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Author Topic: Tinybox battery life (over the life of the product)....  (Read 8201 times)

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Offline hi and lo

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Re: Tinybox battery life (over the life of the product)....
« Reply #15 on: October 26, 2015, 05:13:41 PM »

Remove the Li-ion battery before returning to me!


Just out of curiosity, what are the reasons for recommending your customers do this prior to return and what are the (legal) ramifications for you and the customer? Not that removing the battery is a hard-thing to do, but you're asking customers to a) open up a delicate pieces of electronics equipment and b) handle a potentially hazardous battery.

As the original manufacturer, are you subject to penalty  if a customer sends their box back to you with the battery in-tact? I wouldn't think you have any legal responsibility for them to do or not to do this. As a customer, are their restrictions and penalties for mailing it as-is? Can individual consumers be held liable for shipping li-ion batteries to you?

I'm not 100% up-to-date on guidelines and restrictions for sending hazardous materials, but I would think that for the average customer it's best not to be worrying about opening up the box and removing the battery. That said, I do appreciate your desire to operate as a legitimate business and play by the rules, as opposed to other home-brew manufacturers.
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Offline hi and lo

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Re: Tinybox battery life (over the life of the product)....
« Reply #16 on: October 26, 2015, 08:04:18 PM »
Thanks, Jon, that's awesome. I only ask to split hairs, given that the standard position when it comes to product liability is to assume Murphy's law and recommend against self-repair of any kind. "Do not dispose of battery in fire? Challenge accepted!"


The battery attaches to the PCB with a connector, so there is no soldering, no wire cutting involved.  If you somehow break something else (a wire, a capacitor, etc.) in removal I will fix it when I convert it to NiMH.  The main risk is you will scratch the aluminum panels if you aren't careful with the nutdriver (you want to hold the socket very slightly off the face of the panel).

I really appreciate how this was designed. Removing the battery is simple and if you're gentle with the panel screws and connector, the product can be easily user-serviced for a life-time. It wasn't designed with tamper resistant screws, the electronics and connectors aren't covered in potting compound or epoxy, and the enclosure parts are easily replaceable if they do manage to get dinged up.

Having worked with these Hammond enclosures quite bit now, I would add that you don't want to remove the panels when using metal screws any more often than necessary. Like any screw, you can strip the screwhead and after repeated use the screws may no longer hold tightly. That said, a great thing about the design is that everything but the customized face plate can be easily replaced as Hammond sells all the parts individually. If you ding up the back panel, just get a new blank, drill a hole for the power connector, and voila! Even the main part of the enclosure could be replaced once it gets scratched up.
Friends don't let friends buy tube mics...

Mics: Schoeps MK21 / MK22 / MK4 / MK4V / MK41V / MK41 / MK5; Neumann SKM140; AKG 480/CK61; MBHO 603/KA200N / DPA 4061 / Dynamic Audio Binaurals
Pres & A/Ds: E.A.A. PSP-2 (2x) / Aeta PSP-3 / Sonosax SX-M2 (2x) / Grace V3 / Naiant Tinybox v2.x (Reutelhuber) / Nbox+ / AD2k+ / SBM-1 (2x)
Recorders: 744T / R-44 / PCM-M10 (2x)

Quote from: it-goes-to-eleven

It isn't fear. It isn't subjective. You can measure it on a scope.

Offline Cheesecadet

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Re: Tinybox battery life (over the life of the product)....
« Reply #17 on: October 26, 2015, 10:58:00 PM »
I have a Tonybox v1.5 and it is still going strong on original battery with plenty of use FWIW
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Offline sunjan

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Re: Tinybox battery life (over the life of the product)....
« Reply #18 on: November 12, 2015, 05:18:26 AM »
Hi guys,

Have a Tinybox v1.5 from July 2011. Battery is still great - to be honest I never even once ran it empty!

Recently it took a hit when I dropped it and the gain switch lever is now loose and must be replaced.
Jon: if you read this, please check my mail and we'll try to work out something?!

If Jon doesn't read this: does anyone else know the part number for the gain switch or somewhere I can order it online for some DIY work replacement?!

