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Gear / Technical Help => Recording Gear => Topic started by: larrysellers on May 30, 2018, 10:32:12 AM

Title: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: larrysellers on May 30, 2018, 10:32:12 AM
Previous threads:

http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=181803.0
http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=182278.0
http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=182573.0
http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=183580.0
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: larrysellers on May 30, 2018, 10:33:42 AM
2 recordings with the newest firmware (v2.20) and no issues.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: sos on May 31, 2018, 11:37:44 AM
A quick followup firmware, v. 2.21, has just been released:

http://cdn.sounddevices.com/download/guides/FRN-MixPreSeries-v221.pdf

All features relate to cue markers, only.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Gordon on May 31, 2018, 12:12:29 PM


All features relate to cue markers, only.

nope....

Fixed

For all models:
Windows 7 and 8 were not able to import or read MixPre .wav audio files.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: sos on May 31, 2018, 12:17:05 PM
I read/linked the wrong page...

https://www.sounddevices.com/support/downloads/mixpres-firmware
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rigpimp on May 31, 2018, 01:27:38 PM
.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on June 01, 2018, 04:05:35 PM
I have a firmware request, I sent it directly to SD, but I want to post here so others can ask as well. I know it's nitpicking.

Please note that polarity, and not "phase" is the correct term for that which is upside down but not time-shifted. Phase would involve a time-shift, and not just a hot/cold switcheroo!  ^-^

Hey Sound Devices!
Please change the PHASE setting label on each channel to POLARITY, thanks!

(edited to change will send to sent!)
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rigpimp on June 01, 2018, 04:09:32 PM
Gonna run v2.21 tonight for Hackensaw Boys.  Wish me luck!
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: larrysellers on June 01, 2018, 04:13:33 PM
Clip indicator and peak hold look nice on the new FW.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rigpimp on June 01, 2018, 05:40:13 PM
Clip indicator and peak hold look nice on the new FW.

Do those occur native or is it a setting you have to turn on?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: larrysellers on June 01, 2018, 06:04:51 PM
If you the ring LEDs turned on,  it should happen automatically.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rigpimp on June 02, 2018, 12:27:28 AM
If you the ring LEDs turned on,  it should happen automatically.
At sound check for Hackensaw Boys.  Ring LEDs on, no clip indicator or peak hold
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: checht on June 04, 2018, 02:33:52 PM
Can't find the answer to this in the thread, so pardon the repeat question:

The manual for the MP-3 states 'The MixPre-3 can record up to five audio tracks...'

So can one send the aux in to the mix tracks w/out the ISO's? Or is there some other way, or is it only 5 if you do a hot mix of the 3 ISO's onto the mix tracks along with the aux pair?

Or should I just have gotten the 6? :)

~Chris
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rigpimp on June 04, 2018, 03:01:46 PM
I ran v.2.21 on Friday night without any problems.  I just formatted my card, loaded my preset, turned on bluetooth and away I went.

I will re-comment on the fact that during soundcheck I tentatively cranked my levels to see what the "clip indicator" looked like and saw nothing.  Also, is the peak hold feature the falling bar from the peak of each meter?  Hasn't that always been there?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: heathen on June 04, 2018, 03:12:57 PM
Can't find the answer to this in the thread, so pardon the repeat question:

The manual for the MP-3 states 'The MixPre-3 can record up to five audio tracks...'

So can one send the aux in to the mix tracks w/out the ISO's? Or is there some other way, or is it only 5 if you do a hot mix of the 3 ISO's onto the mix tracks along with the aux pair?

Or should I just have gotten the 6? :)

~Chris

I was curious about this after reading your comment so I looked at the manual.  It appears to me that the five tracks are the three ISOs and the LR mix.  Hopefully someone who has more familiarity with the MP3 will correct me if I'm wrong.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: dallman on June 04, 2018, 04:08:42 PM
Can't find the answer to this in the thread, so pardon the repeat question:

The manual for the MP-3 states 'The MixPre-3 can record up to five audio tracks...'

So can one send the aux in to the mix tracks w/out the ISO's? Or is there some other way, or is it only 5 if you do a hot mix of the 3 ISO's onto the mix tracks along with the aux pair?

Or should I just have gotten the 6? :)

~Chris

I was curious about this after reading your comment so I looked at the manual.  It appears to me that the five tracks are the three ISOs and the LR mix.  Hopefully someone who has more familiarity with the MP3 will correct me if I'm wrong.

You are correct the MixPre3 is 3 ISO tracks and in addition an L/R mix track. So while it has 5 tracks total, only 3 are ISO tracks or individual inputs. That is why it is called a MixPre3. There is a lot of commenting on people who thought or presumed there would be a way to have 5 (ISO) inputs, but that is not how the deck was designed. From early comments at SD, it seems unlikely this can be changed nor was it in the design to begin with.

Similarly the MixPre6 has 6 ISO tracks. It has in addition a L/R mix track for a total of 8 tracks, but only has 6 (ISO) input tracks. And to clarify further, only four of the inputs (ISO's) have the Kashmir Preamps. Tracks 5 and 6 are plug in power or supply your own through an external Preamp.

ISO = Isolated track
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: fanofjam on June 04, 2018, 08:18:02 PM
I have a firmware request, I sent it directly to SD, but I want to post here so others can ask as well. I know it's nitpicking.

Please note that polarity, and not "phase" is the correct term for that which is upside down but not time-shifted. Phase would involve a time-shift, and not just a hot/cold switcheroo!  ^-^

Hey Sound Devices!
Please change the PHASE setting label on each channel to POLARITY, thanks!

(edited to change will send to sent!)


For what it's worth, the terms seem to used interchangeably...perhaps it's an American English vs Queens English thing.  Anyway, I went to B&H's website and did a sample of audio preamps that have polarity/phase switches and both terms are used.  (FWIW, I've always called it 'phase' and I'm pretty sure that's how it's referred to in my DAW...Adobe Audition though I don't have Audition on this machine I have in front of me.)

These guys call it a phase switch or phase reverse on the face of their preamp.

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/581139-REG/Summit_Audio_TPA_200B_TPA_200B_Microphone_Line_Preamp.html
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1316011-REG/fmr_audio_rnp8380_really_nice_preamp.html
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/835231-REG/Chandler_LTD1_MIC_PREAMP_EQ_LTD1_MIC_PREAMP_EQ_1_CHANNEL.html

These guys call is a polarity switch.

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1113552-REG/lindell_audio_evo6_500_series_discrete_mic.html
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1239336-REG/trident_audio_series_80b_dual_microphone.html
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/689904-REG/Millennia_STT_1_SST_1_Origin_Twin.html
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on June 05, 2018, 12:13:39 AM

For what it's worth, the terms seem to used interchangeably...
For what it's worth, I did say I was nitpicking, but I'll double down and say that about half of the uses are incorrect, or at the very least, imprecise.
Quote


These guys call it a phase switch or phase reverse on the face of their preamp.
Without looking, I can tell you that they all have it mislabeled if it's a switch.
Quote
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/581139-REG/Summit_Audio_TPA_200B_TPA_200B_Microphone_Line_Preamp.html
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1316011-REG/fmr_audio_rnp8380_really_nice_preamp.html
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/835231-REG/Chandler_LTD1_MIC_PREAMP_EQ_LTD1_MIC_PREAMP_EQ_1_CHANNEL.html

These guys call it a polarity switch.
and they are correct.
Quote


https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1113552-REG/lindell_audio_evo6_500_series_discrete_mic.html
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1239336-REG/trident_audio_series_80b_dual_microphone.html
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/689904-REG/Millennia_STT_1_SST_1_Origin_Twin.html

Here is a pretty good discussion of why polarity refers to signal inversion and phase refers to timing
https://theproaudiofiles.com/phase/

"One of the most confusing topics in audio is Phase. I think part of what makes it confusing is that people use it in reference to more than one issue.
What always seems to make things clear for me: figure out precisely which aspect is the concern then focus on the part that matters. It is such an issue that I avoid using the word Phase to prevent confusion.
There are really two things people mean when they say Phase: Polarity or Timing Difference.
Hopefully differentiating these can help you decide if you should push that Invert button or move a microphone when things sound weird."
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on June 06, 2018, 12:15:07 AM
I'm not going to post every time I make a recording with the MixPre6, but I will make an exception for my initial outings. I recorded two shows by Monks Of Doom in small clubs in the San Francisco bay area. The deck performed more-or-less as expected. I was running firmware 2.10, and starting/stopping record and monitoring via the iOS app.

I was using the "suggested" custom combo mode where the knobs control ISO gain. I like it in principle, but in order to check the gain I had to move the fader, and change the gain!?  That seems weird.

Don't get me wrong, Audacity has the same problem, I have to click on the channel gain in order to find out how it's set, and that changes it if I move the mouse pointer at all!? But that's not my favorite way to run a user interface.

And we're off to the races.

Kick down thread for LMA posts: https://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=186685.0

https://archive.org/details/MonksOfDoom2018-05-19
Saturday, May 19, 2018
San Francisco, CA USA
The Make Out Room

https://archive.org/details/MonksOfDoom2018-05-20
Sunday, May 20, 2018
Albany, CA, USA
The Ivy Room
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: checht on June 06, 2018, 11:17:19 AM
[snip] ...but in order to check the gain I had to move the fader, and change the gain!?  That seems weird.

Why do you want to know the gain setting while recording? During a show, the only thing I care about is levels.

After a show, I sometimes see where the gain ended up in order to have a general sense of where to start at in a similar situation.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Gordon on June 06, 2018, 11:23:15 AM
[snip] ...but in order to check the gain I had to move the fader, and change the gain!?  That seems weird.

Why do you want to know the gain setting while recording? During a show, the only thing I care about is levels.

After a show, I sometimes see where the gain ended up in order to have a general sense of where to start at in a similar situation.

this!  I tend to start at 20.   after that I don't care about the number just levels.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: jmitchell on June 07, 2018, 07:11:10 AM
[snip] ...but in order to check the gain I had to move the fader, and change the gain!?  That seems weird.

Why do you want to know the gain setting while recording? During a show, the only thing I care about is levels.

After a show, I sometimes see where the gain ended up in order to have a general sense of where to start at in a similar situation.



this!  I tend to start at 20.   after that I don't care about the number just levels.

I start at 20, but usually end up a bit higher.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: aaronji on June 07, 2018, 07:47:52 AM
There is a new version (I think) of the Wingman app:  https://www.sounddevices.com/support/downloads/wm-firmware (https://www.sounddevices.com/support/downloads/wm-firmware).
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: dallman on June 07, 2018, 10:50:52 AM

I was using the "suggested" custom combo mode where the knobs control ISO gain. I like it in principle, but in order to check the gain I had to move the fader, and change the gain!?  That seems weird.

Don't get me wrong, Audacity has the same problem, I have to click on the channel gain in order to find out how it's set, and that changes it if I move the mouse pointer at all!? But that's not my favorite way to run a user interface.

And we're off to the races.



I am now running 2.21 and the need to turn the gain knob is no longer the case. Just pushing the knob in to show the ISO track allows you to see what the gain setting is.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on June 07, 2018, 05:52:45 PM
I am now running 2.21 and the need to turn the gain knob is no longer the case. Just pushing the knob in to show the ISO track allows you to see what the gain setting is.
I am not seeing that this is the case at all. Using the settings I have, a push of the channel knob takes you to the channel control page, but does not show the level until I move the knob. Likewise, in the mode where the level meters show, a twist of the knob is required to show the level of the channel. The MixPre6 must be a quantum recorder, because its operation is affected by looking at it.

Evidently, I am getting spoiled by modern digital metering. In the future, I'll simply set the knobs at 9 o'clock and go get drunk.

Until now, I've usually liked to run left and right channels at the same level. Changing one and not the other shifts the stereo image. Going forward I will have to learn how to use the balance control in linked mode. It seems unintuitive to me, but the SV3800 worked that way.

In Linked Mode do the knobs for #2 and #4 need to be at "noon" in order for channel balance to be preserved?

"Good sound, weird operation" is my review after three shows.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: dallman on June 07, 2018, 06:01:18 PM
I am now running 2.21 and the need to turn the gain knob is no longer the case. Just pushing the knob in to show the ISO track allows you to see what the gain setting is.
I am not seeing that this is the case at all. Using the settings I have, a push of the channel knob takes you to the channel control page, but does not show the level until I move the knob. Likewise, in the mode where the level meters show, a twist of the knob is required to show the level of the channel. The MixPre6 must be a quantum recorder, because its operation is affected by looking at it.

I think it changed with 2.20. I know I used to have to turn the knob, but now I only needed to press the ISO button.
Title: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: ycoop on June 07, 2018, 06:48:45 PM
I'm not going to post every time I make a recording with the MixPre6, but I will make an exception for my initial outings. I recorded two shows by Monks Of Doom in small clubs in the San Francisco bay area. The deck performed more-or-less as expected. I was running firmware 2.10, and starting/stopping record and monitoring via the iOS app.

I was using the "suggested" custom combo mode where the knobs control ISO gain. I like it in principle, but in order to check the gain I had to move the fader, and change the gain!?  That seems weird.

Don't get me wrong, Audacity has the same problem, I have to click on the channel gain in order to find out how it's set, and that changes it if I move the mouse pointer at all!? But that's not my favorite way to run a user interface.

And we're off to the races.

Kick down thread for LMA posts: https://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=186685.0

https://archive.org/details/MonksOfDoom2018-05-19
Saturday, May 19, 2018
San Francisco, CA USA
The Make Out Room

https://archive.org/details/MonksOfDoom2018-05-20
Sunday, May 20, 2018
Albany, CA, USA
The Ivy Room

Did you have a stand at the Ivy Room? Where were you situated?


Avantone CK-1s > DR-60d
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on June 07, 2018, 06:52:39 PM
https://archive.org/details/MonksOfDoom2018-05-20
Sunday, May 20, 2018
The Ivy Room
Quote
Did you have a stand at the Ivy Room? Where were you situated?

Avantone CK-1s > DR-60d
Oh thanks for the reminder that I never filled out the blanks for lineage & source. Fixed now.
Ivy Room, no board feed was available from dude.
Neumann KM140s on stand at FoH + KM143s split on stage > Sound Devices MixPre6 > WAV @24/48
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: justink on June 08, 2018, 12:20:39 AM
https://archive.org/details/MonksOfDoom2018-05-20
Sunday, May 20, 2018
The Ivy Room
Quote
Did you have a stand at the Ivy Room? Where were you situated?

Avantone CK-1s > DR-60d
Oh thanks for the reminder that I never filled out the blanks for lineage & source. Fixed now.
Ivy Room, no board feed was available from dude.
Neumann KM140s on stand at FoH + KM143s split on stage > Sound Devices MixPre6 > WAV @24/48

this is awesome.  i wish we could get the counting crows on archive.org.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: ycoop on June 08, 2018, 12:36:02 AM
Here is a pretty good discussion of why polarity refers to signal inversion and phase refers to timing
https://theproaudiofiles.com/phase/

"One of the most confusing topics in audio is Phase. I think part of what makes it confusing is that people use it in reference to more than one issue.
What always seems to make things clear for me: figure out precisely which aspect is the concern then focus on the part that matters. It is such an issue that I avoid using the word Phase to prevent confusion.
There are really two things people mean when they say Phase: Polarity or Timing Difference.
Hopefully differentiating these can help you decide if you should push that Invert button or move a microphone when things sound weird."

Correct me if I'm wrong here, but phase and polarity would (sort of) be referring to the same thing for a perfect sinusoidal wave.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Gordon on June 08, 2018, 11:11:25 AM
I am now running 2.21 and the need to turn the gain knob is no longer the case. Just pushing the knob in to show the ISO track allows you to see what the gain setting is.
I am not seeing that this is the case at all. Using the settings I have, a push of the channel knob takes you to the channel control page, but does not show the level until I move the knob. Likewise, in the mode where the level meters show, a twist of the knob is required to show the level of the channel. The MixPre6 must be a quantum recorder, because its operation is affected by looking at it.

I think it changed with 2.20. I know I used to have to turn the knob, but now I only needed to press the ISO button.

just updated to 2.21 and not seeing this either.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: dallman on June 08, 2018, 12:47:26 PM
I am now running 2.21 and the need to turn the gain knob is no longer the case. Just pushing the knob in to show the ISO track allows you to see what the gain setting is.
I am not seeing that this is the case at all. Using the settings I have, a push of the channel knob takes you to the channel control page, but does not show the level until I move the knob. Likewise, in the mode where the level meters show, a twist of the knob is required to show the level of the channel. The MixPre6 must be a quantum recorder, because its operation is affected by looking at it.

I think it changed with 2.20. I know I used to have to turn the knob, but now I only needed to press the ISO button.

just updated to 2.21 and not seeing this either.
I'll see if I can take a picture tonight. It is at the top left of the screen.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Gordon on June 08, 2018, 12:50:17 PM

I'll see if I can take a picture tonight. It is at the top left of the screen.

got it!  I have my channels labeled (ak40l, ak40r etc) so for me the db just flashes for a second and then shows the label.  when you go back to main screen it also shows for a split second.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on June 08, 2018, 01:52:13 PM
Correct me if I'm wrong here, but phase and polarity would (sort of) be referring to the same thing for a perfect sinusoidal wave.
Well, this is why it's confusing. It LOOKS the same but it's only the same when you're doing math on paper, or on your oscilloscope, not in the field.

A sine wave shifted 180 degrees looks the same as one which has its relative polarity inverted. But it's not the same signal, in real life.

MATH TIME, ignore if you want.

Example: a sine wave at 100 Hz has a half wave period of 1/200 second, or 0.005 sec, or 5 ms. If you delay a 100 Hz sine wave 5 ms, and add it to the original at the same level, you should get 100% cancellation.
But now your signal is delayed, by 180 degrees of phase, which is 5ms for a 100 Hz wave. Not really the same signal.

Anyhow. When you speak of phase, there are a lot more degrees of it than just 0 and 180, and a LOT MORE MATH.

