Topic: playing back raw DSD

[Nick's Picks]

good fruckin' luck!
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16883117003&ATT=83-117-003&CMP=OTC-pr1c3watch
only thing I can find.

there is a sound card out there I posted in the MR1 thread too...and maybe there are others.  I'm sure there are.
anyone know of any?

[JasonSobel]

what about the Tascam recorder:

http://www.tascam.com/Products/dvra1000hd.html

if you copy DSD files from a Korg recorder to a computer, and then load it up on the Tascam HD, will it play it back?  probably.  and then you have a fairly affordable, nice HQ, playback deck.

[Nick's Picks]

that was my initial thought.  get the one w/the HDD in it (in place of DVDR) and have it be a DSD jukebox.
if only you could hook a RAID up to it...

[momule]

I should see an old friend of mine over the weekend and I will ask Him for sure what he's using to playback His DSD mixes.  I'm pretty sure he still uses Protools to capture and If I remember right playback is accomplished by  plugins made By Sonic Studio.  Thats what he uses to master the DSD files for SACD disc mastering.  I should see him over the weekend and report back if I get any Good info for ya guy's.

Nick
     

[Nick's Picks]

nice.

[momule]

I just Spoke with Brian via email and he mentioned using Pyramix software.  From what he was saying its pretty spendy as he was saying the 8 channel system they have they gave around $28,000 for and there thinking of upgrading to a 16 channel 

Most of the following is French to me.  He was rambling on but I didn't really have a clue about any of this. 
He kinda giggled last night after reading in my email to him last night when I told him some tapers were using the Mr-1000.  He said he cant even capture or playback over 2.8224Mhz at this point and I guess the Mr-1000 captures twice that. He said Although he can capture RAW DSD it is then converted to DXD format @ 32 bit/352.8 kHz and something about FIR digital filtering and noise shaping has to be done.  I guess this is then mixed and mastered to SACD using an AIT tape.  (whatever the heck that is)  SO apparently they dont really even playback the RAW DSD files.  Its simply for archive sakes.

He simply suggest if you're REALLY wanting to playback RAW DSD to just use the recorder its self for right now.  He mentioned some products made by DAD (digital Audio Denmark) Or a company called Independent Audio.  I guess they make some High end Converters.  He also said bring your checkbook. 

As you were saying Nick it don't look like Raw DSD playback sat this point is really an option without a $30,000 + investment. Oh and don't forget to upgrade your Monitors 

[edtyre]

I just plug my Etymotic ER4P's
into my MR-1 and push play 
Portable sweetness

[desertsky]

To play back DSD (1-bit/2.8Mhz) on a Windows XP/Vista PC with Windows Media 10/11, click the following link to download a freely distributable plugin that Sony has developed.  The plugin converts the DSD to PCM format in realtime as the DSD file is playing.  If you have a good soundcard, you can play DSD files back in up to 24-bit/192KHz quality.  You do need to have a PC with horsepower, at least a 3.0 GHz P4 or duo core PC.   
 
DSD to PCM Playback Plug-in.zip


 
here are the contents of the readme.txt file included in the zip file...


----------------------------------------------------------------------
                             Readme
                      DSD to PCM Playback Plug-in          Version 1.0
----------------------------------------------------------------------

This file describes the latest information for the DSD to PCM Playback
Plug-in.
Please read this before using the DSD to PCM Playback Plug-in.

This Readme is divided into the following sections:
----------------------------------------------------------------------
1) About This Program
2) Before Using the DSD to PCM Playback Plug-in
   - System Requirements
   - System Requirements for 24 bit/96 kHz Playback
3) Important Notes
   - Installation
   - DSD Files Playback
   - CD creation with Windows Media Player
   - Associating the DSF file extension with Windows Media Player
4) Legal Notice

----------------------------------------------------------------------

1) About This Program

- By installing this program, DSD files (extension: *.dsf) can be played
  on the Windows Media Player by converting the files to PCM format.