Thanks!
/Jan

Mics: A-51s LE, CK 930, Line Audo CM3, AT853Rx (hc,c,sc),  ECM 121, ECM 909A
Pres: Tinybox, CA-9100, UA5 wmod
Recorders: M10, H116 (CF mod), H340, NJB3
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Photo rig: Nikon D70, 18-70mm/3.5-4.5, SB-800
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Offline pohaku

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Re: Tinybox battery life (over the life of the product)....
« Reply #19 on: April 16, 2016, 02:49:24 AM »
A late follow up.  Just ordered replacement Li-ion batteries per the link and there was no hazmat charge.  I assume I can take the existing connector off the existing battery and solder it to the wires from the new battery, so I just purchased bare wire units with no connector.  In any event, very reasonable @$18 plus shipping with no hazmat fee.  I ordered 3 so even shipping was cheap on a per unit basis (@$4 a unit).  Fwiw, their shipping policy does specify the hazmat fee that Jon noted, but it was never added to my charge.  As the fee is per box, if you buy multiple units, the per unit cost of the fee obviously drops if they were to charge it.
« Last Edit: April 16, 2016, 02:53:51 AM by pohaku »
Mics: akg c460 (ck61, ck63), c414buls, c568eb; at4049a, 4051a, 4053a, at853; josephson c42; neumann U87, km84i; beyer m130, m160, m500; aea r84; gefell m71, mt711s, m200, m201; sony c38; schoeps cmc6, (mk4, mk21, mk41, mk4v); sennheiser mkh40, md421, md431, md541
Pres: API, a-designs, pendulum, purple, millennia, gt, littlebox, tinybox, usbpre2, CA 9200, pipsqueak, pueblo pending
Cables: KCY, CMR, Naiant AKG actives, PFAs, asst.  GAKables and Darktrain
Recorders/converters: dr680, m10, dr-2d, d50, dr70d, zoom f8, 788T SSD CL-8, lynx aurora 8


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Offline jbell

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Re: Tinybox battery life (over the life of the product)....
« Reply #20 on: April 16, 2016, 09:20:25 AM »
Thanks!!  I'll buy a back up I never had my V2 changed over and would rather keep the Li-ion battery since it runs forever using a KCY setup.  Do you remember how much shipping was for 1 battery?

A late follow up.  Just ordered replacement Li-ion batteries per the link and there was no hazmat charge.  I assume I can take the existing connector off the existing battery and solder it to the wires from the new battery, so I just purchased bare wire units with no connector.  In any event, very reasonable @$18 plus shipping with no hazmat fee.  I ordered 3 so even shipping was cheap on a per unit basis (@$4 a unit).  Fwiw, their shipping policy does specify the hazmat fee that Jon noted, but it was never added to my charge.  As the fee is per box, if you buy multiple units, the per unit cost of the fee obviously drops if they were to charge it.
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Offline pohaku

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Re: Tinybox battery life (over the life of the product)....
« Reply #21 on: April 16, 2016, 09:51:10 AM »
Shipping for 3 was $11.43. I have 3 TBs so I didn't price a single.  You might want to wait a couple days to see whether they try and ding me for the hazmat fee when they ship.  I will post again once they notice me for shipping.  Fingers crossed.
Mics: akg c460 (ck61, ck63), c414buls, c568eb; at4049a, 4051a, 4053a, at853; josephson c42; neumann U87, km84i; beyer m130, m160, m500; aea r84; gefell m71, mt711s, m200, m201; sony c38; schoeps cmc6, (mk4, mk21, mk41, mk4v); sennheiser mkh40, md421, md431, md541
Pres: API, a-designs, pendulum, purple, millennia, gt, littlebox, tinybox, usbpre2, CA 9200, pipsqueak, pueblo pending
Cables: KCY, CMR, Naiant AKG actives, PFAs, asst.  GAKables and Darktrain
Recorders/converters: dr680, m10, dr-2d, d50, dr70d, zoom f8, 788T SSD CL-8, lynx aurora 8


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Offline jbell

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Re: Tinybox battery life (over the life of the product)....
« Reply #22 on: April 16, 2016, 09:52:02 AM »
Will do!!  Thanks for the heads up. 

Shipping for 3 was $11.43. I have 3 TBs so I didn't price a single.  You might want to wait a couple days to see whether they try and ding me for the hazmat fee when they ship.  I will post again once they notice me for shipping.  Fingers crossed.
Schoeps MK4's, MK41's> KCY 250/5 Ig> Naiant PFA (60V)> Sound Devices Mixpre-6

Offline pohaku

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Re: Tinybox battery life (over the life of the product)....
« Reply #23 on: April 19, 2016, 02:57:29 PM »
OK.  They did catch it and the hazmat price has gone up.  They now want $42.50 per box for the hazmat fee.  Bummer.  They have also changed the webpage for this item to call attention to this.

