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Gear / Technical Help => Ask The Tapers => Topic started by: deadphishin420 on August 22, 2019, 11:34:29 AM
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Hello all
I ordered at the end of July a battery pack from church audio. I’ve tried to email them to find out my order status and have got no reply. Does it normally take this long? Is he a member on here? I’m not bashing the guy, just want to make sure a battery box that said they had 10 of in stock took this long. Thanks!
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Grab a drink, kick back and say goodbye to your afternoon:
http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=177464.0
http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=178414.0
"In stock" doesn't mean anything.
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lol
I've had the best luck messaging him on Facebook. Love his gear
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I found out after ordering that "in stock" means he has the raw materials on hand...and that's all it means.
You'll get what you ordered, just don't hold your breath. Sad to say that's just the way it is when ordering from him.
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Good luck :cheers:
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Could be a month, could be 6+
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Don't do it. Nothing but drama and long delays.
If super low cost is what you need, you have other options:
Jon at Naiant makes great products and his service is outstanding.
https://naiant.com/ (https://naiant.com/)
For something that looks more like the things Church makes, check out Sound Professionals:
https://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/gold/category/120/mics (https://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/gold/category/120/mics)
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Church Guy bitched me out when I said off-hand that I didn't like ordering from custom shops like his b/c product support couldn't be guaranteed...
I guess I was right...
Terry
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Don't do it. Nothing but drama and long delays.
If super low cost is what you need, you have other options:
Jon at Naiant makes great products and his service is outstanding.
https://naiant.com/ (https://naiant.com/)
For something that looks more like the things Church makes, check out Sound Professionals:
https://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/gold/category/120/mics (https://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/gold/category/120/mics)
what he said
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I'm still waiting for Sound Professionals to return my at853's I sent them 7 years ago. Calls get me the runaround. I paid them $140 to steal my mics. I'm just pointing out that shit can happen, no matter who you deal with.
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I'm still waiting for Sound Professionals to return my at853's I sent them 7 years ago. Calls get me the runaround. I paid them $140 to steal my mics. I'm just pointing out that shit can happen, no matter who you deal with.
And didn't some people have issues with Naiant recently?
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I use Church Audio mics and gear, and I love the products, but from this point forward I will only be buying second hand and from the Yard Sale. I will never do business with this dude directly ever again.
I placed an original order for 2 sets of mics and a pre-amp on 8/13/2018, after emailing him directly to see if he had what I wanted in stock, because his site said he didn't. He confirmed he had what I wanted, in stock, and that it would ship out the next week, so I placed an order. I got some CA-14 cards, some CA-11 cards, and a 9200. I didn't get in on any FB deal or anything, paid full price for all of it. I received my order 10/24/2018. From what I've come to understand, this is pretty quick and timely for him, but far from the next week that I was expecting from a promise he made unprompted by me. I've used the 14's and 9200 a ton, and love them. I didn't get around to using the CA-11's til around February, and the first time I was setting them up I inadvertently caught the left lead in a mic stand screw and chewed it up pretty good. (Reconfigured my set-up quickly on the fly and still pulled a good tape.) I hit him up about doing a repair, he told me it'd be $60+$20 return shipping, and I told him I'd get them out after Mardi Gras bc it's a busy time of year. He responded and asked "If you can send the payment now that would be cool I have to order some more Cable ASAP." He's quick to get your money, well in advance of services rendered, and then takes his time delivering at his own pace. I shipped the CA-11's for repair on 3/29/2019, and they were delivered at 10:42am on 4/5/2019 (I still have all of the tracking info/confirmations, payment records and emails of all our correspondence if anyone doubts my account here.) I hit him up on 5/17/2019, just to make sure he'd received them, and while not in a rush, I just wanted an ETA bc I was trying to make plans for what I was bringing to festivals this summer. He told me he'd get them done and ship them the following week. Followed up again 6/12/2019 - "It's done, will ship out Monday." On 7/12/2019 the response was just a terse "It's done." with no further details. When asked if they've shipped, he can't say for sure, and when asked for tracking info he tells me he doesn't do tracking on return shipping. My last communication with him was 8/13/2019 - "This shipped it’s on the way sorry for the delays" but so far I haven't received anything.
So as of right now,after a year of corresponding with this guy, I'm out more than $210 ($130 for the mics + $80 for repair + shipping) for a pair of mics I've never used once, and I can't even take them to someone else to have them repaired because he has them now.
