Topic: V3 & 7AH SLA run-time test

[Brian Skalinder]

Just tested my V3 with a 7AH SLA in prep for some festivals I'm attending.  I have a handful of 10AH SLAs (still charging), one of which I'll be testing tomorrow, hopefully.  Anyway, many of you know I post regularly on how to calculate theoretical run-times for your gear.

I thought some may be interested in my actual run-time:

• 6v, 7AH SLA
• 48v phantom on to a pair of CMC64s
• Single SPDIF out to a deck
• ANSR on
• 48 kHz
• Low battery light started flashing at 4 hrs
• V3 shut off at 5 hrs 15 min

So...I got 75% of the rated rated SLA capacity.

[Tim]

thanks Brian!

[JAH]

Just tested my V3 with a 7AH SLA in prep for some festivals I'm attending.  I have a handful of 10AH SLAs (still charging), one of which I'll be testing tomorrow, hopefully.  Anyway, many of you know I post regularly on how to calculate theoretical run-times for your gear.

I thought some may be interested in my actual run-time:
Interesting...we usually say 15 to 20% and this time  (meaning a sample of one....as newer and older SLA times may vary...but still great info).
did you notice any degradation on the V3 (distortion???).
I run both the 10ah and the 7ah.  The 10ah has 2 taps for the short shows (3 hrs'ish)...that way I can run the msbm-1 and the P1 (since the 148 has internals).

Keep up the good work
jah

• 6v, 7AH SLA
• 48v phantom on to a pair of CMC64s
• Single SPDIF out to a deck
• ANSR on
• 48 kHz
• Low battery light started flashing at 4 hrs
• V3 shut off at 5 hrs 15 min

So...I got 75% of the rated rated SLA capacity.

[DaryanLenz]

Bean and I got at least 7 hours of actual usage pushing one saturday suring Panic!

daryan

[Brian Skalinder]

Jah  --  I didn't monitor sonic performance during the batt test, so I don't know if the V3 exhibited any degradation.  Just didn't think of it at the time - I figured the Grace folks wouldn't place the cut-off voltage so low that it would degrade performance, but...something to keep in mind if/when I run another test.

Daryan  --  You got 7 hours out of what capacity SLA...7AH?  10AH?

[DaryanLenz]

I think it was an eco charge...I assume 7amh...we pushed it and made it!

daryan

[Brian Skalinder]

I think it was an eco charge...I assume 7amh...we pushed it and made it!

daryan

Glad you made it!

Did the low batt light come on?  Were you running the ADC the entire time?

Pretty big discrepancy between my 5:15 and your 7:00 hrs.  I know current draw can be pretty variable when using phantom depending on the mics, so that might account for it.  Or maybe my SLA isn't what it used to be.  I'll try to remember to post how my brand-new SLAs work during festivals the next two weeks...curious to see how they perform.

[Nick S.]

7 hours using what mics?  MIght explain the difference in record time!

Nick

[tim in jersey]

I just did Gathering Of The Vibes this weekend and had very similar results as Brian. The low battery light began to flash at roughly 3.5-4 hours. I got another 1:30 out of it, and then swapped batteries for the next couple sets. My 7.2ah SLA's are very low milage.

I ran:

CMC 64's
48V
ANSR
1 SPDIF @ 44.1

[F.O.Bean]

I think it was an eco charge...I assume 7amh...we pushed it and made it!

daryan

we did everything you did.....ad on, phantom on, 48k, ansr,pair of mg 200's, and i think we got about 6-6.5 max due to my geeky timing... ;)but still, hell yeah....

oh, and it was a 7.2 a..... 8)and sonically, i cannot tell one bit of a difference..... ;Dand the low batt starts flashing faster, and faster....also, it was a four year batt, my first one i got in 99..... :oi would guess mic curent draw is a factor here.....

bean

[rabhan]

from mike grace - the v3 should be set to flash low batt @5.75V and power off @5.2V. if you run a 6v below 5v, you will destroy its lifespan. there is no performance fluctuations between 6.5V and 5.2V on the v3.

http://www.taperssection.com/yabbse/index.php?board=20;action=display;threadid=3136;start=msg25257#msg25257

-the standard eco charger will charge a 6v 12ah batt, but it wont float, so you will have to watch it with a meter.

http://www.taperssection.com/yabbse/index.php?board=1;action=display;threadid=2745;start=msg21865#msg21865

[John R]

man, running the 7.2Ah with the 184's i was going all day at telluride, 10am to 6-7pm, before i move to another batt

jr

[rabhan]

12v or 6v ?

