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Author Topic: Legality of Taping - AUD & RF/IEM  (Read 6355 times)

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Offline furburger

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Re: Legality of Taping - AUD & RF/IEM
« Reply #60 on: May 09, 2018, 03:55:07 AM »
Just going to toss this in here: there is not a secret IEM 'clique' of people who have a current pulse on everything or quasi-current. That is a misinformed or aligned perception of reality. Yes, absolutely, there are people who talk to one another and record shows in certain manners and, yes, some of them may have or do on occasion share equipment. All that sounds more like friends interacting over a hobby. Have yet to see evidence of such an idea turn to reality. My point on that aspect is that if there are people who are reliant on others gear then this aspect of the hobby is not for them as it is, notably, somewhat cost conscious at best.

If a clique involves only U2 and Def Leppard fans... well, honestly, I really do like both those bands. I saw Def Leppard back in 1996 in Charlevoix, MI in fact I worked that show cooking hot dogs. Got to watch the majority of the show as the grill closed early. Was very very cool. Tripping Daisy opened. Didn't tape but Tim DeLaughter signed my TDaisy tee shirt.

Further, furburger, your statement that all IEM's have click track is 100% incorrect. I can provide factual evidence time and time again based from recording I made which dispute your assertion. Zero shade, 100% accurate information.

This thread was intended, intended, to be something that was of interest to those that had interest in this specific subject area. Would be really cool if we could jump back to the time a few days ago when that was a possibility. Thank you.


yeah, "don't talk about Fight Club".

yes, the clique exists.

yes, they own every wireless box used onstage.

yes, they mail the boxes to each other to capture entire tours

yes, they don't torrent their recordings

and yes, they record bands I have no interest in whatsoever.


was made aware of them in 1999 (Kurt Vogel was one of them, but he 'retired' a couple years later, I have his Sabbath San Jose '99 and Pearl Jam St. Louis '98 ones); he isn't the 3rd "intital-less" person either (I promised that individual that I'd never reveal anything about them)


all of that is on topic.

and it's all 100% true.


I'm used to it being implied that I'm a liar, but I have nothing to gain by doing so.

do with that what you will.
-------------
people who are fans of the music, they LOVE what I document and capture...people who are fans of themselves....not so much.

Offline daspyknows

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Re: Legality of Taping - AUD & RF/IEM
« Reply #61 on: May 09, 2018, 09:26:14 AM »
Isn't the trick to offer security and the cops crappy Alaskan cabbage?  They will surely let you go.


no, that's to make people like you stfu at the show.

the best was a Pub Crawl in my early 20's in Hawaii when I went to the Pro Bowl ('94)....these college prep doofuses would sell you this "spaghetti dinner and a bus to 5 bars" thing on the sidewalk, and show you group photos of 80 hotties and 20 dudes...of course, when you got there to the first bar where dinner was, it was 80 dudes and 20 chicks.

anyhow, just like a lot of you folks  here, they were all "oh, we smoke Hawaiian, your Alaskan ain't shit". (oh, we have spendy mics, so your recordings ain't shit)


longer story short, I sent 4 of the 6 of them home puking less than 2 hours later, ***because they couldn't handle it.***


you could learn from this maybe.....then again, nah, probably not.

Sorry dude,  your mental illness strikes again.

What are the Symptoms?
Monopolizing conversations? Feelings of entitlement? Belittling others? These are all classic signs of narcissistic personality disorder. Do you know of someone who knows the “right” way and all other ways are wrong? Are they cocky, lack empathy, and think they are largely important? Then it’s possible they might be suffering from this condition.


 I don't talk to asshats like you at shows and would pass on smoking something you passed my way.  I might catch something.

Offline DATBoy

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Re: Legality of Taping - AUD & RF/IEM
« Reply #62 on: May 09, 2018, 10:01:58 PM »
I don't mean to inject myself in this topic, but I've lurked here for a long while before being an actual member. One thing I've noticed is that every time this very topic gets discussed around here, it turns nasty.

