certainly getting worse, but others are again in the race, and seem to be leading it at the moment.
« Last Edit: October 06, 2008, 04:01:33 AM by Petrus »

stirinthesauce

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Re: 5d mkII For the Canon folk
« Reply #10 on: October 06, 2008, 10:48:21 AM »
I have been shooting with Canon digitals for 6 years now (EOS-1D, 1DmkII, 1Ds and 5D, which I use 95% ot the time) and just asked the boss to get me couple of Nikon D700 bodies next. Why? Because D700 is faster than 5DmkII, has better sensetivity, better LCD screen, intervalometer for stop motion video, built in flash, dust cleaner, 51 focus points.

I was also waiting for 5DmkII before my desicion, but I do not see much improvement. I am not impressed with 21MPix sensor, because there are no lenses which can resolve well enough for that. Already when 5D originally came out a major photograpy site made a real life comparason to 1DsMkII at 16 MPix and concluded that 5D at 12 MPix was just as sharp as 1DsMkII at 16 MPix. Tha fact is that it is impossible to get midformat sharpnes with 35mm format lenses, even diffraction starts to show if you close the aperture to smaller than f11. It is not the number of pixels in the file, but what information there actually is which matters.

5DmkII is a major letdown. 5D has been my favourite camera for 3 years, but yes, they are new kids in the block now, from old families.

Maybe I should not write this here, as I am not "Canon folk", but I am not "Nikon folk" either, neither "Minolta folk" or "Olympus folk" even though I have used all those professionally for 30 years. We should not attach ourselves too much to a certain brand but get the best there is at the moment.

I do understand the lens problem, more or less have to stick to one brand, but I am lucky enough to be able to replace everything every now and then. That said, I have been happily working with Canons for 6 years, and the new Canon models are not certainly getting worse, but others are again in the race, and seem to be leading it at the moment.

That's all well and good but have you actually used the 5dmkII or just making assumptions?

As for speed, the 5d was never the sportsman's camera.  40d-50d or 1dmkIII for speed.

As for image quality and lens capability, I want to read hands on experience.

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Re: 5d mkII For the Canon folk
« Reply #11 on: October 06, 2008, 11:47:19 AM »
Now that there are 21.1 mp on a full frame sensor, quality is encrouching on medium format.

Oh, how I wish it were true!    DSLR's are great for low-light but I'm still on the fence for landscapes.

You need about 100 mp to simulate medium format.  6x7 @ 4000dpi = 9440x11020.  There are definitely cases where I wish I could scan at higher than 4000dpi.

The other rub.. and this is big..  A pure analog process for printing is much better than digital.  I have important film (shots of SRV) that print Great at large sizes from the original film but look pretty awful from 4000 dpi scans.   The amusing irony is that the challenges of optical analog to digital conversion (and anti-aliasing) aren't all that different than those we face with audio.

stirinthesauce

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Re: 5d mkII For the Canon folk
« Reply #12 on: October 06, 2008, 12:13:17 PM »

Oh, how I wish it were true!    DSLR's are great for low-light but I'm still on the fence for landscapes.


The 5d (and 5dmkII) are the landscape photog's dream camera.  I am a landscape photog and love the 5d.  Can you say wide?!  ;D  Full frame sensor. 

The downside is lackluster dynamic range compared to film but what is lacking is more than made up for by having a digital darkroom (photoshop).  Couple summers ago I took a workshop with a pro who interned under Ansel Adams.  He primarily shoots digital today but sees a place for film still.  However, he stated what used to take him all day in the darkroom now took less than 5min in photoshop. 

Here is an example.  Went shooting waterfalls at dusk.  In the middle of the creek, plenty of light.  Around the edges were so dark.  I needed to bring out the background some and increase overall exposure as well as working with color saturation.  In less than 5min I have some very usable shots that were not usable before hand.

Quick and dirty:




« Last Edit: October 06, 2008, 12:14:48 PM by stirinthesauce »

Offline Petrus

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Re: 5d mkII For the Canon folk
« Reply #13 on: October 06, 2008, 01:03:48 PM »
That's all well and good but have you actually used the 5dmkII or just making assumptions?

As for speed, the 5d was never the sportsman's camera.  40d-50d or 1dmkIII for speed.

As for image quality and lens capability, I want to read hands on experience.

Making assumptions based on 30 years of pro photography, understanding what lens resolution and diffraction means, using 5D and different EOS-1D series cameras for 6 years, testing D700, reading tests and comments about achievable true resolutions with modern sensors in different sizes and existing lenses, and reading balanced opinions on both 5DmkII and D700.

Why would I take EOS-1DMkIII when D700 is almost as fast, and better in all other respects, and costs 1/3?

Best midformat digital backs equal 4x5 film, but only with new "digital" series lenses which are diffraction limited to f5.6.

Actually sensors have more dynamic range now than slide film. I do not miss film at all, in my tests even EOS-1D with 4.7 MPix equalled 100 ASA Fuji Astia slide in real sharpness, 12 MPix is good enough for magazine full spreads, good enough for me. We even printed full spreads from 4.7 MPix and nobody complained (looked better than 35mm slide). Megapixel war is over with me.

stirinthesauce

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Re: 5d mkII For the Canon folk
« Reply #14 on: October 07, 2008, 12:41:54 AM »
so, back to the original interest of my creating this thread.  For the Canon folk, who here is interested in this mkII and has anyone played with it yet.

90+ pages on fm  :P

Good time to by a 5d.  They are be dropped like flies out on craigslist LA and elsewhere.  Holding onto mine til at least tax return time. 

 

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