EDIT: GOT 'EM, SEE BELOW
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Like, if it's gonna be 6 months, cool. Tell me i'll have them in 6 months. Don't tell me that they're done and shipping out next week when they are not, and you have no intention of delivering on this.
It isn't the wait that pisses me off, it's the expectations created by unkept promises and dishonesty.
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attitude to me is nearly as important, and that's what put me off Chris C for permanent
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Well, it's a goddamned miracle.
I literally typed the above post, left my office, and came home to find them in my mailbox.
And wouldn't ya know it, it has a tracking number after all.
Still, it's not an experience that I will be engaging in again. If you're expecting stuff from him, I hope you get it eventually.
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If urgency is important I would *NEVER* order anything from any of these one man shops.
Some guys just aren't that good at running a business. Some are in over their heads (too much work), and some just have legitimate life issues come up which may delay your product from arriving.
You want it in 2 days? Amazon or B+H is your best route, but obviously it's going to cost you more.
I wish more of these guys would make it more clear that they can't guarantee when the product may arrive due to bring a one man operation. Set the expectations of the customer low enough that they are sure they can keep them happy. If you think it's going to take a month to make...tell them 2 months. Obviously the downside to this is some people may not make a purchase.
I'm about to sell a ton of vinyl on Discogs and will be making it very clear that I'm just a regular guy with a regular life and may not be able to ship things same day (or maybe even until the weekend). I'm sure I will still get some moron bitching because their record didn't arrive in 3 days, but at least I can point them to something that they should have read in the first place.
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I want to be clear, I'm not upset about the wait. I know he's a one man show, and a busy dude, that's cool, just keep me apprised of the situation. I wasn't expecting a quick turn around. But don't tell me you're sending them on Monday in June if you're not shipping them until August. Because then I'm looking out for them in the mail, and when they don't show I don't know if it's bc they got lost or stolen or weren't sent. So then I want to know the shipping info so I can track them in case it's the former, and instead of saying "Hey, I didn't get around to it, sorry," I get fed an obvious lie about not having tracking information on return shipments. Now you're just disrespecting me, someone that paid you money for your services. If you didn't get to it, just own it and say so. The dishonesty just shows a complete lack of character and integrity. He builds great gear though, just wish he'd be more forthright in his dealings.
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giving up on the 'in stock' battery box i ordered in early july that i was told shipped in early august
i thought 7 weeks out would be time
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His communication (or lack thereof) has always been his issue. Sorry to see more folks bitten by the issue.
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:banging head:
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Great gear, I recommend as many have already said, if you need it fast try the yard sale first.
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I just got a message that it sent out last week. Let’s see if that’s the case.
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I just got a message that it sent out last week. Let’s see if that’s the case.
(https://i.imgur.com/7MhtsqS.gif)
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if the pages and pages of his misdeeds are not enough , read this post.: dont buy from him. If you do you do so at the risk of exceptionally poor customer service leading to a sour taste in one's mouth.
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Maybe his amp repair business has picked up, but most of these problems could be solved with honest communication about expectations. We all know that one man shop custom gear can take a while to get, just be up front about production time. The misleading "in stock" status needs to be addressed as well.
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Ive had (2) different repair transactions last over a year each. I love his gear, but I highly recommend to have backup mics just in case something goes wrong because the return time is never what you might expect.
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Really too bad.
With better service Chris could make a killing here.There are so many cool preamps, mics, cables, etc to be made.
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Seeing as how timely shipping seems to be an issue would I notice any real world difference using a battery box ordered from sound professionals with CA-14s vs waiting on one of his? Asking for a total noob...
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Seeing as how timely shipping seems to be an issue would I notice any real world difference using a battery box ordered from sound professionals with CA-14s vs waiting on one of his? Asking for a total noob...
Nope, power is power. Sound Pros is more expensive but they ship quickly for free (most of the time) and have great service.
Sending you a PM.
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Seeing as how timely shipping seems to be an issue would I notice any real world difference using a battery box ordered from sound professionals with CA-14s vs waiting on one of his? Asking for a total noob...
Nope, power is power. Sound Pros is more expensive but they ship quickly for free (most of the time) and have great service.
Sending you a PM.
I find that Sound Pros is a little cheaper, if you live in The States, because of the high cost of Canadian Post. The new series of Sound Pro Battery Boxes are EXTREMELY NICE and the smallest BB you'll find (that I know of).