I am ordering several of these, so I am still willing to pay the hazmat fee.


Jon, does the rechargeable little box use the same battery?  If it does, I'll order another (for a total of 4) and do a clean sweep of all my Naiant devices.

Edit: - per Jon, little box (hereinafter "LB") uses a different, larger battery:

http://www.batteryspace.com/li-ion1850074v1400mah1036whbatterymodulewithprotectioniclc18500s2r1wr.aspx

Note that the LB battery is UN38.3 passed, so it should not require a hazmat fee if you order one to replace your LB battery.



Thanks!
« Last Edit: April 19, 2016, 05:37:24 PM by pohaku »
Mics: akg c460 (ck61, ck63), c414buls, c568eb; at4049a, 4051a, 4053a, at853; josephson c42; neumann U87, km84i; beyer m130, m160, m500; aea r84; gefell m71, mt711s, m200, m201; sony c38; schoeps cmc6, (mk4, mk21, mk41, mk4v); sennheiser mkh40, md421, md431, md541
Pres: API, a-designs, pendulum, purple, millennia, gt, littlebox, tinybox, usbpre2, CA 9200, pipsqueak, pueblo pending
Cables: KCY, CMR, Naiant AKG actives, PFAs, asst.  GAKables and Darktrain
Recorders/converters: dr680, m10, dr-2d, d50, dr70d, zoom f8, 788T SSD CL-8, lynx aurora 8


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Offline Fatah Ruark (aka MIKE B)

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Re: Tinybox battery life (over the life of the product)....
« Reply #24 on: September 04, 2016, 03:10:41 PM »
I have a Tinybox 1.0 with a Li-Ion battery.

What is the behavior I'd expect to see if my battery was going bad?

Recorded last night's Phish show. Made it 50 minutes into the second set and the Tinybox looks like it shut off. I think I checked it about an hour in and noticed no levels and the Tinybox was off (no light). Turned it off and back on again and it was still dead. I would have expected it to start sounding poor (distorted) from the battery dying and slowly getting worse until it died, but it just went from on to off.

Transferred the recording and it goes from a nice sounding recording to nothing in about 1 second...almost like it got switch off by accident, but that didn't happen.

Also...charging question. I never really paid attention to how long it takes to charge, but I plugged it in this morning (obviously it was completely dead), and the light on the charger turned green in about 15 minutes. I know it has to take longer than 15 minutes to charge this thing...should I be concerned about that? I've left it connected to the charger hoping there is a trickle charge now. I'm rolling again tonight for Phish. I'd like to make a complete recording. I did leave the Tinybox on between sets yesterday so I'll keep it turned off unless there is music tonight.

Luckily not a life or death situation at Phish. Nice to make my own recording, but plenty of other tapers to back me up...but I need to figure this out for my next show when I might be the only taper.


-24      -12              -6             0       OVER
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||| MICS:  Beyer CK930 ~ Nevaton MCE400 ~ Countryman B3 |||
||| CABLES: Kind Kables |||
||| PREAMPS: Naiant Tinybox | Naiant Littlebox | Naiant IPA | Church BB |||
||| DECKS: Sound Devices MixPre-6 | Sony M10 |||
||| PLAYBACK: Outlaw Audio RR2150 > Epos ELS8 |||
||| PHOTO: Sony a6000 | Sony 16-50 | Sony 55-210 | Rokinon 14mm | Rokinon 8mm |||
|||Concerts History || LMA Recordings || Live YouTube Channel|||

Offline jbell

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Re: Tinybox battery life (over the life of the product)....
« Reply #25 on: September 04, 2016, 03:15:00 PM »
Sounds like it is time for a replacement!!  I have a Tinybox v2 and I worry about this issue.  I usually only carry as a backup pre these days.  This thread has links to the battery you would need or Jon will convert your tinybox. 

I have a Tinybox 1.0 with a Li-Ion battery.

What is the behavior I'd expect to see if my battery was going bad?

Recorded last night's Phish show. Made it 50 minutes into the second set and the Tinybox looks like it shut off. I think I checked it about an hour in and noticed no levels and the Tinybox was off (no light). Turned it off and back on again and it was still dead. I would have expected it to start sounding poor (distorted) from the battery dying and slowly getting worse until it died, but it just went from on to off.