  Note: Because a DSD file is converted to PCM format,
  the audio quality is not the same as the DSD original audio quality.

  Note: A VAIO computer that supports DSD playback can play DSD files
  with the original audio quality.
 

----------------------------------------------------------------------

2) Before Using the DSD to PCM Playback Plug-in

- System Requirements

This program has been tested and validated to work with the following
environments only. Other environments are not supported.
 
  - Windows Media Player 10 or Windows Media Center preinstalled
    on VAIO computers with an installation of Windows XP.
     
  - Windows Media Player 11 or Windows Media Center preinstalled
    on VAIO computers with an installation of Windows Vista.
     
  - Intel Celeron Processor 1.6 GHz or faster

- System Requirements for 24 bit/96 kHz playback.

  - Intel Pentium 4 Processor 3.0 GHz or faster

  - Processor with Multi-Core or Hyper Threading (HT) Technology

  - Default DirectSound Device supports 24 bit/96 kHz playback

  - When using Windows Vista, the "sample rate and bit depth to be used 
    when running in shared mode" setting of the default playback device 
    must be set to 96 kHz or greater.

    Follow these steps to adjust this setting:

    1. Open the Windows Control Panel.
    2. Click "Hardware and Sound."
    3. Click "Sound."
    4. In the window that appears, click the device with the check mark.
    5. Click "Properties."
    6. Click "Advanced."
    7. Select one of the following options for "the sample rate and bit 
       depth to be used when running in shared mode":

        - 16 bit/96 kHz
        - 16 bit/176 kHz
        - 16 bit/192 kHz
        - 24 bit/96 kHz
        - 24 bit/176 kHz
        - 24 bit/192 kHz

  Note: When these conditions are not fulfilled, playback will be
        16 bit/44.1 kHz.


----------------------------------------------------------------------

3) Important Notes

- Installation

  - When using Windows Vista
    When you install the DSD to PCM Playback Plug-in on your computer
    as a standard user, Windows will ask you to provide an administrator
    password. In this case, enter the password.

  - When using Windows XP
    To install this program, you must log on to the computer using
    an account with administrator privileges.
    (For example, Administrator User Accounts.)
    If you have logged on using a Limited User Account, log off
    and log back on using an account with administrator privileges.

  - If the DSD Playback Plug-in has already been installed,
    This program cannot be installed.

  - You do not need to install this program to a VAIO computer
    that supports DSD playback because it can play DSD files
    with the original audio quality.

- DSD Files Playback

  - If the system requirements are not fulfilled, audio playback
    may jump or not play normally.

- CD creation with Windows Media Player

  - When adding DSD files, you can create a data CD using the writing function
    of Windows Media Player. However, this data CD is not compliant with
    DSD Disc specifications.

- Associating the DSF file extension with Windows Media Player

  - If you install Windows Media Player after installing this program,
    Windows Media Player will not be registered as the player for DSF
    files (*.dsf).

    To make Windows Media Player the default player for DSF files, right-
    click a DSF file in Windows Explorer, select Properties from the 
    shortcut menu, and, in the window that appears, select Windows Media 
    Player as the program to open DSF files.

   
----------------------------------------------------------------------

4) Legal Notice

VAIO is a trademark of Sony Corporation.

"Direct Stream Digital", DSD and their logos are trademarks of
Sony Corporation.

Microsoft, Windows, Windows Media Player and Media Center are
registered trademarks or trademarks of Microsoft Corp. in the United States
and/or other countries.

Intel, Celeron and Pentium are trademarks or registered trademarks of
Intel Corporation or its subsidiaries in the United States and other countries.

Other system names and product names appearing herein are generally trademarks
or registered trademarks of their respective makers. These trademarks are not
denoted in this document by means of the TM or (R) symbols.

----------------------------------------------------------------------
  Readme.txt / Copyright 2007 Sony Corporation

[Colin Liston]

That still isn't playing back in DSD format though.  Close, but...

