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Author Topic: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 3  (Read 30721 times)

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Offline nolamule

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Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 3
« Reply #300 on: August 09, 2017, 01:06:19 AM »
That was a single NP-F570, I'm using it as backup for my Hawk-Woods dummy cell.

Sony NP-F570 - 1.5 hours

Was that one or a pair?  The NP-F770 is twice the mAh, so likely about twice the time (for similar settings and mic draw, of course).


Offline aaronji

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Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 3
« Reply #301 on: August 09, 2017, 10:57:41 AM »
^ That's very helpful; thank you.  I guess it is not unreasonable to assume that you'd get ~ 3 hours with two of them, ~ 6 hours with two NP-F770s, and ~ 8.5 hours with a pair of 970s.  Assuming the same settings and mic draw...

Offline rippleish20

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Offline jbell

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Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 3
« Reply #303 on: August 10, 2017, 03:40:29 PM »
I might have to grab the Hawk-woods sd2 when it is available!!  I like the orientation of the battery better than the SD L mount sled


https://www.trewaudio.com/product/hawk-woods-sd-1/
 
https://www.trewaudio.com/product/hawk-woods-sd-2/
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Offline lerond

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Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 3
« Reply #304 on: August 10, 2017, 03:44:49 PM »

I'd love to be able to Link 1/2 & 3/4 like my old SD722, where Channel 1 controls gain, and Channel 2 controls balance between the two linked channels!

This is one of the biggest things I would like to see changed!
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Offline waltmon

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Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 3
« Reply #305 on: August 10, 2017, 09:35:24 PM »
It's easy to link channels like that no issues
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Offline nolamule

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Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 3
« Reply #306 on: August 10, 2017, 09:37:14 PM »
Those are both great solutions!! But neither allow for hot swapping without a USB-C battery.


https://www.trewaudio.com/product/hawk-woods-sd-1/
 
https://www.trewaudio.com/product/hawk-woods-sd-2/

It is easy to link the faders, not the gain like the 7-series recorders.

It's easy to link channels like that no issues
« Last Edit: August 11, 2017, 10:22:39 AM by nolamule »

Offline dactylus

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Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 3
« Reply #307 on: August 11, 2017, 08:26:42 AM »
Those are both great solutions!! But neither allow for hot swapping without a USB-C battery.


https://www.trewaudio.com/product/hawk-woods-sd-1/
 
https://www.trewaudio.com/product/hawk-woods-sd-2/

Agreed on both of these Hawk-Woods products being great powering solutions. 
hot licks > microphones > recorder



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Offline Todd R

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Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 3
« Reply #308 on: August 11, 2017, 11:55:14 AM »
I guess I keep reading these threads with posts and frustrations about channel linking, setting up the Mixpre with custom mode using basic gain, etc., and feel like I should try to make a plea for people to re-think their old work flow.

I have recorded 25-30 sets now with the Mixpre-6 in a number of different venues, with a large variety of types of music (from acoustic duets to more louder jam-grass to more typical rock sets), using different sets of mics.  I've never used anything but advanced mode, and I've always pre-set my gain before the show started and never changed the gain settings during a set.  Even using a couple sets of new-to-me mics in venues I've never used them at, every set I've recorded has ended with peaks in the range of -18dbFS for the quietest recording to -7dbFS for the loudest recording.

Bottom line, I don't think it is very hard with our level of experience as tapers to guess beforehand approximately how much gain you need.  And the Mixpre series is incredibly quiet, even my acoustic stuff that ended up at -20dbFS shows no hint of noise once I've boosted/normalized the recording in post.  Short of incredibly quiet studios or nature recording, for concert recording in almost any setting we can imagine, if you ended up with way too little gain and a recording that topped out at -40dbFS, you won't notice any noise hit once you normalize the levels up in post, at least based on SD's published specs.  This seems to have been borne out when the earlier firmware resulted in recordings at -40db or -45db if you had turned off the LR mix tracks in the set up (now fixed).  People who had that problem reported no issues once they boosted/normalized their -40db recordings up to 0dbFS.

I'd really recommend folks trying to record with this new thought process/workflow.  If you set up gain beforehand and don't touch it, there's no need for to get into the custom mode with basic gain, no worries about channel linking or 4-ch linking since they will be "linked" at the same gain up front.  The Mixpre series allows you to set a precise level of gain on all channels, if for example you're using a 4ch ambisonic mic and set up and match the gain beforehand and never change gain during the set, there is no need for channel linking.