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Any recs on a Sound Pros battery box that's similar to Church power supply options? I have a CA-9200, but I'd like to pick up something that's comparable to a UBB.
Also, what's the best option for running CA mics off XLR phantom power? After some digging I read on here that you can use a Naiant PFA, but do I need to get it custom output for 9v? I use a Zoom H4N, and I think phantom output is either 24v or 48v. Without some sort of adaption to 9v output will it fry the mics?
Sorry, I'm a bit of a n00b, and know nothing of electrical stuff beyond what i remember from high school physics 20 years ago. Basically, I want to be able to run 4 channels, omni's and cards at the same time, one set off the 3.5 input, and 1 set thru the XLR inputs.
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My experience dealing with CA over the last few years, is mixed, but improving.
Yes, don't expect goods to be shipped in a hurry, but when the last order went missing in the post, it was eventually replaced.
The quality and design of the preamps remains very good, and they are more durable than the SP battery boxes (YMMV).
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YMMV indeed
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The quality and design of the preamps remains very good, and they are more durable than the SP battery boxes (YMMV).
More durable? Sound Pros is ABS plastic vs the rubber modeling mold of the CA's?
I respectfully disagree.
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I recall issues with wire or soldering failures in CA products as well..
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I recall issues with wire or soldering failures in CA products as well..
That's not something I've experienced. All of his gear has been rock solid for me
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The quality and design of the preamps remains very good, and they are more durable than the SP battery boxes (YMMV).
More durable? Sound Pros is ABS plastic vs the rubber modeling mold of the CA's?
I respectfully disagree.
I have used a 3-wire CA-9100 preamp for around 10 years, and it is rock solid. I took delivery of a CA-9200 preamp a month ago and am testing it at the moment.
In comparison, the two SP battery boxes I had lasted 3-4 years of heavy use each before crapping out on me - usually losing, or sounding bad on one channel.
The Naiant PIPsqueaks are pretty tough, sound nice, and are beautifully built, but battery life is only 6-12 months.
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I'm 12 years on my SP battery box
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I love his gear and never had issues ordering from him (3 separate orders, CA-14 + CA-Ugly, CA-11, and then a CA-ugly 2) .
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My battery box order was pretty slow being filled.
I ordered the ugli originally because that was the only one that was listed "in stock". I wanted the bat2b which was not available at the time.
While waiting, I eventually saw that the bat2b was once again available. I asked to change my order and Chris took care of it.
Yes, it took awhile but I'm very happy with the replacement order.
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Any recs on a Sound Pros battery box that's similar to Church power supply options? I have a CA-9200, but I'd like to pick up something that's comparable to a UBB.
Chris Church has preamp CA ugly.
Also, what's the best option for running CA mics off XLR phantom power? After some digging I read on here that you can use a Naiant PFA, but do I need to get it custom output for 9v?
Naiant can build you phantom adapter that suits for Chris Church mics.
The second option is to use CA preamp with custom cable - CA mics -> CA preamp -> custom cable -> TS h4n.
The third option should be to use battery box with custom cable - CA mics -> bb -> custom cable -> XLR h4n. But be very careful. You must to turn off phantom power, otherwise you will fry battery box and mics.
I use a Zoom H4N .... Basically, I want to be able to run 4 channels, omni's and cards at the same time, one set off the 3.5 input, and 1 set thru the XLR inputs.
I am not sure, but I think H4N can record only one pair of external and one pair of internal mics. It is not possible to record two pairs of external mics with this device. Handheld recorder, that can record two external pairs, is only Tascam DR2D. It is discontinuated now, but you can find some used one.
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Nope, the H4N has a pair of XLR/TRS combo jacks, and then a 1/8" mic-input. If you plug something into the 1/8" mic-in, it will bypass the internal mics.
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Thanks for adding. I don't own h4n. If it can record 4 external tracks, that's great, we have a replacement for Tascam dr2d.
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Quite the opposite for me. I had a Zoom H4N going back to 2008 when it first came out. Rarely used it once I got the Tascam 2D. Only thing I don't like about the 2D is inability to monitor the second input--that's just a set and forget it. Zoom H4N had a lot of quirks and things I didn't like, and for that size, just use the Zoom H6.
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FWIW he posted on FB yesterday that all outstanding orders will go out today.
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FWIW he posted on FB yesterday that all outstanding orders will go out today.
