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Gear / Technical Help => Recording Gear => Topic started by: IronFilm on January 25, 2018, 06:10:39 AM

Title: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: IronFilm on January 25, 2018, 06:10:39 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iFLRRzhxvog (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iFLRRzhxvog)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OrV9yf_KkcU (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OrV9yf_KkcU)


Key Features:
Available for US$199:
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1385361-REG/zoom_zf1lp_zoom_f1_field_recorder.html (https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1385361-REG/zoom_zf1lp_zoom_f1_field_recorder.html)

Or for US$249 with shotgun module:
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1385362-REG/zoom_zf1sp_f1_field_recorder_with.html (https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1385362-REG/zoom_zf1sp_f1_field_recorder_with.html)

Manual and Quick Guide:

https://www.zoom.co.jp/sites/default/files/products/downloads/pdfs/E_F1.pdf (https://www.zoom.co.jp/sites/default/files/products/downloads/pdfs/E_F1.pdf)
https://www.zoom.co.jp/sites/default/files/products/downloads/pdfs/E_F1_QuickGuide.pdf (https://www.zoom.co.jp/sites/default/files/products/downloads/pdfs/E_F1_QuickGuide.pdf)
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: heathen on January 25, 2018, 08:44:19 AM
Looks like the only adjustments for line in level are "Lo-, Lo, Mid-, Mid, Mid+, Hi-, Hi, Hi+, Hi++ or AUTO."
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: IronFilm on January 25, 2018, 10:57:10 AM
I guess when you're putting a lav on a person and you can't monitor it during the film scene, welllll... you can't do better than a vague guess at the levels. So who needs more detail than that?! :-/

One of the reasons it is a damn pity there is no option for dual safety track recording like the Tascam DR10L / DR10CS have. Hopefully Zoom will very quickly bring out a firmware update to fix this oversight (assuming this can be fixed by firmware, and isn't a hardware issue).
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: Chromenose on February 11, 2018, 03:58:19 PM
I've read another tread about this onze but can't find it anymore. Unboxing etc and  some Nice information??

Rob
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: heathen on February 11, 2018, 06:53:40 PM
I've read another tread about this onze but can't find it anymore. Unboxing etc and  some Nice information??

Rob
I don't see it either.  It would be a shame if it got deleted because there was some good info and photos in that thread.
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: Fatah Ruark (aka MIKE B) on February 11, 2018, 08:25:35 PM
I checked this out at B+H the other day. Construction seemed a little weak (but since it's mostly plastic maybe it won't set of metal detectors).

And the salesperson said you can only record in mono...but I guess this might be handy for super stealth where mono is better than nothing.

I forgot to ask, but it did look like you could remove the "belt clips" so it would probably be easier to slide into a pocket then.
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: heathen on February 11, 2018, 08:28:53 PM
And the salesperson said you can only record in mono

Based on the (now deleted) other thread I think this is incorrect.
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: heathen on February 11, 2018, 08:33:33 PM
If anyone needs any info or has questions, please feel free to PM me anytime.
If you could repost some of the info and pictures in this thread that would be great...if nothing else it could be a great resource for anyone considering this deck.  First-hand experience is very valuable!
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: obsidian on February 11, 2018, 11:54:28 PM
If anyone needs any info or has questions, please feel free to PM me anytime.
If you could repost some of the info and pictures in this thread that would be great...if nothing else it could be a great resource for anyone considering this deck.  First-hand experience is very valuable!

Sure thing.

http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=185390


Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: Sebastian on February 12, 2018, 02:31:58 AM
Sadly, I deleted the thread. I put a lot of information and pictures in the post and was trying to help people make a sound buying decision, but it was becoming overwhelmed with non-related and inaccurate guesses by one poster who then decided to make comments about "Americans". I don't support hatred and negative behavior so I deleted the thread. Sorry. If anyone needs any info or has questions, please feel free to PM me anytime.

Sadly, that is a lie. Usually I try not to feed the trolls, but I feel that I need to rectify some of these accusations you made.

Those "guesses" by me and other people were merely questions which you chose to dispose as "false claims". When comparing sizes of different recorders, you chose to ignore the F1's thickness in order to make it appear smaller than it is. When this was pointed out to you, you took your ball and went home.

The comment about "Americans" made by me was a tease about imperial units of measurement. While customary in the US, no one outside of the US understands those and I made a joke about that. Never was there any "hatred" involved. In fact, I love your country (except for the imperial system)! ;-)

Please stop behaving like an 8 year old. And thanks for the pictures and the info you provided.
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: 2manyrocks on February 12, 2018, 08:17:59 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QJVhH5WQ6es  FWIW, a review which goes into  detail about the menus, etc.  Linked for whatever useful info it may contain and opinions may vary. 

