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Gear / Technical Help => Battery Boxes, Preamps, Mixers, ADCs, and Processors => Topic started by: DaryanLenz on March 13, 2003, 09:07:21 PM
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Well, again I am contemplating switching some gear, because I would like to move onto an all-in-one solution. The bag is getting awfully heavy. Anyway, what are the opinions of the mini-me pre and a/d combo, run mic in? I could probably pull off a mini-me by selling the sax and ad1k. Any comments on what you think would sound better?
FYI I run: Microtech Gefell m200->sonosax sx-m2->apogee ad1k->tascam da-p1
Thanks
Daryan
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I have been using the mini-me as a stand alone unit for about 20 shows now. All the talk of the pre in it being weak is mostly bull. I ran a V2 in front for ahwile and found the mini-me by it's self to do just fine. The A/D in it is the best. If you like the apogee sound, then you will love the mini-me. The mini-me is very warm, very analogish but the highs and mids are also good. It has a real "umph" in the low end that is it's trademark in my opinion. I am sure with the Gefells it would sound great. I just got a V3 to test out and will get back with what I think about that soon, but you can't go wrong with either or.
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I have run a few shows with it (four to be exact) and my impressions / notes are the following:
-- The preamp is very, very clean. I can't really call it "weak" because of the jumper situation; if you want more gain, just switch the jumper to the high gain position.
-- What the hell does this mean anyway: a "weak" preamp? How is weakness a sonic quality? I really don't understand this terminology as it applies to a sonic characteristic.
-- I know that I will catch hell for this, but I don't think that the A/D in the unit is the greatest thing since sliced bread. That said, it is still better than anything out there in the taping realm. It has a sheen applied over everything, almost like an audible processing effect that you may hear on a Backstreet Boys album. It is not neutral, but sounds "digitalized" in a warm sort of way, if that makes any sense.
-- I still prefer this unit over anything else out there with my mics. I can't decide, however, whether the sound is ultra-clean or a bit hazy with the A/D.
-- I really do need to tape some more to get a better feel for this unit. So take the above comments with a grain of salt.
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-- I know that I will catch hell for this, but I don't think that the A/D in the unit is the greatest thing since sliced bread. That said, it is still better than anything out there in the taping realm.
Jaime,
I feel ya man. I'm not totally sold on the a/d stage either. The highs/high mids are nice, but I find the low end to be a little cloudy (in an airy/empty sort of way) at times, IMHO. Warm, but not as defined/present as I would like. At least this is what I get out of my tapes. On another well-known board I heard someone refer to the low end sound as being kind of "tubby" and I totally agree with that description. With that said, I also feel that it's still one the best a/d's out there right now. I've only heard things about the pre section, I've never used it myself. I guess I'll get the chance sooner than later because of the fact that my new pre won't be ready for some time now. I just don't feel like switching the jumpers again....damn I'm lazy! ::) 8) ;D
Kevin
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I guess what I meant by the best, is that it's currently the best portable A/D out there now. There is always room for improvement. Look forward to checking out the V3 next weekend to see how it stacks up.
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Well, I can't lie, I love the apogee sound. How does the a/d section compare to the ad1k? I have an ad1k, and the only reason I want to switch, and I mean the only reason, is because of the all in one box appeal. Thanks, and keep those comments coming!
Daryan
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personally I think the sound of the mini me will be completely different that sax>ad1k which may be good in your case, dunno if I would want a sax behind geffells or not. Guess thats a personal opinion. Most people I tape with (i.e. all Panic tapers) HATE the sonosax, I believe used correctly it can sound great. The mini pre is more transparent than the sax which a fuller bottom end to my ears. All depends on yer tastes.
Cheers to my 3rd star.
Trey
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+T for Trey. ;D
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I like the sax, I am not sure why it gets a bad rep. I think however, that it aounded better with the mbho's than it does with the gefells. The gefells seem darker to me than the mbho's, so I think that may be where the sax comes into play. Do you think the minime would produce better tapes than the sax->ad1k combo?