[desertsky]

That still isn't playing back in DSD format though.  Close, but...

I know, there's an ever better way of playing back DSD through your home stereo if you have a Sony PS3.  And that's by burning your DSD files to a dvd in DSD Audio format, an audio disc format Sony developed.  PS3 has been able to play DSD Audio discs since the 1.6 firmware in May.  I bought a VAIO notebook over the weekend and have already burned one of my MR-1 DSD recordings to DSD Audio disc.  Playback through my home stereo using the PS3 is sweeeeeet!!!  Blows away 16-bit/44.1 audio cds.  The PS3 takes the DSD and converts to PCM, then sends it to your receiver over HDMI (if your receiver supports audio input over HDMI) or S/PDIF optical.  If you go with HDMI, it'll go to your receiver in 24-bit/176.4KHz PCM.  With S/PDIF, it's 24-bit/88.2Khz.  I've got one of the newer Yamaha home theater receivers, the RX-V2700, which will even accept raw DSD over it's HDMI inputs.  So I'm HOPING Sony will add the option of sending DSD over HDMI to a future firmware release for the PS3.  But it already sounds amazing in 24/176.4KHz PCM.  
After examining the DSD Audio disc I burned with my VAIO notebook, I discovered that anyone can create a DSD Audio disc.  It doesn't require a Sony VAIO PC/notebook with the preloaded DSD Disc burning software.  You just have to burn the DSD files to a dvd data disc (UDP) in the proper directory structure for DSD Audio discs and create an index text file that is required.  Then use any dvd burning software like Nero to burn the disc.  I even did it myself yesterday on my non-VAIO Windows PC and the disc played fine in my PS3.  In the next couple days I'll put together a How-to Guide for taking the raw DSD files the MR-1 creates during recording, splitting them up into separate DSD tracks with the Korg Audiogate software, and then prepare the files in the correct directory format for burning to dvd.    If there's interest, I can even torrent the sample DSD Audio disc I manually authored yesterday.  It's a couple DSD tracks from a Rusted Root show I recorded last week with my MR-1.  It's about 15 minutes long, ~700MB.  The full show in DSD would take up over 5GB, requiring two single-density blank DVD's or a dual-layer DVD.  And it would take quite awhile to seed, so I'm not sure I want to go there.   

[gmm6797]

I know, there's an ever better way of playing back DSD through your home stereo if you have a Sony PS3.  And that's by burning your DSD files to a dvd in DSD Audio format, an audio disc format Sony developed.<clip>

Any good FAQs on how to make an audio DVD/DVDA?  Now that I am heading into the 1 bit works, I need to read up/test/play around a bit

[richardl]

This is very cool.

It supports both DSF and DFF files, but, alas, not WSD files.

[richardl]

The existence of the Sony DSD plugin for Windows Media makes it theoretically possible to have a direct DSD import filter for PCM-based wave file editors like SoundForge or Audition. I tried opening a DFF file in SoundForge 9, and it gives an error. But a sufficiently smart import plugin could buffer the PCM data coming out of this DSD plugin. True, it's not be the same as editing DSD data (for that we will need new tools and algorithms). But it would let you edit DSD recordings without requiring the additional step of converting to PCM in Korg's AudioGate.

[H₂O]

Cool about the PS3!!! Talking about HDMI, doesn't version 1.2 support DSD streams?  Obviously your reciever would need to support this as well.

Does the PS3 support HDMI DSD streams?

Just found a thread on this though...

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/archive/index.php/t-778773.html

[desertsky]

Yes, HDMI 1.2 supports DSD streams.  My Yamaha receiver has HDMI 1.2a and will accept DSD, but alas the PS3 does not yet (hopefully soon!) stream DSD.  It does the PCM conversion to 24bit/176.4kHz, which actually sounds pretty darn good!  I don't know if my ears will be able to tell the difference if and when the PS3 does DSD output to my receiver.