It seems to me that Zoom has positioned this as an alternative to the Tascam lav recorder at the same MSRP.  The Tascam lav is seen as a bargain by some DSLR shooters compared to the cost of wireless lavs and doesn't have the risk of wireless dropouts.   



 
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: obsidian on February 12, 2018, 10:40:21 AM
When comparing sizes of different recorders, you chose to ignore the F1's thickness in order to make it appear smaller than it is.

... and just how did I make something "appear smaller" when I showed several pictures of it. I even mentioned, more than once, that it is in fact "thicker". What would I have to gain in this by making something "appear smaller"??? I don't work for Zoom or have stock in them ... I'm just reporting my opinions.
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: IronFilm on February 14, 2018, 12:32:07 AM
And the salesperson said you can only record in mono

Based on the (now deleted) other thread I think this is incorrect.

Why did a thread get deleted?!
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: Fatah Ruark (aka MIKE B) on February 14, 2018, 12:53:10 PM
And the salesperson said you can only record in mono

Based on the (now deleted) other thread I think this is incorrect.

I checked the B+H page and you are correct. It says it records in stereo.

Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: heathen on March 01, 2018, 05:40:09 PM
Pretty in-depth look at the F1 here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QJVhH5WQ6es
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: Ozpeter on March 03, 2018, 09:26:11 PM
Looking at the features and the overall user interface, this looks rather like a Zoom H1N repackaged for a different use case.
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: IronFilm on March 05, 2018, 12:57:53 AM
Well that fact it is branded as "F series" is meant to indicate it has a bit more processing power behind it than say an H1 would. So perhaps future firmware updates might bring good news?

But while it lacks TC, it doesn't really seem worthy of the "F series" naming in my eyes.
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: Ozpeter on March 05, 2018, 09:25:58 AM
What I  mean is, the key features it shares with the H1N (not the original H1, the new one) are as follows -

    Two-channel audio recorder
    Supports up to 24-bit/96 kHz audio
    Broadcast WAV format (BWF)—files are automatically time-stamped
    1.25" monochromatic LCD display can be read under bright light
    Stereo 1/8" mic/line input jack with plug-in power (2.5V)
    Stereo 1/8" phone/line output jack with dedicated volume control
    Built-in limiter and auto level control to avoid clipping
    Low-cut filter
    Pre-Record function
    Tone generator for calibrating audio levels between the F1 and a camera
    Sound marker function outputs quick tone for syncing audio and video
    Micro-USB port for data exchange to and from computer
    Use as an audio interface to record directly to your computer or iOS device
    Runs on two standard AAA alkaline, Lithium, or NiMH rechargeable batteries, or AD-17 AC adapter (available separately)
    Up to 10 hours of operation with alkaline batteries (when using lavalier)

Card capacity and recording formats are also identical.

Features unique to the F1 are all related to the physical design -

    Includes windscreen, belt clip, mic clip
    Includes LMF-1 omnidirectional lavalier microphone
    Lightweight and low-profile design—attaches to belts and waistbands, or fits inside pockets without being seen
    Compatible with all Zoom microphone capsules

Now whether the audio internals are significantly different I can't tell from the available specs, but they may well have simply used the H1N internals lock stock and barrel to minimise production costs.  If so, you are paying a fair bit extra for the form factor - which of course may well be something you value.
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: Psinka on March 29, 2018, 02:56:37 AM
Got mine F1-LP couple days ago  ;D
It's damn small!!! Will test it tomorrow on gig with AT943  >:D
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: heathen on March 29, 2018, 11:01:56 AM
Got mine F1-LP couple days ago  ;D
It's damn small!!! Will test it tomorrow on gig with AT943  >:D
I'm looking forward to more first-hand information about this thing. Just out of curiosity, are you running the 943s straight into the F1, or will you be using some kind of battery box or preamp?
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: dallman on March 29, 2018, 12:44:07 PM
Got mine F1-LP couple days ago  ;D
It's damn small!!! Will test it tomorrow on gig with AT943  >:D
I'm looking forward to more first-hand information about this thing. Just out of curiosity, are you running the 943s straight into the F1, or will you be using some kind of battery box or preamp?
I like the deck a great deal. And while I see it for me primarily in a low pro situation, I recently had a chance to see it and use it out in the open. It was really nice and easy to use. What I do not like, is that the gain adjustments are incremental and it cycles up and after the highest, goes back to the lowest. That said I can easily work around it now that open testing has given me a feel for it's abilities.
https://archive.org/details/um2018-03-17.akg481.flac16 (https://archive.org/details/um2018-03-17.akg481.flac16)
As for running mics in without a preamp or battery box, the deck supplies 2.5v of plug in power. I'd always use some external powering, as I would on any PIP deck.
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: heathen on March 29, 2018, 12:52:27 PM
https://archive.org/details/um2018-03-17.akg481.flac16 (https://archive.org/details/um2018-03-17.akg481.flac16)
Thanks for the link...I'm looking forward to listening to this.
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: Psinka on March 30, 2018, 10:31:02 AM
Got mine F1-LP couple days ago  ;D
It's damn small!!! Will test it tomorrow on gig with AT943  >:D
I'm looking forward to more first-hand information about this thing. Just out of curiosity, are you running the 943s straight into the F1, or will you be using some kind of battery box or preamp?