When you actually want to invert polarity, without delaying a signal at a certain frequency, you (and SD!) should just label the function POLARITY and not phase. Especially if you can remedy it in firmware! Those fancy hardware boxes from B&H can't get a new paint job over the internet!!!
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: justink on June 08, 2018, 11:33:57 PM
i want to see a mixpre vs. Grace V3 comp.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: capnhook on June 09, 2018, 09:13:14 AM
Correct me if I'm wrong here, but phase and polarity would (sort of) be referring to the same thing for a perfect sinusoidal wave.
Well, this is why it's confusing. It LOOKS the same but it's only the same when you're doing math on paper, or on your oscilloscope, not in the field.

A sine wave shifted 180 degrees looks the same as one which has its relative polarity inverted. But it's not the same signal, in real life.

MATH TIME, ignore if you want.

Example: a sine wave at 100 Hz has a half wave period of 1/200 second, or 0.005 sec, or 5 ms. If you delay a 100 Hz sine wave 5 ms, and add it to the original at the same level, you should get 100% cancellation.
But now your signal is delayed, by 180 degrees of phase, which is 5ms for a 100 Hz wave. Not really the same signal.

Anyhow. When you speak of phase, there are a lot more degrees of it than just 0 and 180, and a LOT MORE MATH.

When you actually want to invert polarity, without delaying a signal at a certain frequency, you (and SD!) should just label the function POLARITY and not phase. Especially if you can remedy it in firmware! Those fancy hardware boxes from B&H can't get a new paint job over the internet!!!

+T morst

Truth
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: aaronji on June 13, 2018, 11:17:17 AM
New "M" flavors of the MixPre-3 and -6:  https://www.sounddevices.com/news/news/sound-devices-news/introducing-the-mixpre-3m-and-mixpre-6m-for-musicians (https://www.sounddevices.com/news/news/sound-devices-news/introducing-the-mixpre-3m-and-mixpre-6m-for-musicians)...
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: ts on June 13, 2018, 01:12:11 PM
So will the 3M handle a 2 channel SBD feed via Aux in while running mic in on channels 1 and 2? Also, these are $100 cheaper than their predecessors, but SD is offering a plug-in for $99 which turns your existing 3 or 6 into a M. :hmmm:
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rippleish20 on June 13, 2018, 01:29:02 PM
So will the 3M handle a 2 channel SBD feed via Aux in while running mic in on channels 1 and 2? Also, these are $100 cheaper than their predecessors, but SD is offering a plug-in for $99 which turns your existing 3 or 6 into a M. :hmmm:

No. The 3M is three input. XLR only, no bluetooth/Wingman, no m/s encoding...


http://cdn.sounddevices.com/download/lit/MixPreMegaComparisonChart.pdf
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: ycoop on June 13, 2018, 03:17:46 PM
So will the 3M handle a 2 channel SBD feed via Aux in while running mic in on channels 1 and 2? Also, these are $100 cheaper than their predecessors, but SD is offering a plug-in for $99 which turns your existing 3 or 6 into a M. :hmmm:

No. The 3M is three input. XLR only, no bluetooth/Wingman, no m/s encoding...


http://cdn.sounddevices.com/download/lit/MixPreMegaComparisonChart.pdf

https://www.sounddevices.com/images/products/MixPre-3MRightPanel-web.png

Looks like it has an aux/mic input to me, and if I’m reading that chart correctly that can be two channels.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: heathen on June 13, 2018, 03:26:14 PM
From the manual for the MixPre-3m: "The MixPre-3M lets you record up to three tracks at once from either the three
XLR inputs, Aux in connectors, or USB inputs."
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rippleish20 on June 13, 2018, 06:55:45 PM
I'm sorry,I can see how my XLR comment was misinterpreted - I was actually referring to the fact that they replaced the combo inputs with XLRs only.. You can only record three channels at a time as heathens comment reflects...


The plugin also appears to supplement the 3/6 with the m features rather than replacing them. Based on the video they released, after installing the plugin on a 3/6, you create a project and that project can use the traditional 3/6 firmware feature set or the new plugin features...

So will the 3M handle a 2 channel SBD feed via Aux in while running mic in on channels 1 and 2? Also, these are $100 cheaper than their predecessors, but SD is offering a plug-in for $99 which turns your existing 3 or 6 into a M. :hmmm:

No. The 3M is three input. XLR only, no bluetooth/Wingman, no m/s encoding...


http://cdn.sounddevices.com/download/lit/MixPreMegaComparisonChart.pdf

https://www.sounddevices.com/images/products/MixPre-3MRightPanel-web.png

Looks like it has an aux/mic input to me, and if I’m reading that chart correctly that can be two channels.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: dallman on June 14, 2018, 02:24:25 AM
I'm sorry,I can see how my XLR comment was misinterpreted - I was actually referring to the fact that they replaced the combo inputs with XLRs only.

MixPre 3 was always XLR only. MixPre 6 and 10 have combo inputs
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: JM Charcot on June 14, 2018, 06:52:06 AM
I asked Sound Devices, but maybe someone knows here, or has already used it, if I buy the musician plugin for my Mixpre-3, will it act after only as a Mixpre-3M, or will I still be able to use it also as a Mixpre-3 when recording in the field?

Kind regards,

JM.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rippleish20 on June 14, 2018, 09:41:38 AM
I'm sorry,I can see how my XLR comment was misinterpreted - I was actually referring to the fact that they replaced the combo inputs with XLRs only.

MixPre 3 was always XLR only. MixPre 6 and 10 have combo inputs

I didn't realize that. Thanks...
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rippleish20 on June 14, 2018, 09:45:36 AM
I asked Sound Devices, but maybe someone knows here, or has already used it, if I buy the musician plugin for my Mixpre-3, will it act after only as a Mixpre-3M, or will I still be able to use it also as a Mixpre-3 when recording in the field?

Kind regards,

JM.

Based on the video they put up, a Mixpre-3 or 6 with the plugin can act as it normally does using the stock firmware or act as if it were a m version. After you install the plugin, you create a  project and choose between "audio" and "music". One gives you the standard feature set and the other the m feature set...
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: JM Charcot on June 14, 2018, 10:00:57 AM
I asked Sound Devices, but maybe someone knows here, or has already used it, if I buy the musician plugin for my Mixpre-3, will it act after only as a Mixpre-3M, or will I still be able to use it also as a Mixpre-3 when recording in the field?

Kind regards,

JM.

Based on the video they put up, a Mixpre-3 or 6 with the plugin can act as it normally does using the stock firmware or act as if it were a m version. After you install the plugin, you create a  project and choose between "audio" and "music". One gives you the standard feature set and the other the m feature set...

Absolutely, I just had the confirmation from Sound Devices, this is good news.  :)
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: dogmusic on June 14, 2018, 11:04:55 AM
Can you transfer a recording made as an Audio project into a Music project internally in the MixPre6 with plugin (i.e., for use as a bed track) or would you have to download it first to computer and then import it?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Paul Isaacs on June 14, 2018, 06:31:11 PM
Can you transfer a recording made as an Audio project into a Music project internally in the MixPre6 with plugin (i.e., for use as a bed track) or would you have to download it first to computer and then import it?

You can import it directly from audio project into music project! So damn versatile!
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: dogmusic on June 14, 2018, 07:35:48 PM
Can you transfer a recording made as an Audio project into a Music project internally in the MixPre6 with plugin (i.e., for use as a bed track) or would you have to download it first to computer and then import it?

You can import it directly from audio project into music project! So damn versatile!

Excellent! That opens up many possibilities. Thanks for your reply, Paul.

If you've recorded at 24/192 in Audio, will it do the conversion to 24/96 when importing into Music?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: IronFilm on June 14, 2018, 09:10:04 PM
I asked Sound Devices, but maybe someone knows here, or has already used it, if I buy the musician plugin for my Mixpre-3, will it act after only as a Mixpre-3M, or will I still be able to use it also as a Mixpre-3 when recording in the field?

Kind regards,

JM.

I assume it will be just like 10T users who buy the M plugin. You will get all the benefits of the original plus the M version in the same device.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: noahbickart on June 14, 2018, 09:16:04 PM
As a taper, does the M plugin help me at all?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on June 15, 2018, 01:02:33 AM
As a taper, does the M plugin help me at all?
I'll gamble and say that's a straight NO.

I'm not really seriously considering the purchase of this M plugin for my 6.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: edtyre on June 15, 2018, 12:47:32 PM
As a taper, does the M plugin help me at all?
No
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Paul Isaacs on June 15, 2018, 01:15:37 PM
Can you transfer a recording made as an Audio project into a Music project internally in the MixPre6 with plugin (i.e., for use as a bed track) or would you have to download it first to computer and then import it?

You can import it directly from audio project into music project! So damn versatile!

Excellent! That opens up many possibilities. Thanks for your reply, Paul.

If you've recorded at 24/192 in Audio, will it do the conversion to 24/96 when importing into Music?

No!
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: noahbickart on June 19, 2018, 07:04:08 AM
I've finally updated my firmware.

Have any of you made use of the cue markers for "what we do?" If so, how?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on June 19, 2018, 11:29:56 PM
I've finally updated my firmware.

Have any of you made use of the cue markers for "what we do?" If so, how?
I get distracted during shows and can't be counted on to track an entire set live. Far easier for me to do it in post.

Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Mike D (VT) on June 23, 2018, 08:00:21 PM
I'm the proud new owner of a MixPre 6!
Most recently, I had a Tascam DR-70D (currently FS) and I feel like it's a big upgrade.
I've always admired Sound Devices quality and sound and I'm very excited to use it in the field in about a month.
Thanks for all the info in the last +/- 75 pages of these threads. It took awhile, but I managed to pull quite a lot of useful tips and feel very comfortable with it already.
If anyone here runs Jim Williams 460s, please chime in!
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Brian Skalinder on June 28, 2018, 02:49:36 PM
All -- I've moved the discussion of MixPre-3/6 v. Zoom F4/8 discussion to its own thread (http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=186975.0).  Please discuss and compare there, and leave this thread for discussion about the MixPre-3 and -6.  Thanks.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rigpimp on June 28, 2018, 04:51:00 PM
All -- I've moved the discussion of MixPre-3/6 v. Zoom F4/8 discussion to its own thread (http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=186975.0).  Please discuss and compare there, and leave this thread for discussion about the MixPre-3 and -6.  Thanks.

Thank you for cleaning it up.  You must have just picked an arbitrary post and moved everything after that?  My posts about using the Mixpre-6 USB-A as an audio output just ended up in a thread a comparing it to a Zoom product.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: aaronji on June 28, 2018, 05:02:53 PM
All -- I've moved the discussion of MixPre-3/6 v. Zoom F4/8 discussion to its own thread (http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=186975.0).  Please discuss and compare there, and leave this thread for discussion about the MixPre-3 and -6.  Thanks.

Thanks, Brian!
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Brian Skalinder on June 28, 2018, 07:07:00 PM
Thank you for cleaning it up.  You must have just picked an arbitrary post and moved everything after that?

I picked what seemed like the start of the comparison and took everything after.  Tried splitting out post by post, but the mechanism to do so wasn't working properly.  So I just split off everything.  Apologies for the inconvenience.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: borjam on June 30, 2018, 01:16:12 PM
I received my MixPre-3 on Friday. Coming from a FR-2LE and a MD661mkii it was like I reached Nirvana or something.

Being someone who only skims manuals it was a bit puzzling at first. And of course I am someone who immediately configures whatever thing in "advanced" rather than "basic" mode. Once figured out, I see how it fits different use cases.

Anyway, the important stuff.

First thing I did after hearing so much about the headphone amplifier was to hook it to a computer, plug my HFI-650 cans and listen to "Alfa Centauri" by Fredrik Carlquist. I must say I was blown away immediately. These headphones are very efficient but I think that their impedance on low frequencies is too low. So many headphone amplifiers can suffer a lot with them. I can see these units getting fashionable at some audiophile circles as headphone amplifiers. Something similar happened with Metric Halo several years ago, with audiophiles getting the ULN-8 just to use it as a D/A converter.

Which brings us to the next test: going to the nearby wetland and listen to some birds. I tried some not-so-gentle movements of the Rode Blimp without engaging the HPF yet and I was really surprised. Of course there was low frequency sound. But the amplifier didn't distort. (The FR-2LE can even catch fire doing this).

Next test: Limiters and HPF. Both implemented in the analog domain or with a first stage in the analog domain. Impressive. The release time for the limiter is long (500 ms) and it's not possible to adjust it, but that's only evident when one pushes the envelope too much. Using the limiters reasonably (ie, to prevent accidents) it shouldn't be much of a problem.

The HPF is great. Coming from a FR-2LE, like a different world. It cut down the handling noise perfectly without affecting the conversion of course. And I really like the metering. It's quite convenient. The headphone volume knob is in an odd position, that's true. But it's only a minor annoyance (at least for me).

I was surprised at how small it is. Reviews mentioned it of course but you have to behold it to believe. I've noticed that it consumes a lot of power, but good preamplifiers with excellent noise floors are hungry. Anyway for now Eneloop Pros seem to be a good solution. Eventually I guess I'll get the L-mount battery adapter. It's a great solution to use it in a bag.

Now, I'm curious about the usage of a 32 bit ADC. Have they added resolution to the bottom in order to reduce quantization noise? Reviewers are surprised at how silent it is even when recording at low levels adding gain in post. So that might be an explanation.

I'm a happy camper for now although I've pestered them a bit about the lack of a phase/polarity reversal option for the inputs.

Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: mjwin on July 05, 2018, 03:05:13 PM
Query re. USB data connection

I've just taken delivery of a MixPre-6, & it's a fab device in most respects  But one simple task is eluding me &  I'm tearing my hair out.

I don't want to power the MixPre via USB, simply drag & drop a few files onto a connected pc.  With a solid battery pack connected, methinks I ought to be able to plug in a USB C-A cable, select transfer mode, and away we go, just like with every other piece of USB equipment I've ever encountered.

But it seems this is not the case.  When I do so with an A-C cable, (or use just one part of the supplied Y cable), the MixPre crashes, or goes into an endless power-up loop, & so on.  I contacted SD tech support who have been super-prompt in replying  either side of the holiday,  and they asked for  a video of the machine behaviour, which I sent. But  I've  just been  told that I MUST use the supplied Y lead & take up 2 USB slots on the p/c. "or it will cause the machine to hang as you were encountering."   Surely this isn't correct?

The user manual is confusing too. In one place (p7) it says I can choose battery power over USB,  in the USB section (p33) this option  isn't mentioned (nor, more importantly,  is the option on the actual machine).

Hmmm...

This is such a simple & fundamental requirement, it must be possible.... Every other USB device in the known universe just connects when you plug it in!

So any input welcome!

Thanks,

Martin
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: aaronji on July 05, 2018, 04:03:08 PM
^ I use the supplied Y-cable, with the part marked "data" plugged into the computer and the USB-c end plugged into the MixPre with a battery sled attached. When I switch the MixPre on, I get a screen that says something like "USB-c power low. Use battery power?" I click "yes" and go to file transfer mode, at which point an Explorer window for the MixPre pops up. Then, I can drag and drop or copy and paste the files.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: mjwin on July 05, 2018, 05:30:40 PM
@aaronji Thanks for that succinct description. That's exactly how I would expect the MP6 to behave if it had an issue with the power.  Giving the option to select battery power also tallies with what is said in the manual.  But when I connect my MP6 in this way, (only one USB-A connector)  it simply freezes or enters an endless power-cycle loop.  I wonder why SD support told me that this was expected behaviour.  I was beginning to think, "welcome to the brave new world of USB-C incompatibilities", but maybe my unit has a problem after all.  Doubtless I'll get to the root of it all at some point, but for now I'm going "old school" and popping out the SD card to transfer files. It's simple. It works.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on July 05, 2018, 09:06:53 PM
When I switch the MixPre on, I get a screen that says something like "USB-c power low. Use battery power?" I click "yes" ...
That is weird behavior. I just tested on my MacBook Pro and my MixPre6 fired up fine with just the "Data" side of the Y cable in the mac USB port. It did have the low voltage indication, but that's ok. I don't usually click YES on this. I let the machine run at low power, unless I need to use 4 channels of 48V Phantom Power right then.

In fact, when I have the machine plugged into USB-C doing transfers or messing with the menus, I typically don't even keep the battery sled attached at all, so I don't have to reject that message!

Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: aaronji on July 06, 2018, 06:12:58 AM
When I switch the MixPre on, I get a screen that says something like "USB-c power low. Use battery power?" I click "yes" ...
That is weird behavior. I just tested on my MacBook Pro and my MixPre6 fired up fine with just the "Data" side of the Y cable in the mac USB port. It did have the low voltage indication, but that's ok. I don't usually click YES on this. I let the machine run at low power, unless I need to use 4 channels of 48V Phantom Power right then.

Why is it weird?  As far as I am concerned, the choice between battery or USB power for file transfer is pretty much arbitrary.  Six of one, half dozen of the other and all.  I guess if your battery is really low, USB might make more sense, but, otherwise, it's a question of what color battery indicator you prefer!  Much of the time, I just pull the card if I am unpacking my gear (removing the batteries from the sled) and use the built-in SD card reader on my computer... 
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: aaronji on July 06, 2018, 06:23:16 AM
@aaronji Thanks for that succinct description. That's exactly how I would expect the MP6 to behave if it had an issue with the power.  Giving the option to select battery power also tallies with what is said in the manual.  But when I connect my MP6 in this way, (only one USB-A connector)  it simply freezes or enters an endless power-cycle loop.  I wonder why SD support told me that this was expected behaviour.  I was beginning to think, "welcome to the brave new world of USB-C incompatibilities", but maybe my unit has a problem after all.  Doubtless I'll get to the root of it all at some point, but for now I'm going "old school" and popping out the SD card to transfer files. It's simple. It works.

Is the MixPre already powered up when you plug in the cable?  Maybe that makes a difference?  I have always hooked up the cable and then turned on the recorder.  Also, maybe try an earlier firmware.  1.53 seems pretty stable (although lacking a few features of the newer versions); they are all available for download on the SD site.  Lastly, have you reformatted the card after any firmware updates?  I have seen a few posts elsewhere suggesting that the card should be formatted with the installed version of the firmware.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: mjwin on July 06, 2018, 03:14:17 PM
Is the MixPre already powered up when you plug in the cable?  Maybe that makes a difference?  I have always hooked up the cable and then turned on the recorder.  Also, maybe try an earlier firmware.  1.53 seems pretty stable (although lacking a few features of the newer versions); they are all available for download on the SD site.

