Topic: Looking to record live shows - need a solid portable device

[rastasean]

If I was in a band and someone wanted to charge me, I would want a mix and mastered copy of the performance from something like the soundboard. otherwise, if we're just talking a two audience channels, I would do it myself and not pay somebody.
I'm pretty sure all first times are amateur so just come to realize that it will take practice to perfect this.

[deadjim]

If I was in a band and someone wanted to charge me, I would want a mix and mastered copy of the performance from something like the soundboard. otherwise, if we're just talking a two audience channels, I would do it myself and not pay somebody.
I'm pretty sure all first times are amateur so just come to realize that it will take practice to perfect this.

I agree. I've been in several bands, and when I wanted a show recorded I did it myself.. however, you'd be suprised how many people want a live recording and are willing to pay for it. I already have 4 bands asking me to do their show and I haven't even started yet. For $50/$75 bucks a pop, it's worth it to them. Most simply don't have the right equipment, don't have a person to do it for them, and don't care about running through the soundboard. I don't plan on running through the soundboard, because then you have to start working with the venue - and I'm not going that route. Plus you don't get a "live" feel.. and mics will do a decent enough job to capture a performance.
I've been writing music for 10 years, playing music for 16, and recording music for 8.. Field recorders, however, aren't my forte, but it's not too much different. There's just too damn many of them.

There's a large local scene here, and many would love to have someone record their stuff with video, to toss up on youtube

[techgui]

With the Dr-2d you can record both from the internal cards and the sound board.  Then you can mix on post to maintain that live energy.

[rastasean]

It sounds like you're more interested in making money rather than promoting undiscovered/not too popular bands. Most of us consider this a hobby but I know there are some professionals on here who record orchestras, so we generally don't charge for something we already like doing.

[F.O.Bean]

I occassionally do live "demos" for small bands for around $50.00

[deadjim]

It sounds like you're more interested in making money rather than promoting undiscovered/not too popular bands. Most of us consider this a hobby but I know there are some professionals on here who record orchestras, so we generally don't charge for something we already like doing.

Right.. I'm not promoting. I'm providing a service to the bands themselves. There is some talent in the local area here and I've helped out before recording shows with my SM-57 and mini-disc recorder back in the day, and I had fun doing it. But you won't see me going to every show, recording music I could care less about.

I occassionally do live "demos" for small bands for around $50.00

Thank you.

[earmonger]

If you're going to charge $50 -$75 a pop, and a great recorder like the Sony PCM-M10 is only about $230, ditto the Tascam DR-2D--which you will make back after a handful of gigs-you should consider investing in some mics that will make the bands sound hi-fi rather than depending on built-ins.

Also, you may not have to work with the venue to record the soundboard. Shouldn't the band be able to give you permission to do that? They might also let you put some mics on a stand on the soundboard, where a simple stereo recording should sound optimum.  If you are just standing in the crowd with a handheld, you're going to get conversation and crowd noise you don't want. Gigs are not studio sessions.

[mepaca]

It sounds like you're more interested in making money

What's wrong with getting paid to do what you love? It's one of the keys to happiness.

[cashandkerouac]

Really, you probably won't even need a pre for most situations.  A small, inexpensive battery box will do the trick nicely with a decent recorder, such as the M10...

i use a sony m-10 and it's great.  absolutely reliable, easy to use, compact.  my vote is for the external pre and mics, and even at extremely loud shows i've used a pre-amp.  if you use the line jack rather than the mic jack you won't have to worry about saturated levels.  it's pretty much foolproof.  the church audio CA14 and 9100 (or 9200) are a nice combo with the m-10 and very affordable.

[aaronji]

i use a sony m-10 and it's great.  absolutely reliable, easy to use, compact.  my vote is for the external pre and mics, and even at extremely loud shows i've used a pre-amp.  if you use the line jack rather than the mic jack you won't have to worry about saturated levels.  it's pretty much foolproof.  the church audio CA14 and 9100 (or 9200) are a nice combo with the m-10 and very affordable.

You don't need to worry about overloading the mic input on the M10 either.  It can take a pretty hot signal; guysonic measured it at +2 dBu (http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=130924.msg1722931#msg1722931).  Using a mic with a sensitivity of 6 mV/Pa, like a DPA 4061, that'll get you up to 138 dB SPL.  I guess that the Church mics are around that level too.  Even with considerably more sensitive mics (like DPA 4060, 20 mV/Pa), you can get up to 128 dB SPL. 

That is freakin' loud (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loudest_band_in_the_world).  130 dB SPL is typically taken as the threshold of pain...

If you anticipate recording at those sorts of volumes, or anywhere close really, you could easily go mics > bb > line.  Not to say you shouldn't get and use a pre if you want, and you might really need it for very quiet recording, but for the vast majority of shows it just isn't necessary with the M10.  Compared to a pre, a battery box will save some size and some money too (for the next upgrade, of course)!

[shpy]

Please, can someone explain me, what portable recorder i need for decent sound while recording live shows

Now i have zoom h4n recorder and  http://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/gold/item/SP-CMC-2  mics.. I use 4CH and use both mics.. internal and external for different sounds and later i mix them.  Zoom has a lot of features that i dont need. (i don't like zooms auto level, because it just reduce sound to -6db but not raise when i need. Sometimes in record one guitar has noticeable lower level, while camcorder records that sound better)  Can someone suggest recorder with XLR and 4 tracks mode oriented to loud sound source for better quality ?  Maybe in rock, metal live recording DR-40 would be better?

[ArchivalAudio]

Please, can someone explain me, what portable recorder i need for decent sound while recording live shows

Now i have zoom h4n recorder and  http://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/gold/item/SP-CMC-2  mics.. I use 4CH and use both mics.. internal and external for different sounds and later i mix them.  Zoom has a lot of features that i dont need. (i don't like zooms auto level, because it just reduce sound to -6db but not raise when i need. Sometimes in record one guitar has noticeable lower level, while camcorder records that sound better)  Can someone suggest recorder with XLR and 4 tracks mode oriented to loud sound source for better quality ?  Maybe in rock, metal live recording DR-40 would be better?

Never ever, and I mean Never! use auto levels. to record music.. it will limit and compress the signals and sometimes give  the effect of "breathing"  when trying to "level" out the levels.  the h4 should work fine just  manually set and adjust recording levels.

[shpy]

buy if no auto levels.. in situation when sound guy during show changing levels of guitars, drums, vocals.. it not so great.  Maybe After record i have to use normalization or what. Im not an expert with audio software also

[earmonger]

As above, don't use auto level.  A real concert is not at the same level all the way through and auto will try and force it to be willl sound very unnatural. Auto is even worse for something like an interview, where it pumps up the SPACE between the words to be just as loud AS the words.

It's better to have the changes in volume that take place during a concert.

Bands tend to get louder as the set goes on. So set the manual level a little bit low to leave room for when it gets louder. 

I have a Sony PCM-M10. It has a green light to indicate that it's at the optimum recording level. I set a level so the green light starts blinks on and off--a little low, but ready for peaks. 

[nulldogmas]

buy if no auto levels.. in situation when sound guy during show changing levels of guitars, drums, vocals.. it not so great.  Maybe After record i have to use normalization or what. Im not an expert with audio software also

What I wish more recorders had is the old function from Rockbox where if the sound level rises to a point where it starts clipping, the recorder lowers the gain incrementally until it's back in the safe zone.

That said, it's really not that hard to adjust volume in post. Just select the part that doesn't sound loud enough (or sounds too loud) and shift the volume up or down 1-2dB at a time until it matches. Auto levels are EEEEVIL, don't touch them.