It's not so important gig and i will use only F1 and AT943 without bbox or preamp.
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: heathen on March 30, 2018, 11:08:40 AM
It's not so important gig and i will use only F1 and AT943 without bbox or preamp.

Could you switch to using a BB/pre halfway through so there's a useful comp of how the F1 performs with/without BB/pre?
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: dactylus on March 30, 2018, 01:21:48 PM
Got mine F1-LP couple days ago  ;D
It's damn small!!! Will test it tomorrow on gig with AT943  >:D
I'm looking forward to more first-hand information about this thing. Just out of curiosity, are you running the 943s straight into the F1, or will you be using some kind of battery box or preamp?
I like the deck a great deal. And while I see it for me primarily in a low pro situation, I recently had a chance to see it and use it out in the open. It was really nice and easy to use. What I do not like, is that the gain adjustments are incremental and it cycles up and after the highest, goes back to the lowest. That said I can easily work around it now that open testing has given me a feel for it's abilities.
https://archive.org/details/um2018-03-17.akg481.flac16 (https://archive.org/details/um2018-03-17.akg481.flac16)
As for running mics in without a preamp or battery box, the deck supplies 2.5v of plug in power. I'd always use some external powering, as I would on any PIP deck.
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: Psinka on March 30, 2018, 05:21:38 PM
Could you switch to using a BB/pre halfway through so there's a useful comp of how the F1 performs with/without BB/pre?

Not this time :-(
My settings on F1 was 24/48 and reс level "norm". For At943 with 4.7k mod it's too low...
Unfortunately there was no other bands and i can't test settings on them.
Here small part of my record http://megamozg.us/F1.wav - added about 15db

In next 10 days i will go on another gig where i can test different settings with and without bbox.
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: HJD on March 30, 2018, 06:12:33 PM
This is a compelling little recorder, especially for use with a lavalier. I think I'm going to pick one up :) I like that it works with Zoom's different microphone capsules and the XLR attachment. I just wish it were also capable of overdubbing as that would make it even more versatile and appealing to me. Oh well, I guess you can't have it all.
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: HJD on March 30, 2018, 07:37:59 PM
By the way, does anyone know if the F1 will record line level signals via the optional XLR/TRS module?
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: Psinka on March 31, 2018, 02:07:01 AM
By the way, does anyone know if the F1 will record line level signals via the optional XLR/TRS module?

According to Zoom's specification F1 compatible with all interchangeable modules
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: HJD on March 31, 2018, 07:35:10 AM
By the way, does anyone know if the F1 will record line level signals via the optional XLR/TRS module?

