Author Topic: Advice on Running MP-2>Mod SBM-1 (Read 13327 times)

nickgregory · « **on:** April 30, 2003, 10:08:27 AM »

OK, so I searched the archives on Oade, and apparently everyone has an opinion on how to run this combo...so here I am looking to this board! The deal is this, I bought a MP-2 (Thanks Scott!) and will be running:

AKG 391(s)>MP-2>Mod SBM-1>D100

I am looking for current advice around the following:

1) I have cables to run both XLR>RCA or mini>RCA (Kindkables.com...shameless plug, but Ed deserves it!)...I know the increased db's provided through the XLR option, but is there anything else I need to be concered with here?

2) How should I run it? It seems there are two opinions, basically plug in the mic's to the MP-2, basically run levels dead minimally, and adjust on the SBM-1. The other option that I have seen people do is set the SBM-1 levels conservatively and adjust on the MP-2. Which do folks here prefer?

3) I won't have my SLA until after the Particle show (my first outing with it) and curious if (a) Particle runs two sets? So maybe I can swap batts out and run alkalines, and/or (b) what could I expect to get using liths vs. Energizer Max?

Any opinions, suggestions anyone has, I would love to hear!

Appreciate the advice in advance.

Nick

creekfreak · « **Reply #1 on:** April 30, 2003, 10:30:20 AM »

I ran an mp-2 into a modsbm-1 for awhile. First off, I do not like the sound of the mp-2 at high gain so bearing that in mind, its better to keep the mp-2 low and run the sbm-1 opened up some. I don't think running some gain from the mp-2 is bad, just try to keep the sbm-1 above 5 and you should be good.

goose · « **Reply #2 on:** April 30, 2003, 10:43:27 AM »

3) Particle usually plays two sets - you should be fine switching batteries at set break.

Wish I could help with the others, but I got no experience with the MP-2!

Brian Skalinder · « **Reply #3 on:** April 30, 2003, 11:14:55 AM »

Quote from: nickgregory on April 30, 2003, 10:08:27 AM

So maybe I can swap batts out and run alkalines, and/or (b) what could I expect to get using liths vs. Energizer Max?

I ran a SD Mixpre for a while (damn near identical to the MP2) and found it to be a power pig. I got barely over an hour on plain old alkalines. Not sure about the various flavors of super-duper alkalines (e.g. Duracell "Ultra"). Maybe someone else can chime in.

FWIW, the battery compartment may require a mod in order to run rechargables if you're considering that in the future.

nickgregory · « **Reply #4 on:** April 30, 2003, 11:16:53 AM »

Quote from: Brian Skalinder on April 30, 2003, 11:14:55 AM

FWIW, the battery compartment may require a mod in order to run rechargables if you're considering that in the future.

I have heard that. Is this the fix that everyone is sending the MP-2 off to Sound devices to get done?

nickgregory · « **Reply #5 on:** April 30, 2003, 11:17:26 AM »

And thanks the advice guys thus far....+T

Keep it coming..!

Nick

Jason B · « **Reply #6 on:** April 30, 2003, 11:47:50 AM »

Nick,

I'll be on-stage for Particle at the Lincoln. See you there.

-JB

Todd R · « **Reply #7 on:** April 30, 2003, 12:11:02 PM »

I ran km184>mp2>modSBM1 for about a year or so. I think most folks will tell you the mp2 doesn't sound as good at high gain, and I agree completely. I ran 1/8" mini to RCA's on the SBM1 to keep the gain of the mp2 to an absolute minimum. Personally, I never had a problem running mini out rather than XLR. No pulled cables, no dropouts. I guess the drunks like my stand better than my gear.

I also ran the mp2 at pretty much minimum gain--knobs completely counter-clockwise, other than getting L-R levels matched. Then I used the gain adjust of the modSBM1. SBM levels were generally between 6-9.

Sounded great this way. I never really noticed the bloated mp2 low end folks always talk about, perhaps since I used so little gain out of the mp2. Only drawback with running this way is that the knobs at very low gain are incredibly sensitive. Really need to grab the knobs and just visualize which way you want them to turn, otherwise you'll get a very noticeable shift in levels on your tape.

-Todd

jlykos · « **Reply #8 on:** April 30, 2003, 12:18:43 PM »

Right on, Todd; great advice! I loved your modSBM when I had it; a car accident took care of that.

