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Author Topic: Recording on the Top of a Mountain  (Read 4789 times)

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Offline ol' dirty taper

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Recording on the Top of a Mountain
« on: July 21, 2011, 02:31:06 PM »
Hey everyone, been m.i.a. for awhile but getting back into things again.  >:D

I've been approached with a pretty cool opportunity to tape a show for a small live release cd, problem is it's going to be on top of a mountain in the evening, so winds will pick up around 3-4pm, show starts at 7pm and on into the night... being run off generators and all sorts of other stupid noise issues. I am mainly focusing on setup and wind here, I can bitch to them about where to put generators later.

The plan is to use my Beyer MC930 SS ORTF on my T-bar somewhere back from the stage a little and an AT4033a either on the same stand or on stage somewhere, never messed with an on stage setup, but is this a good mic to use or not? Mainly concerned with the wind and what it'll pickup. I love my MC930 SSs so not worried about how they'll perform, have some dead rats on the way to cover those puppies. I'll have to get coverage for the AT4033 if I decide to use it. Or move the MC930s to the stage lip as well?

Then I was going to run everything through my Motu Traveler and also run to it a sbd line-out. or if they can, lineout each input to my board independently.

Winds get up to about 13-15 mph when it gets going around 5-7pm

Kind of just curious if anyone has any advice, tips for reducing wind, mic placement etc. It's literally open space, crest of a mountain. no big rocks behind them to echo or anything.

A few years back I taped the Gorge in Washington state and had great luck using a borrowed Baby Ball Gag and just the foam on a MC930. Never used the AT4033 outside, hardly ever seen anyone tape a show with it either.

Thanks in advance.
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Online Fatah Ruark (aka MIKE B)

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Re: Recording on the Top of a Mountain
« Reply #1 on: July 21, 2011, 02:36:54 PM »
Big ass Shures. I've had to physically hold down my stand from being blown away and have had little issue with wind noise (other that wind phasing) . Also get close to the source to reduce phasing from the wind.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/68646-REG/Shure_A81WS_A81WS_Windscreen_for.html
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Offline ol' dirty taper

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Re: Recording on the Top of a Mountain
« Reply #2 on: July 21, 2011, 02:44:25 PM »
Hey Fatah

So you're recommending the B.A.Shures for the MC930s? From what I recall a SM57 is similar in size to the MC930s.
Mic : Schoeps MK21 | Microtech Gefell M300 | Beyer MC950 MC930 MC910 CK930 | Line Audio OM1 | DPA 4061 | Naiant X-X Omni | Beyer TG L34C | AT831s
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Re: Recording on the Top of a Mountain
« Reply #3 on: July 21, 2011, 02:46:45 PM »
Yep. Exactly what I run outside. They are a little pricey, but completely worth it.
||| MICS:  Beyer CK930 | DPA 4022 | DPA 4080 | Nevaton MCE400 | Sennheiser Ambeo Headset |||
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Offline acidjack

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Re: Recording on the Top of a Mountain
« Reply #4 on: July 21, 2011, 05:00:41 PM »
Yup, those big ass shures should do the trick.

Also I'd at least consider running the Beyers onstage ORTF.  There's no real magic to running onstage.  Do you have an SBD feed?  If so, that will make it nice and easy to sync the recording up, too.

If they have vocals, this is where onstage can be less ideal.  You can solve that with the SBD feed, or less optimally, put that single AT mic on a stack (or DFC, but if it's only really getting vocals, I'd consider just putting it right where the vocals are coming out, to make a 'poor man's sbd')

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Offline F.O.Bean

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Re: Recording on the Top of a Mountain
« Reply #5 on: July 21, 2011, 11:27:28 PM »
Yep. Exactly what I run outside. They are a little pricey, but completely worth it.
Schoeps MK 4V & MK 41V ->
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Re: Recording on the Top of a Mountain
« Reply #6 on: July 22, 2011, 09:47:05 AM »
The big shures are great.  But whether they are enough depends on how much gain you are running, the material you are recording, and the amount of wind (probably also the wind direction in relation to the mics). 

For quiet material at higher gain, they are often not sufficient.  If you put a fake fur cover on them, you will lose some HF detail.  And again, there are a lot of situations where that still won't be enough for the wind.  That's why you see location sound rigs with big, expensive wind protection setups.

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Re: Recording on the Top of a Mountain
« Reply #7 on: July 22, 2011, 10:57:59 AM »
The big shures are great.  But whether they are enough depends on how much gain you are running, the material you are recording, and the amount of wind (probably also the wind direction in relation to the mics). 

For quiet material at higher gain, they are often not sufficient.  If you put a fake fur cover on them, you will lose some HF detail.  And again, there are a lot of situations where that still won't be enough for the wind.  That's why you see location sound rigs with big, expensive wind protection setups.

I concur, go for the rats. They are the only thing that will prevent wind noise with that sort of wind and even then you may get some. Get a stiff enough breeze and any windscreen will produce some where as the fur on the rats catch and reduce it before impact. You can EQ the top end to compensate for the rats, but you'll have more trouble getting rid of the wind noise without damaging the recording though. Lesser of two evils IMHO.

Also, in my experience, the wider the angle, the more I notice the phasing.
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Offline ol' dirty taper

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Re: Recording on the Top of a Mountain
« Reply #8 on: July 22, 2011, 04:42:07 PM »
all really good tips. thanks guys!

Going to mess around tonight on the top of the hill I live on. Get a gnarly coastal breeze around 3-4pm.

