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stevetoney

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I'm Officially Retired...
« on: April 21, 2014, 03:56:55 PM »
...from stealthing.

So, I got into this thing we do as a stealther.  Recorded hundreds of shows that way.  Then I sold my stuff because I needed money, but also because stealthing wore me out. 

There's been some shows come through over the last couple years I really wanted to go to, but dumb ole taper-me, I'm not interested in going to shows I can't record.  So over the last couple of years, I've gradually picked up gear that would allow me to record in stealth mode.

The problem is...ever since having all of the gear to do it, I've seen AT LEAST 20 shows and I pass them up, because I just have no fun at a show where I stealth. 

I've even gone so far as to have all my gear packed and ready to walk out the door, but then turn right around and stay home. 

Last week a band came through town (Cloud Cult from Minn/St. Paul area) that I've been looking forward to seeing ever since the last time I saw them in Pittsburgh 3 years ago.  They'd scheduled a gig here last year and I was really disappointed when it was cancelled.  So they finally came through last weekend and I bailed...didn't want to stealth it.  Maybe they'll be back on some festival lineups like they were when I first saw them at 10KLF in 2009.

I guess it's time to face facts and declare myself officially retired from stealthing forever.  If the trend here in the US ever changes back to no open taping, I think I'll die.
« Last Edit: April 23, 2014, 07:20:39 AM by tonedeaf »

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Re: I'm Officially Retired...As a Stealth Taper
« Reply #1 on: April 21, 2014, 04:05:49 PM »
I give it up to all the stealth tapers. that is some hard work. I'm sure it takes a toll on ya over the years. these last 4 years back in the game open taping, taken a toll on me
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Re: I'm Officially Retired...As a Stealth Taper
« Reply #2 on: April 21, 2014, 05:05:07 PM »
I'd probably feel a lot better after every show if I stealth taped... I'd probably drink a whole lot less. :)

Anways, I've done exactly two stealth without guilt shows in the last 4 years and can't see myself doing any more anytime soon, even though I've got plenty of gear to do so. For me, it really has nothing to do with enjoyment of the show and everything to do with respect for the venues I frequent and relationships formed since becoming an nyctaper contributor. It's amazing how cooperative most venues have been to us and you couldn't pay me to jeopardize those relationships by stealth taping.

I'd probably still stealth tape a festival or unqiue event held outside a normal venue, but otherwise I'm pretty much committed to playing it by the rules or not at all.


stevetoney

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Re: I'm Officially Retired...As a Stealth Taper
« Reply #3 on: April 22, 2014, 08:08:49 AM »
I'd probably feel a lot better after every show if I stealth taped... I'd probably drink a whole lot less. :)

Anways, I've done exactly two stealth without guilt shows in the last 4 years and can't see myself doing any more anytime soon, even though I've got plenty of gear to do so. For me, it really has nothing to do with enjoyment of the show and everything to do with respect for the venues I frequent and relationships formed since becoming an nyctaper contributor. It's amazing how cooperative most venues have been to us and you couldn't pay me to jeopardize those relationships by stealth taping.

I'd probably still stealth tape a festival or unqiue event held outside a normal venue, but otherwise I'm pretty much committed to playing it by the rules or not at all.

Thanks for this comment.  This definitely factors in for me as well. 

There are four venues here in Pittsburgh that I tape in fairly regularly and two of those are venues that I'd have a total guilt trip about if I stealthed because of my friendships with the principals.  The other two have never given me a problem so even though I don't have personal relationships with the principals, it would definitely be disrespectful to record a band that's not taper friendly.  The guilt trip is one of the factors contributing to the buzz kill I mentioned earlier that I feel when I've bailed at the very end on the night of the show I was thinking about stealthing.


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Re: I'm Officially Retired...As a Stealth Taper
« Reply #4 on: April 22, 2014, 08:24:35 AM »
You know...  as soon as you sell your gear, King Crimson will announce their tour...   :P

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Re: I'm Officially Retired...As a Stealth Taper
« Reply #5 on: April 22, 2014, 08:57:07 AM »
Terry...one of the reasons I love taping is because the music I love the most is played right in front of me.  I paid to see U2 and Green Day in stadium venues in the last 3 years, but that's it over the last ten or more years...and neither of those shows inspired me at all other than being with people I care about (I can't get them to go to shows with me otherwise since they know nothing about the music I like). 

There's Phish of course but (cover your eyes and ears) I probably won't worry about recording another Phish show because even those Phish shows I've recorded, I end up listening to the LivePhish release alot more than any of the recordings...with the exception of a good number of Taylor or Chris's FOB recordings.  (All of the God's consipired together in a blissful moment with regards to Taylor's Tahoe Tweezer...that's a Hall Of Fame recording right there.)  Section recordings are fine and I'm glad people are allowed to record, but generally I'm reaching for the LivePhish option if I have it available to me...I know I know.  :facepalm:

I'm not a King Crimson fan...and otherwise I can't really think of a reunion that I'd die to tape.  There are lots of dead musicians in that category, but that's not exactly pertinent... LOL.