You can get a show or two out of lithiums. You can probably get a complete show out of alkalines also. I believe that the 391 series can accept phantom power from 9-48 volts and the MP-2 has a switch where you can supply 15 or 18 volts (forgot which one) to the mics if you want to save on battery power. You can most likely get a complete show off some Duracells if you keep the level meter off on the MP-2; the meter is bright as hell and sucks up a lot of juice.

Nick, I ran this combo for a while and absolutely loved the results. I may be at Particle also so see me if you have any questions.

DaryanLenz · « **Reply #9 on:** April 30, 2003, 12:35:11 PM »

Jamie,

You surely should go to particle, run the bomb rig

, and send me a copy of that stage tape. Go Team Gefell!

Daryan

jlykos · « **Reply #10 on:** April 30, 2003, 12:44:29 PM »

Yeah, maybe break out the omnis for once at Particle. A trip to Taco Bell took care of that (non) experiment at the Panic shows. Don't ever eat there if you are doing something cool within the next few days!

Nick, I forgot to mention that depending on the model of MP-2 you have, you may already have the battery modification done. Try a pair and see if it powers up; if it does not, you need the modification. They did change the spring assembly in later production runs. If you need the modification, a pair of MAHA 1800 rechargeables will last you through a show. The mod was free and they fixed it and mailed it out in the same day.

creekfreak · « **Reply #11 on:** April 30, 2003, 01:39:58 PM »

so is this particle band good? Heard a lot of good things and they are playing the late night stage at the Vibes this year

Jason B · « **Reply #12 on:** April 30, 2003, 01:43:05 PM »

Particle is a rocking band. Definitely go check them out Kris. I don't like STS 9, or any of the other techno-ish bands, but Particle takes the stage and rocks full out until the end of the show! Great band, great live show. Definitely check them out.

-JB

DaryanLenz · « **Reply #13 on:** April 30, 2003, 02:30:21 PM »

Yeah, they rock for sure. I wouldn't reccomend a bunch of shows in a row, as they don't have a whole lot of material from what I could tell, but they definately rick!

Daryan

nickgregory · « **Reply #14 on:** April 30, 2003, 02:56:35 PM »

Quote from: jlykos on April 30, 2003, 12:18:43 PM

Right on, Todd; great advice! I loved your modSBM when I had it; a car accident took care of that.

You can get a show or two out of lithiums. You can probably get a complete show out of alkalines also. I believe that the 391 series can accept phantom power from 9-48 volts and the MP-2 has a switch where you can supply 15 or 18 volts (forgot which one) to the mics if you want to save on battery power. You can most likely get a complete show off some Duracells if you keep the level meter off on the MP-2; the meter is bright as hell and sucks up a lot of juice.

Nick, I ran this combo for a while and absolutely loved the results. I may be at Particle also so see me if you have any questions.

Jamie,

Thanks for the feedback....one more question though. Understanding that the 391's can accept 9-52V of power...is there a performance impact on the mic if I run the 15volt option to it?? Seems in theory there may be, but I am curious.

Thanks all for the advice though.....but seriously, am I going to be the only guy running in the aud for Particle?

Nick

Jason B · « **Reply #15 on:** April 30, 2003, 03:03:01 PM »

Quote from: nickgregory on April 30, 2003, 02:56:35 PM

Quote from: jlykos on April 30, 2003, 12:18:43 PM
Right on, Todd; great advice! I loved your modSBM when I had it; a car accident took care of that.

You can get a show or two out of lithiums. You can probably get a complete show out of alkalines also. I believe that the 391 series can accept phantom power from 9-48 volts and the MP-2 has a switch where you can supply 15 or 18 volts (forgot which one) to the mics if you want to save on battery power. You can most likely get a complete show off some Duracells if you keep the level meter off on the MP-2; the meter is bright as hell and sucks up a lot of juice.

Nick, I ran this combo for a while and absolutely loved the results. I may be at Particle also so see me if you have any questions.

Jamie,

Thanks for the feedback....one more question though. Understanding that the 391's can accept 9-52V of power...is there a performance impact on the mic if I run the 15volt option to it?? Seems in theory there may be, but I am curious.

Thanks all for the advice though.....but seriously, am I going to be the only guy running in the aud for Particle?