Anyway, that's all I got to say. Just a quick observation.

Offline Galen

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Re: Legality of Taping - AUD & RF/IEM
« Reply #63 on: May 10, 2018, 12:07:54 AM »
Yeah, agree with DATboy. This turned nasty. For little reason. Can we please ignore the smoke and get to the topic?

As far as I can tell for anyone who has posted on this topic in this thread thus far - I am the only active wireless taper out there not part of a non-existent clique? Radio silence? Would be great to have some others chime in or if not contact via PM if that is safer for you. I do not want anything from anyone, just trying to explore this issue further. To rehash, where are the other people who pull multiple sources per show (i.e.: mixes), multiple boxes, multiple recorders and sweet results?
http://www.collectiveunconscious.org/

Recorders:
Sony PCM-M1 (Oade Mod II) x 2, Sony PCM-M1 (stock) x 1
Casio DA-R100 (1991 model, only used when able to use DC)
Edirol R-09
Tascam DA-R40
Sony MD RZ700 (retired)
Sharp MD MT-180 (retired)

Microphones:
Nakamichi CM-300, omni (Stealth/non-mod, my father's originals from 1978)
DPA 4061 > MPS6030
Aiwa CM-30
Core Sound Binauarals
Soundman OKMII-R
Marantz EM-8
SEN G2/3
Shure P10R (470-698)
Icom RX7

Offline furburger

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Re: Legality of Taping - AUD & RF/IEM
« Reply #64 on: May 10, 2018, 04:18:20 AM »
Isn't the trick to offer security and the cops crappy Alaskan cabbage?  They will surely let you go.


no, that's to make people like you stfu at the show.

the best was a Pub Crawl in my early 20's in Hawaii when I went to the Pro Bowl ('94)....these college prep doofuses would sell you this "spaghetti dinner and a bus to 5 bars" thing on the sidewalk, and show you group photos of 80 hotties and 20 dudes...of course, when you got there to the first bar where dinner was, it was 80 dudes and 20 chicks.

anyhow, just like a lot of you folks  here, they were all "oh, we smoke Hawaiian, your Alaskan ain't shit". (oh, we have spendy mics, so your recordings ain't shit)


longer story short, I sent 4 of the 6 of them home puking less than 2 hours later, ***because they couldn't handle it.***


you could learn from this maybe.....then again, nah, probably not.

Sorry dude,  your mental illness strikes again.

What are the Symptoms?
Monopolizing conversations? Feelings of entitlement? Belittling others? These are all classic signs of narcissistic personality disorder. Do you know of someone who knows the “right” way and all other ways are wrong? Are they cocky, lack empathy, and think they are largely important? Then it’s possible they might be suffering from this condition.


 I don't talk to asshats like you at shows and would pass on smoking something you passed my way.  I might catch something.


go read your "show notes" and note how often you reference yourself vs. the actual show.

then go look in the mirror and pat yourself on your narcissistic back.

repeatedly.


projection is not your strong suit.

just so you know.
-------------
people who are fans of the music, they LOVE what I document and capture...people who are fans of themselves....not so much.

Offline furburger

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Re: Legality of Taping - AUD & RF/IEM
« Reply #65 on: May 10, 2018, 04:20:43 AM »
Yeah, agree with DATboy. This turned nasty. For little reason. Can we please ignore the smoke and get to the topic?

As far as I can tell for anyone who has posted on this topic in this thread thus far - I am the only active wireless taper out there not part of a non-existent clique? Radio silence? Would be great to have some others chime in or if not contact via PM if that is safer for you. I do not want anything from anyone, just trying to explore this issue further. To rehash, where are the other people who pull multiple sources per show (i.e.: mixes), multiple boxes, multiple recorders and sweet results?