That sounds like the check's in the mail, no jobs will be lost in the merger or I will save you the last line of coke?
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"your call is important to us"
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Thanks for the tips, kuba e.
:cheers:
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JUST DONT.
ftlog DONT.
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I did once and never will again plenty of his gear shows up in the yard all the time
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Sorry to hear about your experience with Church Audio. I haven't ordered from them personally, but have you tried reaching out to them through social media or a phone number?
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Sorry to hear about your experience with Church Audio. I haven't ordered from them personally, but have you tried reaching out to them through social media or a phone number? :tomato:
Welcome to taperssection, egmonton...you really haven't been around here very much, eh?
.
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what a bizarre bump for 3 year old thread...
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My sense is that Chris is getting out of this business, let's just say. Love his CA 14s. If you have any that need to be repaired reach out to neutrino, rather than Chris
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My sense is that Chris is getting out of this business, let's just say. Love his CA 14s. If you have any that need to be repaired reach out to neutrino, rather than Chris
I can vouch for neutrino's excellent work on CA-14 repair.
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My sense is that Chris is getting out of this business, let's just say. Love his CA 14s. If you have any that need to be repaired reach out to neutrino, rather than Chris
I can vouch for neutrino's excellent work on CA-14 repair.
I started out with Church gear and was very pleased with it. It's perfect for on-a-budget, entry-level and casual taping enthusiasts.
I'm glad to see someone has stepped in to fill the repair void.
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My sense is that Chris is getting out of this business, let's just say. Love his CA 14s. If you have any that need to be repaired reach out to neutrino, rather than Chris
I can vouch for neutrino's excellent work on CA-14 repair.
I started out with Church gear and was very pleased with it. It's perfect for on-a-budget, entry-level and casual taping enthusiasts.
I'm glad to see someone has stepped in to fill the repair void.
this!
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It's been years since Church audio was responsive to customers. I don't think it's a bad thing if he gets out of the business. Bob
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CC made an announcement that he was no longer going to build preamps or microphones and was selling off his inventory last year. I am an avid user of his CA9200 preamp with his CA-14 cards and omnis and wanted a backup for when my current one dies. I knew he would take a long time - even months before ordering. Im sure he will still come through (he always has for me)...
but just wanted to put this out there for anyone wondering if hes better at his shipping timelines:
I paypaled him $249+$25 shipping + PayPal INTL fees on June 8th 2022.
9 excuses since and no shipment.
any month now :lol:
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And he is still having "sales" on Facebook.
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And he is still having "sales" on Facebook.
yep! thats why i wanted to comment on this post to warn people.
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Last time I ordered from one of his sales I had my mics and battery box within 2 weeks
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I was at the local dope shop a few days ago and saw this ... and then it all started making sense.
(https://i.imgur.com/GO6cjd2l.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/RKxmpd9l.jpg)
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Ha! Classic!
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i have a set of his mics that terminate into a 1/8" male stereo or trs. i just tried to use them with the 9v open face box they came with (2x1/8"trs i/o). seems like there is a problem. any idea how to power these things? anyone have a schematic? thx in advance.
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Tell me more about the problem.
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Unfortunately, I had a poor experience with him as well.
I ordered a pair of CA-14 omnis from him on February 8, 2023 and the Ugly Battery Box a couple weeks later. By the 23rd, they had not yet shipped, so I reached out. March 6, I'm told they're "going out this week." March 11 comes by and I request a refund and open a dispute with PayPal. I get a response blaming the weather for the delay in shipping and how this is just a hobby business and all that. Then he asks me if I'll accept $60 back as a refund on the battery box and he'll send out the mics in a couple days. I accept, close the case and within a few days, both items arrived in the mail. So, I got a free battery box out of the deal, nearly a month and a half later.
Another thing I wasn't too impressed by was the lack of packing materials included. Both the mics and battery box were sent in a plain, flat bubble mailer. For what was to be $200 worth of audio recording equipment, I was shocked to see how poorly they'd been packed.
I've yet to really use any of this stuff, actually. Went through the hassle of bringing it with me into the Hollywood Bowl on 04/22, but figured trying to stealth from way in the very back of the Bowl while there was an OTS would just be futile.
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CC made an announcement that he was no longer going to build preamps or microphones and was selling off his inventory last year. I am an avid user of his CA9200 preamp with his CA-14 cards and omnis and wanted a backup for when my current one dies. I knew he would take a long time - even months before ordering. Im sure he will still come through (he always has for me)...
but just wanted to put this out there for anyone wondering if hes better at his shipping timelines:
I paypaled him $249+$25 shipping + PayPal INTL fees on June 8th 2022.
