Become a Site Supporter and Never see Ads again!

Author Topic: Smallest Pre-amp with 48v Phantom Power  (Read 12517 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline willndmb

  • Trade Count: (17)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *****
  • Posts: 6532
  • Gender: Male
Re: Smallest Pre-amp with 48v Phantom Power
« Reply #15 on: January 28, 2011, 12:17:30 PM »
Todd is right, I goofed on the MiniR82 dimensions.

Will, the cubic footprint is simply the W x D x H multiplied.
As an example, Littlebox specs are:
"Case size, standard: 4.7" x 3.1" x 1.7" (120mm x 78mm x 43mm)"

4.7 x 3.1 x 1.7 = 24.769
gotcha

the aerco is 18 then
4x3x1.5
Mics - AKG ck61/ck63 (c480b & Naiant actives), SP-BMC-2
XLR Cables - Silver Path w/Darktrain stubbies
Interconnect Cables - Dogstar (XLR), Darktrain (RCA > 1/8) (1/8 > 1/8), and Kind Kables (1/8f > 1/4)
Preamps - Naiant Littlebox & Tinybox
Recorders - PCM-M10 & DR-60D

Offline jbell

  • TDS
  • Trade Count: (133)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *****
  • Posts: 3884
  • Gender: Male
  • Spreadicated
Re: Smallest Pre-amp with 48v Phantom Power
« Reply #16 on: January 28, 2011, 05:19:19 PM »
could you do an extended case version with aa or 9v sled? 
Schoeps MK4's, MK41's> KCY 250/5 Ig> Naiant PFA(60V)> Sound Devices Mixpre-6

Offline jbell

  • TDS
  • Trade Count: (133)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *****
  • Posts: 3884
  • Gender: Male
  • Spreadicated
Re: Smallest Pre-amp with 48v Phantom Power
« Reply #17 on: January 28, 2011, 05:47:31 PM »
Just a thought the Aerco uses 9v batteries.

Extended tinybox?  No, that would be a littlebox.  Those battery trays aren't exactly small you know . . .
Schoeps MK4's, MK41's> KCY 250/5 Ig> Naiant PFA(60V)> Sound Devices Mixpre-6

Offline Todd R

  • Over/Under on next gear purchase: 2 months
  • Trade Count: (29)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *****
  • Posts: 4857
  • Gender: Male
Re: Smallest Pre-amp with 48v Phantom Power
« Reply #18 on: January 28, 2011, 06:10:07 PM »
It's possible to design a P48 tinybox but it would lack an internal battery.  I don't think that's a very compelling product, but if enough people think otherwise . . .

Possible to do a 48v tinybox with 1:1 microtransformers to block the 48v DC instead of the larger blocking capacitors?  Of course, this assumes the tranfos are smaller than the caps, but I thought they were.  Aiming of course to still keep the battery inside.
Mics: Microtech Gefell m20/m21 (nbob/pfa actives), Line Audio CM3, Church CA-11 cards
Preamp:  none <sniff>
Recorders:  Sound Devices MixPre-6, Sony PCM-M10, Zoom H4nPro

Offline Chuck

  • Trade Count: (41)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *****
  • Posts: 10448
  • Gender: Male
  • time between the notes...
    • My recordings on the LMA
Re: Smallest Pre-amp with 48v Phantom Power
« Reply #19 on: January 28, 2011, 08:59:29 PM »
I built a 5 x 9v NiMH littlebox (kit) into a Hammond 1590BB enclosure.

http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=123658.0

I *think* it's the same enclosure as the Aerco. It's very small and sounds great!
Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one.

Microphones: (2) Microtech Gefell M300, (2) AKG C 480 B comb-ULS/ CK 61/ CK 63, (2) CAD GXL1200 (cardioid and sub-cardioid capsule & electronics mod), (2) Audix M1290-o, (2) Micro capsule active cables w/ Naiant PFA's, (2) Naiant MSH-1O, (2) Naiant AKG Active cables, (2) Church CA-11 (cardioid), (2) CAD C9, (1) Nady SCM-1000 (mod)
Pre-amps: Naiant littlekit v2.0, BM2p+ Edirol UA-5, Church STC-9000
Recorders: Tascam DR-680, iRiver iHP-120 (Rockboxed & RTC mod), Denon DTR-80p