According to Zoom's specification F1 compatible with all interchangeable modules

Thanks for your reply Psinka!  :) Yes, that's what I understand as well. I asked because when I glanced through the F1 user manual I couldn't find anything about recording line level signals. I found the manual here: https://www.zoom-na.com/sites/default/files/products/downloads/pdfs/E_F1.pdf (https://www.zoom-na.com/sites/default/files/products/downloads/pdfs/E_F1.pdf)
I don't have much experience recording line level signals, but, as I understand it, on some recorders you have to choose between microphone or line level signals on a switch or in a menu while on others the XLR part of the combo jacks are microphone level while the TRS part is for line level. So perhaps by using the TRS input on Zoom XLR-module the F1 will record a line level signal? If anyone could confirm this I'd be glad to hear from you. Thanks in advance!  :)
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: farve4 on March 31, 2018, 08:37:38 AM
I shall be breaking mine in tonight when I see BOC
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: capnhook on March 31, 2018, 09:27:20 AM
Make great tapes man +T
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: earmonger on March 31, 2018, 02:07:24 PM
Zoom really should un-bundle the mics.
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: heathen on April 10, 2018, 12:34:10 AM
I decided to order one of these and give it a try first-hand.
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: crunchy on April 10, 2018, 01:21:56 PM
Looks like a cool little recorder. Would be awesome if someone made a PFA with KCY connector for the expansion module on the top. Talk about a tiny rig!
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: jefflester on April 10, 2018, 07:50:25 PM
Looks like a cool little recorder. Would be awesome if someone made a PFA with KCY connector for the expansion module on the top. Talk about a tiny rig!
The extension module doesn't supply phantom.
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: heathen on April 19, 2018, 10:13:49 PM
Just received the F1 today.  I should be able to test it out at a show soon, but for now here's some photos to show the size of it compared to the Roland R-05 and the CA9200.  If the F1 works out and I decide to keep it, I may dremel off the rails to make it even smaller.  Even with those rails, though, the thing is tiny.

(Gold star to anyone who can identify what these things are resting on.)
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: heathen on April 22, 2018, 01:12:58 PM
Comp of the F1 and Roland R-05 here: http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=186178.0
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: florian.ardelean on April 23, 2018, 06:58:48 AM
Really not as tiny as I'd like. Remember the SONY MZ-RH1? Released 12 YEARS ago (!) That was MINUSCULE by comparison and I'll bet good money it still sounds better than any "small" handheld portable recorder today.

What baffles me is why SONY never made a SD or microSD version in the same format factor, they could have fit an enormous LI-ION battery instead of the MD.
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: dallman on April 23, 2018, 11:05:26 AM
Really not as tiny as I'd like. Remember the SONY MZ-RH1? Released 12 YEARS ago (!) That was MINUSCULE by comparison and I'll bet good money it still sounds better than any "small" handheld portable recorder today.

What baffles me is why SONY never made a SD or microSD version in the same format factor, they could have fit an enormous LI-ION battery instead of the MD.

Other than the guide rails, the Zoom is smaller.

Zoom F1:   2.5 x 1.3 x 3.1" (W x H x D)

SONY MZ-RH1: 3.45 x 0.68 x 3.45 inches (W x H x D)

The Zoom has an easy to read screen too. My only complaint is the gain control which only goes up in a circular loop and then goes from highest gain back to lowest and the loop starts over. Not sure what they were thinking with that bit of firmware.
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: checht on April 23, 2018, 12:03:50 PM

Zoom F1:   2.5 x 1.3 x 3.1" (W x H x D)


Don't you mean W x D x H?
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: florian.ardelean on April 23, 2018, 12:05:52 PM
Then it really is tiny. Can't really tell from the pictures, it just looks so... bulky!
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: heathen on April 23, 2018, 12:19:37 PM
Then it really is tiny. Can't really tell from the pictures, it just looks so... bulky!

Trust me, even with the rails it is tiny.  Even having read about it and seen pictures online, I was still surprised by the size when I opened up the package.
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: dallman on April 23, 2018, 12:21:07 PM

Zoom F1:   2.5 x 1.3 x 3.1" (W x H x D)


Don't you mean W x D x H?
No, My arranged order is different but accurate as posted. I rearranged the order on Zoom as its as listed to show the 2 devices in the same order. You can check the Zoom on B and H and the SONY on Amazon. However it appears they measured the Zoom laying down so to speak.

Here is the exact paste from B and H on the Zoom:
Dimensions (W x D x H)   2.5 x 3.1 x 1.3" /
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: spyder9 on April 24, 2018, 09:55:59 PM
Has anyone attempted to remove the rails yet?
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: heathen on April 25, 2018, 09:34:00 AM
Has anyone attempted to remove the rails yet?
I probably will.  If I do I'll certainly post here about it.
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: lsd2525 on April 25, 2018, 10:13:26 AM
Has anyone attempted to remove the rails yet?
I probably will.  If I do I'll certainly post here about it.

I've gone off the rails a few times
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: heathen on April 26, 2018, 03:13:59 PM
I don't remember if it's been brought up yet, but I asked Zoom how much plug in power the F1 provides and was told it's 2.5V.
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: thebeaker on May 25, 2018, 01:43:00 AM
Hi, I am plannig to get a new recorder. Until now it is the IRiver h120 and because here in Germany it is hard to get gear in, so I don´t use a Batterybox.
So my CA11/14 stuff is working with just connected to Line-In in Iriver and I am able to record moderately loud rock shows with it.
Will it be also possible with ZoomF1 and its provided mic power?
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: thebeaker on May 27, 2018, 06:04:18 PM
Has anyone attempted to remove the rails yet?
I probably will.  If I do I'll certainly post here about it.

