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Author Topic: Advice on bluegrass "studio" recording.  (Read 6592 times)

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Offline mmmatt

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Re: Advice on bluegrass "studio" recording.
« Reply #15 on: January 21, 2005, 10:18:59 AM »
That is way cool heath... do definately post.  If I'm off base on some of my comments/suggestions please don't feel like you can't call me out.  I admit I have almost no field experience, and I'm working off of theroy.  +T heath for doing a great thing!

Matt
I do think taping is the reality of the business..it is also an impetus for artists to create studio CDs that are ART, not just another recording...    Fareed Haque  2-4-2005




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Offline Nick in Edinboro

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Re: Advice on bluegrass "studio" recording.
« Reply #16 on: January 21, 2005, 10:23:35 AM »
Razorback, good point...

I've been using some Grado SR-80's as my "monitors" consist of some 2.1 midgrade computer speakers :)

I could burn CD's and put them on my home listening system but it's an involved step and doesn't allow the tweaking on the fly...

We're far from high class when it comes to this operation :P  Ghetto style all the way.


Matt thatnks too for all the interest.. really appreciate all your feedback.  Tower City was written by Lori, the main female vocalist you hear...  I think it even has the lines "show us your boobs" at some points in the song :P  Kinda funny.. it was the first time they really played it as a group as it's pretty new.
« Last Edit: January 21, 2005, 10:25:23 AM by Nick in Edinboro »
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Offline heath

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Re: Advice on bluegrass "studio" recording.
« Reply #17 on: January 21, 2005, 11:06:23 AM »
you really won't need to worry too much about separation, but if you want to have makeshift gobos, use some type of structure and moving blankets.  You can get these pretty cheap (i actually stole like 7 of them from Uhaul--they were in the back of a trailer I rented for moving, and I kept them).  Old matresses help deaden as well, and you can usually find them at goodwill for like $5.  Regardless, it's not crucial.

Upright bass can be tricky to master.  If the artist has any sort of electronic pickup, that can make things really easy.  I am going to assume the player in your setup does not have one, and that your only option is mic'ing.  First off, keep the mics for the upright within about a foot of the sound source.  I, for one, don't like too much "room" in a bass track.  It can lead to muddy tracks.  We can always add reverb or room tone later.  Ideally, use a 2 mic setup on an upright.  I large diapragm condensor just outside the f-hole would be the first mic, and the second can be either a small diaphragm condensor or another large diaphragm just above the bridge, aimed towards the hole to your liking (try experimenting with different angles until you get the tone you like). 

Acoustic guitars can be mic'd SO MANY different ways, but what I have typically has results with is the following:
one condenser about a foot away from the guitar aimed where the neck and body meet and also towards the hole, without being pointed directly at it...I find that micing the hole leads to a very boomy guitar, which while occassionally desireable isn't always the most flattering tone.  I also like to put another mic aimed towards the bridge (again, about a foot away).  By playing with the mix between these 2 mics, you can achieve a nice sound.  If you only end up with one mic on the guitar, go with the first placement (where the neck and body meet).

I have never had the opportunity to mic a fiddle, but I got this from another enigneer, and it makes sense to me:
Violin / Fiddle: recommended Neumann U-87, Neumann KM-184, AKG C-460B

If you want a bluegrass / country fiddle sound with lots of bite, place the mic directly
above the bridge about 8" - 10" away.  The smoother the sound desired, the farther away
the mic should be - up to 3 or 4 feet away if necessary and the more off-axis.  I won't use
anything but a condenser on violin.


I have also never mic'd a banjo, but from what I hear, a 57 (or a condeser) aimed at the drum head should provide adequate results. 

What are you using for vocal mics?  How are these positioned? 

As I change my mind on mic'ing techniques, I'll re-post...It's really a feel thing.  Place a mic, go back to listening position, if you don't like how it sounds, change angle/distance/mic, repeat. 



As far as me helping you out...I'd really like to try some things (like fiddle and banjo micing).  My only necessities for an overnight stay would be a couch where I can throw a sleeping bag (although a bed would certainly be better).  Let me know...it's not that far for me to drive up there...

h
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Offline Nick in Edinboro

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Re: Advice on bluegrass "studio" recording.
« Reply #18 on: January 21, 2005, 11:15:32 AM »
Heath, awesome.

He does have a pickup for the bass.. but the amp he has is a big POS.  Old electric bass cabinet with a guitar head frankenstiened onto it (ghetto again!).

I'm not sure what the vocal mics are...  They just looked like any other vocal mic I've seen (black, round globe top :P).    I can take inventory next week for a better idea.  We only have 10 mics, just enough... they were using some shatty cards ($99 and paid too much) for the violins before I brought the oktavas last time.. then the handful of sm57's. 