I've tried it all ways, with (nearly) always the same result: on power-up the splash screen comes up, ring LEDs flash, all goes blank for a couple of seconds & the cycle repeats... Pulling the USB cable usually resets it & the device powers up fine.  A couple of times (including on the video I sent to SD) the device actually froze & I had to pull the battery to power it down!  Not good.

I'm using the  latest firmware, 2.21 which came with the MP6, & I don't really want to roll back as far as 1.53. Also, with a potentially unstable machine, I don't want to run the risk of "bricking" it when performing a f/w update! 

I'm a bit reluctant to contact my suppliers over this just yet since I've already had them replace a faulty MX8AA battery sled, and I also felt I needed to tell them that their delivery courier left both the  Mixpre & the replacement sled at the side of the road rather than bringing them to my house! So they're gonna think I really am the customer from Hell if I tell them my Mixpre is, well, "not fully functional" shall we say...  It also doesn't help that the guy in SD support was adamant that my unit was behaving correctly, ie locking up &/or power cycling, when connecting just the data plug of the Y cable (or a standard USB C-A cable).  As an electronics engineer myself, I still can't believe that SD would knowingly  release something which actually crashed/locked up if the user forgot to connect a cable (which is effectively all I'm doing): their stuff is usually bulletproof.  And, of course, you guys seem not to have this problem anyway, just (maybe) a warning message on screen  if there's insufficient USB power. 

I guess at this point, the more ppl who say that they transfer data just fine with a single USB-A, the more backup I have if I claim my unit is faulty.  I don't post much here, but I do find the can-do attitude & willingness to help just so refreshing :cheers:
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on July 06, 2018, 09:02:30 PM
When I switch the MixPre on, I get a screen that says something like "USB-c power low. Use battery power?" I click "yes" ...
That is weird behavior. I just tested on my MacBook Pro and my MixPre6 fired up fine with just the "Data" side of the Y cable in the mac USB port. It did have the low voltage indication, but that's ok. I don't usually click YES on this. I let the machine run at low power, unless I need to use 4 channels of 48V Phantom Power right then.

Why is it weird?  As far as I am concerned, the choice between battery or USB power for file transfer is pretty much arbitrary.  Six of one, half dozen of the other and all.  I guess if your battery is really low, USB might make more sense, but, otherwise, it's a question of what color battery indicator you prefer!  Much of the time, I just pull the card if I am unpacking my gear (removing the batteries from the sled) and use the built-in SD card reader on my computer...

Sorry my post was not clear. I typed it up, and then right before posting, I reorganized it, and it reads like I was saying your reaction to the battery choice was weird. Not what I meant.

I meant that the behavior of mjwin's machine was weird!!! 
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: borjam on July 07, 2018, 04:22:51 AM
In case it's some current supply problem with your USB port (although it shouldn't happen, Sound Devices are experts on power management from what I've seen) try reducing power consumption.

In advanced mode you can turn inputs off. I imagine that they will turn off the preamp for the channel in order to save energy (I would do it). You can even try reducing the screen and leds brightness.

I have tried the USB cable (MixPre 3) connected to my 2010 Mac Pro and it works. The ports are USB 2.0 (USB 3.0 didn't exist yet). I know that some PC motherboards fail to meet the power requirements of USB 2.0 devices, hence so many Y cables seen on devices intended for PCs. I know that in the case of the MixPres the reason is that they need more current than offered by a standard USB 2.0.

You can also try a good powered USB 2.0 hub. If the problem is in the motherboard failing to deliver power that would solve it. But make sure that it's 2.0.
And a good one, there is so much crap out there nowadays...

Also, have you tried a different card? Some are troublesome and Amazon has been known to sell knock-offs of well known brands.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: mjwin on July 08, 2018, 02:55:05 PM
Ok. Thanks for the suggestions / ideas. After reading these, together with some pretty extensive online research, I decided that the MP6 really shouldn't be behaving as it did. So today I thought I'd do one last test cycle &, guess what?

It now works correctly! (?) 

No crashes, power cycles or other tantrums. In short, exactly as it should be.

So, in each of the following instances, I get that little warning box pop up:
"USB-C Power is low. Battery power present,  would you like to run on battery power?
If I choose
"YES" - batt gauge full-on green (presumably runs off 8AA sled)
"NO" - batt gauge orange with the USB symbol. (presumably runs off USB low power)

I tried each plug of the Y lead independently - fine
A standard USB A-C cable I bought in town -  fine
2 different laptop pcs - fine
an Anker powercore 10000 - fine

I did give the MP6 a pretty good talking to the other night, showed it some scary looking test equipment which was gonna prod its insides, etc. Sometimes this does the trick. Machines can get above themselves...

So, now I just need to get out & hit record.  :headphones:
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: dallman on July 09, 2018, 01:40:04 AM
Ok. Thanks for the suggestions / ideas. After reading these, together with some pretty extensive online research, I decided that the MP6 really shouldn't be behaving as it did. So today I thought I'd do one last test cycle &, guess what?

It now works correctly! (?) 

No crashes, power cycles or other tantrums. In short, exactly as it should be.

So, in each of the following instances, I get that little warning box pop up:
"USB-C Power is low. Battery power present,  would you like to run on battery power?
If I choose
"YES" - batt gauge full-on green (presumably runs off 8AA sled)
"NO" - batt gauge orange with the USB symbol. (presumably runs off USB low power)

I tried each plug of the Y lead independently - fine
A standard USB A-C cable I bought in town -  fine
2 different laptop pcs - fine
an Anker powercore 10000 - fine

I did give the MP6 a pretty good talking to the other night, showed it some scary looking test equipment which was gonna prod its insides, etc. Sometimes this does the trick. Machines can get above themselves...

So, now I just need to get out & hit record.  :headphones:
Nothing like a happy ending! :clapping: :cheers:
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: checht on July 10, 2018, 03:40:18 PM
 Bluetooth issues resolved with help from tech-support.

********WARNING*********
 This method erases all internal presets so be sure to save them to SD card before using.
*************************

I’ve been having trouble with my MP3 not connecting to my iPhone X and the wingman app. It originally connected fine but the last couple months it’s taken me multiple times to connect and usually I have to go into the system menu and turn Bluetooth off and back on again. [insert IT Crowd joke here].

Today I called tech-support and the tech suggested I try a reset which consisted of holding the headphone knob and the channel one knob down while powering up and keeping them held down until I got to the home screen.

At this point looks like everything works great. I’ve tested it quite a few times and it connects to Bluetooth every time it boots.

Also I asked the tech about the potential for Bluetooth audio monitoring and he said that it’s policy for them not to comment on features in development but I interpreted that as meaning it is a distinct possibility.

Cheers
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: dynamicalories on July 12, 2018, 09:15:37 AM
Just got my MixPre-6 yesterday and I think I've mostly got this thing figured out, but two questions remain:

1. How do I turn off the recording of the L-R Mix track? I just want to record 4 tracks. I figured out how to link channels 1 and 2, and 3 and 4, so I basically just want to end up with 2 stereo tracks which I do understand will be in a polywave file.

2. Is there still an issue with 64 GB SD cards? Or has that issue been resolved. (I've got the 2.21 firmware.)

Thanks!
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: dallman on July 12, 2018, 10:45:16 AM
Just got my MixPre-6 yesterday and I think I've mostly got this thing figured out, but two questions remain:

1. How do I turn off the recording of the L-R Mix track? I just want to record 4 tracks. I figured out how to link channels 1 and 2, and 3 and 4, so I basically just want to end up with 2 stereo tracks which I do understand will be in a polywave file.
MENU-RECORD- SUB MENU-Rec L,R Mix-Deselect L&R (Off). You will still see the meters, but it will not record them. Pg 29 of the manual

2. Is there still an issue with 64 GB SD cards? Or has that issue been resolved. (I've got the 2.21 firmware.)
No issue. I have been using 64 and 128 cards without any issue.

Thanks!
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: dynamicalories on July 12, 2018, 11:19:47 AM
Thanks!
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on July 12, 2018, 12:23:18 PM
Just got my MixPre-6 yesterday and I think I've mostly got this thing figured out, but two questions remain:

1. How do I turn off the recording of the L-R Mix track? I just want to record 4 tracks. I figured out how to link channels 1 and 2, and 3 and 4, so I basically just want to end up with 2 stereo tracks which I do understand will be in a polywave file.
MENU-RECORD- SUB MENU-Rec L,R Mix-Deselect L&R (Off). You will still see the meters, but it will not record them. Pg 29 of the manual

Note that the record mode must be set to Advanced for this to be available.

What's the difference between OFF and OFF AND LINKED for the mix tracks?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: aaronji on July 12, 2018, 12:36:52 PM
Sorry my post was not clear. I typed it up, and then right before posting, I reorganized it, and it reads like I was saying your reaction to the battery choice was weird. Not what I meant.

I meant that the behavior of mjwin's machine was weird!!!

No worries; I kind of figured it was something like that!

It now works correctly! (?) 

That's good to hear.  Out of curiosity, can you think of anything you may have done differently or did the gremlins exorcise themselves?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: dallman on July 12, 2018, 12:41:52 PM
Just got my MixPre-6 yesterday and I think I've mostly got this thing figured out, but two questions remain:

1. How do I turn off the recording of the L-R Mix track? I just want to record 4 tracks. I figured out how to link channels 1 and 2, and 3 and 4, so I basically just want to end up with 2 stereo tracks which I do understand will be in a polywave file.
MENU-RECORD- SUB MENU-Rec L,R Mix-Deselect L&R (Off). You will still see the meters, but it will not record them. Pg 29 of the manual

Note that the record mode must be set to Advanced for this to be available.
In Basic mode, only the L/R mix bus will be recorded. (Also pg 29) If recording 4 channels you will already be in Advanced mode. ;D

What's the difference between OFF and OFF AND LINKED for the mix tracks?
There is no "OFF and LINKED" setting, there is a "LR LINKED" setting which means the Left Gain controls the the LR mix.

Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: mjwin on July 12, 2018, 03:19:16 PM
It now works correctly! (?) 

That's good to hear.  Out of curiosity, can you think of anything you may have done differently or did the gremlins exorcise themselves?

Well, the latter, I think. For a short while...   Next day I tried again & the problem was back. Then I saw:


Today I called tech-support and the tech suggested I try a reset which consisted of holding the headphone knob and the channel one knob down while powering up and keeping them held down until I got to the home screen.

Thanks for this.  Actually, I think we need to produce our own TS version of the user guide, but without all the important stuff left out lol!

So I tried the system reset, & got a screen which says:
"formatting settings, please wait" (takes about 30sec before home screen)

Which cleared the problem. Great. So at least the issue appears to be  software related & not the box itself. I plugged & unplugged the USB cable in various combinations of power up/down, and it continued to behave just fine.

Then I re-loaded my settings which I'd saved to SD card... But, on the next attempt at USB connection, it hung! 

At this point, I did the factory reset again, and all was fine once more.

So I figured the problem is something to do with my saved settings.  Fortunately the files are in .xml format, so easy to view.  Every parameter is specified explicitly, so it's easy to go through line by line & compare my personal settings with the default values. Nothing seems obviously amiss or corrupt,  though a few of the numerical parameters don't make much sense without specialist knowledge of the firmware. 

So this time I re-configured the settings manually & saved them. As yet, things are working ok.   So for some reason I might just have created a corrupt setup file the first time around.

And that, in a (rather large) nutshell, it where I'm at. But I'm treading cautiously...

Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on July 12, 2018, 06:52:16 PM
Note that the record mode must be set to Advanced for this to be available.
In Basic mode, only the L/R mix bus will be recorded. (Also pg 29) If recording 4 channels you will already be in Advanced mode. ;D

What's the difference between OFF and OFF AND LINKED for the mix tracks?
There is no "OFF and LINKED" setting, there is a "LR LINKED" setting which means the Left Gain controls the the LR mix.

In v2.21 there is a record setting for the Rec L,R called "Off & Linked" - it's on page two of the Mix control options.
Page 1 has L&R Linked, L&R, L, R
Page 2 has Off, or Off & Linked
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: larrysellers on July 12, 2018, 07:05:27 PM
I passed a TC signal from my Fostex FR2 and it was received by the Mixpre 3. RCA TC output of the FR2 to the mini aux input of the Mixpre 3. Record trigger worked perfect too.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: dallman on July 13, 2018, 01:04:40 AM
Note that the record mode must be set to Advanced for this to be available.
In Basic mode, only the L/R mix bus will be recorded. (Also pg 29) If recording 4 channels you will already be in Advanced mode. ;D

What's the difference between OFF and OFF AND LINKED for the mix tracks?
There is no "OFF and LINKED" setting, there is a "LR LINKED" setting which means the Left Gain controls the the LR mix.

In v2.21 there is a record setting for the Rec L,R called "Off & Linked" - it's on page two of the Mix control options.
Page 1 has L&R Linked, L&R, L, R
Page 2 has Off, or Off & Linked
Sorry, I didn't realize there were some new screens.
Per Sound Devices:
The Rec L,R Off and Linked button links the Left and Right track and disarms both.
Seems silly, but maybe there is a reason I am just not seeing.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: edtyre on July 14, 2018, 03:37:34 PM
Can't get my MP3 to show up as an output usb device on my MAC, trying to use as headphone amp?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: justme on July 14, 2018, 07:47:26 PM
Can't get my MP3 to show up as an output usb device on my MAC, trying to use as headphone amp?

When you connect the MP3 via USB-C to the Mac - Make sure the MP3 System setting for USB-C is set to Audio to enable it as a USB audio interface.
If it is set to Power Only the MP3 will not act as an USB I/O interface.

To enable the MP3 as a 5 channels Input and 2 channels Output interface - Make sure the System Setting for USB Audio is set to Normal. You will need to launch the macOS Audio Midi Setup and choose 6 Channels (and relaunch the Audio Midi app). Then you will have a 3 channel + LR Mix Input and 2 channels Output enabled.
If it is set to Stereo Out - the MP3 will act as a 2 channel Output only unit.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: edtyre on July 15, 2018, 01:01:09 PM
Can't get my MP3 to show up as an output usb device on my MAC, trying to use as headphone amp?

When you connect the MP3 via USB-C to the Mac - Make sure the MP3 System setting for USB-C is set to Audio to enable it as a USB audio interface.
If it is set to Power Only the MP3 will not act as an USB I/O interface.

To enable the MP3 as a 5 channels Input and 2 channels Output interface - Make sure the System Setting for USB Audio is set to Normal. You will need to launch the macOS Audio Midi Setup and choose 6 Channels (and relaunch the Audio Midi app). Then you will have a 3 channel + LR Mix Input and 2 channels Output enabled.
If it is set to Stereo Out - the MP3 will act as a 2 channel Output only unit.

Thanks for the advise, but i know all that. It just wont show up as a USB device, can't get it to mount to transfer a file. It has been this way since i bought
it brand new. IT won't work with any of my Macs. Here's a pic of my Midi Panel . BTW...latest firmware and latest Mac OS
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: justme on July 15, 2018, 01:14:38 PM
I'm a little confused here :)

Does it not show up as a USB Audio device and not even as a USB transfer mode even if you select File Transfer?
Do you have any other USB Audio devices connected at the same time?
In macOS you can set Finders prefs to not show external devices from the side bar and in the sidebar you can choose to hide any external units.

Which macOS do you use?
Which cable do you use to connect the MP3 with the Mac?

On my MBP 2015 with macOS 10.13.5 I've tried the included USB-C to dual USB A and they work.
I've also tried an Anker USB-C to USB A which also works properly.

What does the System Information and USB units show when you have the MP3 connected?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Gordon on July 15, 2018, 01:24:24 PM
in the mixpre settings are you going into system > file transfer?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: edtyre on July 15, 2018, 01:41:08 PM
Thanks for the help. I am pretty much an expert user here, i admin dozens of macs.
My unit just doesn't work via any usb function, i will try another MP3 and cable(s) soon

Not going to use it as an interface anyway, just wanted to see what the excitement was
using as a usb headphone amp.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: justme on July 15, 2018, 02:07:24 PM
Cool. Then we pretty much to do the same :)

If you are lucky it's just a bad cable.
Otherwise it kind of sound like your MP3 need a closer checkout by SD. :/

Thanks for the help. I am pretty much an expert user here, i admin dozens of macs.
My unit just doesn't work via any usb function, i will try another MP3 and cable(s) soon

Not going to use it as an interface anyway, just wanted to see what the excitement was
using as a usb headphone amp.

Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: justme on July 15, 2018, 05:00:07 PM
I’m in search for some info.

Could anyone with a L- mount sled be able to measure the sled output terminal voltage when it holds a fully charged L-battery?
Does it measure 8.4V?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Chuck on July 16, 2018, 12:02:34 PM
So, am about to pull the trigger on a MixPre 6.

I've read the manual. Any advice on getting going quickly with this thing?
I've started reading all the threads, but it's daunting.

I'm assuming Advanced mode...
What connector are you guys using for external power? The full sized USB?
Can it make stereo tracks in pairs or is each track going to be mono?
Any rookie mistakes I can avoid right off the bat?
Things that are not obvious in the beginning?

Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on July 16, 2018, 01:39:07 PM
I'm assuming Advanced mode...
What connector are you guys using for external power? The full sized USB?
Can it make stereo tracks in pairs or is each track going to be mono?
I use the USB C - C cable that came with my USB-C power pack (big fat Anker pack) or I use the USB-C -> USB A cable that came with that one when I power two channels off a smaller USB-A power pack.

I get stereo tracks on mine. I do suggest turning OFF the "L,R Mix" track, unless you need it for some reason. This way, when you only record 2 channels, you get a normal WAV instead of a multi-channel Poly Wav. Not a big deal to use the Poly Waves but you have to split them if you wanna flac 'em. (SD has a software app for that on their site)

Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: jbell on July 16, 2018, 02:31:09 PM
It records in polywave files!  One file with all your stereo tracks.  You can use Wave Agent (Free from SD) to separate the tracks into stereo pairs.  I run mine in custom mode so I can use the front knobs to control the gain.  Everything else in the menu I turn on advance.  It is easy to use and for me fairly intuitive.  I'd say once in hand mess with the settings and if you have problems post questions and everyone will get you fixed up. 