[John R]

12v or 6v ?

12v

[rabhan]

yeah, i believe everyone else in this thread has a 6v, thats why you get longer runtimes.

[John R]

you're right, my bad.  used a 6v eco for 5 hrs, same rig.  low batt was lit.

jr

[DaryanLenz]

One thing you should remember is that Bean and I may have had about an hour variance on actual time and mental time.  I would trust your more  controlled ( ) tests a lot more than ours.  

Daryan

[JAH]

So I'm thinking about getting some new batteries here pretty soon. I have been running 6v 7.2Ah
With the next batts.......
Is bigger better? 6v 14Ah? (not sure of exact Ah size on the larger batt)
Or is it better to have two different 6v 7.2Ah, and just change to fresh power when necessary?
I kind of like the idea of having two batts and leaving one charging while using the other. Or having one as a backup for the occasional long session.

Also.......
Anyone know if a 6vdc@750mA battery charger will charge up the larger capacity 6v battery?
http://batterytender.com/product_info.php?products_id=5&osCsid=882fb5a42bc268d15b2e316a72e84fdb
With 4 pin xlr termination

Thanks guys!

Is bigger bettter....heh, heh, heh   she thinks so
Seriously...how much do you want to carry?  I find the 10AH batts easier to carry than 2 x 7ah for a 3 hr show.  but for festival time it's what you can lug cause you're going to need 'em all.
I'd say figure you average time spent recording/run time...i.e. I do many 3 hr shows and neded to power 2 items. So 10 AH (mine is actually a 12AH) is better than 2x7ah (providing you don't have a major power pig ...gotta check your I draws..)
Then for festivals you may need an additional battery or two (AH dependent).  Now keep in mine, you will need to recharge them too...I have 2 chargers (1AH each) to get it done simutaneously.
You don't want to run the batts till they cut off/deck/pre /adc/???dies cause deep drains kill SLAs fast (that's why the have marine batts for deep cycles). Which is why the total run time is derated by ~20%.

hope it helps
jah

[John R]

gotta roll with jah on this.  it all depends on what you do most of the time.  most of my work is at festivals, so i go big.  my inventory:

2 ea 12v, 7.2A/h, 2 chargers
3 ea 6v, 7.2A/h, 2 chargers(i can only find one since my move though)

a lot of weight to move around, but i always have access to close AC, so it makes charging/rotation pretty easy.  ymmv.

jr

[Marc Nutter]

you're right, my bad.  used a 6v eco for 5 hrs, same rig.  low batt was lit.

jr

Hi John and All,

It should be noted that the longer run times John is getting are the result of the regulated output of the EC-90 (the Eco-Charge with dual output).  If you were to run the 12v output to a V3, you should expect the same operation times as those being posted regarding the 6v batteries.  When a 12v is used to power a 6 or 12v V2/V3, the units will run hotter as they are dissipating the extra voltage as heat whereas the regulator in the EC-90 is not wasting the power.  

This is true with all devices under 12v that are used with the EC-90.

John, please correct me if this is not the case for what you are doing.

Happy Recording,

Marc

[rabhan]

marc, so you are saying that the v3 runtimes shouldnt change whether you use a 12v or 6v?

[Marc Nutter]

marc, so you are saying that the v3 runtimes shouldnt change whether you use a 12v or 6v?

Yes, as long as they are normal 6 or 12 v batteries.
The Eco-Charge EC-90 is a unique animal.  The regulator they have used does not waste power through heat dissipation like the V3/V2, or MiniMe would.

All of these devices draw the same amount of current regardless of whether it is from a 6 or 12v source.

Happy Recording,

Marc

[John R]

you're right, my bad.  used a 6v eco for 5 hrs, same rig.  low batt was lit.

jr

Hi John and All,

It should be noted that the longer run times John is getting are the result of the regulated output of the EC-90 (the Eco-Charge with dual output).  If you were to run the 12v output to a V3, you should expect the same operation times as those being posted regarding the 6v batteries.  When a 12v is used to power a 6 or 12v V2/V3, the units will run hotter as they are dissipating the extra voltage as heat whereas the regulator in the EC-90 is not wasting the power.  