9 excuses since and no shipment.
any month now :lol:
update on mine: he messaged me from the PO today saying they are shipping. over a year later, no discount offered for me.
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9 out of 10 taperssection members agree...
Dissatisfaction guaranteed.
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It's complicated. I am always very satisfied with the microphones, once I have them in my hands. Great products for the price, terrible customer relations. Buy used if you can find them. People tend to hoard them. Thank you Neutrino for your wonderful repair work on them.
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^ I don't think it's all that complicated, to be honest. Personally, I don't think the mics are all that great (there are other options that are better, in my opinion) and the customer service is atrocious. I feel much more confident buying from a company that will communicate, honor time frames, and provide service in a timely manner (and I am willing to pay more for those things). He doesn't even have any decent specs for his stuff ("Frequency response: 20hz to 20khz +/- 10db"; seriously?). The guy had his heyday here on ts.com, but I am surprised that any member would take the plunge at this point...
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I bought a pair of the ca11 cardioids very well used in the YS for real cheap. They are really good sounding mics if you can get them in the right spot.
I wouldn't enter into a business transaction with him based on his seemingly unhinged temperament that he displayed as a member here. He popped off on people with a lot of venom. The terrible communication and what seemed like lies and excuses with his customers was more than enough to keep me from dealing with him on any gear but his instability seals the deal.
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^ I don't think it's all that complicated, to be honest. Personally, I don't think the mics are all that great (there are other options that are better, in my opinion) and the customer service is atrocious. I feel much more confident buying from a company that will communicate, honor time frames, and provide service in a timely manner (and I am willing to pay more for those things). He doesn't even have any decent specs for his stuff ("Frequency response: 20hz to 20khz +/- 10db"; seriously?). The guy had his heyday here on ts.com, but I am surprised that any member would take the plunge at this point
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Just curious what mics are just as small and easily inserted into a hat or necklace like church 14's? I have his mics stuck on double sided velcro tape and placed in one place or another...
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AT853 is what I would choose. Sound Professionals has a branded version and that is what I would do instead of the Church Audio path. My first recordings were with a set of CA mics so I'm familiar with the products and still have a set in my gear case.
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The ca 14s are fine little microphones and great value for the money. That said, I would not buy from him directly, but keep my eyes open for used ones in the yard sale.
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And I am now using my recently acquired Line CM3 mics whenever possible
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AT853 is what I would choose. Sound Professionals has a branded version and that is what I would do instead of the Church Audio path.
I've done side-by-side comparisons of the AT853 and CA-14 cards, and they are as close to identical as you can get. And the AT853s are much sturdier, and have interchangeable caps.
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^ I don't think it's all that complicated, to be honest. Personally, I don't think the mics are all that great (there are other options that are better, in my opinion) and the customer service is atrocious. I feel much more confident buying from a company that will communicate, honor time frames, and provide service in a timely manner (and I am willing to pay more for those things). He doesn't even have any decent specs for his stuff ("Frequency response: 20hz to 20khz +/- 10db"; seriously?). The guy had his heyday here on ts.com, but I am surprised that any member would take the plunge at this point...
All of this and the recommendation for AT853/AT943 from SoundPros.
I live in a great place for small businesses - New Orleans. When I was new here, I read pretty much every thread that I had even a modicum of interest in. I was always taken by the fact that these mics were very similar to other mics in their size/range/etc, but people were having some of the worst support/delivery time with Chris. At no point in time did I think buying from him would be a viable option based upon read history. I thought of all the little cafes and lunch spots here and figured Sound Pros had what I wanted and actually got back to its customers (as evidenced still today). Seemed like if I was going to get a great lunch from a place other locals were going to perhaps I should be paying attention to the reviews and what other diners were saying after. Why would I go get a po-boy from a shop that takes forever and sometimes forgets the order entirely? The sandwich itself is pretty similar to other sandwiches in its class - its not fine dining at that price.
Recently, a fairly well known taper I am friends with decided to switch to stealth as his baseline. We talked a lot about different setups before he bought one. I was really surprised when he chose CA-14s. Even though he bought a used pair on this site, I simply can't cross that bridge. Its full of holes and a fraying rope is holding it up one side. Sure, I can get to the other side without falling, but there are a lot of better options within the scope of my needs that will get the job done. What we do is stressful enough. Why make it more so?