For batteries I use usb c> usb c with the suggested anker as a backup.

https://www.amazon.com/Anker-PowerCore-Ultra-High-Capacity-Portable/dp/B014ZO46LK/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1531765922&sr=8-4&keywords=Anker+usb+c+battery&dpID=41nBqHD%252BCfL&preST=_SY300_QL70_&dpSrc=srch

I have the L mount sled for my main battery power.  You can hot swap the batteries, which is nice.  I purchased the following batteries and they have worked great.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Kastar-Battery-Charger-Sony-NP-F960-NP-F970-NP-F975-F950-BC-VM10-BC-VM50-BC-V615/262886954168?hash=item3d354894b8%3Am%3AmBCJ1E72Sn11dQ4ceT4UeNg&var=561885471462&_sacat=0&_nkw=Kastar+battery+charger+and+Sony+batteries&_from=R40&rt=nc&_trksid=m570.l1313

So, am about to pull the trigger on a MixPre 6.

I've read the manual. Any advice on getting going quickly with this thing?
I've started reading all the threads, but it's daunting.

I'm assuming Advanced mode...
What connector are you guys using for external power? The full sized USB?
Can it make stereo tracks in pairs or is each track going to be mono?
Any rookie mistakes I can avoid right off the bat?
Things that are not obvious in the beginning?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Gordon on July 16, 2018, 02:39:46 PM
It records in polywave files!  One file with all your stereo tracks.  You can use Wave Agent (Free from SD) to separate the tracks into stereo pairs.

but as Morst said if you only do 2 channels and l/r is turned off you get a stereo file not a poly.

Some software will handle poly but wavelab won't.  Once I got the correct workflow down for wave agent it only takes a second to both split and combine to make stereo files.  Below is how you make both 1&2 & 3&4 into stereo files.


(https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1801/42547094295_853e42fd5c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/27PJYPi)wa (https://flic.kr/p/27PJYPi) by Gordon Wilson (https://www.flickr.com/photos/gordonlw/), on Flickr
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Gordon on July 16, 2018, 02:41:07 PM
for battery's I have 4 AA rechargeables in the sled as backup and use this.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01KYUDAN4/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I can get about 8 hours off one.  keeping AA in enables hot swapping.

with this cable

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01MSMOMAR/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: junkyardt on July 16, 2018, 03:12:56 PM
So, am about to pull the trigger on a MixPre 6.

I've read the manual. Any advice on getting going quickly with this thing?
I've started reading all the threads, but it's daunting.

I'm assuming Advanced mode...
What connector are you guys using for external power? The full sized USB?
Can it make stereo tracks in pairs or is each track going to be mono?
Any rookie mistakes I can avoid right off the bat?
Things that are not obvious in the beginning?

I just pulled the trigger on one recently myself. It's easier to learn it by actually sitting down and messing with the menu options yourself than it is to read the manual. Some things in the manual are under-explained or poorly explained, and annoyingly the manual refers to an early firmware version and thus doesn't refer to some menu options that are now available in v2.21.

As others have said, you can use the SD Wave Agent Beta software to split polywave files into stereo files. I was not able to figure out a way to do this splitting in Adobe Audition 3.0, which is what I use once I have a stereo 2-channel file. Has anyone found a way to set the MixPre to simply record into sets of 2-channel stereo files directly when using all the channels? It appears the polywave default is the only option. Not hugely annoying, but it'd be nice to cut out that extra step of using the SD software.

As someone else said, you'll likely want to set the overall mode to "custom" rather than "advanced", and then set channel, headphone, record and metadata options to "advanced" while setting gain to "basic". This is because using gain in advanced mode actually introduces functionality that is less than optimal for taping, as it forces you to set the gain for each channel by using the touch menu screens (and you can't see what the levels look like while you're setting the gain this way), and instead turns the knobs into fader knobs for adjusting the overall L-R mix. This is functionality that might be good for podcasters or some other applications, but for taping a show I just want the gain knobs to be gain knobs where I can see how the levels are changing in real-time when I adjust the gain. I set the L-R mix to off entirely, so the faders are completely unnecessary. If you're planning to use the L-R mix channels, you may want to consider whether setting gain to "advanced" is useful for you, though. I also set the outputs to "basic" because I won't be using the outputs and thus don't need that whole menu to be available. If you're going to be streaming or something though you might want the outputs menu set to "advanced" so you have those menu options.

You'll probably want to set channels 1 and 2 as linked, 3 and 4 as linked and 5 and 6 as linked. The star button is a wild card type of button that can be set to do several different things, but I find it's best to set it to take you to the screen for channels 5 and 6, since the screens for channels 5 and 6 are otherwise more tedious to get to. Also if you're going to be using channels 5 and 6 for a board patch or other line level signal, you'll want to set channels 5 and 6 to "aux in 1" (found under the channels 5 and 6 menu screen) and also (this time under the inputs menu screen) set "aux in mode" to "line". If "aux in mode" is set to "mic", it's telling the MixPre to provide 3v plug-in-power through that input.

Morst, I also was confused by the difference between "off" and "off and linked", but since I'm not using the mix tracks anyway it doesn't matter for me.

Lastly, is anyone else having trouble editing the headphone preset options once they're already set? I assume that for editing the HP presets you use the headphone volume knob to scroll left and right, then click in on the knob to either select or deselect a channel you want assigned to that preset, right? For me, pressing in on the HP knob works to select and deselect certain channels, but not the ones that were already selected for that preset, if that makes sense. In other words, the channels I selected the very first time I made that HP preset appear to be permanently locked to that preset. This seems like a bug to me, very weird!

There are still a few menu options I don't understand, such as the entire tone menu, the "phase" option under each channel, the difference between 1-2 and 1-2MS (for linking channels), and the option under the inputs menu called "MS Decode", which can be set to "ISOs & Mix" or "Mix Only". But I'm not worried about the stuff I don't understand, because I understand how to get it working fully for the purposes I'll be using it for.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rigpimp on July 16, 2018, 04:23:39 PM
So, am about to pull the trigger on a MixPre 6.

I've read the manual. Any advice on getting going quickly with this thing?
I've started reading all the threads, but it's daunting.

I'm assuming Advanced mode...
What connector are you guys using for external power? The full sized USB?
Can it make stereo tracks in pairs or is each track going to be mono?
Any rookie mistakes I can avoid right off the bat?
Things that are not obvious in the beginning?

It should not be that hard to create a cheat sheet in Google Docs.  I will post my xml presets on google drive and link to them in the cheat sheet.  We can all make a google doc that can be modified by anyone.  I'll start it.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: dallman on July 16, 2018, 04:53:29 PM

Morst, I also was confused by the difference between "off" and "off and linked", but since I'm not using the mix tracks anyway it doesn't matter for me.

To Sound Devices:
In v2.21 there is a record setting for the Rec L,R called "Off & Linked" - it's on page two of the Mix control options.
Page 1 has L&R Linked, L&R, L, R
Page 2 has Off, or Off & Linked
Because it was added in the last firmware revision (give or take) It is not covered in the manual. Any insight is appreciated.


From Sound Devices (but incomplete):
The Record controls pertain to the functionality of the Left/Right mix tracks.  The L R buttons allow you to record arm only the left or only the right channel of the Left/Right mix tracks.  L & R record arms both L/R, while the Rec L, R L& R Linked button arms and links the L/R mix tracks.  A function you may find useful on Page 2 of the Rec L, R L& R Linked menu is the OFF button, which disarms recording on the L/R mix tracks.

Kind Regards,

Sean McMahon
Sound Devices, LLC


To Sound Devices:
Hi Sean,
 I understand what you are saying, but there is also a button that says "Off and Linked". This is next to the "off" button on page 2. That is the button I am asking about. Thanks!


From Sound Devices:
The Rec L,R Off and Linked button links the Left and Right track and disarms both.

Thank you and kind regards,

Sean McMahon
Sound Devices, LLC

Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rippleish20 on July 16, 2018, 05:01:43 PM

To Sound Devices:
Hi Sean,
 I understand what you are saying, but there is also a button that says "Off and Linked". This is next to the "off" button on page 2. That is the button I am asking about. Thanks!


From Sound Devices:
The Rec L,R Off and Linked button links the Left and Right track and disarms both.

Thank you and kind regards,

Sean McMahon
Sound Devices, LLC

Oy, that's a helpful answer. 
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Chuck on July 16, 2018, 08:12:45 PM
Well, I got through this thread and I'll most likely pull the trigger tomorrow. Lots of great info here.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: jbell on July 17, 2018, 09:10:10 AM
You won't be disappointed!!  It is a great deck.

Well, I got through this thread and I'll most likely pull the trigger tomorrow. Lots of great info here.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Chuck on July 17, 2018, 09:35:31 AM
I hope so. I JUST ordered it. :)
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Chuck on July 17, 2018, 12:30:49 PM
Reading up like crazy now...

Can anyone explain that Y-cable that comes with the MixPre-6? Is that only useful when powering from a computer? I assume one USB-A connector supplies power and the other allows data transfer? All that can't be done with one USB-A to USB-C cable?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Gordon on July 17, 2018, 12:55:07 PM
the y cable is useless to me.  it's HUGE and bulky and I've heard of others having issues with it.  My pc has a usb c so I go c to c from the mp6 to transfer files.

edit:  for transfer purposes any usb a to c should work in theory.  You may get the "low power" warning but it doesn't matter for transfer.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: justme on July 17, 2018, 01:13:01 PM
It’s only useful for those lacking usb-c with proper PD.
The Y-cable uses power and data from one USB A connector and power only from the other. A single USB A connector can not properly supply the MP with power for all inputs, +48 and other features.

Yes. It’s way beyond thick and annoying to use.

Reading up like crazy now...

Can anyone explain that Y-cable that comes with the MixPre-6? Is that only useful when powering from a computer? I assume one USB-A connector supplies power and the other allows data transfer? All that can't be done with one USB-A to USB-C cable?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Chuck on July 17, 2018, 01:15:00 PM
It’s only useful for those lacking usb-c with proper PD.
The Y-cable uses power and data from one USB A connector and power only from the other. A single USB A connector can not properly supply the MP with power for all inputs, +48 and other features.

Yes. It’s way beyond thick and annoying to use.

Reading up like crazy now...

Can anyone explain that Y-cable that comes with the MixPre-6? Is that only useful when powering from a computer? I assume one USB-A connector supplies power and the other allows data transfer? All that can't be done with one USB-A to USB-C cable?

Thanks guys. That's what I figured.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Gordon on July 17, 2018, 01:21:53 PM
A single USB A connector can not properly supply the MP with power for all inputs, +48 and other features.


not entirely true.  I have a right angle single a to c that powers with the green light and works perfect.  unfortunately I don't know the make/model/link to the cable as it came in a package with my gently used mp6.  seller can't find it either.

Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: justme on July 17, 2018, 01:24:38 PM
Post a pic of it and I’ll get into it and make sure I’ll find it. :)

A single USB A connector can not properly supply the MP with power for all inputs, +48 and other features.


not entirely true.  I have a right angle single a to c that powers with the green light and works perfect.  unfortunately I don't know the make/model/link to the cable as it came in a package with my gently used mp6.  seller can't find it either.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: sos on July 17, 2018, 01:31:21 PM
It was a random eBay purchase (one of several) bought back in the early days leading up to the deck's release, when people were trying to figure out what would work/not. Chinese surprise...
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rigpimp on July 17, 2018, 01:31:45 PM
A single USB A connector can not properly supply the MP with power for all inputs, +48 and other features.


not entirely true.  I have a right angle single a to c that powers with the green light and works perfect.  unfortunately I don't know the make/model/link to the cable as it came in a package with my gently used mp6.  seller can't find it either.

Me too.

Cerrxian 1m Right Angle USB 3.0 Type A Male to USB 3.1 Type C Male Left & Right Angle USB Data Sync and Charge Adapter Cable https://www.amazon.com/dp/B06XP5T78F/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_0GItBbQ7CXSX6
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: edtyre on July 17, 2018, 02:37:11 PM
Thanks for the help. I am pretty much an expert user here, i admin dozens of macs.
My unit just doesn't work via any usb function, i will try another MP3 and cable(s) soon

Not going to use it as an interface anyway, just wanted to see what the excitement was
using as a usb headphone amp.

The dual cable was bad right out of the box, works perfect with usb-c to usb -a cable.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: larrysellers on July 17, 2018, 02:46:44 PM
Glad to hear you got it working Ed.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: dynamicalories on July 17, 2018, 04:02:56 PM
I've only done a couple shows so far but I've been fine running Battery > USB A > USB C > MixPre-6 with the supplied cable.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: K.C. on July 17, 2018, 05:57:19 PM
I can't get my MP6 to play back any files. They play fine on my PC, but not on the recorder. What am I missing?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on July 17, 2018, 06:18:01 PM
I can't get my MP6 to play back any files. They play fine on my PC, but not on the recorder. What am I missing?
Make sure you have firmware v2.21. There was a bug where you lost the ability to play projects back if the card was removed from the MixPre.

I've only done a couple shows so far but I've been fine running Battery > USB A > USB C > MixPre-6 with the supplied cable.

That one is pretty big, and if I don't need to use it, I'd rather tote something smaller!
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: K.C. on July 17, 2018, 06:51:37 PM
I can't get my MP6 to play back any files. They play fine on my PC, but not on the recorder. What am I missing?
Make sure you have firmware v2.21. There was a bug where you lost the ability to play projects back if the card was removed from the MixPre.

I'm on v2.21, so not sure why it doesn't work
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: checht on July 17, 2018, 07:57:14 PM
How about a library of configs to share?

Might be helpful for folks new to the MixPre series.

Just save a config to SD, then copy it to PC in file transfer mode, then upload.

Anyone think this would be useful?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on July 17, 2018, 09:45:12 PM
I can't get my MP6 to play back any files. They play fine on my PC, but not on the recorder. What am I missing?
Do they show up on the recorder and not play? Or do they simply not appear? The bug with the old firmware is that they would not appear, once the card was re-inserted into the MixPre.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: K.C. on July 17, 2018, 10:00:41 PM
I can't get my MP6 to play back any files. They play fine on my PC, but not on the recorder. What am I missing?
Do they show up on the recorder and not play? Or do they simply not appear? The bug with the old firmware is that they would not appear, once the card was re-inserted into the MixPre.

They show up on the recorder, but do not play
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: edtyre on July 19, 2018, 05:36:12 PM
Forgive me if this has been mentioned before, but this thing is a GREAT headphone amp.
I was using a Mytek DSD DAC (1500) into a Rudistar (italian) headphone amp (900)

This might sound better, need more listening but it's very good. Dont like the midget knob.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: aaronji on July 19, 2018, 06:29:18 PM
Dont like the midget knob.

You can get a 3D printed knob extender here (https://store.lom.audio/products/mixpre-knob). Cheap, even with shipping, but he also provides the files to print it yourself.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: sos on July 19, 2018, 07:14:37 PM
Sweet, just ordered a clear one ($9.18 shipped, from Slovakia)...

Thx, aaronji!


EDIT: Received. Took 11 days, via Registered Letter. Fits like a glove (firmly), and will definitely enhance the experience!
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Chuck on July 21, 2018, 01:30:19 AM
Just got my MP-6 today. This thing is really cool. It packs a lot of features in a small package.
Is there any way to activate and use the grayed out symbols when naming presets? Why would they tease me by letting me see them, but grey them out so I can't use them?  ???

Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: mjwin on July 21, 2018, 01:59:14 PM
Is there any way to activate and use the grayed out symbols when naming presets? Why would they tease me by letting me see them, but grey them out so I can't use them?  ???
The issue is that the preset name which you enter has to comply with standard filename conventions,  i.e. no special characters, such as symbols, etc. When you save your preset to the SD card (which is a VERY good idea imho) you will find a file MYNAME.XML in the "SETTINGS" folder of the card. This can then be backed up, or copied to another card, shared with people, etc.  As it's an XML file,  it's readable with any application which can view text, & is quite interesting if you're into that kind of thing...
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Chuck on July 21, 2018, 02:48:10 PM
Is there any way to activate and use the grayed out symbols when naming presets? Why would they tease me by letting me see them, but grey them out so I can't use them?  ???
The issue is that the preset name which you enter has to comply with standard filename conventions,  i.e. no special characters, such as symbols, etc. When you save your preset to the SD card (which is a VERY good idea imho) you will find a file MYNAME.XML in the "SETTINGS" folder of the card. This can then be backed up, or copied to another card, shared with people, etc.  As it's an XML file,  it's readable with any application which can view text, & is quite interesting if you're into that kind of thing...

Awesome answer mjwin! Thank you very much. It might be easier to make presets that way, to use a txt editor. I'm going to give it a try.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on July 21, 2018, 09:51:34 PM
Awesome answer mjwin! Thank you very much. It might be easier to make presets that way, to use a txt editor. I'm going to give it a try.
Good luck. I've opened up a few of my preset .XML's and it looks like a huge bunch of code with very little interesting stuff.
I hope SD eventually makes a PC / Mac / Linux program to let us edit, store & file them.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Chuck on July 22, 2018, 12:34:57 PM
Awesome answer mjwin! Thank you very much. It might be easier to make presets that way, to use a txt editor. I'm going to give it a try.
Good luck. I've opened up a few of my preset .XML's and it looks like a huge bunch of code with very little interesting stuff.
I hope SD eventually makes a PC / Mac / Linux program to let us edit, store & file them.

I have a website, so I'm quite familiar with .XML files. When opened in an HTML editor they make sense and are easy to edit.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rigpimp on July 23, 2018, 01:01:12 PM
I had a few really weird bugs with 2.21 this weekend at the Gorge.  I was powered up and ready to roll and I could not get get wingman to see my recorder.  Wumbo couldn't get his to work either.  My Bluetooth saw neither device.

On night one or two I was ready to roll and physically flipped the power switch OFF and and it would not turn off.  I disconnected my external battery and it flipped to internals.  I had to pull my internal pack to get the deck to power down. 

Why the heck does a deck NOT power down when you hit the kill switch? 
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: checht on July 23, 2018, 01:09:50 PM
I had a few really weird bugs with 2.21 this weekend at the Gorge.  I was powered up and ready to roll and I could not get get wingman to see my recorder.  Wumbo couldn't get his to work either.  My Bluetooth saw neither device.

