Topic: Neumann KM-185 hypers - anyone use them?

[kgreener]

Does anyone have any experience with Neumann KM-185 hypercardiods?  If so, how do they compare to the KM-184's?  I realize the caps on this line are not interchangeable, so would the 184's be more versatile/balanced for a variety of applications?  It seems so many folks use hypers for just about anything & everything, why shouldn't one buy hypers instead?

Also, how do the Neumann's compare overall to something like AKG 391's?  I know that might be a silly question, but I gotta ask it.  

Thanks!

[Tim]

Hmmm....

some people, if they could have only one type of cap, swear by hypers... others cards. It's really a matter of personal preference and depends greatly on what hypers you're talking about, what you're running behind them, and where you tape.

The schoeps mk41 (technically not a "hyper") is amazing sounding and you would be fine with just that cap. The Neumann ak50 hyper cap is pretty bright, I've made some fine tapes with them and heard plenty of good ones. I think you'll find though that most people who have only one pattern and run neumanns prefer the cardioid (ak40, km184).

I like what I've heard out of the akg480/ck63 setup... that might be worth considering.

**edit

Wanted to add that I find myself moving away from hypers and utilizing cards more often, they just sound more natural to my ears... YMMV

[Lil Kim Jong-Il]

The Neumann ak50 hyper cap is pretty bright, I've made some fine tapes with them and heard plenty of good ones.

I ran AK50s for one tour.  It's not that they are bright as much as they just have no bass.  They have a little HF emphasis but the bass rolloff pretty severe.  I really tried to like them.  I didn't want to do post production bass boost and my playback system has no tone control.  So I don't have AK50s any more.

You are on the money that the shoeps 41s and akg 63s are the better hypers IMHO.  My want of hypers almost drove me to the darkside.  But after listening to quite afew tapes made with hypers, I'm back to AK40s in the section and AK43s up close.

[creekfreak]

I think it really depends on where you are taping. If you are taping small shitty sounding rooms, or will be way back in the TS then hypers will be great. As Tim said, the mk41 is my fav cap of all time....can use it anywhere and it sounds just fantastic.

[jpschust]

umm you guys know the ak50 cap and the 185 hypers don't sound exactly the same?  You've got a self noise difference between the 150 combo and the 185s

[Tim]

you done A/B's?

the only person I know that has A/B'd any of this stuff is Todd, who A/B's the ak40's and the km184's.

I don't doubt that they don't sound "exactly the same" but I have a hard time believing they're very different from each other. The ak50's were used as an example to illustrate the general tendency of small diaphragm Neumann hypers. I have no personal experience with the km185's and I can't think of anyone I know who does.

So please post your experiences with the km185's and be sure to distinguish their sonic characteristics from the ak50's as we have described them.

[jpschust]

sorry, i dont have any experiences with the 185's in sepcific, though i have used the 150s before.  my comment was just to recognize that the mics are different mics and dont have completely the same specs.

[Todd R]

Yep, I did a comparison using two V3's (one borrowed from Nutter) and my pair of km184s before they got shipped out to their new owner, and my new pair of km140s.  It was a Sam Bush, Leftover Salmon show at the Gothic, fob/dfc.  Gothic has good sound, but if I had had a choice, I would have done it for something other than the LoS show.

The km140s and km184s were definitely different, though the differences were slight and you had to listen for them.  Off the top of my head, I remember the low end on the 140s to be fuller and tighter.  Still, they are very, very similar.

Since not too many people run km185s, comparing to the ak50s can still be useful.  I did clamp on a stand at a moe. Kahunaville, DE show with a guy running km185s, back when I was running km184s.  I got a tape from him, but it's probably lost in a box somewhere.

I agree though, I wouldn't use the km185/ak50s as my only mics.  I love the neumann sd cards, but the hypers can be a bit thin and bright.  They work good in small, poor sounding venues that still have strong bass going, but I doubt I'd like them in the back of Thomas and Mack.  Even the OTS of the Denver fillmore, which is pretty far back for a club but not nearly as far back as an arena, was not a good match with the ak50s in my estimation.