Transferred the recording and it goes from a nice sounding recording to nothing in about 1 second...almost like it got switch off by accident, but that didn't happen.

Also...charging question. I never really paid attention to how long it takes to charge, but I plugged it in this morning (obviously it was completely dead), and the light on the charger turned green in about 15 minutes. I know it has to take longer than 15 minutes to charge this thing...should I be concerned about that? I've left it connected to the charger hoping there is a trickle charge now. I'm rolling again tonight for Phish. I'd like to make a complete recording. I did leave the Tinybox on between sets yesterday so I'll keep it turned off unless there is music tonight.

Luckily not a life or death situation at Phish. Nice to make my own recording, but plenty of other tapers to back me up...but I need to figure this out for my next show when I might be the only taper.
« Last Edit: September 04, 2016, 06:05:54 PM by jbell »
Schoeps MK4's, MK41's> KCY 250/5 Ig> Naiant PFA (60V)> Sound Devices Mixpre-6

Offline Fatah Ruark (aka MIKE B)

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Re: Tinybox battery life (over the life of the product)....
« Reply #26 on: September 04, 2016, 03:18:18 PM »
^ Yep. I'm thinking of getting the IPA's. I think this is a sign from above that I need a new toy. :D

This looks like the battery. I'll have to double check the Tinybox, but I'll wait until tomorrow to do that. Don't want to fiddle with anything when I have a show to head to in a few hours.

EDIT: Forgot the link.

http://www.batteryspace.com/li-ion1443074v600mah444whbatterymodulesidebysidewithprotectioniclc14430s2r1wr.aspx?variation=8162
« Last Edit: September 04, 2016, 05:12:16 PM by Fatah Ruark (aka MIKE B) »
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||| MICS:  Beyer CK930 ~ Nevaton MCE400 ~ Countryman B3 |||
||| CABLES: Kind Kables |||
||| PREAMPS: Naiant Tinybox | Naiant Littlebox | Naiant IPA | Church BB |||
||| DECKS: Sound Devices MixPre-6 | Sony M10 |||
||| PLAYBACK: Outlaw Audio RR2150 > Epos ELS8 |||
||| PHOTO: Sony a6000 | Sony 16-50 | Sony 55-210 | Rokinon 14mm | Rokinon 8mm |||
|||Concerts History || LMA Recordings || Live YouTube Channel|||

Offline ~Jon Stoppable

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Re: Tinybox battery life (over the life of the product)....
« Reply #27 on: September 04, 2016, 04:59:05 PM »
tinybox runs a voltage converter, so it will die fast and hard with no warning other than the low battery indicator.  All v1s are probably EOL for the battery; those were built six years ago.  The charger behavior is an indication of a bad cell.

Offline Fatah Ruark (aka MIKE B)

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Re: Tinybox battery life (over the life of the product)....
« Reply #28 on: September 04, 2016, 05:12:46 PM »
tinybox runs a voltage converter, so it will die fast and hard with no warning other than the low battery indicator.  All v1s are probably EOL for the battery; those were built six years ago.  The charger behavior is an indication of a bad cell.

EOL meaning that the battery should be dying around now...or EOL meaning you can no longer replace it?
-24      -12              -6             0       OVER
||||||||||||||||||||||||||| []  
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||| []

||| MICS:  Beyer CK930 ~ Nevaton MCE400 ~ Countryman B3 |||
||| CABLES: Kind Kables |||
||| PREAMPS: Naiant Tinybox | Naiant Littlebox | Naiant IPA | Church BB |||
||| DECKS: Sound Devices MixPre-6 | Sony M10 |||
||| PLAYBACK: Outlaw Audio RR2150 > Epos ELS8 |||
||| PHOTO: Sony a6000 | Sony 16-50 | Sony 55-210 | Rokinon 14mm | Rokinon 8mm |||
|||Concerts History || LMA Recordings || Live YouTube Channel|||

Offline jbell

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Re: Tinybox battery life (over the life of the product)....
« Reply #29 on: September 04, 2016, 05:14:58 PM »
EOL=End of life

tinybox runs a voltage converter, so it will die fast and hard with no warning other than the low battery indicator.  All v1s are probably EOL for the battery; those were built six years ago.  The charger behavior is an indication of a bad cell.

EOL meaning that the battery should be dying around now...or EOL meaning you can no longer replace it?
Schoeps MK4's, MK41's> KCY 250/5 Ig> Naiant PFA (60V)> Sound Devices Mixpre-6

 

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