On night one or two I was ready to roll and physically flipped the power switch OFF and and it would not turn off.  I disconnected my external battery and it flipped to internals.  I had to pull my internal pack to get the deck to power down. 

Why the heck does a deck NOT power down when you hit the kill switch?

Been having the bluetooth bug on 2.2.1 also. Full reset fixed it for 2 shows, but it's back again. I can get bluetooth to work by going into settings and turning it off and back on again. It then shows up in Wingman. Using iOS.

Re: powering down. Any chance you were in play mode? it won't power down in that condition...
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rigpimp on July 23, 2018, 01:31:12 PM
I had a few really weird bugs with 2.21 this weekend at the Gorge.  I was powered up and ready to roll and I could not get get wingman to see my recorder.  Wumbo couldn't get his to work either.  My Bluetooth saw neither device.

On night one or two I was ready to roll and physically flipped the power switch OFF and and it would not turn off.  I disconnected my external battery and it flipped to internals.  I had to pull my internal pack to get the deck to power down. 

Why the heck does a deck NOT power down when you hit the kill switch?

Been having the bluetooth bug on 2.2.1 also. Full reset fixed it for 2 shows, but it's back again. I can get bluetooth to work by going into settings and turning it off and back on again. It then shows up in Wingman. Using iOS.

Re: powering down. Any chance you were in play mode? it won't power down in that condition...

Yes, it was in play mode.  The reason I tried to power down was because hitting the stop button wouldn't stop playing the file.  I'm hoping I didn't corrupt a file but yanking battieres in the middle of playback. 

With my preset I'm forced to turn Bluetooth on every time, intentionally.  I toggled it on/off a couple of times to no avail.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: justme on July 23, 2018, 01:50:55 PM
Regarding power up and down the tiny switch - is that a mechanical or logic power switch?
I've began leaving he MP in power on setting and instead power the unit up and down with my USB-C power bank switch instead.

Not sure it's a recommended solution but it's far more manageable when the MP-3 is stuck deep into the bag all wired up.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: dogmusic on July 23, 2018, 04:03:42 PM
I recently had an opportunity to test the MP6 limiters when an unexpectedly very loud lightning crack came through the mics during a thunderstorm recording. Here's a link to a 45 sec clip containing the sound:

https://app.box.com/s/5rm7j9bhm4i064gywu79hg523obp6xfh

The sound occurs at around the 00:13 sec mark.

CAUTION! It's pretty loud, so be sure to listen first at low volume.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Gordon on July 23, 2018, 04:03:43 PM
I have always had issues with bluetooth/wingman on all firmware versions (i'm on Android).  oddly enough I had no issues at all with it the other night on 2.21
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rigpimp on July 23, 2018, 06:28:18 PM
I have always had issues with bluetooth/wingman on all firmware versions (i'm on Android).  oddly enough I had no issues at all with it the other night on 2.21

This may sound crazy but I'm exactly the opposite.  I've never had any problems with BT/wingman until this weekend on 2.21.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: jbell on July 23, 2018, 06:35:04 PM
I used wingman for the first time the other night with 2.21 no problems, well Gordon did keep hooking up to my deck. 
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Gordon on July 23, 2018, 07:04:14 PM
I used wingman for the first time the other night with 2.21 no problems, well Gordon did keep hooking up to my deck.


You need a password!
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Chuck on July 23, 2018, 07:04:43 PM
I used wingman for the first time the other night with 2.21 no problems, well Gordon did keep hooking up to my deck.


You need a password!

LOL
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on July 25, 2018, 12:20:00 AM
Regarding power up and down the tiny switch - is that a mechanical or logic power switch?
I believe I've noticed a lag in shutting down when it's still writing a file, so I think it's a logic switch. I could easily be mistaken though.


PS look at that lightning bolt limiting from dogmusic's sample. I've noticed the same pattern when I overdrive mine. I like it. Much more easy on the transducers than a square wave!
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: junkyardt on July 28, 2018, 11:07:47 AM
this might be a stupid question, but does anyone know how to type on the mixpre screen? like when it brings up the keyboard to change the filename or something, pressing the letter buttons doesn't do anything. i can get around it for renaming files and naming channels by doing it in the wingman app, but i'm asking specifically for the purpose of setting a bluetooth password. there doesn't seem to be a way to set a password in the app (that i can find), and bringing up that menu option on the mixpre screen and attempting to type doesn't do anything.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Gordon on July 28, 2018, 11:12:12 AM
this might be a stupid question, but does anyone know how to type on the mixpre screen? like when it brings up the keyboard to change the filename or something, pressing the letter buttons doesn't do anything. i can get around it for renaming files and naming channels by doing it in the wingman app, but i'm asking specifically for the purpose of setting a bluetooth password. there doesn't seem to be a way to set a password in the app (that i can find), and bringing up that menu option on the mixpre screen and attempting to type doesn't do anything.

headphone knob or you can connect a usb keyboard.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: junkyardt on July 28, 2018, 11:50:47 AM
^^doh! thanks, the knob didn't occur to me for some reason.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: justme on July 28, 2018, 11:54:35 AM
I one of those wireless keyboards with a tiny USB dongle that identify itself as a keyboard to the Mixpre. Works perfect.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on July 28, 2018, 12:50:19 PM
headphone knob or you can connect a usb keyboard.
Note that the USB port is only able to support a keyboard in "Full Power" mode, not low power mode.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: junkyardt on July 28, 2018, 12:54:32 PM
just playing around with the SD software Wave Agent Beta for the first time on an actual recording of a show, and it was a little confusing at first with the numbering schemes of the channels. i figured it out but i thought i would explain here in case it helps anyone. i have a mixpre-6, and i don't use the L-R mix, only iso tracks. last night i recorded one pair of mics to channels 1 and 2 (xlr) and another pair of mics to channels 5 and 6 (stereo 1/8" aux/mic in) with channels 3 and 4 (xlr) empty/unused. as i see it, there are 3 ways of numbering these tracks:

1) the way they are numbered in/on the mixpre unit itself -- channels 1-4 are xlr, channels 5-6 are aux/mic in or usb or whatever.
2) same as in 1) but including the L-R mix, shifting the numbers accordingly. so the L-R mix is now channels 1-2, channels 1-4 are now 3-6, and channels 5-6 are now 7-8.
3) numbering them in order based on only the channels you happened to use. so in my case, because i used 4 channels, channels 1-2 would be 1-2 and channels 5-6 would be 3-4.

the SD software shows a table where the first two column headings are "channel" and "interleave". the "channel" column uses the numbering scheme in 2), accounting for the L-R mix. the "interleave" column uses the numbering scheme in 3), referring only to the channels used in that particular polywave file. after experimenting with the matrix for splitting files, i realized that the matrix requires you to select the channels you want according to 3) or "interleave". at first i tried selecting according to the numbering scheme in 2), or selecting channels 3-4 and 7-8 as my two output files. this didn't work, as it detected channels 7-8 to be blank, despite listing 7-8 as existing channels under the "channel" column header. a little confusing! anyway, thought i would share this in case it saves someone else a headache.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on July 28, 2018, 01:17:38 PM
Wow, I have not dug that deeply. I just drag them into either Audacity, or Sound Forge, and they pop up in their original channel pairs, titled like they are in the machine.


I don't FLAC my masters for my own archives, so I don't usually need to split things, unless I plan to share something out and want to have lossless compression for the transmit.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Chuck on July 28, 2018, 02:33:49 PM
My first official outing with my MixPre-6 went well on Friday afternoon. I set-up a bunch of pre-sets first to cover the situations I experience most often. I employed ToddR's recommended "set it and forget it" strategy for the soundcheck, but I guess I'm just a tweaker as I went back to using the knobs as gain controls after the soundcheck. I just feel more comfortable with that workflow.
That small LCD screen works great in bright sun.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: dynamicalories on July 29, 2018, 08:50:24 AM
I did my first 4-track recordings with the MixPre yesterday. What a great device. Really easy to use. Splitting the Polywavs was easy as pie.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rigpimp on July 29, 2018, 05:12:56 PM
I did my first 4-track recordings with the MixPre yesterday. What a great device. Really easy to use. Splitting the Polywavs was easy as pie.

I found out recently that Wavelab is working on support for polywavs so hopefully no need to split up in the future
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: dynamicalories on July 29, 2018, 07:05:20 PM
I did my first 4-track recordings with the MixPre yesterday. What a great device. Really easy to use. Splitting the Polywavs was easy as pie.

I found out recently that Wavelab is working on support for polywavs so hopefully no need to split up in the future

I actually really like the workflow because one of my usual venues give me a dual mono board feed, so I can just choose one channel and make a mono file when I do the splitting. (I use Audition CC for most of my work.)
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Gordon on July 30, 2018, 03:09:46 PM
just playing around with the SD software Wave Agent Beta for the first time on an actual recording of a show, and it was a little confusing at first with the numbering schemes of the channels. i figured it out but i thought i would explain here in case it helps anyone. i have a mixpre-6, and i don't use the L-R mix, only iso tracks. last night i recorded one pair of mics to channels 1 and 2 (xlr) and another pair of mics to channels 5 and 6 (stereo 1/8" aux/mic in) with channels 3 and 4 (xlr) empty/unused. as i see it, there are 3 ways of numbering these tracks:

1) the way they are numbered in/on the mixpre unit itself -- channels 1-4 are xlr, channels 5-6 are aux/mic in or usb or whatever.
2) same as in 1) but including the L-R mix, shifting the numbers accordingly. so the L-R mix is now channels 1-2, channels 1-4 are now 3-6, and channels 5-6 are now 7-8.
3) numbering them in order based on only the channels you happened to use. so in my case, because i used 4 channels, channels 1-2 would be 1-2 and channels 5-6 would be 3-4.

the SD software shows a table where the first two column headings are "channel" and "interleave". the "channel" column uses the numbering scheme in 2), accounting for the L-R mix. the "interleave" column uses the numbering scheme in 3), referring only to the channels used in that particular polywave file. after experimenting with the matrix for splitting files, i realized that the matrix requires you to select the channels you want according to 3) or "interleave". at first i tried selecting according to the numbering scheme in 2), or selecting channels 3-4 and 7-8 as my two output files. this didn't work, as it detected channels 7-8 to be blank, despite listing 7-8 as existing channels under the "channel" column header. a little confusing! anyway, thought i would share this in case it saves someone else a headache.



Yea it can be very confusing at first!  I only have one set of mics + sbd feeds so my 1&2 are always mics, 3&4 (if used) are always sbd.  I do not use l/r mix.  So I labeled the channels in the mixpre so they show in waveagent.

The second screen shot shows how to easily split and combine both 1&2 and 3&4 at the same time.


(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/940/29873884968_b43ed53dbb_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/MvRtdd)wa2 (https://flic.kr/p/MvRtdd) by Gordon Wilson (https://www.flickr.com/photos/gordonlw/), on Flickr


(https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1801/42547094295_853e42fd5c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/27PJYPi)wa (https://flic.kr/p/27PJYPi) by Gordon Wilson (https://www.flickr.com/photos/gordonlw/), on Flickr
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: dallman on July 30, 2018, 03:37:39 PM
^^^
That is all good information, I would add the following if you do use the mix:

One time I was playing around before a show and accidentally turned the mix back on which I normally never use.
I assumed that 1 and 2 were mics  1 and 2, 3 and 4 were mics 3 and 4 and so on with the mix being 7 and 8, BUT
when I checked with Sound Devices because the sounds were not jiving with what I expected soundwide (like my omnis sounding more bassy than my cards), I was told by them, the mix is on (polywave) 1 and 2, which did jive with what I was hearing, but seemed to me to be counter intuitive. So my mics 1 and 2 were on (polywave) 3 and 4, my mics 3 and 4 were on (polywave) 5 and 6, and my mics 5 and 6 were on (polywave) 7 and 8.

So unless there is some way to change or select where the mix ends up on the polywave, one might assume they are the last 2 tracks, but they actually are the first 2 tracks
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Chuck on July 30, 2018, 04:48:32 PM
I know it's not supposed to work, but has anyone found a USB-A (battery out) to USB-C (MixPre in) battery/cable that fully powers the MixPre (green light)? The MixPre Remote Powering thread isn't there anymore... ???
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rigpimp on July 30, 2018, 04:59:19 PM
I know it's not supposed to work, but has anyone found a USB-A (battery out) to USB-C (MixPre in) battery/cable that fully powers the MixPre (green light)? The MixPre Remote Powering thread isn't there anymore... ???

Again, this one works for me.  http://a.co/dWMWfuP

I tuck the cable THROUGH the bar in the front left corner and then plug it into the USB-C.  It tends to get in the way of know #1 and #2 a bit less but it helps with strain relief since it is right-angled on both ends.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: justme on July 30, 2018, 05:28:21 PM
I know that this is on the edge of what one should do but I just had to try. :)
I got a bit annoyed over having to fiddle so much when swopping SD cards and then I remembered that I had a couple of SD card extenders somewhere from some previous experiments.

Anyway I tested them in my Mac and ran write and read tests so I decided to try it in my mixpre3.

This way I can route the SD card to be accessible even when bagged tight or without having to remove the sled.
As you can see the sharp edge of the sled do nudge the flat cable so if one would want to be sure it does not cause any serious damage to it, the edge of the sled should be trimmed a bit. And I have not tested the data integrity in a RF noisy environment so I would not recommend this for any serious use. But with better shielding it should be possible.

Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Chuck on July 30, 2018, 05:42:10 PM
I know it's not supposed to work, but has anyone found a USB-A (battery out) to USB-C (MixPre in) battery/cable that fully powers the MixPre (green light)? The MixPre Remote Powering thread isn't there anymore... ???

Again, this one works for me.  http://a.co/dWMWfuP

I tuck the cable THROUGH the bar in the front left corner and then plug it into the USB-C.  It tends to get in the way of know #1 and #2 a bit less but it helps with strain relief since it is right-angled on both ends.

Hmmm... OK. It must be my battery then, because I bought that cable and this battery https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01KYUDAN4/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 and my MixPre-6 won't even power up with that cable. I tries to boot, but all I see is the firmware page then it powers down and tries to reboot again endlessly.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Chuck on July 30, 2018, 05:53:23 PM
I did my first 4-track recordings with the MixPre yesterday. What a great device. Really easy to use. Splitting the Polywavs was easy as pie.

I found out recently that Wavelab is working on support for polywavs so hopefully no need to split up in the future

FWIW, CuBase 5 supports them. The version I have does import them either all together or on individual tracks, not paired though.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rigpimp on July 30, 2018, 06:04:55 PM
Hmmm... OK. It must be my battery then, because I bought that cable and this battery https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01KYUDAN4/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 and my MixPre-6 won't even power up with that cable. I tries to boot, but all I see is the firmware page then it powers down and tries to reboot again endlessly.

That would be my guess then.  I use this battery:  http://a.co/chzO2XT
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rippleish20 on July 30, 2018, 06:50:13 PM

If you are using this battery, which has a USB-C output, why wouldnt you just use a USB-C to USB-C cable? An amazon basics cable is like $7


I know it's not supposed to work, but has anyone found a USB-A (battery out) to USB-C (MixPre in) battery/cable that fully powers the MixPre (green light)? The MixPre Remote Powering thread isn't there anymore... ???

Again, this one works for me.  http://a.co/dWMWfuP

I tuck the cable THROUGH the bar in the front left corner and then plug it into the USB-C.  It tends to get in the way of know #1 and #2 a bit less but it helps with strain relief since it is right-angled on both ends.

Hmmm... OK. It must be my battery then, because I bought that cable and this battery https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01KYUDAN4/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 and my MixPre-6 won't even power up with that cable. I tries to boot, but all I see is the firmware page then it powers down and tries to reboot again endlessly.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rigpimp on July 30, 2018, 07:13:57 PM
Ha, I did not even notice it had USB-C.  Good call.


If you are using this battery, which has a USB-C output, why wouldnt you just use a USB-C to USB-C cable? An amazon basics cable is like $7

Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Chuck on July 30, 2018, 07:54:46 PM

If you are using this battery, which has a USB-C output, why wouldnt you just use a USB-C to USB-C cable? An amazon basics cable is like $7


I know it's not supposed to work, but has anyone found a USB-A (battery out) to USB-C (MixPre in) battery/cable that fully powers the MixPre (green light)? The MixPre Remote Powering thread isn't there anymore... ???

Again, this one works for me.  http://a.co/dWMWfuP

I tuck the cable THROUGH the bar in the front left corner and then plug it into the USB-C.  It tends to get in the way of know #1 and #2 a bit less but it helps with strain relief since it is right-angled on both ends.

Hmmm... OK. It must be my battery then, because I bought that cable and this battery https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01KYUDAN4/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 and my MixPre-6 won't even power up with that cable. I tries to boot, but all I see is the firmware page then it powers down and tries to reboot again endlessly.

Oh, I do. I have a straight USB-C to straight USB-C cable that works great. I'm just looking for a right angle to right angle cable that works too.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: jbell on July 30, 2018, 08:13:54 PM
These work!  I wish I could find a right angle cable that was only a 1 ft. 

https://www.amazon.com/CableCreation-Braided-Macbook-Nintendo-Aluminum/dp/B01N41JUI4/ref=sr_1_15?ie=UTF8&qid=1532995961&sr=8-15&keywords=Right+angle+usb+c+to+usb+c+cable


If you are using this battery, which has a USB-C output, why wouldnt you just use a USB-C to USB-C cable? An amazon basics cable is like $7


I know it's not supposed to work, but has anyone found a USB-A (battery out) to USB-C (MixPre in) battery/cable that fully powers the MixPre (green light)? The MixPre Remote Powering thread isn't there anymore... ???

Again, this one works for me.  http://a.co/dWMWfuP

I tuck the cable THROUGH the bar in the front left corner and then plug it into the USB-C.  It tends to get in the way of know #1 and #2 a bit less but it helps with strain relief since it is right-angled on both ends.

Hmmm... OK. It must be my battery then, because I bought that cable and this battery https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01KYUDAN4/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 and my MixPre-6 won't even power up with that cable. I tries to boot, but all I see is the firmware page then it powers down and tries to reboot again endlessly.