EDIT:  I take it back, I'd give it up for a chance to record the original Meters lineup.
« Last Edit: April 22, 2014, 08:59:17 AM by tonedeaf »

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Re: I'm Officially Retired...As a Stealth Taper
« Reply #6 on: April 22, 2014, 09:09:55 AM »
Terry...one of the reasons I love taping is because the music I love the most is played right in front of me.  I paid to see U2 and Green Day in stadium venues in the last 3 years, but that's it over the last ten or more years...and neither of those shows inspired me at all other than being with people I care about (I can't get them to go to shows with me otherwise since they know nothing about the music I like). 

There's Phish of course but (cover your eyes and ears) I probably won't worry about recording another Phish show because even those Phish shows I've recorded, I end up listening to the LivePhish release alot more than any of the recordings...with the exception of a good number of Taylor or Chris's FOB recordings.  (All of the God's consipired together in a blissful moment with regards to Taylor's Tahoe Tweezer...that's a Hall Of Fame recording right there.)  Section recordings are fine and I'm glad people are allowed to record, but generally I'm reaching for the LivePhish option if I have it available to me...I know I know.  :facepalm:

I'm not a King Crimson fan...and otherwise I can't really think of a reunion that I'd die to tape.  There are lots of dead musicians in that category, but that's not exactly pertinent... LOL.

EDIT:  I take it back, I'd give it up for a chance to record the original Meters lineup.

LOL!  There is a reason I've never taped a PH show...

Terry

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Re: I'm Officially Retired...As a Stealth Taper
« Reply #7 on: April 22, 2014, 09:23:15 AM »
I've stealthed a few times. The last few were for convenience more than necessity. I taped at a festival with sixteen stages/venues. There were several things I wanted to tape and time did not allow for set up and breakdown in between. So I geared up and had a blast. The tapes turned out pretty damn good. Except the one where I inadvertently switched the recorder to internal mics and taped from a shorts pocket facing backwards. Talk about sounding like ass.

I am not concerned with respect for venues or artists. If I stealth a non-friendly band, it is for my ears only. I open tape to share. If I want something non-taper friendly bad enough to stealth it, I won't feel bad keeping it to myself. Stealthing is more work and and less enjoyment. If I stand motionless for two hours without a pee break I don't feel guilty hoarding.

I have been to several shows of artists both open, neutral and anti-taping this year and left the gear at home. It feels strange at first, but the feelings of regret at not having taped do subside. I actually have no regret whatsoever that I didn't tape my first (and last) Keller Williams show Sunday night.
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adrianf74

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Re: I'm Officially Retired...As a Stealth Taper
« Reply #8 on: April 22, 2014, 09:29:58 AM »
I have been to several shows of artists both open, neutral and anti-taping this year and left the gear at home. It feels strange at first, but the feelings of regret at not having taped do subside.

Really?  I can count the times where I took a break due to "taper burnout" and eventually bumped into a show I'd wished I'd taped THEN and NOW.   I can count about 5 or 6 shows (out of about 30-40 during my last break in the mid-to-late 2000's) where I wish I'd rolled and am still bummed that I hadn't today.

It does get easier... until you encounter the above.

And, to agree with ToneDeaf, stealthing is often more of a pain in the ass than it's worth especially if a crowd is badly behaved.


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Re: I'm Officially Retired...As a Stealth Taper
« Reply #9 on: April 22, 2014, 10:04:57 AM »
Every time I start thinking that stealthing is more of a pain in the ass than it's worth, I pull a recording that changes my mind.  My tolerance for douchebaggery in the crowd has gone down though.  Maybe that just comes with being old and cranky. 
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Re: I'm Officially Retired...As a Stealth Taper
« Reply #10 on: April 22, 2014, 10:42:06 AM »
Maybe that just comes with being old and cranky.

QFT. +1.

stevetoney

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Re: I'm Officially Retired...As a Stealth Taper
« Reply #11 on: April 22, 2014, 10:46:54 AM »
I've stealthed a few times. The last few were for convenience more than necessity. I taped at a festival with sixteen stages/venues. There were several things I wanted to tape and time did not allow for set up and breakdown in between. So I geared up and had a blast. The tapes turned out pretty damn good. Except the one where I inadvertently switched the recorder to internal mics and taped from a shorts pocket facing backwards. Talk about sounding like ass.

I think that there's a shortage of good fart recordings.  Tape on, my friend...and please post the best fart recordings...make sure there's no bass roll off.

I am not concerned with respect for venues or artists. If I stealth a non-friendly band, it is for my ears only. I open tape to share. If I want something non-taper friendly bad enough to stealth it, I won't feel bad keeping it to myself. Stealthing is more work and and less enjoyment. If I stand motionless for two hours without a pee break I don't feel guilty hoarding.

