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Gear / Technical Help => Remote Power => Topic started by: justink on October 12, 2017, 11:00:59 AM

Title: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: justink on October 12, 2017, 11:00:59 AM
What do we have in 2017?

does the charger matter at all?  or is it all in the battery itself? 

i figure any charger will charge, the only variable is how quickly.  so, i shouldn't need to upgrade my charger, just the battery itself, right?
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: rippleish20 on October 12, 2017, 11:46:07 AM
Panasonic Eneloop Pro
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: justink on October 12, 2017, 12:04:03 PM
Panasonic Eneloop Pro

Thought so.

Would an energizer charger work just fine with these?
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: GLouie on October 12, 2017, 02:19:02 PM
I think any of the Eneloop family is the gold standard for AA NiMHs. Some have a bit more power, but less cycles.

I also feel the charger makes a difference, dumb vs. smart. You can balance charge time, heat & cell life, and the charger should use the dV/dt charge sensing and be reliable at detecting end of charge.

Personally, I use a Maha-Powerex MH-C9000, although there are several others well thought of. My understanding is that the charge rate should optimally be about 0.5-1C, so a 2000mAh Eneloop should be charged at 1000mA-2000mA. I understand that this Maha undercharges slightly and does a tiny trickle charge after it says, "full," but never totally shuts off. You are supposed to remove the cells after an overnight charge & sit, I guess.
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: voltronic on October 12, 2017, 07:57:34 PM
I've been using the 2400 mAh Duracell Ion Core (https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00DP2U43I/ref=cm_cr_srp_d_pdt_img_top?ie=UTF8) for a few years, and they are excellent.  They are re-branded Eneloop XX's but cheaper and often found in supermarkets and drugstores.

Here is testing (https://www.amazon.com/review/R5USCMSI5N7I7/ref=cm_cr_pr_perm) showing that these are the same as Eneloop XX.
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: justink on October 12, 2017, 09:48:30 PM
I've been using the 2400 mAh Duracell Ion Core (https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00DP2U43I/ref=cm_cr_srp_d_pdt_img_top?ie=UTF8) for a few years, and they are excellent.  They are re-branded Eneloop XX's but cheaper and often found in supermarkets and drugstores.

Here is testing (https://www.amazon.com/review/R5USCMSI5N7I7/ref=cm_cr_pr_perm) showing that these are the same as Eneloop XX.

Interesting. I have to double check but I think this is what I bought last time. (Those Duracell’s)
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: willndmb on October 21, 2017, 08:20:49 PM
I use Duracell and Eneloop
Both work fine, both work in each other's charger fine.
I actually think I get much better run times on my m10 with the Duracell, granted they are slightly more powerful but the difference in run time seems like it's not equal
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: fanofjam on October 27, 2017, 05:41:29 PM
My opinion...batteries are sorta like mic capsules...different designs for different situations.  So IMHO, there's no right answer.

I think it's more important to focus on the technical specs of the battery, which mainly consists of the battery chemistry and capacity...than the brand name.  Then apply those specs to your specific piece of gear.  It's not always intuitively obvious what the specs should be, just like it's not always intuitively obvious which mic capsules would work best when you walk into a venue.

Lots of people are calling out Eneloops, but most of the Eneloop designs are low discharge...which means that they'll hold their charge of a long period of time.  But low discharge batteries also have disadvantages...I can't remember off the top what the down side of the low discharge battery is...seems like it's higher internal resistance. 

Google battery university and spend two or three hours there and you'll learn alot. 
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: rippleish20 on November 01, 2017, 11:23:35 PM
https://wavreport.com/2017/05/21/review-ikea-rechargeable-batteries/
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: voltronic on November 02, 2017, 08:07:49 PM
https://wavreport.com/2017/05/21/review-ikea-rechargeable-batteries/

That's awesome!  Now that my Duracells are showing signs of fatigue, I'm going to try these next.  Have you tried them yourself?  If so, what charger do you like with them?
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: rippleish20 on November 03, 2017, 12:27:51 AM
https://wavreport.com/2017/05/21/review-ikea-rechargeable-batteries/

That's awesome!  Now that my Duracells are showing signs of fatigue, I'm going to try these next.  Have you tried them yourself?  If so, what charger do you like with them?