I'd imagine they have money to spend if we can get some pointers on what to get thats worth the money...

I can get you crash space like that for sure...  My accomidations at the rents house aren't too bad in that respect.. I have the whole basement to myself which consists of a living room (with futon and couch) and then my sleeping quaters.. we can def. make this work..!
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Offline BJ

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Re: Advice on bluegrass "studio" recording.
« Reply #19 on: January 21, 2005, 11:35:21 AM »
if you give me ample notice(and i dont have a show), and would like to borrow anything, 393's, ua5, etc...just drop me a line...I can mail it up to you...i REALLY like the 393's/391's on an acoustic guitar....and that would give you a two mic option that heath was talking about...
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Re: Advice on bluegrass "studio" recording.
« Reply #20 on: January 22, 2005, 09:44:08 PM »
Very nice !  +T  Fletcher at Mercenary has said several times that it's people who make great recordings, not equipment.
You are proving that.

My somewhat naive thoughts:

That female voice is great !  Players are tight.  Something in the banjo on last sample is off, mic'ing or pickin', not sure.
I like a contact mic on a banjo with a small mixer(S.D. ?) to a front LD, FWIW.  watch for reflections off the banjo head.
The bass is right, what did you mic it with ?

You need a little, not too much, reverb on the voice, it's noticeably dry, but sweet as an angel.
When you notice the reverb, it is too much. Go up until you hear it and back off a tiny bit.
Also, go dry at times for the contrast.

Are these folks signed anywhere ? (just curious)
« Last Edit: January 22, 2005, 09:57:36 PM by Ohm »

Offline Nick in Edinboro

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Re: Advice on bluegrass "studio" recording.
« Reply #21 on: January 23, 2005, 10:17:29 PM »
Thanks for comments..

Ya, the reverb, we thought we'd add that in the post processing, although it's a lil' tough with 2 tracks to get it right :)

The bass I think was another sm57 but I'll find out next week.

We'll work on the panning ideas (one guitar left other right) as I think that's a good idea!

I moved the samples, you can find them on my new website ;D  There's a picture up on there too of the band...
 - http://braintuba.no-ip.com

Not signed--just a fun project now.  They have played Blue Herron Fest and open for Donna The Buffalo sometimes.. that's about it.
« Last Edit: January 23, 2005, 10:19:19 PM by Nick in Edinboro »
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Offline capnhook

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Re: Advice on bluegrass "studio" recording.
« Reply #22 on: January 26, 2005, 09:57:28 AM »
Hey Nick....I've got the Great Blue Heron recording from last year if you need it ;)
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Offline heath

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Re: Advice on bluegrass "studio" recording.
« Reply #23 on: February 04, 2005, 12:23:03 PM »
How's this coming Nick?
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Offline Mojowill

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Re: Advice on bluegrass "studio" recording.
« Reply #24 on: February 04, 2005, 12:46:31 PM »
Am I missing something where's the hillbilly blowing into the XXX whiskey jug ;D ??? 
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Offline mmmatt

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Re: Advice on bluegrass "studio" recording.
« Reply #25 on: February 04, 2005, 12:52:45 PM »
Am I missing something where's the hillbilly blowing into the XXX whiskey jug ;D ??? 
fricken' rockers!   ;)

Yeah Nick... I've been wondering myself.  Any more samples?

Matt
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Offline BJ

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Re: Advice on bluegrass "studio" recording.
« Reply #26 on: February 24, 2005, 09:14:03 AM »
Nick,
seeing as its been three weeks, I thought i would resurrect this old thread and check to see if there has been anything new going on...new mixes to share, experiences, problems...anything.  Hope to hear some more of it soon.

BJ
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Offline heath

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Re: Advice on bluegrass "studio" recording.
« Reply #27 on: February 24, 2005, 02:29:06 PM »
Nick,
seeing as its been three weeks, I thought i would resurrect this old thread and check to see if there has been anything new going on...new mixes to share, experiences, problems...anything.  Hope to hear some more of it soon.

BJ

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Offline Nick in Edinboro

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Re: Advice on bluegrass "studio" recording.
« Reply #28 on: February 25, 2005, 10:16:28 AM »
My bad guys!!!  I didn't realize this had been bumped.. I don't frequent this forum too often, sticking mainly to open/yard sale/ and playback :) ;D

They never invited me back ???  I dunno, apparently I suck? 

Bummed about it but what can you do?  Sucks..
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Offline heath

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Re: Advice on bluegrass "studio" recording.
« Reply #29 on: February 25, 2005, 10:18:03 AM »
you must suck  ;) :P
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