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Author Topic: Schoeps MK41 for small clubs and loud metal music?  (Read 1626 times)

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Offline Sebastian

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Re: Schoeps MK41 for small clubs and loud metal music?
« Reply #30 on: May 07, 2018, 04:54:51 AM »
It sure makes me crave for Schoeps. Not sure about MK41 vs MK41v though?

For stealth, I prefer the V capsules (even though they're a bit bigger than the regular ones). Especially when wearing them in a hat, they can be used with a stereo bar and that'll give you a better stereo image.
Schoeps { MK6 | MK41V | MK4 } > NBob actives > {Naiant Tinybox v2.0 | Naiant IPA | Naiant PFAs} > {Zoom F8 | Sony PCM-M10 | Tascam DR-2d | Olympus LS-P1}

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Offline TheMetalist

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Re: Schoeps MK41 for small clubs and loud metal music?
« Reply #31 on: May 07, 2018, 03:09:52 PM »
For stealth, I prefer the V capsules (even though they're a bit bigger than the regular ones). Especially when wearing them in a hat, they can be used with a stereo bar and that'll give you a better stereo image.

I will look closer at the V's. I really find them interesting.
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"The music is your passport - Your magic key - To all the madness that awaits you." B.L. '86

Offline ycoop

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Re: Schoeps MK41 for small clubs and loud metal music?
« Reply #32 on: May 07, 2018, 05:04:21 PM »
For stealth, I prefer the V capsules (even though they're a bit bigger than the regular ones). Especially when wearing them in a hat, they can be used with a stereo bar and that'll give you a better stereo image.

I will look closer at the V's. I really find them interesting.

What are the technical and practical differences between the regular Schoeps capsules and the ones with the V designation?
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Offline daspyknows

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Re: Schoeps MK41 for small clubs and loud metal music?
« Reply #33 on: May 07, 2018, 06:14:23 PM »
I was going to say the same things.  I generally use my MK41's in stadiums, arenas and festivals while I run MK4's in smaller venues or if I am very close in an arena or festival.  If you are on Dime I have a few hundred shows up there and everything  from the last 26 years are recorded with MK4's or MK41's.  There are a few metal shows and lots of rock shows.

I've listened to a few of your recordings now. Both MK4's and MK41's. Great recordings indeed.

I still prefer the hypers though. The MK4's are a bit diffuse and capture too much of the room sound for my liking. As I said, only a matter of taste. I love your Tom Petty 2017-05-27 Bottlerock recording made with MK41's. Truly magnificent.

It sure makes me crave for Schoeps. Not sure about MK41 vs MK41v though?

Schedule permitting I am going to catch the Uli Jon Roth show at a local club of 500.  https://www.cornerstoneberkeley.com/music-venue/cornerstone-events/  If I do I can try and run both the MK4's and MK41's  >:D using the NBox PLatinum and the Rbox which are very similar.  That should provide a nice comp in a  >:D situation.

Offline perks

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Re: Schoeps MK41 for small clubs and loud metal music?
« Reply #34 on: May 07, 2018, 07:57:29 PM »
for small clubs you don't want to run hypercards. your best bet for small clubs (or anywhere where you are close to the sound source) is subcards, then cards, then hypercards. you might want to run hypers in an arena situation.

I have to disagree with you here. For what I do my hypers are great. I usually go for the stacks and I love the presence and "in your face" kind of sound they achive in clubs. Especially when recording metal bands. They also remove some annoying chatters and clappers around me.

I find at rock clubs where SPL's are easily above 100db that the human voice is no match for what is coming out of the speakers. Unless the loud person is directly in front of me and turning around to talk directly into the mics I dont usually have problems with talkers. At a show where the human voice can easily match or exceed the sounds coming off the stage this crowd noise is a much bigger problem.

If you are going to record off the stacks I'd think you would want to be close enough so that there is no reflection sound or other room noise that could be louder than what is coming out of the speakers. I always think of this method of recording like mic-ing a guitar amp.

I understand the OP likes the sound of hypers and there is no arguing about preferences - people like what they like but for me when I'm grabbing mics to do 007 I almost always grab the cards (Schoeps MK5's) over the hyper/super (MK41's) unless I'm very far away from the stage or in a very narrow room simply because the hypers are far more susceptible to phasing issues. I can hear the stereo image moving on playback when the recordist moves their mics even a small amount.  This problem exists whether  cards or hypers are used but I've found it much more noticeable with a pair of hypers. 
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Offline daspyknows

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Re: Schoeps MK41 for small clubs and loud metal music?
« Reply #35 on: May 07, 2018, 08:10:57 PM »
for small clubs you don't want to run hypercards. your best bet for small clubs (or anywhere where you are close to the sound source) is subcards, then cards, then hypercards. you might want to run hypers in an arena situation.