Daryan
why does the sax get such a bad rep with panic tapers anyhoo? Everyone I know that has one really likes it...plus it is tiny!
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Well, after thinking about it, and remembering the interest free credit I have at musicians friend, I think I may sell the ad1k, and pick up a mini-me with the credit and the money then do I a/b with the sax to see if I want to keep it or not. I love the sax, so that will probably be what I do. Can I run a mini-me off of a 6v battery? That sure would be nice!
Daryan
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Best thing to do would be to find a MME you could run for a comparison. I haven't heard MG200>MME yet, so it's hard to say how it'll sound by just guessing.
I know Rev Kev has a MME now, in your general vicinity. He'd probably be down for a comparison tape one night, even if it's Set 1 sax>adk, Set 2 >MME.
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Yeah, I see Kevin from time to time, and could probably pull this off. Has anyone done an ad1k vs. minime comparision line-in at all? My guess would be the minime sounds better, but having not heard a direct comparision, I don't really know.
Daryan
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Yes, you can run a MMe off a 6-volt.
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Can I run a mini-me off of a 6v battery? That sure would be nice!
Yep that's no problem.
If you like the Apogee sound you'll love the MiniMe. The pre section is passable but depending on what sound you are going for an outboard pre may be useful. I did a V2/MMe pre comparison and I found them to sound very similiar, if that gives you any sort of frame of reference.
I've spent some quality time with the V3 lately and I really like it but I am an Apogee man at heart so I'm sticking with the MiniMe. I like the warmth of the MiniMe over the transparency of the V3.
I think Jamie made some good points, I can see where you might describe the sound as having a sheen over it... but I don't think that is necessarily a bad thing depending on your ears and your rig. The ak50's that I run can be pretty bright but when matched with the MiniMe I think that they compliment each other nicely. I ran a V3 in Denver for Phish and while they sound pretty nice I definitely miss having that Apogee sound there to warm up my mics.
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Daryan-
I would def listen before I bought anything. Ideally you want an oade m148, hehe. I like the sound of the mini me and would run it alone if I didn't have an oade m148. Also, I think many folks have heard bad combinations of the sax or the sax run wrong or on inferior or undesirable playback sysytems. If your a sax lover then please dont switch, unless it just doesn't sound right with the geffells. But trust your ears.
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So Trey if you didn't have the 148 you would run the MiniMe pre? That just struck me as interesting...
I don't think I've ever heard your comments on the MiniMe pre... would love to know what you think!
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Oh yeah and I second that emotion on the 148... if you want some punch nothing beats the 148!
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I find the pre in the mini me to be very similiar to the v2 in that it is transparent. I am now running soem very good sounding mics that I am not very interested in coloring the sound of. I do, however, enjoy the coloration of the oade m148 as I feel it adds MORE. More clarity better around the edges, and it is a very quiet preamp. My feeling is that you should be happy with your mics and feel comfortable with the way they sound with no coloration. You can still add coloration but the mics have to start the equation for me. The preamp can either pass the signal (transparent) or color it somehow, yet I feel both are coloring it. I think the pre in the mini me is as good as any other pre amp out there barring the oade m148, yet why I am about to buy a v3 I am unsure. Does anyone have any experience running a pre infront of the v3?
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Well, I am gonna sell the ad1k, as I feel it is about time to get rid of it anyway. I think the mini-me will be just as good, and it will be fixable when it breaks...which has been really worrying me with the ad1k lately, especially considering I tape in small bars all the time. I am gonna run some comparisions with the sax and the mini-me, then decide what to do. My ears tell me from all of the samples I have heard that I will like the minime mic in, but we shall see.
Daryan
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I am sure you will like the mini-me.
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if you run an external Pre with gain adjustment, what is the use of going mic-> in? or are you just talking about eliminating the Sax altogether and using the Mme pre only?
you get the Mme, then you're gonna havta get a Lappy for some 24 bit action. hehe...
regardless, when you get ready to get rid of the Sax, give me a holler. ;)
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responding to a few posts at once
>> I guess what I meant by the best, is that it's currently the best portable A/D out there now. There is always room for improvement. Look forward to checking out the V3 next weekend to see how it stacks up.<<
I am 100% sold on the v3, at least with 4022s (and yes i've definitely given the minime it's fair chance).