I talk about the topic, then you-know-who turns on his broken projector.

that said, this 'clique' has existed for nearly/over 20 years.


they scan the guitar mags for the new wireless boxes, then purchase every one, so they know which artist is using which frequency

that's not to say others haven't taken it upon themselves to do what they can, but this group of folks really exists.
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people who are fans of the music, they LOVE what I document and capture...people who are fans of themselves....not so much.

Offline daspyknows

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Re: Legality of Taping - AUD & RF/IEM
« Reply #66 on: May 10, 2018, 09:32:15 AM »
Isn't the trick to offer security and the cops crappy Alaskan cabbage?  They will surely let you go.


no, that's to make people like you stfu at the show.

the best was a Pub Crawl in my early 20's in Hawaii when I went to the Pro Bowl ('94)....these college prep doofuses would sell you this "spaghetti dinner and a bus to 5 bars" thing on the sidewalk, and show you group photos of 80 hotties and 20 dudes...of course, when you got there to the first bar where dinner was, it was 80 dudes and 20 chicks.

anyhow, just like a lot of you folks  here, they were all "oh, we smoke Hawaiian, your Alaskan ain't shit". (oh, we have spendy mics, so your recordings ain't shit)


longer story short, I sent 4 of the 6 of them home puking less than 2 hours later, ***because they couldn't handle it.***


you could learn from this maybe.....then again, nah, probably not.

Sorry dude,  your mental illness strikes again.

What are the Symptoms?
Monopolizing conversations? Feelings of entitlement? Belittling others? These are all classic signs of narcissistic personality disorder. Do you know of someone who knows the “right” way and all other ways are wrong? Are they cocky, lack empathy, and think they are largely important? Then it’s possible they might be suffering from this condition.


 I don't talk to asshats like you at shows and would pass on smoking something you passed my way.  I might catch something.


go read your "show notes" and note how often you reference yourself vs. the actual show.

then go look in the mirror and pat yourself on your narcissistic back.

repeatedly.


projection is not your strong suit.

just so you know.

Not quite.  I tell people about my experience as many tapers do, you on the other hand spend your time fluffing mediocre (at best) sounding recording.  I guess I hit a raw nerve and you are displaying more symptoms of your mental illness.

Responds to criticism with shame, anger, and humiliation
Belief that nobody should question your motives and should have unwavering compliance with your requests
Preoccupied with fantasies of unlimited success
Belief of great self-importance; only understood and should only associate with individuals of high-status
Expectations of being realized as superior
In need of and requiring constant admiration
Exaggeration of achievements and talents

 

Offline fanofjam

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Re: Legality of Taping - AUD & RF/IEM
« Reply #67 on: May 10, 2018, 10:56:02 AM »
I don't mean to inject myself in this topic, but I've lurked here for a long while before being an actual member. One thing I've noticed is that every time this very topic gets discussed around here, it turns nasty.

Anyway, that's all I got to say. Just a quick observation.

Respectfully, your observation is incorrect.  Reasonable people have discussed this topic many, many times without it becoming toxic.  It's an important topic to our hobby.  For example, I recall one awesome thread, it at least five years ago, where the lawyers and legal experts posted the actual text of the laws of all fifty US states, as regards taping.  There have been many others as well.

This conversation only becomes toxic when a few people decide on their own that they want to be asses, or in cases where the subject veers off to stealth taping, they decide on their own to violate a long-standing ts.com paradigm to keep stealth conversations stealth, or to say fuck all of the rest of you, I'm gonna just discuss or do whatever suits me. 

Taperssection is a community and, like it or not, people need to abide by the spoken and unspoken rules of the community or they'll be called out.  You might ask, well who made the rules?  Really there are no rules...there are just paradigms but the community established the paradigms over the years.  The community existed before most people here joined...and I think everyone can agree that the community need takes precedent over the wants and needs of any individual member, though some people don't get or care to respect that concept.

...which brings me to the subject of Furburger.  Nearly ANY conversation he imposes himself into turns toxic because he refuses to 'speak' civilly to people.  He predominantly carries himself like an asshole, yet he's constantly claiming discrimination.  Pretty obvious that Furburger has always had trouble playing nice in a sandbox.  Boo hoo for Furburger.  Fuck Furburger. 