I have to disagree with you here. For what I do my hypers are great. I usually go for the stacks and I love the presence and "in your face" kind of sound they achive in clubs. Especially when recording metal bands. They also remove some annoying chatters and clappers around me.

I find at rock clubs where SPL's are easily above 100db that the human voice is no match for what is coming out of the speakers. Unless the loud person is directly in front of me and turning around to talk directly into the mics I dont usually have problems with talkers. At a show where the human voice can easily match or exceed the sounds coming off the stage this crowd noise is a much bigger problem.

If you are going to record off the stacks I'd think you would want to be close enough so that there is no reflection sound or other room noise that could be louder than what is coming out of the speakers. I always think of this method of recording like mic-ing a guitar amp.

I understand the OP likes the sound of hypers and there is no arguing about preferences - people like what they like but for me when I'm grabbing mics to do 007 I almost always grab the cards (Schoeps MK5's) over the hyper/super (MK41's) unless I'm very far away from the stage or in a very narrow room simply because the hypers are far more susceptible to phasing issues. I can hear the stereo image moving on playback when the recordist moves their mics even a small amount.  This problem exists whether  cards or hypers are used but I've found it much more noticeable with a pair of hypers.

Complete agreement.  I also really make an effort not to move when wearing the mics regardless of type of venue.  I am also partial to being dead center rather than doing a stack tape.

Offline MakersMarc

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Re: Schoeps MK41 for small clubs and loud metal music?
« Reply #36 on: May 07, 2018, 09:02:38 PM »
Also believe that 41 or 41v are more susceptible to phasing than my 4v.
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Offline TheMetalist

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Re: Schoeps MK41 for small clubs and loud metal music?
« Reply #37 on: May 08, 2018, 10:05:17 AM »
I find at rock clubs where SPL's are easily above 100db that the human voice is no match for what is coming out of the speakers. Unless the loud person is directly in front of me and turning around to talk directly into the mics I dont usually have problems with talkers. At a show where the human voice can easily match or exceed the sounds coming off the stage this crowd noise is a much bigger problem.

If you are going to record off the stacks I'd think you would want to be close enough so that there is no reflection sound or other room noise that could be louder than what is coming out of the speakers. I always think of this method of recording like mic-ing a guitar amp.

In Sweden we have a 100dB limit at shows. Bands are not allowed to play very loud here. And metal fans? They are screaming more than talking. And singing and whistling and clapping. Lots of noise around me. I'm usually close to the stacks which mostly mean I'm in the pit with all screaming maniacs.


I understand the OP likes the sound of hypers and there is no arguing about preferences - people like what they like but for me when I'm grabbing mics to do 007 I almost always grab the cards (Schoeps MK5's) over the hyper/super (MK41's) unless I'm very far away from the stage or in a very narrow room simply because the hypers are far more susceptible to phasing issues. I can hear the stereo image moving on playback when the recordist moves their mics even a small amount.  This problem exists whether  cards or hypers are used but I've found it much more noticeable with a pair of hypers.

I'm pretty used to be a human stand. Luckily I don't get much phasing. Perhaps my CK63's are forgiving.
It's not about fancy equipment. It's about the thrill, passion and hard work. Liberate the music!

"The music is your passport - Your magic key - To all the madness that awaits you." B.L. '86

Offline TheMetalist

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Re: Schoeps MK41 for small clubs and loud metal music?
« Reply #38 on: May 08, 2018, 10:06:10 AM »
Schedule permitting I am going to catch the Uli Jon Roth show at a local club of 500.  https://www.cornerstoneberkeley.com/music-venue/cornerstone-events/  If I do I can try and run both the MK4's and MK41's  >:D using the NBox PLatinum and the Rbox which are very similar.  That should provide a nice comp in a  >:D situation.

That would be really cool. I really appreciate that! Thank you. And... Uli rocks!  8)


Complete agreement.  I also really make an effort not to move when wearing the mics regardless of type of venue.  I am also partial to being dead center rather than doing a stack tape.

At smaller venues I try to be dead center with mics in stereo configuration pointing to stacks. At larger venues and outdoors I record one stack only.
It's not about fancy equipment. It's about the thrill, passion and hard work. Liberate the music!

"The music is your passport - Your magic key - To all the madness that awaits you." B.L. '86

 

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