I've gone off the rails a few times

Did u try? :)
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: Ozpeter on June 02, 2018, 10:14:54 AM
At https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hi5x5Go4eIY there is a very intelligent review of the H1N, which I strongly suspect is the generally the same as the F1 but in a different case.  In the review and in the comments, the reviewer claims that below a certain point the input level knob switches from analog to digital attenuation.  This he says could mean that with loud sources, the analog stage could overload before the digital stage.  I wonder whether any users of the F1 have noticed anything like that?  (I realise that the stepped input level of the F1 could make it hard to determine this - analysis of noise at different input settings can sometimes reveal what is going on).
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: TimeBandit on November 09, 2018, 04:54:16 AM
Hi, I am plannig to get a new recorder. Until now it is the IRiver h120 and because here in Germany it is hard to get gear in, so I don´t use a Batterybox.
So my CA11/14 stuff is working with just connected to Line-In in Iriver and I am able to record moderately loud rock shows with it.
Will it be also possible with ZoomF1 and its provided mic power?


AFAIR you can use the Church Audio Mics with plugin Power, but their High SPL capability is just guaranted with the battery box / preamp.

Stumbled across the device today sorry for waking up that thread but with tiny battery box from church or sound profesionals this is the ideal  >:D device. It just looks like "this is my new casio g shock watch, nothin special"   ;D
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: Sebastian on November 09, 2018, 04:56:56 AM
because here in Germany it is hard to get gear in

You must be doing something wrong.
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: TimeBandit on November 09, 2018, 05:01:15 AM
indeed. even with the pcm-m10 i always handled this as a "cell phone" :D

but i will take na look at this one here. came across this today watching "Techmoan" on youtube and this was in the recommendations  :lol:
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: cleantone on December 05, 2018, 10:04:56 AM
Hey guys! I'm (for the first time ever) wanting to put together a stealthy rig. Cost effective as I'm not buying much gear these days. I had actually picked up the competing Tascam DR-10L for use in video work but it only records dual mono (safety gain). I later learned this Zoom unit can do stereo. Which got me thinking that perhaps it's a good stealth recorder. Reading through this looks promising. Now that it's been a while what were you all's findings? Battery box necessary for something like Church mics? In terms of rock concert volumes? I have some shows coming up in April that I am in the sweet spot for and can't open record. I also go to a fair amount of comedy shows and use my iPhone. Which is pretty good but mono. Any real world reviews of this for concert recording?
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: dallman on December 05, 2018, 12:19:27 PM
Hey guys! I'm (for the first time ever) wanting to put together a stealthy rig. Cost effective as I'm not buying much gear these days. I had actually picked up the competing Tascam DR-10L for use in video work but it only records dual mono (safety gain). I later learned this Zoom unit can do stereo. Which got me thinking that perhaps it's a good stealth recorder. Reading through this looks promising. Now that it's been a while what were you all's findings? Battery box necessary for something like Church mics? In terms of rock concert volumes? I have some shows coming up in April that I am in the sweet spot for and can't open record. I also go to a fair amount of comedy shows and use my iPhone. Which is pretty good but mono. Any real world reviews of this for concert recording?
On the plus side, it is small, easy to conceal and the pre-amps are good. I really like the recordings I get. As for a battery box, the F1 certainly does not supply any more PIP than a larger deck and while I do not know the voltage, I always use a small external pre-amp, so at the least I'd say yes to a battery box. Like all small decks you may (or may not) get away with skipping it, but to me the sound quality of the recording is noticeably worse.
My one peeve and this is a reason I favor the Roland R-07 and Marantz PMD 620, is the gain control. Gain is in fixed increments and can only be adjusted up. So, if you have it set too high at the start of a show, the only recourse is to go higher and higher until it goes lower. That means, depending on how fast you can press the gain button, some distortion then a bit of total silence then the gain you desire. So, a few seconds that take will require a bit of post work, adjusting of volumes and all to get to sound ok.
Title: Re: Zoom F1 recorder
Post by: cleantone on December 05, 2018, 01:35:09 PM
Thanks. I don't think I've ever seen that Roland R-07. That looks pretty interesting. Time to dive into research! The gain issue is definitely unappealing. Good tip!