Recordings on the LMA: http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/ChuckM
Recording website & blog: http://www.timebetweenthenotes.com

Offline willndmb

  • Trade Count: (17)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *****
  • Posts: 6532
  • Gender: Male
Re: Smallest Pre-amp with 48v Phantom Power
« Reply #20 on: January 28, 2011, 10:16:09 PM »
how would one power the tiny box if it was 48v?
external power?? to me that would defeat the purpose

i like not needing tools to change the battery, ie lb vs aerco
Mics - AKG ck61/ck63 (c480b & Naiant actives), SP-BMC-2
XLR Cables - Silver Path w/Darktrain stubbies
Interconnect Cables - Dogstar (XLR), Darktrain (RCA > 1/8) (1/8 > 1/8), and Kind Kables (1/8f > 1/4)
Preamps - Naiant Littlebox & Tinybox
Recorders - PCM-M10 & DR-60D

Offline page

  • Trade Count: (25)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *****
  • Posts: 8389
  • Gender: Male
  • #TeamRetired
Re: Smallest Pre-amp with 48v Phantom Power
« Reply #21 on: January 29, 2011, 12:51:24 AM »
how would one power the tiny box if it was 48v?
external power?? to me that would defeat the purpose

i like not needing tools to change the battery, ie lb vs aerco

conversely, I'd rather have a removable 9v for the (polarization 48v tinybox), even if it meant removing the case each evening to change it. I'd use it so little that the internal l-ion would have to be removed/changed before I really got a good use out of it. I guess in some ways if a removable 9v isn't an option down the road, I'd gaffer tape it to the bottom of the box and wire a connector going inside somewhere. Ugly as sin, but it would allow me to change the battery. I've gotten burned twice on hard to remove l-ion units already so I'm weary of them. ymmv
"This is a common practice we have on the bus; debating facts that we could easily find through printed material. It's like, how far is it today? I think it's four hours, and someone else comes in at 11 hours, and well, then we'll... just... talk about it..." - Jeb Puryear

"Nostalgia ain't what it used to be." - Jim Williams

Offline willndmb

  • Trade Count: (17)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *****
  • Posts: 6532
  • Gender: Male
Re: Smallest Pre-amp with 48v Phantom Power
« Reply #22 on: January 29, 2011, 08:38:15 AM »
i agree
a 48v where you had to remove the case would be better imo then nothing at all
akg actives are better then a 48v tinybox too ;)
Mics - AKG ck61/ck63 (c480b & Naiant actives), SP-BMC-2
XLR Cables - Silver Path w/Darktrain stubbies
Interconnect Cables - Dogstar (XLR), Darktrain (RCA > 1/8) (1/8 > 1/8), and Kind Kables (1/8f > 1/4)
Preamps - Naiant Littlebox & Tinybox
Recorders - PCM-M10 & DR-60D

Offline page

  • Trade Count: (25)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *****
  • Posts: 8389
  • Gender: Male
  • #TeamRetired
Re: Smallest Pre-amp with 48v Phantom Power
« Reply #23 on: January 29, 2011, 01:03:01 PM »
You can have a 9V tinybox now, you just have to request it.  You need to be a bit careful with closing the case as the screws are steel but the case is aluminum.  If you overtorque the screws you'll strip the case.


oooo, aaaaaaa. shiney. thanks for the info.
"This is a common practice we have on the bus; debating facts that we could easily find through printed material. It's like, how far is it today? I think it's four hours, and someone else comes in at 11 hours, and well, then we'll... just... talk about it..." - Jeb Puryear

"Nostalgia ain't what it used to be." - Jim Williams

Offline Roger Gustavsson

  • Trade Count: (1)
  • Taperssection Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 420
Re: Smallest Pre-amp with 48v Phantom Power
« Reply #24 on: January 29, 2011, 04:19:05 PM »
P48 or P12, but I think many microphones do not take the full advantage of P48. Many are specified for 9-52 V. Maybe some are doing fine on P12? It is up to which microphones are going to be used.


Roger

Offline willndmb

  • Trade Count: (17)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *****
  • Posts: 6532
  • Gender: Male
Re: Smallest Pre-amp with 48v Phantom Power
« Reply #25 on: January 29, 2011, 04:50:46 PM »
P48 or P12, but I think many microphones do not take the full advantage of P48. Many are specified for 9-52 V. Maybe some are doing fine on P12? It is up to which microphones are going to be used.