I guess I'm just missing the reasons people have for wanting to control gain during the set, but with incredibly quiet preamps (noise at -130dbV) and an unbelievably wide dynamic range (120db), the Mixpre can be easily used with gain set very low and conservative (leading to very low recording levels) and then boosted in post with no discernible penalties.  Guessing what gain levels you need beforehand when you are just shooting for peaks at -30dbFS (but willing to accept -1dbFS) leaves a wide target and doesn't require much knowledge and experience to achieve.

If people are willing to try this as a new workflow, it sure seems to avoid many of the complaints folks have about this recorder.  That's my long-winded public service plea.  Sorry, not trying to lecture experienced tapers on how to approach their recordings, just trying to emphasize that new technologies and vastly improved recorders and preamps allow for new ways of doing things which didn't work before.  (Compare for example the recording I made years ago with a Sony D7 DAT using phantom power supplies and the internal D7 preamps.  Peaks at -16db, oh god the noise on that recording, sounded like listening to music on a boom box by the ocean.)
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Offline dallman

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Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 3
« Reply #309 on: August 11, 2017, 12:27:37 PM »
^^^
=T, great and very true post. I couldn't agree more.

I set mine a bit differently because I still like having the knobs control gain, but I preset my gain and I have not needed to touch it. The real proof of the value of these preamps can be seen with the first firmware update, which still left one glitch. That glitch was that if you turned off the mix track, your recording would look right, but would be very low, so much so that you had to add about 15db of gain, which is a really really large amount of gain, but the recording was still absolutely quiet in the quiet parts and rich and full sounding musically. 

Go conservative and edit in post. This is an amazing deck for staying careful and conservative, no loss of quality. For anyone that does not make any changes in post, it is like recording with one arm tied behind your back.
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Offline rippleish20

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Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 3
« Reply #310 on: August 11, 2017, 12:39:32 PM »
I've adapted to the workflow. I use my Mixrpre in advanced mode and its not that hard to set gain and be happy. I like my Mixpre quite a bit - there are many nice aspects to it But getting used to the workflow doesn't translate to the workflow being ideal, or for everyone. It still strikes me as a mixer marketed as a recorder.
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Offline jbell

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Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 3
« Reply #311 on: August 11, 2017, 12:48:48 PM »
The mix track issues was fixed with firmware 1.11!!  I have been recording with mine turned off without issue.

^^^
=T, great and very true post. I couldn't agree more.

I set mine a bit differently because I still like having the knobs control gain, but I preset my gain and I have not needed to touch it. The real proof of the value of these preamps can be seen with the first firmware update, which still left one glitch. That glitch was that if you turned off the mix track, your recording would look right, but would be very low, so much so that you had to add about 15db of gain, which is a really really large amount of gain, but the recording was still absolutely quiet in the quiet parts and rich and full sounding musically. 

Go conservative and edit in post. This is an amazing deck for staying careful and conservative, no loss of quality. For anyone that does not make any changes in post, it is like recording with one arm tied behind your back.
Schoeps MK4's, MK41's> KCY 250/5 Ig> Naiant PFA(60V)> Sound Devices Mixpre-6

Offline rippleish20

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Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 3
« Reply #312 on: August 11, 2017, 01:02:16 PM »
All the bugs I encountered seem to have been fixed as of 1.11.
MK22's / MK41's / MK41v's (for sale) / MK4v's / MK4's / AKG C480Bs+ck61, ck63 / Telefunken FET M60 Cards and Hypers (for sale) / AT853s (for sale)
KCY 250/5 and Nbob KCY (x2) > naiant PFA or IPA or Nbox  / SP-SPSB-11 Battery Box
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Offline waltmon

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Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 3
« Reply #313 on: August 13, 2017, 01:39:51 PM »
That's the first I am reading of the SD-2 version of Hawkwoods...that's bad ass...I have 3 - 8800ma  cells and 3 - 6600ma cells
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Offline dallman

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Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 3
« Reply #314 on: August 13, 2017, 03:36:45 PM »
The mix track issues was fixed with firmware 1.11!!  I have been recording with mine turned off without issue.

^^^
=T, great and very true post. I couldn't agree more.

I set mine a bit differently because I still like having the knobs control gain, but I preset my gain and I have not needed to touch it. The real proof of the value of these preamps can be seen with the first firmware update, which still left one glitch. That glitch was that if you turned off the mix track, your recording would look right, but would be very low, so much so that you had to add about 15db of gain, which is a really really large amount of gain, but the recording was still absolutely quiet in the quiet parts and rich and full sounding musically. 

Go conservative and edit in post. This is an amazing deck for staying careful and conservative, no loss of quality. For anyone that does not make any changes in post, it is like recording with one arm tied behind your back.
Exactly, but it was a great opportunity to see what the preamps could do being pushed. The next update fixed the issue which I should have been more clear about.
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