This is true with all devices under 12v that are used with the EC-90.

John, please correct me if this is not the case for what you are doing.

Happy Recording,

Marc

yes, running the v3 with the ec-90 form the 6v port.  me luv it long time.

jr

[Wes]

Marc,
What eco-charges secret to getting the dual output voltage?  is it as simple as a step down transformer which steps the output voltage on the 6v side from 12V down to 6V or am completely off?

[Brian Skalinder]

Marc - great stuff!  Thanks for posting, we seemed to be struggling a bit with this one before you chimed in.  Much appreciated.

In general, for my money and the minimal added weight, I'm happy to carry 2 6v 7AH SLAs vs. an Ecocharge EC-90.

2 x 6v/7AH SLAs + XLRs = $45 and 6.2 lbs

1 x 12v/6v/7AH EC-90 = $190 and 5.5 lbs

Granted, the EC-90 gives you the option of 12v and/or 6v - a great value to some folks - but that's not a feature I need.

At any rate, it's good to know why John's times were much longer so everyone can make their own decisions about buying or making their own, etc.  An informed decision is always a better decision.  

[rabhan]

i like the 6v/12ah option for cheaper and lighter, but you gotta make it yourself.

[F.O.Bean]

One thing you should remember is that Bean and I may have had about an hour variance on actual time and mental time.  I would trust your more  controlled ( ) tests a lot more than ours.  

Daryan

according to dat tape timings, wsp was about 3hrs. on the dot, biscuits first set was about 1hr and 30 mins....and their second was the same..we switched before encore and did all of those 2 shows.... ...now account for level checkings and whatnot, thats at least 6 hrs. right off the bat...... ;)i am gonna check and see the mg200 current draw,......

bean

[Lee]

One thing you should remember is that Bean and I may have had about an hour variance on actual time and mental time.  I would trust your more  controlled ( ) tests a lot more than ours.  

Daryan

according to dat tape timings, wsp was about 3hrs. on the dot, biscuits first set was about 1hr and 30 mins....and their second was the same..we switched before encore and did all of those 2 shows.... ...now account for level checkings and whatnot, thats at least 6 hrs. right off the bat...... ;)i am gonna check and see the mg200 current draw,......

bean

3mA according to their website...

[F.O.Bean]

One thing you should remember is that Bean and I may have had about an hour variance on actual time and mental time.  I would trust your more  controlled ( ) tests a lot more than ours.  

Daryan

according to dat tape timings, wsp was about 3hrs. on the dot, biscuits first set was about 1hr and 30 mins....and their second was the same..we switched before encore and did all of those 2 shows.... ...now account for level checkings and whatnot, thats at least 6 hrs. right off the bat...... ;)i am gonna check and see the mg200 current draw,......

bean

3mA according to their website...

thanks lee, my comps slow....now what about schemps.....

[Brian Skalinder]

thanks lee, my comps slow....now what about schemps.....

According to the archival section with Doug Oade's info, the Shoeps draw 4mA.

[F.O.Bean]

thanks lee, my comps slow....now what about schemps.....

According to the archival section with Doug Oade's info, the Shoeps draw 4mA.

thanks brian, i just found it at the schempz page too....1mA is so small a difference it shouldnt matter.now i can see if it was powered by 12v, where the current consumtion goes up to 8 mA, but what the heck......

[tivva]

brian...
nice job....
New V3 owner

so your 10 runs for 7.5 hrs....?

now we gotta figure out something with this screw on power deal....need some type of 90deg mini xlr like on V2....
couldn't find in my catalogs? Any suggestions???
pax..
tivv

[Brian Skalinder]

so your 10 runs for 7.5 hrs....?

I haven't run it down completely yet on a 10AH SLA, but based on my experiences so far, it should go 7.5 hours yes.

now we gotta figure out something with this screw on power deal....need some type of 90deg mini xlr like on V2....
couldn't find in my catalogs? Any suggestions???

Ahem...check the archives.  

Unfortunately, there's no good answer on this one.  Several people have hacked the V3 power adapter to make it less obtrusive.  Mine is super-ghetto, the others are all much better, though in all cases the hacked cables are working well without glitches.  Here's a link from the archives...check out [2] specifically:

http://www.taperssection.com/yabbse/index.php?board=14;action=display;threadid=6093