FWIW, I'm OK with this.  I hope my earlier message didn't imply that others should feel guilty for stealthing.  My own guilt feelings stem simply from the fact that I've never discussed it with my friend that runs the venue...he's a music fan first and foremost so I think he wouldn't have a big problem with it if he knew I wasn't sharing, but since I haven't run it by him, I don't feel good doing it since I respect the shit out of the guy.

I have been to several shows of artists both open, neutral and anti-taping this year and left the gear at home. It feels strange at first, but the feelings of regret at not having taped do subside. I actually have no regret whatsoever that I didn't tape my first (and last) Keller Williams show Sunday night.

LOL about your Keller comment.  You're the first person I've ever heard that didn't like him.  (I lie.) 

As far as not taping, my issue is less about whether or not I tape, it's more a fear or phobia of attending a 'life experience' mind blowing show without my gear.  Stupid as it sounds...as an old guy/taper that's attended so many of these shows over the years, I'd almost rather not be there at all than regret not having taped those shows.

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Re: I'm Officially Retired...As a Stealth Taper
« Reply #12 on: April 22, 2014, 11:13:05 AM »
I have been to several shows of artists both open, neutral and anti-taping this year and left the gear at home. It feels strange at first, but the feelings of regret at not having taped do subside.

Really?  I can count the times where I took a break due to "taper burnout" and eventually bumped into a show I'd wished I'd taped THEN and NOW.   I can count about 5 or 6 shows (out of about 30-40 during my last break in the mid-to-late 2000's) where I wish I'd rolled and am still bummed that I hadn't today.

Disclaimer: I have been on an emotional roller coaster the last year and a half after being blindsided by a request for divorce. Regret is a negative emotion and it is tough to let go, but sometimes you have to do it for your own sanity. I still spend a lot of days wishing I had done things differently with my marriage. It really puts the recording stuff in perspective.

I've stealthed a few times. The last few were for convenience more than necessity. I taped at a festival with sixteen stages/venues. There were several things I wanted to tape and time did not allow for set up and breakdown in between. So I geared up and had a blast. The tapes turned out pretty damn good. Except the one where I inadvertently switched the recorder to internal mics and taped from a shorts pocket facing backwards. Talk about sounding like ass.

I think that there's a shortage of good fart recordings.  Tape on, my friend...and please post the best fart recordings...make sure there's no bass roll off.

I don't know about the bass roll off, sometimes they can be a little muddy and need some cleaning up in post.  ;D


I have been to several shows of artists both open, neutral and anti-taping this year and left the gear at home. It feels strange at first, but the feelings of regret at not having taped do subside. I actually have no regret whatsoever that I didn't tape my first (and last) Keller Williams show Sunday night.

LOL about your Keller comment.  You're the first person I've ever heard that didn't like him.  (I lie.)

In all fairness the first set was solo "loopy" shit.  Jeff Sipe played drums and Gibb Droll guitar in the second set and Keller stayed on the bass and didn't loop anything. That was good. Just don't think I could make it through another solo set from him.

eta: And Adrian, I know you've been through a lot lately. Sometimes real life puts the whole hobby thing in a different light.

« Last Edit: April 22, 2014, 11:15:53 AM by hoppedup »
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Re: I'm Officially Retired...As a Stealth Taper
« Reply #13 on: April 22, 2014, 11:26:52 AM »
At a ripe age of AARP membership, I only record if have permission. I have more or less abandoned the stealth means of recording.  Stealth was always part of the challenge and fun back in the day, but over the past years (decades +), I find that the challenge is to establish contact with the artists and or band managers months - weeks prior to a show coming to town requesting access to openly record.  Permission does not always happen, but I have rarely been turned down, especially when I am able to supply the performer(s) and management with a copy after the performance.  Downside, if it really is a downside, at times they may not wish for it to be distributed openly in many the case (LMA or Torrent) or I have been asked to delay sharing due to their commercial release coming up. If they decide to release it, then I get the recording credits of which I have a few under the belt.

There are creative means for which one can present ones self in a better light to gain open access recording. This poses the greater challenge for me at least when comparing it to the old days of smuggling recording gear into a venue.  Mellowing with age?

Recently I had contacted Nick Waterhouse on FB and asked for permission to record him in Philly, he gave me the green light.  When I had a chance to talk to him in person, Nick's stand out comment to me after the show was:  "I love Tapers"!  I was the only person recording.  I came in and set up as I wanted with no problems from venue staff and was able to supply Nick with a copy, as well as the opening band.  Point being is that it made for a better recording than it would have been if I had been is stealth mode and allowed me to also enjoy the show and not look like a stiff all night.

Just my spin on the challenges facing us today in re. to many of the artist's, bands and venues.

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Re: I'm Officially Retired...As a Stealth Taper
« Reply #14 on: April 22, 2014, 11:54:13 AM »
Every time I start thinking that stealthing is more of a pain in the ass than it's worth, I pull a recording that changes my mind.  My tolerance for douchebaggery in the crowd has gone down though.  Maybe that just comes with being old and cranky.

+T  Gotta agree 100%.  Even with my back killing me from standing still, it's still worth it when you get home and= ;D
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