I havent tried them yet nut Im going to.
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: dactylus on November 04, 2017, 11:20:14 AM
https://wavreport.com/2017/05/21/review-ikea-rechargeable-batteries/

+T
Thanks for posting this.  I'm going to give these a try.
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: fanofjam on November 04, 2017, 09:33:12 PM
https://wavreport.com/2017/05/21/review-ikea-rechargeable-batteries/

Holy moly.  Thanks for the tip.  For anyone in the Atlanta area, they have the four packs of both AA (2450mah) and AAA (900mah) for only $3.99 a pack!!  I picked up eight packs. 
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: eman on November 15, 2017, 01:42:28 PM
I got the Powerex charger and it works great, once I figured out the programming sequence. The trouble with our hobby is that if you run one show the batteries are far from discharged so it is hard to get them fully charged again. The Powerex will discharge then recharge to capacity. It also analyzes to tell you your batteries are shot, which a lot of them were. I use the shot ones for remotes which don't need a lot of juice and not such a critical function. You can set the charge/discharge rate low or high, depending on how urgent your need is. If you have plenty of time, you can do a nice slow charge which for me is every time pretty much. I don't know how accurate it is, but it also estimates how many mAh each battery has when you are done charging. Definitely a huge improvement on the cheapo hardware store models which operate on a timer and wear out your batteries prematurely, overheating them. Worth the investment.
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: justink on November 15, 2017, 11:18:12 PM
I got the Powerex charger and it works great, once I figured out the programming sequence. The trouble with our hobby is that if you run one show the batteries are far from discharged so it is hard to get them fully charged again. The Powerex will discharge then recharge to capacity. It also analyzes to tell you your batteries are shot, which a lot of them were. I use the shot ones for remotes which don't need a lot of juice and not such a critical function. You can set the charge/discharge rate low or high, depending on how urgent your need is. If you have plenty of time, you can do a nice slow charge which for me is every time pretty much. I don't know how accurate it is, but it also estimates how many mAh each battery has when you are done charging. Definitely a huge improvement on the cheapo hardware store models which operate on a timer and wear out your batteries prematurely, overheating them. Worth the investment.

sounds cool.  got a link?  thanks.
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: justink on November 15, 2017, 11:21:40 PM
these look like they might be eneloop cells like the ikea batts too.

https://www.amazon.com/Tattu-Rechargeable-Flashlight-Alarm-Clocks-Toothbrushes/dp/B01N1ZX5MT/ref=sr_1_20_sspa?ie=UTF8&qid=1510805921&sr=8-20-spons&keywords=powerex+charger&psc=1
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: dactylus on November 21, 2017, 10:33:00 AM
^
Did you notice this HUGE gaffe in the packaging of those TATTU batteries?  Somebody in their marketing department should have been canned. 

"NOTICE: "+" "-" on the TATTU Logo do not represent the polar ends"
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: fanofjam on November 21, 2017, 11:07:37 PM

^
Did you notice this HUGE gaffe in the packaging of those TATTU batteries?  Somebody in their marketing department should have been canned. 