Oh, I do. I have a straight USB-C to straight USB-C cable that works great. I'm just looking for a right angle to right angle cable that works too.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Gordon on July 31, 2018, 11:44:57 AM
I know it's not supposed to work, but has anyone found a USB-A (battery out) to USB-C (MixPre in) battery/cable that fully powers the MixPre (green light)? The MixPre Remote Powering thread isn't there anymore... ???

Again, this one works for me.  http://a.co/dWMWfuP

I tuck the cable THROUGH the bar in the front left corner and then plug it into the USB-C.  It tends to get in the way of know #1 and #2 a bit less but it helps with strain relief since it is right-angled on both ends.

Hmmm... OK. It must be my battery then, because I bought that cable and this battery https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01KYUDAN4/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 and my MixPre-6 won't even power up with that cable. I tries to boot, but all I see is the firmware page then it powers down and tries to reboot again endlessly.

Are you using C on the mixpre side and A on the battery?  I have the same battery and the below cable that came from SoS when I bought my mixpre from him.  He no longer had the cable in his ebay sales history so we were unsure the exact one..  Anyway it works!  The sticker on it says "0110006j" so googling I found these on amazon denmark:

https://www.amazon.de/geflochten-rechts-gewinkelt-Ladeger%C3%A4t-Daten-Sync-Kabel/dp/B06VXB1W8P?th=1

So I googled "1M 2A Braided 90 Degree Right Angled USB 3.1 Type C Charger Data Sync Cable".  Looks like this is it, from hong kong on ebay....

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1M-2A-Braided-90-Degree-Right-Angled-USB-3-1-Type-C-Charger-Data-Sync-Cable-Cord/332056692769?hash=item4d501f0821%3Am%3Am_IHzv_LCgQI2iVwZVqqKhQ&var=541089383410&_sacat=0&_nkw=1M+2A+Braided+90+Degree+Right+Angled+USB+3.1+Type+C+Charger+Data+Sync+Cable&_from=R40&rt=nc&LH_TitleDesc=0



That said I also have the c>c Jbell linked to. 


(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/850/43048542664_0692489f95_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/28A42WQ)2018-07-31 08.47.33 (https://flic.kr/p/28A42WQ) by Gordon Wilson (https://www.flickr.com/photos/gordonlw/), on Flickr


(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/942/43764260231_331676a3a4_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/29FigQT)2018-07-31 11.24.57 (https://flic.kr/p/29FigQT) by Gordon Wilson (https://www.flickr.com/photos/gordonlw/), on Flickr


(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/857/28828370557_94ea69b79a_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/KVsWcF)2018-07-31 11.25.04 (https://flic.kr/p/KVsWcF) by Gordon Wilson (https://www.flickr.com/photos/gordonlw/), on Flickr


(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/854/43764259161_7a7496af15_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/29Figwr)2018-07-31 11.25.09 (https://flic.kr/p/29Figwr) by Gordon Wilson (https://www.flickr.com/photos/gordonlw/), on Flickr




Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Chuck on July 31, 2018, 12:16:34 PM
Gordon, I bought that cable too. It took forever to get here. I put the USB-A side into the battery and the USB-C side into the MixPre. When I turn on the power my MixPre tries to boot, but doesn't make it all the way. I'll have to test it again. No biggie, because I do have a couple of 2x USB-C cables that work fine. Is there a setting that needs to be changed?

I know it's not supposed to work, but has anyone found a USB-A (battery out) to USB-C (MixPre in) battery/cable that fully powers the MixPre (green light)? The MixPre Remote Powering thread isn't there anymore... ???

Again, this one works for me.  http://a.co/dWMWfuP

I tuck the cable THROUGH the bar in the front left corner and then plug it into the USB-C.  It tends to get in the way of know #1 and #2 a bit less but it helps with strain relief since it is right-angled on both ends.

Hmmm... OK. It must be my battery then, because I bought that cable and this battery https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01KYUDAN4/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 and my MixPre-6 won't even power up with that cable. I tries to boot, but all I see is the firmware page then it powers down and tries to reboot again endlessly.

Are you using C on the mixpre side and A on the battery?  I have the same battery and the below cable that came from SoS when I bought my mixpre from him.  He no longer had the cable in his ebay sales history so we were unsure the exact one..  Anyway it works!  The sticker on it says "0110006j" so googling I found these on amazon denmark:

https://www.amazon.de/geflochten-rechts-gewinkelt-Ladeger%C3%A4t-Daten-Sync-Kabel/dp/B06VXB1W8P?th=1

So I googled "1M 2A Braided 90 Degree Right Angled USB 3.1 Type C Charger Data Sync Cable".  Looks like this is it, from hong kong on ebay....

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1M-2A-Braided-90-Degree-Right-Angled-USB-3-1-Type-C-Charger-Data-Sync-Cable-Cord/332056692769?hash=item4d501f0821%3Am%3Am_IHzv_LCgQI2iVwZVqqKhQ&var=541089383410&_sacat=0&_nkw=1M+2A+Braided+90+Degree+Right+Angled+USB+3.1+Type+C+Charger+Data+Sync+Cable&_from=R40&rt=nc&LH_TitleDesc=0



That said I also have the c>c Jbell linked to. 


(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/850/43048542664_0692489f95_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/28A42WQ)2018-07-31 08.47.33 (https://flic.kr/p/28A42WQ) by Gordon Wilson (https://www.flickr.com/photos/gordonlw/), on Flickr


(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/942/43764260231_331676a3a4_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/29FigQT)2018-07-31 11.24.57 (https://flic.kr/p/29FigQT) by Gordon Wilson (https://www.flickr.com/photos/gordonlw/), on Flickr


(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/857/28828370557_94ea69b79a_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/KVsWcF)2018-07-31 11.25.04 (https://flic.kr/p/KVsWcF) by Gordon Wilson (https://www.flickr.com/photos/gordonlw/), on Flickr


(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/854/43764259161_7a7496af15_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/29Figwr)2018-07-31 11.25.09 (https://flic.kr/p/29Figwr) by Gordon Wilson (https://www.flickr.com/photos/gordonlw/), on Flickr
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Gordon on July 31, 2018, 12:19:30 PM
hmm.  works fine here.  you know you have to hit the button on the battery to power it on.  Also I have AA in the sled as backup so perhaps that helps it boot then switches to usb??
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: mjwin on July 31, 2018, 01:42:49 PM
Hmmm... OK. It must be my battery then, because I bought that cable and this battery https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01KYUDAN4/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 and my MixPre-6 won't even power up with that cable. I tries to boot, but all I see is the firmware page then it powers down and tries to reboot again endlessly.
Regardless of cable or USB power source, the MixPre should behave in a defined way and not go into this uncontrolled loop.

But this is very interesting, as my MP6 has (had) the same problem at times.

When the problem occurs, do you have a secondary power source  i.e. battery sled connected?  If so, the MixPre should bring up a screen saying  "USB power is low, do you want to use "battery power?" If you choose "yes", all should be fine with a green battery indicator on screen. If you choose "no", the device should still power-up but in low-power mode with an amber USB power indicator.

Before chucking your USB cable, or tearing your hair out (or both), you could try the "load factory defaults" system reset:
Today I called tech-support and the tech suggested I try a reset which consisted of holding the headphone knob and the channel one knob down while powering up and keeping them held down until I got to the home screen.

I don't know if you have loaded and saved your own presets, but I have a feeling (unconfirmed) that there's an elusive bug somewhere in there which causes this boot-up loop if the preset file becomes corrupted in some way.  With my MP6, the factory reset seemed to cure the problem until I loaded my bad preset file...
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Chuck on July 31, 2018, 01:51:29 PM
Hmmm... Thanks for posting. I'll do some more research and let you know what I find. I have two USB-A to USB-C right angle cables that people say work for them, but don't work for me. I haven't tried to reset the device yet, because it functions great for me except for that USB issue, which really isn't a huge bother.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: jbell on July 31, 2018, 02:56:07 PM
I bought a couple of usb a > usb c cables that others claimed worked for them, but never worked for my deck.  I only tried them since I had a bunch of usb a batteries.  Eventually I gave up and bought an approved Anker and use usb c > usb c cable. 



 



Hmmm... Thanks for posting. I'll do some more research and let you know what I find. I have two USB-A to USB-C right angle cables that people say work for them, but don't work for me. I haven't tried to reset the device yet, because it functions great for me except for that USB issue, which really isn't a huge bother.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: checht on July 31, 2018, 03:21:04 PM
Never had any issues using this USB A -> C cable or the following C -> C cable with the Monoprice battery. Both are from Amazon:

A - C
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B077JLLCW1/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1

C - C
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01MSMOMAR/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Chuck on July 31, 2018, 06:03:11 PM
Thanks for all the help guys. My findings...

When I pushed the headphone knob and channel one knob in at the same time and rebooted the MP6 it didn't erase the firmware or any of the stored pre-sets. It did bring up the "Would You Like to Run on Battery Power" message which is good. So, the power up and power down cycle is history.

Neither of these USB-A to USB-C cables:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B06XP5T78F/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

https://www.ebay.com/itm/3FT-Right-Angle-Micro-USB-or-USB-C-to-Left-Angle-USB-2-0-Charger-Sync-Data-Cable/162327537413?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&var=461341515784&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

Run on full power with this battery:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01KYUDAN4/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
 
I get the orange bar with any combination of those items. Which is no big deal. I'm just reporting my findings.

This cable gives me the green bar with that battery:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01GMZP2I6/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

So, I ordered another one as a spare.

Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: borjam on July 31, 2018, 08:08:18 PM
I have been playing with my MixPre 3 a bit, hooking it to a laboratory power supply, a multimeter and an oscilloscope.

The thing really needs power: more than 850 mA with a single channel recording and the voltage at 5.2 V (a reasonably healthy pack of NiMH). Lowering voltage the unit's internal voltage regulators pulled even more current, reaching 950 mA.

I wouldn't use batteries with just a USB-A output. The advantage of USB-C is that there is less uncertainty.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Chuck on July 31, 2018, 08:36:24 PM
I just ran 4 of these: https://www.amazon.com/Powerex-MHRAAAI4-Imedion-Rechargeable-Batteries/dp/B003LWP0OU/ref=sr_1_7?ie=UTF8&qid=1533083379&sr=8-7&keywords=batteries+powerex through the Refresh option on this: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000RSOV50/?tag=ahjoo-20 I tested them twice and got 2 hours of run time on my MP6 recording 4 channels with 2 Microtech Gefell M300's (P 48, DIN 45596, IEC 268-15): 3.3 mA) the other two channels line input and I got 2 hours of run-time.

The batteries are about 8 years old! So, to say the least, I'm impressed with how well it handles power management.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Chuck on August 01, 2018, 12:33:53 PM
Anyone want to trade one of these:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01MSMOMAR/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1

for these two?:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B06XP5T78F/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

https://www.ebay.com/itm/3FT-Right-Angle-Micro-USB-or-USB-C-to-Left-Angle-USB-2-0-Charger-Sync-Data-Cable/162327537413?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&var=461341515784&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

 ;D
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: checht on August 02, 2018, 08:41:02 PM
Ignorant question:

How do you de-select a source when editing a headphone preset? I mistakenly added the L mix to one, and can't figure out how to undo.

~Thanks, Chris
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on August 03, 2018, 04:56:59 AM
Ignorant question:

How do you de-select a source when editing a headphone preset? I mistakenly added the L mix to one, and can't figure out how to undo.
I could be super-wrong since this is from "memory" and not referencing the machine or the manual, but I think you roll the cursor around with the headphone level knob, and click it in towards the machine to toggle each source being on or off in each headphone mix.




???
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: junkyardt on August 04, 2018, 10:32:41 AM
Ignorant question:

How do you de-select a source when editing a headphone preset? I mistakenly added the L mix to one, and can't figure out how to undo.

~Thanks, Chris

yeah, I asked about this same issue in this thread a few weeks back:


Lastly, is anyone else having trouble editing the headphone preset options once they're already set? I assume that for editing the HP presets you use the headphone volume knob to scroll left and right, then click in on the knob to either select or deselect a channel you want assigned to that preset, right? For me, pressing in on the HP knob works to select and deselect certain channels, but not the ones that were already selected for that preset, if that makes sense. In other words, the channels I selected the very first time I made that HP preset appear to be permanently locked to that preset. This seems like a bug to me, very weird!


i haven't figured it out either. the way morst describes it is the way it SHOULD work, but it doesn't. once you have selected certain channels as part of a HP preset, it appears impossible to deselect them. very odd, i think it might be a bug. i'm going to email SD about it soon. fwiw, i've noticed the same issue in the outputs menu (choosing which channels are fed through the stereo out).
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: checht on August 04, 2018, 11:22:26 AM
^ Exactly my problem.

Calling SD monday.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: borjam on August 04, 2018, 05:03:51 PM
This is what I’ve found.

There is a small bug in the headphone preset edition. Fortunately there is a workaround.

Depending on how the recorder is configured you can route inputs pre or post fader to the headphone output, or just pre fader if you are not using the mixing facilities, ie, your gain settings are in basic mode. In that case you can make only selections that make sense.

For example, my recorder is configured as follows:

Channel: Advanced
Gain: Basic
Headphone: Advanced
Record: Advanced
Metadata: Advanced
Outputs: Advanced

I record only ISOs, not a stereo mix. So my headphone preset has inputs 1, 2 and 3 assigned to both headphone channels. Nothing fancy.

With the gain in basic mode it makes no sense to talk of LR mix, because the knobs become gain controls rather than mixer faders.

The bug is: I have tried to select the L and R channels from the stereo mix assigning them to headphone outputs and it works, while it shouldn’t. The trouble is, once I have selected them I can’t deselect them so I have effectively broken my headphone preset.

Fortunately there is a workaround: change gain to advanced mode so that the knobs become mixer faders again and hence the LR stereo mix makes sense, and you will be able to deselect them again.

I guess the same can happen if you have routed post fader inputs to the headphone outputs and you have changed gain to basic mode or something of the sort. I’ll report it to SD so that they can fix it in the next version.

Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Chuck on August 04, 2018, 05:42:22 PM
Last night I had the opportunity to utilize the Wingman app. I was at the Arvada Center in Arvada, CO. The best place to put my stand was on a ledge that was on top of the soundboard area. I was able to monitor my levels and recorder status from about 9 yards away at my lawn seat. It was pretty cool to see that everything was well by viewing my phone without having my bag right in-front of me. I love this thing! Its my favorite recorder ever. ;D
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: checht on August 06, 2018, 11:43:32 AM
Update on the headphone preset editing issue. From SD:

'Thank you for contacting us. This issue only appears in Custom mode when setting Gain: Basic and Headphone: Advanced. Upon further testing, Basic and Advanced Mode does not have this issue. Thank you for bringing this to our attention.'
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: borjam on August 06, 2018, 03:14:03 PM
I received exactly the same answer.

So now they know. The custom/basic/advanced options create quite a complicated entanglement of options ;)
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: lovebuzz on August 09, 2018, 03:11:07 PM
I haven't been keeping up this thread at all, I haven't logged in much lately.  Can someone tell me how to disable ch 1 and 2?  At one point i read something about a firmware update that included the option to disable recording the overall mix (ch 1 and 2).

Thanks.  These are long threads.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: checht on August 09, 2018, 03:23:24 PM
Record:Rec L,R:Off
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: TheImplodingVoice on August 09, 2018, 05:16:33 PM
Hi, everyone. I'm in New Jersey and I'd like to check out a MixPre-6 in person. I was offered to check one out in Washington, DC but I haven't had the chance to drive down to do it.
Is anyone in NJ / NYC / Philadelphia willing to let me see the MixPre-6 in person? I'm debating on MixPre-3 (and using Sony M10 for extra channels), or getting the MixPre-6. Need to determine if the 6 is small enough for stealth. Can meet at a show or to just to get a drink. Thank you.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Paul Isaacs on August 09, 2018, 05:36:54 PM
Gotham Sound in NY have them. They're cool folk. They'll help you out.
https://www.gothamsound.com/product/mixpre-3-recorder
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: junkyardt on August 09, 2018, 05:39:57 PM
I'm debating on MixPre-3 (and using Sony M10 for extra channels), or getting the MixPre-6. Need to determine if the 6 is small enough for stealth.

what type of situation are you referring to by stealth, exactly? i just got a mixpre-6 recently, and i certainly consider it to be stealthable in terms of shows where open taping isn't allowed at small clubs that have no security -- the types of shows where there's a ticket taker and ID checker and otherwise you just walk right in. if, however, you're referring to being able to get the mixpre-6 (or 3) into arenas and other venues that use walkthrough detectors, wands and thorough patdowns, probably not. without getting into stealth talk too much, as that's frowned upon around here, you'd definitely have to be really creative and go above and beyond the norm to make the mixpres work in that scenario. i'm not planning on using it in those types of scenarios. and furthermore, i'm not sure the size difference between the 3 and 6 would be big enough to make a difference in this regard, as they both contain quite a bit of metal i think, and both would be easily found by any semi-competent door search.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: TheImplodingVoice on August 09, 2018, 06:36:15 PM
Any type of stealthing, including the latter type you recommended. Metal isn't the problem; it's the size, and it's a good point you made that their size is almost the same.
Without the battery, we're talking 1.3" and .3" additional, which isn't much. It's the square shape that makes it challenging to walk in.
5.68” x 4.35” versus 6.53” x 4.65”

For reference, a Sony M10 is 4.5" x 2.5" area, and I find that easy to bring in anywhere.
A Sonosax SX-M2 preamp's area is 5.75″ x 3.4″.

I'm debating on MixPre-3 (and using Sony M10 for extra channels), or getting the MixPre-6. Need to determine if the 6 is small enough for stealth.

what type of situation are you referring to by stealth, exactly? i just got a mixpre-6 recently, and i certainly consider it to be stealthable in terms of shows where open taping isn't allowed at small clubs that have no security -- the types of shows where there's a ticket taker and ID checker and otherwise you just walk right in. if, however, you're referring to being able to get the mixpre-6 (or 3) into arenas and other venues that use walkthrough detectors, wands and thorough patdowns, probably not. without getting into stealth talk too much, as that's frowned upon around here, you'd definitely have to be really creative and go above and beyond the norm to make the mixpres work in that scenario. i'm not planning on using it in those types of scenarios. and furthermore, i'm not sure the size difference between the 3 and 6 would be big enough to make a difference in this regard, as they both contain quite a bit of metal i think, and both would be easily found by any semi-competent door search.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: TheImplodingVoice on August 09, 2018, 06:37:35 PM
Thank you; I'll contact them about checking one out before buying.
Are there preferred retailers out there?