As far as the material, none of it is very quiet at all. Its some bands ala Earth, Sleep... you know, psych drone rock stuff. Some local acts and Serial Hawk from Seattle.

The wind I am planning on passing the mics at least perpendicularly, pretty sure I dont want them facing into it.

Anyone in the SLO California area should hit me up!

Good thing the rats are on the way then. should be here today or tomorrow!
« Last Edit: July 22, 2011, 04:44:22 PM by ajmiller »
Mic : Schoeps MK21 | Microtech Gefell M300 | Beyer MC950 MC930 MC910 CK930 | Line Audio OM1 | DPA 4061 | Naiant X-X Omni | Beyer TG L34C | AT831s
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Offline F.O.Bean

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Re: Recording on the Top of a Mountain
« Reply #9 on: July 22, 2011, 08:03:30 PM »
I have been recording for MANY years now, and I have owned the BAShures for about 8 to 10 or so years, and I have yet to hear any wind noise w/ them. I don't own any dead rats for the BAShures, but I do have the large DPA Screens+Dead Rats and those work as good as the BAShures do on their own :) I HAVE gotten a bit of phasing, but have never really had wind noise w/ the BAShures, and I have recorded LOTS of outdoor sets/shows ;) As always, YMMV!
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Offline ol' dirty taper

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Re: Recording on the Top of a Mountain
« Reply #10 on: July 22, 2011, 08:31:28 PM »
Bean that's pretty reassuring. I hope the rats handle things alright.

however, I got paid today... might just get a set of the shures regardless... ;D

Is B&H the average price or has anyone found cheaper?
Mic : Schoeps MK21 | Microtech Gefell M300 | Beyer MC950 MC930 MC910 CK930 | Line Audio OM1 | DPA 4061 | Naiant X-X Omni | Beyer TG L34C | AT831s
Pre : Aerco MP-2 | Naiant Littlebox
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Offline F.O.Bean

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Re: Recording on the Top of a Mountain
« Reply #11 on: July 22, 2011, 09:19:35 PM »
Bean that's pretty reassuring. I hope the rats handle things alright.

however, I got paid today... might just get a set of the shures regardless... ;D

Is B&H the average price or has anyone found cheaper?

Yeah, either go the Large DPA+Dead Rats or the BAShures route. You WON'T be disappointed ;)
Schoeps MK 4V & MK 41V ->
Schoeps 250|0 KCY's (x2) ->
Naiant +60v|Low Noise PFA's (x2) ->
DarkTrain Right Angle Stubby XLR's (x3) ->
Sound Devices MixPre-6 & MixPre-3

http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/diskobean
http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/Bean420
http://bt.etree.org/mytorrents.php
http://www.mediafire.com/folder/j9eu80jpuaubz/Recordings

Offline ol' dirty taper

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Re: Recording on the Top of a Mountain
« Reply #12 on: August 17, 2011, 03:43:32 PM »
Thought I'd share my experience with my setup.

I ran the MC930s with a pair of tbrown4's "Dead Muppets/Rats" on the stock foam and had no issue. Winds picked up as soon as I hit REC at 6pm and I ran until 1am through strong gusts of wind from in & off shore. I kind of took a gamble, considering all the glowing reports about the BAShures, but I am extremely happy with how things came out.

I opted against "on stage" since all bands did have vocals and I wouldve been right in front of the drum setup.

No wind noise, no phasing (that I detected so far), I was facing the coast, slightly off centered to avoid direct wind.

Thanks everyone for the input and advice on everything, was nice to get my feet wet again. I'll post a sample up as soon as I get through the files.
Mic : Schoeps MK21 | Microtech Gefell M300 | Beyer MC950 MC930 MC910 CK930 | Line Audio OM1 | DPA 4061 | Naiant X-X Omni | Beyer TG L34C | AT831s
Pre : Aerco MP-2 | Naiant Littlebox
Deck : SD MixPre 10 II | SD MixPre 6 II | Sony PCM-A10 | Zoom F3
Pho/Vid : Sony a58 | Panasonic ZS100 | DJI Osmo Pocket

Offline F.O.Bean

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Re: Recording on the Top of a Mountain
« Reply #13 on: August 18, 2011, 12:57:19 AM »
Awesome!
Schoeps MK 4V & MK 41V ->
Schoeps 250|0 KCY's (x2) ->
Naiant +60v|Low Noise PFA's (x2) ->
DarkTrain Right Angle Stubby XLR's (x3) ->
Sound Devices MixPre-6 & MixPre-3

http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/diskobean
http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/Bean420
http://bt.etree.org/mytorrents.php
http://www.mediafire.com/folder/j9eu80jpuaubz/Recordings

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Re: Recording on the Top of a Mountain
« Reply #14 on: August 18, 2011, 05:44:08 AM »
Nice.

Windy is subjective, so I'm not sure what you mean by strong gusts. Like I said before I've had to physically hold my stand at Red Rocks before to prevent it from blowing away. The Big Ass Shures worked under those conditions. Obviously you can't do anything about wind phasing other than getting closer to the source.

Glad all worked out. It's never fun to run in an unknown environment.
||| MICS:  Beyer CK930 | DPA 4022 | DPA 4080 | Nevaton MCE400 | Sennheiser Ambeo Headset |||
||| PREAMPS: DPA d:vice | Naiant Tinybox | Naiant IPA |||
||| DECKS: Sound Devices MixPre6 | iPod Touch 32GB |||
|||Concert History || LMA Recordings || Live YouTube |||

 

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