>> Well, I can't lie, I love the apogee sound. How does the a/d section compare to the ad1k? <<
i ran a minime/ad1k comparison at 10-11-02 mule if you want that
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Scott, would love to hear the ad1k/mme comparison. Well, I got a couple really good offers on the ad1k, so I am probably going to sell as I am worried about the potential of it breaking...and not getting it fixed. Scott, I will let you know what I think in the next few weeks...wanna let me borrow your mini-me for a week in a couple weeks for the moe run so I can decide?? ;)
Daryan
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when exactly?
let me know if i can upload the minime/ad1k comparison anywhere, though like i said i like the v3 :)
scott
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Scott, I will let you know what I think in the next few weeks...wanna let me borrow your mini-me for a week in a couple weeks for the moe run so I can decide?? ;)
Daryan
sure, D. you can borrow it. ;)
when is moe tour/ what ya got coming up?
here's what i have in the near future:
SKB 03/28/03 Madison, Wi./ Luther's Blues
DTB 04/08/03 Milwaukee, Wi./ Pabst Tre.
Vida Blue 04/09/03 Chicago, Il./ Vic Tre.
havta coordinate with Kempka and see what he's taping also.
lemme know and we'll set it up.
~S
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3/29 moe in ames, IA
4/2 moe in NE
4/3 moe in Iowa City, IA
OM Trio wed. We should meet up soon.
Daryan
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you should hit up the Kimock in Madison. it's a Fri night, and i think there are still tix avail. local crew OWNS the Stage taping scene for this show. ;)
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Moe is playing in Madison on the 30th or 31st I think, at the barrymore. I might come up...you all coming or what?
Daryan
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Rev Kev is runnin' a mme these days!! Man, I haven't seen him in ages... Does he run it with the 480's?? I'm thinking i might just spring for a mme... Trey, are you ready to take the smack Ben is gonna give you for running a V3?? You Panic guy's hitting any festivals up north?
SC
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I am not coming north again this summer, baby on the way!!! F Ben, he ran a v2 and a m248 whats he gots to say???
Trey
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Scott, yeah Rev Kev is running the 480's with the MME and sometimes still with the MP-2 in the mix.
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Here are my inittial thoughts on the mini-me pre section. Very transparent, reminds me of the v2, which would make sense, seeing as they both use the same preamp chip from what I can tell. The bottow end seems to be lacking a little, but maybe that is just me. I was thinking an mp-2 would provide for better bottom end, but this could just be venue dependant. I taped the OMTrio on-stage and thought the tape was very transparent, and have totally fallen in love with the gefell sound. Not as dark as the neumann line, and not NEARLY as bright as the mbho's. After running mbho's for quite a bit, the new sound is like heaven to my ears. I would have loved to hang onto them for accoustic music, but alas, who the hell can afford to keep several sets of mics on hand without a real job ;) Anyway, just some initial thoughts, and I am sure I will have more and keep adding to this thread as I get a better feel for the mini-me and using it correctly! The apogee sound is what suits my ears, and with the gefell's, I thinking I am falling in love!
More later
Daryan
anyone ever heard of osolopso or something like that?
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"The bottow end seems to be lacking a little"
First time I have seen some one say that about the mini-me. I found the bottom end to be the best part of the mini-me, punchy and deep, but then again I am not sure how the gefells sound low end wise.
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Well, it could and probably was venue dependant. I will know more by next week!
Daryan
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that is a good point.
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In some shows I've heard with mics>mme, the lows seemed a little bloated. I've got Scott B's comp shows and I must say I almost find the V3 alone to best the V3>mme. Will take a better listen soon. The lows with the mme seemed a little bloated and not as tight.
SC
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The lows with the mme seemed a little bloated and not as tight.
