Topic: Recording > Camcorder

[willndmb]

wasn't sure where to post this since its kinda a mix of a few different topics....

my wife runs a dance show and wants it video taped
last yr it came out OK but as with lots of camcorder stuff the audio isn't the greatest

my camcorder DOES have a MIC IN
what would happen/how would this sound/is it even poss
run 391 > UA-5 > JB3 > camcorder MIC IN via line out

can you hook the line out signal into a mic in signal?

i also have SPs AT853 and a SP Bass/Batteyr box if that would work any better

thanks for the input
and yes i know i could dubb the audio on after but i am trying to avoid that step

[SparkE!]

You'll probably need about 27 dB of attenuation of the line output to reduce it to an amplitude that will be appropriate for the mic input to your camera.  I made an attenuating cable for exactly this purpose so that I can get a good audio track on my video tapes.

[willndmb]

You'll probably need about 27 dB of attenuation of the line output to reduce it to an amplitude that will be appropriate for the mic input to your camera.  I made an attenuating cable for exactly this purpose so that I can get a good audio track on my video tapes.

is there a place to buy one, i have no idea how to make one
thanks

[eman]

http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=59241.0
This thread includes a link to buy an in line attenuator and a circuit diagram to make one yourself.

[willndmb]

thanks again
maybe they don't make one this way, or i just have no found it yet
but the ones i found on google and here all had xlr -- i would need to have 1/8
ratshack had a 1/8 but it was not stereo

i didn't think to go headphone out though, like mention in the thread link above
that might be the trick

[eman]

I think it will work but as Ethan said you can't expect the best results with an impedance mismatch. Chances are that it will sound great and be much better than using the camcorder mic. I know on my camcorder the camera mounted mic picks up motor noise and is more or less useless as a result. From Ratshack you could split/impedance match/back to stereo with $20 of adapters.

[SparkE!]

If the input impedance on your videocamera is 6.8k ohms like it is on most Sony videocameras, then all you need is a series 150k ohm resistor in the signal path for each channel.  When I made mine, I just cut a 1/8" stereo plug to 1/8"stereo plug cable in half, and added a new 1/8" connector to the end, but instead of hooking the signal wires up directly to the new connector end, I first soldered a 150k ohm resistor to each signal wire then connected the other side of the resistors to the appropriate solder lug on the new connector end.  If you use small resistors, you can easily fit them inside the new connector housing.  The net effect is that you still pass the signal through the cable from a 1/8" stereo plug to another 1/8" stereo plug, but each signal path (left and right channels) has 150k ohms of resistance.

[chun]

Honestly - just record it seperate and make sure to run the mic on the cam too.

With that as a refrence its fairly ez to overlay the audio track and match it up to the camcorder one.

[BayTaynt3d]

Most consumer cams can't handle line-in, only mic in via mini. Prosumer cams can usually handle mic or line-in via a switch or menu item, and most of the good ones can take XLR in or RCA/Mini in. I'm betting you can't.

Another approach is to use that AT853 you have with the batt box. That's a mini connector right? If so, as long as you aren't talking high SPL here, that should work no problem straight into the camera. MAKE SURE YOU TURN OFF auto gain control (AGC) if you can. That'll fuck up your levels real bad usually. And if you have any manual control over the levels, make sure to go into manual mode (not AGC) and set the levels accordingly.

Finally, you can also just shoot the video seperate from the audio. Video production does this often, and contrary to what you might think, a lot of time on lower-budget productions, they don't even use timecode, they manually sync in post. So, make your AUD tape like usual. Then when shooting the video, try to stop and start it as LITTLE AS POSSIBLE -- in fact never stop it at all if you can. Then in post using iMovie or Vegas or something, you can do the sync by lining up the video's internal audio with your AUD tape. It helps a little to tape at 48 kz instead of 44.1 if you have the option because that is what MiniDV tapes at and it helps keep sync over longer periods. If you can only do 44.1, then in post convert to 48 BEFORE you drop it into your video timeline.

If you're planning ahead you can head and tail "slate" the audio and video, which makes syncing a little easier in post by CLAPPING such that the camera's on-board mic and your AUD tape BOTH pick up the clap -- and then letting both just record free without pausing. This is usually done with a "clapper board slate" in film/video, but a loud hand clap is plenty good enough -- film the hand clap and make sure the AUD and the VID can "hear" it. And if you remember, do a clap at the end before you stop rolling too (tail slate). These claps on the AUD and VID make syncing super easy, although you can sync without them too. Then in post, first sync the head clap, then check the tail for drift and adjust/stretch a few frames if needed.

Anyway, there's a couple of ideas for you...

[willndmb]

thanks guys
the more i think about it i might just dubb it in post
i have iMovie and know how to use it, i have FCExpress and know a little about that too, although the stuff i don't know much about is dubbing, figures
the JB3 will record 48 out of the UA5 correct??, it just will not do 24/96

+t around

[pfife]

sorry so late, but perhaps this might be worth a try... I had one of these and it worked nicely. I know nothing of impedance though, so I don't know if this will work for you:

http://www.microphonemadness.com/products/mmatatcab.htm

[willndmb]

sorry so late, but perhaps this might be worth a try... I had one of these and it worked nicely. I know nothing of impedance though, so I don't know if this will work for you:

http://www.microphonemadness.com/products/mmatatcab.htm

BINGOOOOOO a 1/8
looks like it would do the trick, i can run my JB3 > 1/8m > 1/8m > this cable > camcorder
OR
AT853 > SP Bass/battery box > this cable > camcorder

can spark or anyone give me some feedback please
thanks pfife +t

PS i must have been spellign it wrong the other day because now i found core sounds and SP with 1/8 cables

[SparkE!]

sorry so late, but perhaps this might be worth a try... I had one of these and it worked nicely. I know nothing of impedance though, so I don't know if this will work for you:

http://www.microphonemadness.com/products/mmatatcab.htm

BINGOOOOOO a 1/8
looks like it would do the trick, i can run my JB3 > 1/8m > 1/8m > this cable > camcorder
OR
AT853 > SP Bass/battery box > this cable > camcorder

can spark or anyone give me some feedback please
thanks pfife +t

PS i must have been spellign it wrong the other day because now i found core sounds and SP with 1/8 cables

Yeah, that looks like it should work.  It gives 20 dB of attenuation.  It's been my experience that 27 dB is ideal for recording of loud shows into a videocamera, but 20 dB should work too.  You need at least 15 dB, but not more than about 40 dB.  (I'm talking about using a battery box and your normal run-of-the-mill electret mics like CSB's or AT853's or just about any other inexpensive electret mics.  Low sensitivity mics will require about 10 dB less attenuation.  So that 20 dB attenuator will work for either normal or low sensitivity electrets.)

[willndmb]

thanks

FTR - SP cable only ghoes up to 6db
Core sound has 2, ones 11db and ones 20db
this one linked above looks to be better quality then the CS cable though

[pfife]

they used to sell the one I linked to through cascade media.... I don't think they do anymore though.   Its really a decently built cable.