Become a Site Supporter and Never see Ads again!

Author Topic: It Is Literally All About Position  (Read 1457 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Gutbucket

  • record > listen > revise technique
  • Trade Count: (13)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *****
  • Posts: 11361
  • Gender: Male
Re: It Is Literally All About Position
« Reply #15 on: August 28, 2017, 12:57:46 PM »
Sometimes I can hear far more detail live, other times I hear details in the recording which I completely missed live.

Is this mostly because of other sensory cues, do you think, or differences in volume as well? One thing that I increasingly notice the more I do this stuff is that it's important to remember that ears and brains have lousy (though not nonexistent) dynamic compression.

Both I think.  It's so difficult to truly divorce ourselves of all other sensory input except hearing, even when we feel we are masterful at doing so.  Yet sound level is a huge factor as well.  Being able to adjust playback level afterwards to what sounds most correct is one of the most powerful tools of all after getting timbre and direct/reverberant balance correct sounding.  The difference in dynamics between being there and what is appropriate for playback is also hugely interesting, and commonly over-simplified by so many in discussions - ie: the audiophile common notion that "dynamic compression is always bad", when dynamic manipulation is so obviously beneficial for live music reproduction when managed correctly.
volition > vibrations > voltages > numeric values | numeric values > voltages > vibrations > virtual teleportation time-machine experience

Offline DSatz

  • Site Supporter
  • Trade Count: (22)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *
  • Posts: 2371
  • Gender: Male
Re: It Is Literally All About Position
« Reply #16 on: August 28, 2017, 10:47:11 PM »
Unless you record in an anechoic chamber, you are recording the room as much as, if not more than, the direct sound. This is why I don't recommend thinking of a stereo pair of microphones as being "aimed at" anything. Rather, they work together to pick up a stereophonic impression of the sound field at their location.
music > microphones > a recorder of some sort

Offline admkrk

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Taperssection All-Star
  • ****
  • Posts: 1592
  • I'm an idiot
Re: It Is Literally All About Position
« Reply #17 on: August 28, 2017, 11:36:29 PM »
I like the way you were able to dumb that down, and still make sense. I was thinking about this and even if you find the perfect spot, it does not mean that your mics will hear the same thing you do when you raise them a couple feet over your head.
"the faster you go ahead, the behinder you get"

"If you can drink ram's piss, fuck, you can drink anything"

Offline nulldogmas

  • Trade Count: (1)
  • Taperssection Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 587
Re: It Is Literally All About Position
« Reply #18 on: August 29, 2017, 07:58:02 AM »
The difference in dynamics between being there and what is appropriate for playback is also hugely interesting, and commonly over-simplified by so many in discussions - ie: the audiophile common notion that "dynamic compression is always bad", when dynamic manipulation is so obviously beneficial for live music reproduction when managed correctly.

Yeah, I'll stop using dynamic compression the minute I do all my music playback on a wall of speakers blasting 110 dB from 50 feet away from me.

Offline kindms

  • Trade Count: (3)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *****
  • Posts: 4213
    • The Breakfast
Re: It Is Literally All About Position
« Reply #19 on: August 29, 2017, 03:56:41 PM »
Walking the box.

I used to see FOH guys do it all the time. Not so much these days or Im just not noticing it as much. even a few feet can have dramatic effects depending on the room.
AKG414 XLS/ST> TCM-Mod Tascam HDP2
Musichall Mambo > VR-2's

Offline heathen

  • Trade Count: (5)
  • Taperssection Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 279
Re: It Is Literally All About Position
« Reply #20 on: August 29, 2017, 05:24:53 PM »
The difference in dynamics between being there and what is appropriate for playback is also hugely interesting, and commonly over-simplified by so many in discussions - ie: the audiophile common notion that "dynamic compression is always bad", when dynamic manipulation is so obviously beneficial for live music reproduction when managed correctly.
There's the rub for someone like me who knows virtually nothing about how and when to use compression.  Because of my own ignorance I don't know how to manage it correctly, so I end up avoiding it altogether in my post-processing.
Mics: Core Sound TetraMic | Countryman B3 | CA-14 omnis | AT853 cards | AKG 460/ck61 | Studio Projects CS5
Decks: Zoom F4 | Tascam DR-70D | Roland R-05

Offline Gutbucket

  • record > listen > revise technique
  • Trade Count: (13)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *****
  • Posts: 11361
  • Gender: Male
Re: It Is Literally All About Position
« Reply #21 on: August 29, 2017, 06:28:03 PM »
^ Wise. Do no harm.  Same goes for EQ - when in doubt, better not to.

It's the "compression is always bad" argument which may be well intended in response to the dynamics devastation wrought by the loudness wars, but is counterproductive in such oversimplification.  Folks just don't listen at the same level as the performance in their home or in the car wearing ear-plugs like they do at a big amplified concert.  Hardly any are actually capable of reproduction at the original SPL.  If they realize it or not, everyone is doing dynamics manipulation by simply adjusting the volume knob.

So much of dynamics is related to recording position- It's easy to set recording levels with minimal headroom back in the section, where everything through the PA is compressed and limited.  Compare that to the headroom required recording on-stage near the drum kit.  Even more so with a close-mic'd kit.


This!-

Quote from: D Satz
Unless you record in an anechoic chamber, you are recording the room as much as, if not more than, the direct sound. This is why I don't recommend thinking of a stereo pair of microphones as being "aimed at" anything. Rather, they work together to pick up a stereophonic impression of the sound field at their location.
volition > vibrations > voltages > numeric values | numeric values > voltages > vibrations > virtual teleportation time-machine experience

 

RSS | Mobile
Page created in 0.15 seconds with 29 queries.
© 2002-2017 Taperssection.com
Powered by SMF
Website Design by Foxtrot Media, Inc., a Baltimore Website Company