Gotham Sound in NY have them. They're cool folk. They'll help you out.
https://www.gothamsound.com/product/mixpre-3-recorder
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: TheImplodingVoice on August 09, 2018, 06:55:48 PM
I just discovered the 3M and 6M models. I read the Comparison on sounddevices.com and the 3M and 6M are for recording concerts, whereas the 3 and 6 are for Video use. Is that correct?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rippleish20 on August 09, 2018, 07:22:04 PM
I just discovered the 3M and 6M models. I read the Comparison on sounddevices.com and the 3M and 6M are for recording concerts, whereas the 3 and 6 are for Video use. Is that correct?

I believe you will find that the non M versions are better for our purposes.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: relefunt on August 09, 2018, 09:48:22 PM
I just discovered the 3M and 6M models. I read the Comparison on sounddevices.com and the 3M and 6M are for recording concerts, whereas the 3 and 6 are for Video use. Is that correct?

 My understanding is that the M versions are more geared to M-usicians recording their own music and/or using a DAW. Why they are $100 less and yet it costs $100 extra for the software to be added to a regular MixPre6 is what I can’t figure out. Not that I’ve tried very hard to find out.

To the person who asked if there are any preferred retailers, I couldn’t find any difference in price anywhere, and no difference in any accessories. I just yesterday ordered one from Sweetwater who have treated me well in the past and are relatively close to me (although the factory is closer).

Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: borjam on August 10, 2018, 02:28:01 AM
I just discovered the 3M and 6M models. I read the Comparison on sounddevices.com and the 3M and 6M are for recording concerts, whereas the 3 and 6 are for Video use. Is that correct?

Not quite.

The M versions are suited to musicians who wish to record multiple tracks and mix them in box without using a DAW, doing overdubs, etc. They are great to record rehearsals without lunging a computer, audio interface, etc.

For field recording (including concerts) features such as MS decoding (which is absent from the M versions) are really important, while overdub, reverb and such are useless.

So: the best option is the non M version.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on August 10, 2018, 03:13:50 AM
M versions lack the bluetooth hardware and the USB-A port for a keyboard to type in track info. I don't find either all that useful, since the Wingman app is crashy, but it is hardware that they don't have to include on the M series. Software to them doesn't cost extra, but if we bought the boxes without it, it would be natural to assume that they'd charge for it.


Speaking of software, I hope they release some sort of freebie to let us check it out. Or maybe open it up so we could write out own plugins?! Third Party party??  :tomato: :smash: :wink2: :yack: :yahoo: 
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: IronFilm on August 13, 2018, 11:28:52 PM
I just discovered the 3M and 6M models. I read the Comparison on sounddevices.com and the 3M and 6M are for recording concerts, whereas the 3 and 6 are for Video use. Is that correct?

 My understanding is that the M versions are more geared to M-usicians recording their own music and/or using a DAW. Why they are $100 less and yet it costs $100 extra for the software to be added to a regular MixPre6 is what I can’t figure out. Not that I’ve tried very hard to find out.

Because the M versions miss out on a bit more than just the Music add on software. For instance the M versions can never ever do TC, for some people that would be a very big loss indeed. Thus the cheaper price.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: zorba on August 14, 2018, 01:27:56 PM
If I understand, in advanced mode frontal knobs act as fader and don't control channel's gain. I prefer to have gains control, is it possible to set a custom mode for controlling the gain with frontal knobs?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Gordon on August 14, 2018, 01:48:25 PM
If I understand, in advanced mode frontal knobs act as fader and don't control channel's gain. I prefer to have gains control, is it possible to set a custom mode for controlling the gain with frontal knobs?

custom mode, everything advanced except gain to basic.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: zorba on August 14, 2018, 05:09:39 PM

custom mode, everything advanced except gain to basic.

Ok, thanks. I do not understand the utility of this dual stage control. I suppose that the frontal knob may control the gain in a simple way.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: junkyardt on August 14, 2018, 05:49:48 PM

custom mode, everything advanced except gain to basic.

Ok, thanks. I do not understand the utility of this dual stage control. I suppose that the frontal knob may control the gain in a simple way.

I think setting gain mode to advanced and having the knobs act as faders is more for podcasters and people who need to balance several channels in an overall L-R mix on the fly. wouldn't really be useful for concert taping. also, I would add that in custom mode you could consider setting outputs to basic unless you actually need the outputs for some reason. i'll probably hardly ever use them so i set them to basic.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: aaronji on August 14, 2018, 06:39:03 PM
^ I use advanced mode. I set the levels based on the overload point of the mics, with some extra gain based on how loud I expect the show to be (but generally a little conservative). An advantage of doing it this way is that you have a hold function of sorts; if you jostle the knobs, you only affect the mix.

In custom mode (basic gain), the knobs actually control some mix of pre- and post-fade gain. SD confirmed this to be the case, but was kind of cagey about the details...
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rippleish20 on August 14, 2018, 06:41:16 PM
I also use advanced mode - it's not clear to me what is happening when you use custom mode to have the channel knobs control gain. I route two channels (of the four I typically record) to the output (post fader)  for streaming and only use the channel knobs to increase the volume going to the output.

I like to understand how things work. In advanced mode, there are two gain stages. The knob on the side is used to set the trim level for the ISOs (at the PRE, pre-fader) and the channel knobs control a secondary gain stage, the level of the channels going into the L/R mix (fader). Are these two different analog gain stages, is one of them a digital gain, etc? When you set the mode to custom and everything to advanced except gain, this brings it down to one gain stage and ISOs are written post fader. But what does this mean? Is the channel knob controlling the analog PRE trim level or is it a digital gain that happens after the PRE's? I owned a F8 prior to the Mixpre and it came with a schematic. In A F8 the fader is a secondary gain stage after the the sound has left the PRE.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: aaronji on August 14, 2018, 07:10:55 PM
^ Based on several e-mails with SD, there are definitely two gain stages: 76 dB at the pre and 20 dB at the fader. They weren't super specific, but my interpretation of their responses is that the pre gain is analog and the fader gain is digital (or, at least, mostly so). In custom mode, with basic gain, they confirmed that it is a mix of the two stages, but wouldn't say where the digital portion kicked in. They did say that, due to their pre/ADC architecture, the analog and digital gain would be indistinguishable both audibly and visually (on the waveform). Not sure if that helps or not!
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: willndmb on August 14, 2018, 09:39:37 PM
Maybe it's just me but this thing seems so complex that's it's total overkill for what we do, no?
I don't understand why or why not I would want the 6 vs 6m either
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on August 14, 2018, 11:44:37 PM
Maybe it's just me but this thing seems so complex that's it's total overkill for what we do, no?
I don't understand why or why not I would want the 6 vs 6m either


They're not  made for "what we do," they are made to sell! SD made something marketed mainly for podcasters, but which happens to work for "what we do."


I am thinking that I might like having the gain controls "hidden" now that I have some idea what I'm going for!??! Since I don't record L,R Mix, it would function like a partial "hold" feature, though it would not prevent the stop button from getting pressed, on the machine or on Wingman!?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Paul Isaacs on August 15, 2018, 12:22:53 PM
Maybe it's just me but this thing seems so complex that's it's total overkill for what we do, no?
I don't understand why or why not I would want the 6 vs 6m either

Basically the M models operate like a DAW (Protools, Logic etc) where you can track, overdub, punch in/out, export/import, metronome, add effects etc.
The non 'M' models operates like a traditional field recorder i.e. where you capture individual recordings, i.e. no overdubbing.

These two ways of operating require fundamentally different record/playback engines. The M models need to be able to record and playback simultaneously.

For those who want both modes of operation (e.g. if you do a bit of field recording and a bit of music creation), you can buy the non-M models and buy a plugin to get the 'M' DAW-like functionality.

Paul


Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rippleish20 on August 15, 2018, 01:11:08 PM
^ Based on several e-mails with SD, there are definitely two gain stages: 76 dB at the pre and 20 dB at the fader. They weren't super specific, but my interpretation of their responses is that the pre gain is analog and the fader gain is digital (or, at least, mostly so). In custom mode, with basic gain, they confirmed that it is a mix of the two stages, but wouldn't say where the digital portion kicked in. They did say that, due to their pre/ADC architecture, the analog and digital gain would be indistinguishable both audibly and visually (on the waveform). Not sure if that helps or not!

Thank you. All of this in line with what I've read but, in the end, it's not really clear exactly whats going on.
 

Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Johannes on August 16, 2018, 03:52:39 AM
Thank you. All of this in line with what I've read but, in the end, it's not really clear exactly whats going on.
At the end it does not matter at all. The noise level of this unit is so low and the limiter so good that no matter how you set your gain: your recording will be usable ;-)

Johannes
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: dogmusic on August 16, 2018, 08:16:11 AM
Thank you. All of this in line with what I've read but, in the end, it's not really clear exactly whats going on.
At the end it does not matter at all. The noise level of this unit is so low and the limiter so good that no matter how you set your gain: your recording will be usable ;-)

Johannes

This is why I have previously suggested that there is actually no analog gain control but that setting levels is always post ADC.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: borjam on August 16, 2018, 09:33:57 AM
This is why I have previously suggested that there is actually no analog gain control but that setting levels is always post ADC.
They say it quite clear. The maximum analog gain is 75 dB. And indeed, with the gain control set to "advanced" you have access to the
analog preamplifier gain.

If you apply gain with the fader then you are applying digital gain. And you can achieve a maximum of 96 dB from microphone to recording.

Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rippleish20 on August 16, 2018, 09:54:16 AM
Thank you. All of this in line with what I've read but, in the end, it's not really clear exactly whats going on.
At the end it does not matter at all. The noise level of this unit is so low and the limiter so good that no matter how you set your gain: your recording will be usable ;-)

Johannes

I understand the concept. I prefer to do the minimum on my recordings post production so it does matter to me. More importantly, I am interested in knowing how it works! I do recognize that it probably makes zero difference noise wise.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: gewwang on August 16, 2018, 10:04:38 AM
Thank you. All of this in line with what I've read but, in the end, it's not really clear exactly whats going on.
At the end it does not matter at all. The noise level of this unit is so low and the limiter so good that no matter how you set your gain: your recording will be usable ;-)

Johannes

I understand the concept. I prefer to do the minimum on my recordings post production so it does matter to me. More importantly, I am interested in knowing how it works! I do recognize that it probably makes zero difference noise wise.


How do you determine what level to set your gain to?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: spyder9 on August 16, 2018, 11:42:36 AM
^^^  Agreed. How do you determine what level to set your gain? 

Also, why is the Mix levels way-hotter than my Mic levels?  Is Gain, in Advanced mode, applied to the Mix recording or the Mic recording? 
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rippleish20 on August 16, 2018, 12:39:16 PM
^^^  Agreed. How do you determine what level to set your gain? 

Also, why is the Mix levels way-hotter than my Mic levels?  Is Gain, in Advanced mode, applied to the Mix recording or the Mic recording?

In advanced mode, you select a channel using the big channel/fader knob, use the touch screen to drill down to "gain" and use the knob on the side to adjust trim (gain at the the pre stage). The Channel knobs themselves control the second stage gain, the volume of the track going into the mix.

"How do you determine what level to set your gain?" I'm not sure exactly what is meant by this question. I use advanced mode and the above process to set the level. I shoot for +12 to +6 in the recording itself. If I am using microphones, I start  +18db gain wise. SBDs are more problematic as they vary enormously. Being in for soundchecks helps quite a but I typically start at +6 db but can end up from -2 to 30db gain wise (these numbers are relative to what the mixpre starts with, when in advanced mode, when setting a channel to "microphone" or "line".

Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: gewwang on August 16, 2018, 01:24:54 PM
^^^  Agreed. How do you determine what level to set your gain? 

Also, why is the Mix levels way-hotter than my Mic levels?  Is Gain, in Advanced mode, applied to the Mix recording or the Mic recording?

In advanced mode, you select a channel using the big channel/fader knob, use the touch screen to drill down to "gain" and use the knob on the side to adjust trim (gain at the the pre stage). The Channel knobs themselves control the second stage gain, the volume of the track going into the mix.

"How do you determine what level to set your gain?" I'm not sure exactly what is meant by this question. I use advanced mode and the above process to set the level. I shoot for +12 to +6 in the recording itself. If I am using microphones, I start  +18db gain wise. SBDs are more problematic as they vary enormously. Being in for soundchecks helps quite a but I typically start at +6 db but can end up from -2 to 30db gain wise (these numbers are relative to what the mixpre starts with, when in advanced mode, when setting a channel to "microphone" or "line".

Well, if you have the knob on the side to adjust the trim and the channel knobs to control the second stage gain, then my question is how do you determine where to set these two settings?

I know that I never had a good answer when I ran V3 into a recorder. Do I run the V3 gain at +30 and the recorder gain at 5? or do I run the V3 gain at +10 and set the recorder gain to 10?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: dogmusic on August 16, 2018, 01:29:17 PM
This is why I have previously suggested that there is actually no analog gain control but that setting levels is always post ADC.
They say it quite clear. The maximum analog gain is 75 dB. And indeed, with the gain control set to "advanced" you have access to the
analog preamplifier gain.

If you apply gain with the fader then you are applying digital gain. And you can achieve a maximum of 96 dB from microphone to recording.

My thinking is that the analog gain is always wide open. The analog input level is actually set by the source.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rippleish20 on August 16, 2018, 02:01:37 PM
This is why I have previously suggested that there is actually no analog gain control but that setting levels is always post ADC.
They say it quite clear. The maximum analog gain is 75 dB. And indeed, with the gain control set to "advanced" you have access to the
analog preamplifier gain.

If you apply gain with the fader then you are applying digital gain. And you can achieve a maximum of 96 dB from microphone to recording.

"The maximum analog gain is 75 dB. And indeed, with the gain control set to "advanced" you have access to the analog preamplifier gain"

From my reading this is largely correct, or at least its the impression I've gotten.  This is why I sued advanced mode.

"If you apply gain with the fader then you are applying digital gain"

I think this is true in advanced mode but not in custom...

https://www.dvestore.com/blog/video-sound-devices-mixpre3-and-mixpre6-modes-and-signal-routing/

"If you want discrete, isolated tracks, then you need to be in Advanced or Custom Mode. When you record ISO tracks, the tracks will record the audio signal that is post-gain but pre-fader to the isolated track. This is what we call pre-fader or pre-fade recording. However, you can have the ISO tracks be post-fader. You need to be in Custom Mode and enable advanced settings for both "Channel" and "Record." This makes the ISO tracks post-fader. In Advanced Mode, the MixPres are configured...You also have separate control over the trim control which is the gain, as well as fader control.

The use of terms and the way something is said is important. In custom mode, the ISOs are post fader. Is this just a poor use of the term fader - and they really just mean big channel knobs used as fader controls in advanced mode - or does it mean it's a digital gain? Why say "post fader"?

I guess my conclusion that the pre-amp is a probably a digitally controlled, analog preamplifier. In other words, the knob are digital controls. In custom mode, the "fader" knobs also control the pre up to the maximum pre gain and then the purely digital gain kicks in?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rippleish20 on August 16, 2018, 02:32:52 PM
^^^  Agreed. How do you determine what level to set your gain? 

Also, why is the Mix levels way-hotter than my Mic levels?  Is Gain, in Advanced mode, applied to the Mix recording or the Mic recording?

In advanced mode, you select a channel using the big channel/fader knob, use the touch screen to drill down to "gain" and use the knob on the side to adjust trim (gain at the the pre stage). The Channel knobs themselves control the second stage gain, the volume of the track going into the mix.

"How do you determine what level to set your gain?" I'm not sure exactly what is meant by this question. I use advanced mode and the above process to set the level. I shoot for +12 to +6 in the recording itself. If I am using microphones, I start  +18db gain wise. SBDs are more problematic as they vary enormously. Being in for soundchecks helps quite a but I typically start at +6 db but can end up from -2 to 30db gain wise (these numbers are relative to what the mixpre starts with, when in advanced mode, when setting a channel to "microphone" or "line".

Well, if you have the knob on the side to adjust the trim and the channel knobs to control the second stage gain, then my question is how do you determine where to set these two settings?

I know that I never had a good answer when I ran V3 into a recorder. Do I run the V3 gain at +30 and the recorder gain at 5? or do I run the V3 gain at +10 and set the recorder gain to 10?

I understand the question better now but I think its more applicable to a V3 than a Mixpre. I've never used a V3 before, but I would do what I do with a uglybox/M10 scenario. I would set the "gain" to the highest level I could for an "average" scenario. If after using it for a number of shows I found I could leave it at 30 and never clip and it left some headroom to fine tune the gain I would leave it there and use the "trim" knob to fine tune it. The Mixpre scenario is different, at least in advanced mode. There are two gain stages but they are not both controlling the final gain on the ISO tracks (which is what I care about). The first stage controls this. The second stage is controlling the volume of the tracks going into the L/R mix.

Lets say you record four tracks - two tracks from microphones and two from the soundboard - and you want to create a matrix later by importing the recorded tracks into a DAW. With the recorder, you set the gain according to what you want the levels on recordings to be. I want my recordings at -12 to -6 db. In the DAW, you adjust the levels of the two pairs according to what you want the mix to be. I typically drop my audience recording by -5 db in the mix, for example. In advanced mode on the mixpre, you are doing both of the processes on the fly. The first stage is controlling the volume of the recording and the second stage is setting the level of the tracks go into a L/R mix, which can be recorded separately.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: spyder9 on August 16, 2018, 04:33:25 PM
^^^  My question:  First stage is the "Gain" in the Advanced Menu option (which affects the ISO tracks loudness)  and 2nd stage is the Knobs (which affect the Mix loudness)?  Does that sound correct?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Chuck on August 16, 2018, 04:41:32 PM
Man, you guys got me all confused. I have mine in Custom > Basic ganged left and right.