Nick

No, I will be the only one on-stage!

nickgregory · « **Reply #16 on:** April 30, 2003, 03:05:01 PM »

Quote from: Jason B on April 30, 2003, 03:03:01 PM

No, I will be the only one on-stage!

Cool...see you there....

Nick

jlykos · « **Reply #17 on:** April 30, 2003, 03:07:07 PM »

I have not done this, as I sold my AKGs before picking up the MP-2. From what I understand, however, the answer is that there is no performance difference at all. It does not matter what voltage the 391s receive; as long as it is above 9v or below 48v, they will operate the same. To back this up, AKG makes the B-18 power supplies, which supply 18 volts to each mic and nobody has ever reported any diminished performance with those supplies.

nickgregory · « **Reply #18 on:** April 30, 2003, 03:13:06 PM »

as you write this, I realize that I have been using the B-18s for a while to power the mics and that they dont provide 48V....will crawl back under the rock for a while...

Thanks for the info though....hope to see you at Particle!

Nick

Jason B · « **Reply #19 on:** April 30, 2003, 03:19:52 PM »

Jamie,

Are you definitely coming?

-JB

jlykos · « **Reply #20 on:** April 30, 2003, 03:28:19 PM »

No, I am not definitely going to the show. Just thinking about it. I may download some of their music before the show and give it a listen before deciding. I want to avoid having to endure another 2.5 hour Garaj Mahal experience where I am obliged to stay because I already have all my gear set up on stage. I would have left that show in under an hour if I was not taping it.

Jason B · « **Reply #21 on:** April 30, 2003, 03:32:23 PM »

Mmmm...you may not like Particle then.You should come anyway though and have some beers with me. They are electro-rock-techno-jam-ish.

Garaj Mahal is one of my favorite bands!! What don't you like about them??

-JB

jlykos · « **Reply #22 on:** April 30, 2003, 03:39:47 PM »

Quote from: Jason B on April 30, 2003, 03:32:23 PM

Garaj Mahal is one of my favorite bands!! What don't you like about them??

Ummmm, everything? No song structure, or even songs for that matter. Flaccid, uninspired "jamming." Noodling and pyrotechnics instead of thoughtful musical passages. Lame, pandering crowd exhortations and theme lyrics. Most importantly, no sense of musical direction whatsoever. What separates these guys from the dozens of other second-, third-, and fourth-tier *generic* (emphasis here) jambands? Nothing, in my opinion.

On the plus side, their drummer was really good and the crowd was totally into the show.

Jason B · « **Reply #23 on:** April 30, 2003, 03:56:01 PM »

You are waaaaaaay to critical.

All this who from someone who listens to some of the crappiest music out there!!

Next time you go to some heavy metal show, I'll go with you, then ripp the entire band and music genre a new one on the way home!!

heehee

creekfreak · « **Reply #24 on:** April 30, 2003, 04:11:14 PM »

I will be sure to check them out, I love techno anyways

jlykos · « **Reply #25 on:** April 30, 2003, 04:18:37 PM »

OK, you're on. I am taping the Contamination festival for Relapse in Carrboro next Sunday (May 10) and you are more than welcome to go with me. Mastodon, the best new (not nu) metal band in ages, is co-headlining with Cephalic Carnage (who I have never heard) and two other bands are support. Should be a good time!

I listen to a lot of very good music, which gives me authority as The Supreme Arbiter of Taste to rag on whoever I want to. I listen to many, many different bands across all genres of music. Therefore, I can make a damn good analogy of Garaj Mahal as being equivalent to Warrant because I have heard enough music from both bands to make a valid comparison.

I do not operate in a world where taste is relative. Sure, I have some guilty pleasures like Missy Elliott, but she makes incredible music and is the most revolutionary musical artist of the past six years. So, I don't know if that pleasure is so guilty. Whatever enriches yourself as a human being, as opposed to always going for the short cheese, should be the paramount criteria by which one judges music. Make every note count and every word mean something, even if it not obvious at first. My problem with what I consider "bad" music like Garaj Mahal is that none of their notes count and their words mean the most banal things. They are the progenitors of the "go with the flow" mentality of not caring about jack and it is one that I wholeheartedly reject!

nickgregory · « **Reply #26 on:** April 30, 2003, 04:22:41 PM »

Jamie, where is that show? I have heard alot of good things about Mastodon and would be interested in checking them out....