I'm sure you can differentiate between Furburger's role in the toxicity of this, or any other thread in which he participates, and the more general subject of this thread, which is important and pertinent. 

« Last Edit: May 10, 2018, 10:57:36 AM by fanofjam »

Offline nak700s

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Re: Legality of Taping - AUD & RF/IEM
« Reply #68 on: May 10, 2018, 03:03:21 PM »
As far as having gear confiscated in a venue goes, it seems like it would be pretty simple to avoid regardless of your rights and security's rights. I'm simply leaving before I'm being led into any private/closed area of any venue. "Oh, didn't know this wasn't allowed, I'll go ahead and leave". Not sure there's really much they can do to you if you go this route. They will have to forcibly detain me in front of other patrons if they must take my equipment.

Best of luck with this approach.  They do have the right to detain and search you if they suspect that you're doing something outside of the boundary of their rules.  They can say whatever they want, but the bottom line is that you must have a bomb on you with all those wires and equipment, right?  See the line of thought there?  They can "say" whatever they need to, and it will be believable...as it is your word against theirs, and you're the one doing something you're not supposed to be doing, while they are actually doing their job.  If you resist, they can and will drag you to their security office.  They can make sure you do not leave the building with a recording of the performance.  They do not have the right to confiscate any of your equipment, but that doesn't necessarily mean they won't try.

There are a lot of opinions and a lot of facts mixed into this thread, mainly because these laws differ from state to state.  You need to become familiar with the laws of the state(s) that you frequently tape in.  Those who claim to know everything are generally the ones who know the least, so you're best off not listening to other's advice unless you know them and that it applies to your location.  I'm sure fruburger would disagree with everything I've said (he disagrees with everyone), but in all reality, he doesn't know everything...true story.  My suggestion to you, is to do what I did.  Ask a lawyer within this field all the questions that you need answers to in case you get busted.  It really is as simple as that.
Normal: Nakamichi CM-700's >> SD 744T (or) Sony PCM-M10
Normal: Crown CM-700's >> SD 302 >> SD 744T
Fun times: 3 Crown CM-700's >> SD 302 >> SD744T + 2 Nakamichi CM-700's >> SD744T
Stealth: CA-14c >> CA 9200 >> Edirol R-09HR
Ultra stealth: AudioReality >> AudioReality battery box >> Edirol R-09HR
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Offline nak700s

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Re: Legality of Taping - AUD & RF/IEM
« Reply #69 on: May 10, 2018, 03:21:10 PM »
This thread was intended, intended, to be something that was of interest to those that had interest in this specific subject area. Would be really cool if we could jump back to the time a few days ago when that was a possibility. Thank you.

Thank you.

There's no reason to hijack a thread when it is so easy to start one dedicated to a different subject.  I will say though, I found the diversion and interesting one...for a little while...until it became a war.
Normal: Nakamichi CM-700's >> SD 744T (or) Sony PCM-M10
Normal: Crown CM-700's >> SD 302 >> SD 744T
Fun times: 3 Crown CM-700's >> SD 302 >> SD744T + 2 Nakamichi CM-700's >> SD744T
Stealth: CA-14c >> CA 9200 >> Edirol R-09HR
Ultra stealth: AudioReality >> AudioReality battery box >> Edirol R-09HR
Simple & Sweet!

Offline ycoop

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Re: Legality of Taping - AUD & RF/IEM
« Reply #70 on: May 10, 2018, 11:44:59 PM »
My suggestion to you, is to do what I did.  Ask a lawyer within this field all the questions that you need answers to in case you get busted.  It really is as simple as that.

How would one go about locating such a lawyer?
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Offline daspyknows

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Re: Legality of Taping - AUD & RF/IEM
« Reply #71 on: May 11, 2018, 12:29:06 AM »
My suggestion to you, is to do what I did.  Ask a lawyer within this field all the questions that you need answers to in case you get busted.  It really is as simple as that.