Roger
doing fine and full potential are different too
in the end it comes down to your ears imo
if you have mics that can run at 12v but sound better at 48v you may or may not care for the 12v sound
Mics - AKG ck61/ck63 (c480b & Naiant actives), SP-BMC-2
XLR Cables - Silver Path w/Darktrain stubbies
Interconnect Cables - Dogstar (XLR), Darktrain (RCA > 1/8) (1/8 > 1/8), and Kind Kables (1/8f > 1/4)
Preamps - Naiant Littlebox & Tinybox
Recorders - PCM-M10 & DR-60D

Offline page

  • Trade Count: (25)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *****
  • Posts: 8389
  • Gender: Male
  • #TeamRetired
Re: Smallest Pre-amp with 48v Phantom Power
« Reply #26 on: January 29, 2011, 06:01:09 PM »
P48 or P12, but I think many microphones do not take the full advantage of P48. Many are specified for 9-52 V. Maybe some are doing fine on P12? It is up to which microphones are going to be used.


Roger
doing fine and full potential are different too
in the end it comes down to your ears imo
if you have mics that can run at 12v but sound better at 48v you may or may not care for the 12v sound

has anyone actually done testing on this? I'd honestly be surprised if schoeps, beyer, and akg all advertised compatibility at P12 and sounded "better" at P48. That seems like an engineering flaw to me.
"This is a common practice we have on the bus; debating facts that we could easily find through printed material. It's like, how far is it today? I think it's four hours, and someone else comes in at 11 hours, and well, then we'll... just... talk about it..." - Jeb Puryear

"Nostalgia ain't what it used to be." - Jim Williams

Offline Roger Gustavsson

  • Trade Count: (1)
  • Taperssection Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 420
Re: Smallest Pre-amp with 48v Phantom Power
« Reply #27 on: January 30, 2011, 09:32:13 AM »
The tradional Schoeps circuitry supplies the same voltage to the impedance convertering stage with P12 or P48. The buffer stage will probably have a higher maximum swing while running on P48. How many are really running their microphones at that high SPL to explore the difference? Normally we do not have 125+ dB in concerts, have we? I think we can find the figures in the specifications of some microphones.

Roger

Offline dactylus

  • Site Supporter
  • Trade Count: (34)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *
  • Posts: 4517
  • Gender: Male
  • Saint Paul, MN
Re: Smallest Pre-amp with 48v Phantom Power
« Reply #28 on: January 30, 2011, 09:57:56 AM »
Short of that, getting a pair of mics that can run on 12v phantom like the Milab vm44-link and pairing them with a tinybox also yields a pretty small solution.


^
Has anyone out there with a pair of Milab VM44-Links gone the 12v phantom route pairing them with a tinybox?  If so I'd love to hear the results as I'd like to have that option available for myself.

« Last Edit: January 30, 2011, 09:59:31 AM by dactylus »
hot licks > microphones > recorder



...ball of confusion, that's what the world is today, hey hey...

Offline page

  • Trade Count: (25)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *****
  • Posts: 8389
  • Gender: Male
  • #TeamRetired
Re: Smallest Pre-amp with 48v Phantom Power
« Reply #29 on: January 30, 2011, 04:15:39 PM »
The tradional Schoeps circuitry supplies the same voltage to the impedance convertering stage with P12 or P48. The buffer stage will probably have a higher maximum swing while running on P48. How many are really running their microphones at that high SPL to explore the difference? Normally we do not have 125+ dB in concerts, have we? I think we can find the figures in the specifications of some microphones.

Roger

Correct, we normally don't. I've only had 2 instances where I came close (mathematically the second one came out to just under 125 and I didn't measure the other) and both were cramped stage lip/onstage environments.
"This is a common practice we have on the bus; debating facts that we could easily find through printed material. It's like, how far is it today? I think it's four hours, and someone else comes in at 11 hours, and well, then we'll... just... talk about it..." - Jeb Puryear

"Nostalgia ain't what it used to be." - Jim Williams

 

RSS | Mobile
Page created in 0.306 seconds with 42 queries.
© 2002-2017 Taperssection.com
Powered by SMF
Website Design by Foxtrot Media, Inc., a Baltimore Website Company