"NOTICE: "+" "-" on TATTU Logo not represent the polar ends"

Good eye.  That's certainly an interesting mistake for a battery manufacturer to make.  I hope there aren't people considering using TATTU rechargeables to power their heart pacemaker.  LOL.
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: BlindGuyEars on November 24, 2017, 12:14:55 PM
I don't know how typical this is, but I just left my Sony M10 running, recording 24-bit 48kHz to internal memory then a 16 GB card, with fully charged Maha/Powerex AA's, and it captured an amazing 19 hours one minute of audio. I'm impressed. (about to put my M10 and CA-9100 pre in the for sale section here. Going D:vice to iPhone)
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: ts on February 26, 2018, 07:38:58 AM
these look like they might be eneloop cells like the ikea batts too.

https://www.amazon.com/Tattu-Rechargeable-Flashlight-Alarm-Clocks-Toothbrushes/dp/B01N1ZX5MT/ref=sr_1_20_sspa?ie=UTF8&qid=1510805921&sr=8-20-spons&keywords=powerex+charger&psc=1

Would be awesome if these are the same. IKEA is 2 hours away from me and these are about the same price.
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: Gutbucket on February 26, 2018, 10:04:36 AM
Powerex low-self-discharge and Eneloop batteries seem pretty much equivalent based on my own use, and also from the research I've done each time I've replaced them (about 3 times in 10 years).  So I'm still using the Powerex  AAs, AAAs, and 9.6Vs with the Powerex chargers (the 9.6V charger is specific to that battery,  the four-bay  AA/AAA charger is their top multi-function model others here are using).  I have Eneloops at work for our digital cameras. 

Independent circuits for each battery, and "smart-charging" routine instead of a dumb timer-based routine are the most important features to have in a charger.

The more advanced features are nice for determining the actual battery capacity (useful for matching cells in pairs, and in determining end of life), "forming" new cells for maximum performance, and, "restoring" older cells for a second life in other non-critical applications.

 
I got the Powerex charger and it works great, once I figured out the programming sequence. The trouble with our hobby is that if you run one show the batteries are far from discharged so it is hard to get them fully charged again. The Powerex will discharge then recharge to capacity. It also analyzes to tell you your batteries are shot, which a lot of them were. I use the shot ones for remotes which don't need a lot of juice and not such a critical function. You can set the charge/discharge rate low or high, depending on how urgent your need is. If you have plenty of time, you can do a nice slow charge which for me is every time pretty much. I don't know how accurate it is, but it also estimates how many mAh each battery has when you are done charging. Definitely a huge improvement on the cheapo hardware store models which operate on a timer and wear out your batteries prematurely, overheating them. Worth the investment.
^
Although this is/was important with old NiCad rechargeables, you don't really need to do this with NiMH batteries in a quality "smart" charger.   NiMH + "smart charging" doesn't have "memory effect" in the same way when only partially drained and recharged.  Using a "smart charger" you can safely fully recharge from an only somewhat discharged state without damage or ill effect.  This is my standard procedure and I get full capacity from the NiMH batteries.  Run the "re-fresh routine" on the Maha charger every 6-months to year or so which does a full automated charge-discharge-recharge cycle and reports true-remaining-capacity.  That provides good lifetime monitoring and reassurance.   The "initial forming routine" does the same but via multiple charge/discharge cycles.  That can take a few days to complete depending on how you set it, and thus is best reserved for brand-new or revival and assessment of end-of life batteries for use in lesser roles.
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: justink on March 29, 2018, 06:28:14 AM
Amazon has a deal on eneloops today. I picked up one of these.

https://smile.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00MIJU7AE/ref=mp_s_a_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1522317833&sr=1-3&pi=AC_SX236_SY340_QL65&dpPl=1&dpID=514JOGA-FUL&ref=plSrch
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: TheMetalist on March 29, 2018, 07:35:06 AM
Amazon has a deal on eneloops today. I picked up one of these.

https://smile.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00MIJU7AE/ref=mp_s_a_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1522317833&sr=1-3&pi=AC_SX236_SY340_QL65&dpPl=1&dpID=514JOGA-FUL&ref=plSrch

Thanks for the heads up! Great deal. Too bad I'm in Sweden. The shipping cost is more than the deal itself. Not to forget the import charges that will be added as well. :banging head:
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: seethreepo on March 29, 2018, 06:55:10 PM
Amazon has a deal on eneloops today. I picked up one of these.