Scott,
I totally agree. The lows/low mids are just too "tubby/cloudy" sounding to my ears. No definiton what so ever.
Kevin
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Love the input guys, cause i've been springin toward a V3 for a month or so now!!! ;)481's and 483's >> V3.......cant wait folks ;D
bean
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Brandon,
Did you buy the V3 yet, or are you going to be soon?
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V3 soon........in about 2 months.......
bean
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I sure hope the 480>V3 combo doesn't sound like the 480>V2 combo... :-\ Please get us some tapes when you get it.
SC
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amen scwervin, i hope not as well, are you getting a v3/mini me?
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whats the beef w/ the 480>V2??????if not satisfactory, please let me hear some samples...........
bean
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unfortunately I may have ridded my collection of these recordings but I ll check, I believe Ben Morrison has some, I know there are plenty of opinions over on the oade board on this combo.
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well, being that the pre in the V3 is pretty much the same as in the V2 I can't imagine the tapes sounding that different unless the A/D in the V3 colors it that much more.
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what are you guys opinions on this combo???i would greatly appreciate everyones feedback...........
bean
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Creekfreek,
My thoughts exactly!
Trey,
Where the heck is Ben anyway?? Has he bought any mics or what!!
I think I've got some 480 tapes, I'll check. If you want my honest $.02 the 480's sound best into an m148 and second best just ps-2>modSBM-1.
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ben is still micless,
my opinion on the 480>v2 combo is that is sounds thin and unnatural. There is just too much flat to me, I really agree with the m148 comment and have also heard a few eaa tapes I enjoyed but to me its just not what would be an optimal setup. For the same price you can own an oade m148, yet you would still need a a>d, a mod sbm-1 or mini me or ad1k would work great, I haven't heard much from the ua5 to comment on it.
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The 480's run too hot for the V2. The low end sounds over-exagerated and like Trey said, unnatural (in an artificial/bloated sort of way). I have a Panic show from 99' I could U/L if you'd like. I also agree w/ the fact that the 480's sound the best with the m148 behind it (next in line is the EAA ;)).
Kevin
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thanks for the input guys ;) i have heard that before.....anybody got a 148 for sale ;D well this is my 100th post also.......cheers fellas.........
bean
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if you have the money saved for a v3 then you have enough for a m148, now get on the list asap!!!
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Bean, I'll let you run the MMe sometime. I still haven't gotten it out quite enough yet...even itching more now that the lappy is in full effect!
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If you want my honest $.02 the 480's sound best into an m148 and second best just ps-2>modSBM-1.
The 480>ps-2>ad500e>d100 combo I ran sounded very good to my ears. Very clean and good detail. The only problems I had were the need for more gain in the TS at larger venues. Up close, this combo was very sweet.
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thanks dan, was kinda lookin for an all-in-one package like my dmic-20 but was thinkin "phuck it" and just might get on that list and run 480>148>mod-sbm1.....thanks for all the input guys.......i want to hear IT ALL!!!!!!! ;D
bean
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I've got that modSBM-1 you will be looking for ;D
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on the ball, huh scervin?.... ;)thats what i like to see.... ;D but its gonna take me a smidge longer than expected!!!!!!
bean
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Bean,
I know that Carl, Trey, Ben, or Julian would prolly have some sweet examples of tapes made 480>148>adk or sbm1.
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I never ran the combo but this used to be a staple rig in the panic scene until the loss of julian( he didn't die he quit attending shows with the regularity and intensity he had), he was usually at every show, ben and carl both ran these rigs yet I believe carl is the only to run 480>m148>mod sbm-1 besides Julian, I mean atleast of the four that you mention, Ben had a m248. E me and lemme know if you'd like some dats or disks with 480>m1/248>mod/sbm-1/ad500/1000
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Trey, thanks for setting me straight. I figured that you guys I mentiioned would be able to help Bean out the best! ;D
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thanks for the input guys ;D....i dont have a fast connection, but would love b+p's or something along those lines as this is a big investment!!!!!!! ;)thanks for all the help..........
bean