Topic: rec me a basic 4-channel recorder

[jerryfreak]

friend promotes bands at a bar and has km140>v2. hes looking for a basic 4 channel for board+mics. when i had my dr680 for sale he said that was too much so im guessing his budget is upper twos to lower threes... hes not opposed to used gear if you could rec a model that shows up occasionally

[F.O.Bean]

Tascam DR2D!!! They can be found for around $100 on sale. I'd say if he waits til around the holidays, they'd be that cheap again

[shoestringconcerts]

Yes I have 3 DR2d's and I used them for exactly this purpose. 
I have a DR2d missing the battery cover that I would sell for $100. 

I am purchasing an 8 Channel recording and simply wont need 3 dr2d's anymore

email shoestringconcerts@gmail.com

[F.O.Bean]

Yes I have 3 DR2d's and I used them for exactly this purpose. 
I have a DR2d missing the battery cover that I would sell for $100. 

I am purchasing an 8 Channel recording and simply wont need 3 dr2d's anymore

email shoestringconcerts@gmail.com

Which recorder are you going to get? My guess is the Tascam DR680

[jerryfreak]

so the 'dual recording feature' seems weird. do you have real level metering on both pirs of channels? i assume you run it line an and mic in at the same time. the tascam page says board+ built in mics but im assuming mic in takes the plcae of built in mics

how does this sound (say relative to a PCM-M10 or R09-HR?)

[John Willett]

If the microphones are good Neumann mics like the KM140, then I would not go any lower than an Edirol R-44 or a Tascam DR-680 - spending less would be a waste of money.

If he wanted a cheaper recorder, he should never have got the KM140s and gone for cheaper mics - getting the KM140 he obviously wants quality - and that means the R-44 or DR-680 as being the very cheapest options that could possibly do the microphones justice.

[adrianf74]

@Bean: Where are you expecting to see the Tascam DR-2D "on sale" for $100 again?  That was a blow-out last fall and since then, there is a demand for the few "new" units that still float around (most places are asking $170+ for it -- if you're lucky).  If I could find a TARDIS or DeLorean, I'd be rich! 

@Jerryfreak:  There is no quick solution here.  If your friend is stuck on a certain budget, he's not going to get what is "IDEAL" and it won't be easy.  As John has mentioned, the R-44 or 680 are probably the best go to's if you want to stay true to XLR with low self-noise.  The DR-2D is 2x 1/8" which might work but they're harder to come by since the product was discontinued and if I was running the mics John alluded to, I wouldn't be considering the 2D for a hot second.  There's also the Roland R-26 (XLR with 1/8" input) which will cost MORE than a used 680.

Finally, there's also the ZOOM H6 with two pairs of XLR inputs PLUS the option to add 2 more but the noise floor on this thing isn't that great from what I've read online.  If I was forking out $400 for the H6, I'd be grabbing a 680.  I know the $430 new 680's also require a TARDIS or DeLorean so used might be the only option right now.    There are some people running the H6 on here and love it; I just don't think it's for me and I think there might be better options.

Somebody told me to buy nice or buy twice... I'd convince your friend to just get what works the BEST for him even if it costs a little more scratch. 

[Gutbucket]

The better arguments against the DR2d are not sound quality* but its 1/8" inputs, lack of phantom power, limited adjustability and inability to accommodate very hot inputs and no multichannel playback capability.  The Dual feature works fine, writing two stereo files.  Although you can't see both simultaneously, you can switch between visually metering levels of both input pairs, however you can not switch the headphone/line-out monitoring (given that limitation, it's metering is far superior to that of the DR680 and even that of the R44). 

Sound wise, I feel the DR2d with an external preamp (the soundboard in this case?) is comparable to that of an M10, R44 or DR680.  I have no hesitation using high quality microphone with the DR2d as long as they get phantom and gain control elsewhere.   As long as those caveats are acceptable, IMO the expensive mics / cheap recorder argument doesn't hold water.

An R44 would be my first suggestion as the best all around basic 4-channel recorder but is well out of the price range.

*[edit- I'm sure the DR2d's noisefloor and dynamic range specs are nothing spectacular, but he won't need anything close to even 90dB of dynamic range to record bands using excellent mics in a bar anyway.  I'm satisfied using it with external preamps for 4 channel classical recordings with low ambient noise floors and large dynamic swings, which are far more of a challenge for the recorder]

[shoestringconcerts]

I am purchasing an 8 Channel recording and simply wont need 3 dr2d's anymore

email shoestringconcerts@gmail.com

Which recorder are you going to get? My guess is the Tascam DR680

Actually I am looking at the Zoom R16 (8 tracks) or a Jam Hub Tracker MT16 (16 tracks)

The DR680 is a nice unit but at that price point I want the ability to record more than 8 tracks.

[LikeASong]

The better arguments against the DR2d are not sound quality* but its 1/8" inputs, lack of phantom power, limited adjustability and inability to accommodate very hot inputs and no multichannel playback capability.  .. (...) ..  I have no hesitation using high quality microphone with the DR2d as long as they get phantom and gain control elsewhere.   As long as those caveats are acceptable, IMO the expensive mics / cheap recorder argument doesn't hold water.

I agree with this. Besides Zooms, that are widely regarded as really noisy and flimsy in several aspects, I would have no fear using expensive mics with "cheap" recorders. With a proper way to power the mics and control the gain, the recordings produced by a DR2D aren't worse than the ones produced by a DR680 or a R44... My 0'02€.

[404 Not Found]

In re. to a 4 or 6 track recorder, the Zoom H6 has been really good so far and is not a flimsy unit.  I do not use it every time I am recording and with the soon to be released add-on accessory for the 2 extra mic inputs, it makes for a good deal especially in noting it's size & price ($399).

I have run feeds from the board direct as well as running additional tracks through either my Sound Device MixPre-D and or my Shure FP33 prior to the Zoom inputs with great results.

As for my Roland R4, I have stopped using it completely.  (That's the R4 and not the R4Pro)

[John Willett]

As for my Roland R4, I have stopped using it completely.  (That's the R4 and not the R4Pro)

And it was the R-44 that was being suggested - cheaper than the R-4 Pro.

The original R-4 never excited me at all and the early versions had i/p 4 polarity-reversed (corrected in later units, I think, after I pointed this out to Roland).

But the R-44 and the new R-88 are nice machines for the price and a friend uses them for serious classical recording with expensive mics.

[2manyrocks]

I'm still trying to figure out how the OP can find 4 channels for $200-$300.  By the time one pays for a DR2d and a couple of 2 channel preamps, it's over budget.  The next price step from there is apparently the Zoom H6 at $399 and from there, maybe the Dr 680 if they put it back on sale for $429 sometime around Black Friday. 

[LikeASong]

I'm still trying to figure out how the OP can find 4 channels for $200-$300.  By the time one pays for a DR2d and a couple of 2 channel preamps, it's over budget.  The next price step from there is apparently the Zoom H6 at $399 and from there, maybe the Dr 680 if they put it back on sale for $429 sometime around Black Friday. 

If I'm reading correctly, I don't think the OP's friend needs a preamp, he already owns a KM-140 + Lunatec V2 combo. He just needs a 4ch recorder to pull some soundboard+mics recordings.

[H₂O]

You can get a used dr680 for $400 - why not go this route?

Or even sell the V2 and use the cash to buy a 680

Or sell the 140s and get some 184s, etc

10 years ago the cheapest 4 track options would run you around $5k - be happy with $400-500