https://smile.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00MIJU7AE/ref=mp_s_a_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1522317833&sr=1-3&pi=AC_SX236_SY340_QL65&dpPl=1&dpID=514JOGA-FUL&ref=plSrch

Thanks for the heads up! Great deal. Too bad I'm in Sweden. The shipping cost is more than the deal itself. Not to forget the import charges that will be added as well. :banging head:
https://wavreport.com/2017/05/21/review-ikea-rechargeable-batteries/   <--- IKEA & Sweden for the win
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: justink on March 29, 2018, 07:40:31 PM
Amazon has a deal on eneloops today. I picked up one of these.

https://smile.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00MIJU7AE/ref=mp_s_a_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1522317833&sr=1-3&pi=AC_SX236_SY340_QL65&dpPl=1&dpID=514JOGA-FUL&ref=plSrch

Thanks for the heads up! Great deal. Too bad I'm in Sweden. The shipping cost is more than the deal itself. Not to forget the import charges that will be added as well. :banging head:
https://wavreport.com/2017/05/21/review-ikea-rechargeable-batteries/   <--- IKEA & Sweden for the win

yeah, if i ever get to ikea again, i'm going to pick up a bunch of these.  problem is that they only offer them instore/not online.  and Ikea is a pain in the ass to get to in Houston.  not worth the special trip just to pick up batteries.    this deal on amazon on the eneloops is pretty good though.
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: johnmuge on January 14, 2019, 03:06:25 PM
Looks like Ikea is shipping these now for $9 for as many packs as you want.
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: ycoop on January 14, 2019, 06:04:35 PM
Looks like Ikea is shipping these now for $9 for as many packs as you want.

Tried to order 2 4 packs and it tells me shipping will be $99. Other option is to order and pick in store.
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: johnmuge on January 14, 2019, 07:14:22 PM
That's strange, I checked shipping them to Florida or Connecticut and it came up $9 no matter what the quantity was.  :shrug:
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: EmRR on January 19, 2019, 12:00:24 AM
I'm seeing $9 for NC.
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: dactylus on January 21, 2019, 09:10:04 AM


$9 for MN.
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: EmRR on January 21, 2019, 09:45:26 AM
Charger....

any comments on the Ikea charger (https://www.ikea.com/us/en/catalog/products/00303648/)?  Looks 'mid-grade' in price.  Very long charge time, assume better for batteries.  12 hrs for 2450mAh. 

Looked at the Powerex, thanks for mentioning Gutbucket.  I see a couple of price tiers, including one with batteries included.  Any thought on Powerex battery value?  I see 2600 and 2700 mAh types. 

with batteries (https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1393449-REG/powerex_mh_c800s8aapro_mh_c800s_with_8_powerex.html/?ap=y&gclid=Cj0KCQiA-JXiBRCpARIsAGqF8wUetPGbPqpBuTWyxDy1-tkxw_h5Po56DQVBs5OBf73NZVp3QwLIBoUaAh0FEALw_wcB&lsft=BI%3A514&smp=Y)

no batteries, more $, similar charging times (https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/883785-REG/Powerex_MH_C800S_8_Cell_Smart_Charger.html/?ap=y&gclid=Cj0KCQiA-JXiBRCpARIsAGqF8wUNSdHyQ6PzUDXtz6I2FeeFLzQX_xtmnmVuXrivkDPuQazUOLzII6IaAsJGEALw_wcB&lsft=BI%3A514&smp=Y)


Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: TheMetalist on January 21, 2019, 02:25:04 PM
Anyone knows if the Powerex (or some similar charger) is available on the European market? Can't find it.  :-[
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: mjwin on January 21, 2019, 02:54:13 PM
Anyone knows if the Powerex (or some similar charger) is available on the European market? Can't find it.  :-[
I got mine from www.mahaenergy.co.uk which is operated by Nevada Radio in the UK. They are the official dealers for MAHA/Powerex & are a long established business also selling amateur radio gear etc.  I'd recommend them.
The MHC9000 is all the charger you'll ever need. It's  a bit bulky for a 4AA charger, but will analyze/test each cell so that you know they're good.  MAHA also do a less complex 8AA version.
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: TheMetalist on January 21, 2019, 03:07:47 PM
Anyone knows if the Powerex (or some similar charger) is available on the European market? Can't find it.  :-[
I got mine from www.mahaenergy.co.uk which is operated by Nevada Radio in the UK. They are the official dealers for MAHA/Powerex & are a long established business also selling amateur radio gear etc.  I'd recommend them.
The MHC9000 is all the charger you'll ever need. It's  a bit bulky for a 4AA charger, but will analyze/test each cell so that you know they're good.  MAHA also do a less complex 8AA version.

Thank you!  :cheers:
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: Sebastian on January 22, 2019, 03:59:16 AM
Order from the UK while you still can!  :banging head:
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: Gutbucket on January 22, 2019, 05:05:22 PM
Charger....

any comments on the Ikea charger (https://www.ikea.com/us/en/catalog/products/00303648/)?  Looks 'mid-grade' in price.  Very long charge time, assume better for batteries.  12 hrs for 2450mAh. 

Looked at the Powerex, thanks for mentioning Gutbucket.  I see a couple of price tiers, including one with batteries included.  Any thought on Powerex battery value?  I see 2600 and 2700 mAh types. 

with batteries (https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1393449-REG/powerex_mh_c800s8aapro_mh_c800s_with_8_powerex.html/?ap=y&gclid=Cj0KCQiA-JXiBRCpARIsAGqF8wUetPGbPqpBuTWyxDy1-tkxw_h5Po56DQVBs5OBf73NZVp3QwLIBoUaAh0FEALw_wcB&lsft=BI%3A514&smp=Y)

no batteries, more $, similar charging times (https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/883785-REG/Powerex_MH_C800S_8_Cell_Smart_Charger.html/?ap=y&gclid=Cj0KCQiA-JXiBRCpARIsAGqF8wUNSdHyQ6PzUDXtz6I2FeeFLzQX_xtmnmVuXrivkDPuQazUOLzII6IaAsJGEALw_wcB&lsft=BI%3A514&smp=Y)

I've been using the Powerex low self discharge (black) AA's and 9.6V's and have no problems with them.  Last I checked, a few years back when I last replaced them, they were on-par with Eneloop.  We use Eneloop at work for cameras and when I've used those for recording their performance seemed about equal.

When I bought the charger maybe 8 years ago or so, the Maha MHC900 and the Lacrosse Technologies charger were the fully "smart" chargers that set the bar.  Either of which I figured was a good investment to extend useful life of the batteries as much as possible and to monitor them to confirm when it's time to retire them prior to failure.

I've purchased my batteries and chargers from Thomasdistributing.com and can recommend them for good service.  Upon my contacting them about a decade ago concerning an earlier model non-low-self-discharge 9.6V which had swelled up a number of months into use, they immediately volunteered to replace it without a return.
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: Gutbucket on January 22, 2019, 05:09:25 PM
BTW, I highly recommend the low-self-discharge (LSD) version of any NiMH AA, AAA, or 9V over the standard version of the same.  The minor reduction in capacity in comparison to non-LSD types is well worth the increased charge retention, reliability, and longevity.
Title: Re: AA Batteries? What's the best rechargeables?
Post by: EmRR on January 22, 2019, 05:48:29 PM
BTW, I highly recommend the low-self-discharge (LSD) version of any NiMH AA, AAA, or 9V over the standard version of the same.  The minor reduction in capacity in comparison to non-LSD types is well worth the increased charge retention, reliability, and longevity.

Good to know, thanks.  More reading to do....