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FWIW, my bought-used CA14s sound as good as my AT853s and can be repaired as needed quickly by Neutrino. I would not buy new ones from Chris because of all the reasons listed above and have not done so for years. Your mileage may vary.
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I've always been curious to try the AT omni caps, but the CA11 have been and will continue to be my preferred stealth mic
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AT853 is what I would choose. Sound Professionals has a branded version and that is what I would do instead of the Church Audio path.
I've done side-by-side comparisons of the AT853 and CA-14 cards, and they are as close to identical as you can get. And the AT853s are much sturdier, and have interchangeable caps.
I agree. And the subcards are great.
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FWIW, my bought-used CA14s sound as good as my AT853s and can be repaired as needed quickly by Neutrino. I would not buy new ones from Chris because of all the reasons listed above and have not done so for years. Your mileage may vary.
Does anyone know if Neutrino will work on other small mics? I have a set of Sennheisier mke-2's that need a bit of help. The work needed is on wires so small I cannot do it myself.
https://en-us.sennheiser.com/mke-2-digital-lapel-mic-voice-audio-recording-mobile-phone
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how can you tell if church mics are omni or cardiod? can i wire them to work with the core sound 9v battery box? thanks in advance
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how can you tell if church mics are omni or cardiod? can i wire them to work with the core sound 9v battery box? thanks in advance
There should be a short red or black piece of shrink tubing coming out of the plug around the wires. Red is omni, black is card.
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Cards have holes in the side of capsule. Omnis do not. Pretty good general rule for SDCs
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Running sp-cmc4 / at853 for years, real great workhorses. bought oversea from soundprofessionals and never any trouble. My advice, skip church audio. Not worth the risk. Agree with Aaronj
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Another great mic is Sennheiser, ME104, a very small (6mm) cardioid.This is a lav mic, and you can change omni, card and supercard caps even.A real good sounding and small microphone !
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Another great mic is Sennheiser, ME104, a very small (6mm) cardioid.This is a lav mic, and you can change omni, card and supercard caps even.A real good sounding and small microphone !
my current go to mics, not easy to soldering but @ the end worth the work :yahoo:
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Running sp-cmc4 / at853 for years, real great workhorses. bought oversea from soundprofessionals and never any trouble. My advice, skip church audio. Not worth the risk. Agree with Aaronj
The mics are a tremendous bargain, it's buying from him directly that is the pain.
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I bought a few BAT2B boxes a bunch of years back during a great sale. I had a smooth transaction, and received them in a timely manner. I'm very happy with the BAT2B's & their small profile.
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turns out i have 2 sets of the cardioid mics and 2 ugly battery boxes. everything is 1/8" trs.
1 ugly box seems to convert the 2 mics to 2 channel mono out. i guess the box is bad.
i recorded a moderately loud show using an r9 going mic in with the r9 internal mic power. the signal level with the r9 mic level switch at low gain was pretty low. i had the r9 mic level gain at 100%. then i switched to high level mic gain and got more gain out of it. i guess those mics need alot of pre amp gain.
does it make sense to get a sound pro battery box that puts out 9v? will i get more gain?
also, i mainly stealth record. how do you use mic clips and have the mics face directly at the sound source? the show i recorded i was close to the stack and i clipped the mics to a backpack and pointed them straight. but clipping to a shirt might be hard to aim. does it matter if they are off axis with the sound source? i guess you could gaff tape them to a balcony rail or a wall or a pole.
thanks in advance for all replies
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I use the Sound Pros 12v spsb10 mini battery box with mine. For cardioid mics you want to point them toward the source. Aiming them matters with directional mics. I usually roll a few straps of gaffers tape around my lighter then use that to attach the mics to something - a seat, a column or railing, etc. I don't wear them ever so can't help with that but I have used a hat sitting on something and taped them to the bill. Mine don't have clips.
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i mainly stealth record. how do you use mic clips and have the mics face directly at the sound source?
Before I adopted my Kangaroo friend, I used croakies in the past. There are pictures from Church's website:
(https://www.church-audio.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/Croakie-Microphone-Up-Close.jpg)
(https://www.church-audio.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/Croakie-Microphone-Closer.jpg)
(https://www.church-audio.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/Croakie-Microphone-Full.jpg)