Nick

jlykos · « **Reply #27 on:** April 30, 2003, 04:24:34 PM »

Go! Studios Room 4 in Carrboro. $10 admission. Get there when the doors open because it will probably sell out. No advance tickets to my knowledge. Taping space is *very* limited so if you want to tape, bring a clamp and the smallest taping bag you can possibly find. Also, don't be squeamish about people reaching for the mic stand or tipping it. It will happen, trust me.

nickgregory · « **Reply #28 on:** April 30, 2003, 04:29:39 PM »

Quote from: jlykos on April 30, 2003, 04:24:34 PM

Go! Studios Room 4 in Carrboro. $10 admission. Get there when the doors open because it will probably sell out. No advance tickets to my knowledge. Taping space is *very* limited so if you want to tape, bring a clamp and the smallest taping bag you can possibly find. Also, don't be squeamish about people reaching for the mic stand or tipping it. It will happen, trust me.

Cool...Thanks....may have to find a way out of mothers day dinner....

greenone · « **Reply #29 on:** April 30, 2003, 04:42:40 PM »

Quote from: nickgregory on April 30, 2003, 02:56:35 PM

seriously, am I going to be the only guy running in the aud for Particle?

No shame in being the only taper...I was "that guy" at three shows last weekend. Of course, it makes you freak out a little bit more when one of your tapes gets chomped while you load it...

--Dave

mterry · « **Reply #30 on:** April 30, 2003, 05:29:02 PM »

last time I taped particle, I was the only one taping AUD, 4 people patched from the board........my copy is the only one curculating.........make us mic tapers proud!

Brian Skalinder · « **Reply #31 on:** May 01, 2003, 03:19:51 PM »

Quote from: jlykos on April 30, 2003, 03:39:47 PM

Ummmm, everything? No song structure, or even songs for that matter. Flaccid, uninspired "jamming." Noodling and pyrotechnics instead of thoughtful musical passages. Lame, pandering crowd exhortations and theme lyrics. Most importantly, no sense of musical direction whatsoever.

Your comment reminds me of an old 1974 Santana/John McLaughlin recording. Some heavy duty jazz-rock fusion going on, and McLaughlin is noodling around all over the place, and I mean ALL over the place, seemingly lost in the noodling. But then, every so often, Santana chimes in with a few choice notes - THE choice notes - as if to say: "Here, John, these are the notes you're looking for."

I can't help but laugh whenever I go back and listen to that old recording.

shmurg · « **Reply #32 on:** May 19, 2003, 01:15:49 AM »

Does running the MP-2 defeat the purpose of the Mod for the SBM-1? Just asking, my set up was just going to be nak's into a modded sbm-1. Do I need to put a beyer MV-100pre before to get beter results?

shmurg@yahoo.com

DaryanLenz · « **Reply #33 on:** May 19, 2003, 01:21:58 AM »

NO, running the mp2 lower with the modsbm higher is what most would reccomend for you to do. The mods are for the analog input stage, so by running analog out of the mp-2 into the analog in of the modsbm, the analog stage is effected and improved. Running a pre in front of an a/d is a very common practice, as both will effect the sound that you are hearing. The stock sbm-1 is crap BTW, and I would most certainly reccomend the mods being done if you have one. That said, this combo was quite common until the v3/mme appeared, and you should be able to find bunches of samples with this lineage on archive or other download portals. My opinion...a darker tape will be made that should be fairly pleasing to the ears. What mics BTW?

Daryan

DaryanLenz · « **Reply #34 on:** May 19, 2003, 01:26:07 AM »

Oops, forgot to mention...the beyer mv100 is not one of m y favorite pres and sounds very thin to me. The mp-2 is transformer based though, so the sound when comparing the two will be very very different. Both units can be picked up pretty cheaply these days though!

Daryan

shmurg · « **Reply #35 on:** May 19, 2003, 02:06:56 AM »

I would be running naks...that change things...they are already a bit higher end in sound.

DaryanLenz · « **Reply #36 on:** May 19, 2003, 02:37:44 AM »

Clarify higher end...meaning an emphasis on the high's?
If so, the mp-2 mioght gfive you better bass response...

Daryan

Author Topic: Advice on Running MP-2>Mod SBM-1 (Read 13327 times)

Jason B

Todd R

DaryanLenz

Jason B

DaryanLenz

Jason B

Jason B

Jason B

Jason B

DaryanLenz

DaryanLenz

DaryanLenz