How would one go about locating such a lawyer?

Scooter123 is a lawyer and taper on here.  He provided his thoughts on the subject before the thread went off the rails.  If I was in a situation he would be the first person I would call unless we were out taping together.

Another taper friend from the bay area (not on this site) is also a lawyer who I'd ask.   Since you are in California their opinions would be more valuable to your situation.  There are two or three others who used to tape and are located on the east coast who would be well versed on the subject in the event shit went down there.  If I was in such a situation, I would reach out to a lawyer I knew and ask them for a referral.   

Another option is to ask Rudy Giuliani but you might not get the best advice. 

Offline furburger

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Re: Legality of Taping - AUD & RF/IEM
« Reply #72 on: May 11, 2018, 05:11:44 AM »

Not quite.  I tell people about my experience as many tapers do, you on the other hand spend your time fluffing mediocre (at best) sounding recording.  I guess I hit a raw nerve and you are displaying more symptoms of your mental illness.




yes, a paragraph or two about "your experience" *getting to the show*, and then, if lucky, a sentence or two ***about the actual show***.

and that's (sentence) a crapshoot because of your shitty grammar/misspellings/missing words.


seriously, if you talk like you type, I can see why you have to fly to other countries for shows, because over there they think your English is stellar.
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Offline splumer

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Re: Legality of Taping - AUD & RF/IEM
« Reply #73 on: May 11, 2018, 10:33:03 AM »
misdemeanor theft: under $500

felony theft: over $500

Since you're obviously a legal scholar, I don't need to tell you this, but for the benefit of others: in Ohio, where I live, $500 is a 5th degree felony. Grand theft starts at $5000. In California, felony theft begins at $950. So it varies by state.


You merely say "before you walk off with that gear, I'd like you to speak to my attorney"


My son is a police officer. I asked him about it, and he said, "Yeah, good luck with that." He went on to explain that the police can confiscate pretty much anything they want, if they have reasonable suspicion that it may have been used, or was intended to be used, in a crime. He said they probably wouldn't, just because it's too much paperwork.
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Offline nak700s

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Re: Legality of Taping - AUD & RF/IEM
« Reply #74 on: May 11, 2018, 12:41:33 PM »
My suggestion to you, is to do what I did.  Ask a lawyer within this field all the questions that you need answers to in case you get busted.  It really is as simple as that.

How would one go about locating such a lawyer?

Scooter123 is a lawyer and taper on here.  He provided his thoughts on the subject before the thread went off the rails.  If I was in a situation he would be the first person I would call unless we were out taping together.

Another taper friend from the bay area (not on this site) is also a lawyer who I'd ask.   Since you are in California their opinions would be more valuable to your situation.  There are two or three others who used to tape and are located on the east coast who would be well versed on the subject in the event shit went down there.  If I was in such a situation, I would reach out to a lawyer I knew and ask them for a referral.   

Another option is to ask Rudy Giuliani but you might not get the best advice.

Good advice all around!
When I had a retail shop, one of my customers happened to be a copyright/trademark attorney that specialized in representing bands.  It's his job to know this stuff, so I asked him and got an education.  His field covered bootlegging, as well as the things you'd expect, so his expertise was of great value to me.  If I got popped, and was in need of a lawyer, I have several friends to choose from locally, but would call him.  As Daspyknows touched upon, an attorney in your state would be best for you (I'm in New York).
Normal: Nakamichi CM-700's >> SD 744T (or) Sony PCM-M10
Normal: Crown CM-700's >> SD 302 >> SD 744T
Fun times: 3 Crown CM-700's >> SD 302 >> SD744T + 2 Nakamichi CM-700's >> SD744T
Stealth: CA-14c >> CA 9200 >> Edirol R-09HR
Ultra stealth: AudioReality >> AudioReality battery box >> Edirol R-09HR
Simple & Sweet!

 

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