When I turn the #1 knob it brings tracks 1 & 2 up or down together. The #2 knob controls the gain of track 2 separately and I use that to match channels. When I see the red bars where I want them I'm happy. Do the same for 3 & 4...

Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rippleish20 on August 16, 2018, 05:00:34 PM
^^^  My question:  First stage is the "Gain" in the Advanced Menu option (which affects the ISO tracks loudness)  and 2nd stage is the Knobs (which affect the Mix loudness)?  Does that sound correct?

Yes
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: jbell on August 16, 2018, 05:18:10 PM
That's how I've run mine and it was one of the first units shipped!!  Never let me down.  It is the best piece of gear I've bought in a long time.  Super happy with my unit. 

Man, you guys got me all confused. I have mine in Custom > Basic ganged left and right.

When I turn the #1 knob it brings tracks 1 & 2 up or down together. The #2 knob controls the gain of track 2 separately and I use that to match channels. When I see the red bars where I want them I'm happy. Do the same for 3 & 4...
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Johannes on August 17, 2018, 03:06:17 PM
I understand the concept. I prefer to do the minimum on my recordings post production so it does matter to me. More importantly, I am interested in knowing how it works! I do recognize that it probably makes zero difference noise wise.
The answer to how it really works can only be given by the maker of the unit. And I would very much like to see an official block diagram! As others have pointed out: it is finally a combination of analog and digital gain. I stopped worrying about the technical details, after having used the units a few times. I watch the meters, set the level a bit on the conservative side and enjoy the result.   

I frequently use two settings
1) Gain set to Basic => Faders control the gain stage
I use this, when I want easy control  (no fiddling with the mini knob on the side) and when I only need the ISO tracks. I aim for -12 to -20 dB on the meters.

2) Gain set to advance => Gain is set via trim and faders control the Mix
I use this, when I need the Mix (to feed a camera) or when I use the MixPre-6 as audio interface. In this case I use the trim to get -12 to -20 dB on the meters. The faders are set to whatever the mix requires.

Both scenarios work fine for me in various task.

Johannes
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: noahbickart on August 17, 2018, 06:41:48 PM
Why is SD not being forthcoming about analog vs. digital gain?

I’ve been using custom mode with everything set to advanced, except gain at basic. Then I gang 1/2, 3/4, and 5/6 and use the big knobs to set levels for the ISO tracks, and don’t record the L/R mix.

I’ve been very pleased with the results, but if all analog gain isn’t available in this mode, I’d be interested in trying it another way.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: justme on August 18, 2018, 03:21:26 AM
The three channel knobs on my MixPre-3 does not have the same angle when set to 0 dB.
Non of them are pointing at 12 and no one is at the same angle as the others. All of them are a few different minutes early of 12.

Anyone else have noticed this or did I just have bad luck?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: zorba on August 18, 2018, 06:23:41 AM
How does it work with the musician plugin? Do the frontal knob control the gain?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Gordon on August 18, 2018, 09:27:13 AM
The three channel knobs on my MixPre-3 does not have the same angle when set to 0 dB.
Non of them are pointing at 12 and no one is at the same angle as the others. All of them are a few different minutes early of 12.

Anyone else have noticed this or did I just have bad luck?

That is to be expected when running mic in and using knobs for gain. With line in 12 should be 0db.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rippleish20 on August 18, 2018, 12:30:11 PM
I don't entirely understand the question nor answer. Can you explain more Gordon?

The three channel knobs on my MixPre-3 does not have the same angle when set to 0 dB.
Non of them are pointing at 12 and no one is at the same angle as the others. All of them are a few different minutes early of 12.

Anyone else have noticed this or did I just have bad luck?



That is to be expected when running mic in and using knobs for gain. With line in 12 should be 0db.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Gordon on August 18, 2018, 12:55:12 PM
with line in the knobs sitting straight up at 12 o'clock is 0db.  I assumed that's what he was referring to.  mic in 0db would be all the way to the left I think.  now that I re-read his post it sounds like he is line in but they are off a hair. 
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: justme on August 18, 2018, 01:35:08 PM
What I meant was that they do not have the same physical position although they are set to the same numerical value.
They all have a slightly different position at any given value except at lowest or highest.

They are off a hair.
Which means I can not look at them and trust their physical relationship to each other. And is forced to nudge them to get the true numerical relationship.

It’s annoying and I believe they should not be that way. :)
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rippleish20 on August 18, 2018, 02:21:29 PM
Mine also vary by a bit

What I meant was that they do not have the same physical position although they are set to the same numerical value.
They all have a slightly different position at any given value except at lowest or highest.

They are off a hair.
Which means I can not look at them and trust their physical relationship to each other. And is forced to nudge them to get the true numerical relationship.

It’s annoying and I believe they should not be that way. :)

Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: spyder9 on August 18, 2018, 03:26:17 PM
^^^  My question:  First stage is the "Gain" in the Advanced Menu option (which affects the ISO tracks loudness)  and 2nd stage is the Knobs (which affect the Mix loudness)?  Does that sound correct?

Yes

Thank you so much for the above tip!  I ran 4 mics last night, so I could compare:  Nakamichi CM-1000 vs DPA 4011TL.  Understanding these two Gain stages really improved my decision making on the fly.  I can now run Microphone and external Preamp comps with confidence.  Making the MixPre-6 a very useful tool.  That said, it's now found a permanent home in my rig collection.    :clapping:
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: borjam on August 18, 2018, 03:38:31 PM
This is why I have previously suggested that there is actually no analog gain control but that setting levels is always post ADC.
They say it quite clear. The maximum analog gain is 75 dB. And indeed, with the gain control set to "advanced" you have access to the
analog preamplifier gain.

If you apply gain with the fader then you are applying digital gain. And you can achieve a maximum of 96 dB from microphone to recording.

"The maximum analog gain is 75 dB. And indeed, with the gain control set to "advanced" you have access to the analog preamplifier gain"

From my reading this is largely correct, or at least its the impression I've gotten.  This is why I sued advanced mode.

"If you apply gain with the fader then you are applying digital gain"

I think this is true in advanced mode but not in custom...
Sorry, my phrase was poorly written. If you use the basic gain mode the faders apply both analog and digital gain. I wanted to say “you are applying digital gain as well”.

i imagine that the first 76 dB will be analog, and moving the fader further will add digital gain.

Also, note that the unit has 32 bit A/D converters. Sound Devices don’t mention why, but I imagine that they wanted to reduce quantization noise for low level signals. Or maybe part of the 75 dB of analog gain are actually digital? Anyway as long as the noise specs are maintained it should be harmless.

Quote
I guess my conclusion that the pre-amp is a probably a digitally controlled, analog preamplifier. In other words, the knob are digital controls. In custom mode, the "fader" knobs also control the pre up to the maximum pre gain and then the purely digital gain kicks in?
Yes, that’s how I think it is. And of course the preamplifier is digitally controlled. But I’m still curious about the 32 bit A/D.

By the way, I saw the internal photos in the FCC filing. Indeed the converter is 32bit (I don’t remember the part number) and the electrolytic caps are high end ones (Nichicon).
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Chuck on August 18, 2018, 10:54:17 PM
Somehow I lost all my Int Presets. Anyone know what could cause that? This will be a problem, as I tend to format the SD card for each new recording. I do load presets into the SETTINGS folder on the SD card from a computer, but if I didn't do that I'd have to quickly rebuild a preset in the field if the Int presets are erased.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rigpimp on August 19, 2018, 01:04:21 AM
Somehow I lost all my Int Presets. Anyone know what could cause that? This will be a problem, as I tend to format the SD card for each new recording. I do load presets into the SETTINGS folder on the SD card from a computer, but if I didn't do that I'd have to quickly rebuild a preset in the field if the Int presets are erased.

Saving the presets to the card is the problem . I had that happen early on and quickly learned to save them to the machine instead.  Any time you completely format the card you'll lose the presets.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: zorba on August 19, 2018, 03:38:16 PM
What happens when the mixpre 6 switch from external to internal power? The recording continue without interruptions?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Chuck on August 19, 2018, 03:38:56 PM
OK, So I set up my presets again by: Save to Int 1, Save to Int 2 etc...
I formatted the SD card and the only presets are those that I saved via Int. No presets in the SETTINGS folder on the SD card now.

Is there any way those Int presets can be erased and screw me now? By removing the battery sled for too long? I will carry a backup SD card now, that has presets loaded, just in case.

One more thing... Has anyone found a protector for the touch screen?  That could be useful.


Impressions after recording 10 sets. I really love this thing.
I recorded some shows with just 2 mics, some with 2 mics and SBD and some with 4 mics. All great sounding with no stress set-up. I find it mostly intuitive and I trust it. My small complaint is the On/Off switch is in a spot that's hard to switch with my big fingers.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Chuck on August 19, 2018, 03:39:29 PM
What happens when the mixpre 6 switch from external to internal power? The recording continue without interruptions?

Yes, seamlessly.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Gordon on August 19, 2018, 03:46:57 PM
Has anyone found a protector for the touch screen?  That could be useful.


When I bought mine from SOS he had one on it.  Maybe he can chime in with what he used.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: checht on August 19, 2018, 04:35:44 PM
Impressions after recording 10 sets. I really love this thing.
I recorded some shows with just 2 mics, some with 2 mics and SBD and some with 4 mics. All great sounding with no stress set-up. I find it mostly intuitive and I trust it. My small complaint is the On/Off switch is in a spot that's hard to switch with my big fingers.

Agree completely with all of this, except I have a 3 so ran 2 mics and mono SBD. Kinda wishing I had gone for the 6. With a USB C cable plugged in, it's hard to switch power. Not a fatal flaw.

I think the  MP-3 signal path is the most flattering to my Schoeps of anything I've ever run.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on August 19, 2018, 04:43:18 PM
Has anyone found a protector for the touch screen?  That could be useful.


When I bought mine from SOS he had one on it.  Maybe he can chime in with what he used.
The screen is a little bit curved, so it is slightly convex. Regular screen protectors from mobile phones work fine if you cut them to size. They will only stick in the middle but you can click the screen right through them out to the corners.
I have found a three-pack of screen protectors from discontinued units like iPhone 3 or 4 for $1, shipped, on ebay. Cut to size and apply to the MP screen.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: zorba on August 20, 2018, 06:20:46 AM
Is it possible to record a standard stereo wav file? Recording with 2 mics and disabling the stereo mix (or disabling iso tracks) the result is a stereo wave file?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: dogmusic on August 20, 2018, 07:29:35 AM
Is it possible to record a standard stereo wav file? Recording with 2 mics and disabling the stereo mix (or disabling iso tracks) the result is a stereo wave file?

Yes.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Fatah Ruark (aka MIKE B) on August 20, 2018, 10:32:25 PM
Is it possible to record a standard stereo wav file? Recording with 2 mics and disabling the stereo mix (or disabling iso tracks) the result is a stereo wave file?

If you disable all but 1 pair of tracks you will get a standard WAV file so you won't have to use WaveAgent to split your files.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: IronFilm on August 21, 2018, 01:21:01 AM
Mine also vary by a bit

What I meant was that they do not have the same physical position although they are set to the same numerical value.
They all have a slightly different position at any given value except at lowest or highest.

They are off a hair.
Which means I can not look at them and trust their physical relationship to each other. And is forced to nudge them to get the true numerical relationship.

It’s annoying and I believe they should not be that way. :)

Does anybody know the reason yet? As this seems odd, is it just poor quality control on their cheaper units?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: borjam on August 21, 2018, 05:23:44 AM
Does anybody know the reason yet? As this seems odd, is it just poor quality control on their cheaper units?
My Mixpre 3 aligns pretty well, although I keep gain in "basic" mode (which means the dB range is in the 90's) and there can be a 2 dB variation between apparently, almost equal positions. The faders are physically very small anyway which doesn't help accuracy.

Can it be some variation in one encoder? I think the knobs are not potentiometers, but encoders. I would be worried if there were "jumps" in the dB range. But as long as it's continuous it shouldn't matter much.

That said: if you need perfect alignment between two tracks you must link them so that a single knob will do the job ang guarantee matched gains. And if you are mixing on the spot your ears and maybe metering will tell you what you are doing, not the numerical dB levels.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Chuck on August 22, 2018, 02:45:16 PM
The Plug In Power provided by 3.5mm input 5/6 on MP-6. Is that robust enough to power electrets like the Church, Audix CPS-MICRO and Nakamichi mics without distortion at loud concerts? I've successfully used that 1/8" input with PIP turn off and a 9v battery box powering the mics.

The spec on the MP-6 is:

Mic 3.5mm: 3V @ 3k source Z

I assume 3v isn't enough?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: checht on August 22, 2018, 02:47:37 PM
I assume 3v isn't enough?

Chris confirmed its not enough for his mics.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Chuck on August 22, 2018, 02:55:02 PM
I assume 3v isn't enough?

Chris confirmed it's not enough for his mics.

Thank you checht.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: junkyardt on August 23, 2018, 12:26:36 PM
yeah, not sure why they bothered adding 3v PIP to the aux in jack. seems like given how much power the unit requires in the first place and the fact that it can do 48v phantom on 4 channels, it wouldn't have been a big deal to make the aux in jack capable of 9v PIP, which would've been much more useful for many different types of mics. i've just been using it with PIP turned off and using my 9v batt box.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: junkyardt on August 27, 2018, 02:34:48 PM
had the mixpre-6 running in my closed camera bag at an outdoor show last night on a really hot, humid night. was recording 4 channels and phantom powering 2. between sets i checked and the mixpre seemed unreasonably hot. like, almost so hot i didn't want to hold it for extended periods. changed the arrangement of the top cover of my bag so that everything was still mostly covered in case of people sloshing beer but that air could now vent a little to let some heat escape, and it didn't get nearly as hot in the next set. could just be a one-off problem i won't encounter again that the ambient air temp on such a hot, humid night was much hotter than at an average indoor show. still, has anyone else encountered this?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Chuck on August 27, 2018, 02:39:16 PM
had the mixpre-6 running in my closed camera bag at an outdoor show last night on a really hot, humid night. was recording 4 channels and phantom powering 2. between sets i checked and the mixpre seemed unreasonably hot. like, almost so hot i didn't want to hold it for extended periods. changed the arrangement of the top cover of my bag so that everything was still mostly covered in case of people sloshing beer but that air could now vent a little to let some heat escape, and it didn't get nearly as hot in the next set. could just be a one-off problem i won't encounter again that the ambient air temp on such a hot, humid night was much hotter than at an average indoor show. still, has anyone else encountered this?

I did with my DR-680! :( Not with the MixPre though.

Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: borjam on August 27, 2018, 05:40:17 PM
I have noticed mine (MixPre-3) getting quite hot while recording birds in Summer, of course with the recorder in a camera bag.

Anyway I wouldn't worry much, I imagine that Sound Devices design their equipment considering that it will be inside a bag.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: jcable77 on August 29, 2018, 08:28:28 PM
Just got my mix pre 6 today. Only had a few minutes before work to mess with it. Im guessing Ill have a few questions. Just ordered this for pickup tomorrow with an A>C cable. Anyone use this?
https://www.bestbuy.com/site/anker-powercore-20000-mah-portable-charger-for-most-usb-enabled-devices-black/5948567.p?skuId=5948567&cmp=RMX&extStoreId=536&ref=212&loc=1&ds_rl=1255843&gclid=Cj0KCQjwiJncBRC1ARIsAOvG-a7DpqqShnIKRCBHyDEjbYb79cGtdsukqFNVSFF3JgnZd0Anb9nRl2gaAuIGEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds
Also was going to go with my lowe pro nova 140 bag but that seem a bit big, although with 4 channels of cables and mics it will probably be a good fit. I dont want to be the lazy one, as ive already got a great deal of info from these threads, but has anyone put together a settings link or spreadsheet of some sort for situational presets for this thing yet? The thing is tiny! Im excited to try it out friday.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: relefunt on August 29, 2018, 09:17:07 PM
Just got my mix pre 6 today. Only had a few minutes before work to mess with it. Im guessing Ill have a few questions. Just ordered this for pickup tomorrow with an A>C cable. Anyone use this?
https://www.bestbuy.com/site/anker-powercore-20000-mah-portable-charger-for-most-usb-enabled-devices-black/5948567.p?skuId=5948567&cmp=RMX&extStoreId=536&ref=212&loc=1&ds_rl=1255843&gclid=Cj0KCQjwiJncBRC1ARIsAOvG-a7DpqqShnIKRCBHyDEjbYb79cGtdsukqFNVSFF3JgnZd0Anb9nRl2gaAuIGEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds
Also was going to go with my lowe pro nova 140 bag but that seem a bit big, although with 4 channels of cables and mics it will probably be a good fit. I dont want to be the lazy one, as ive already got a great deal of info from these threads, but has anyone put together a settings link or spreadsheet of some sort for situational presets for this thing yet? The thing is tiny! Im excited to try it out friday.

I’m not an expert, but I have read a LOT of posts in these threads about people having problems with powering their MixPre3-6’s with various USB-A batteries. The last I looked, Sound Devices was very particular about which batteries these units can utilize so I bought the exact USB-C portable battery which Sound Devices recommends on their website. I personally did not want to take a chance, despite there seeming to be some people who said their battery worked.

https://www.sounddevices.com/tech-notes/mixpre-3-mixpre-6-powering-options
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: jcable77 on August 29, 2018, 09:34:12 PM
Just got my mix pre 6 today. Only had a few minutes before work to mess with it. Im guessing Ill have a few questions. Just ordered this for pickup tomorrow with an A>C cable. Anyone use this?
https://www.bestbuy.com/site/anker-powercore-20000-mah-portable-charger-for-most-usb-enabled-devices-black/5948567.p?skuId=5948567&cmp=RMX&extStoreId=536&ref=212&loc=1&ds_rl=1255843&gclid=Cj0KCQjwiJncBRC1ARIsAOvG-a7DpqqShnIKRCBHyDEjbYb79cGtdsukqFNVSFF3JgnZd0Anb9nRl2gaAuIGEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds
Also was going to go with my lowe pro nova 140 bag but that seem a bit big, although with 4 channels of cables and mics it will probably be a good fit. I dont want to be the lazy one, as ive already got a great deal of info from these threads, but has anyone put together a settings link or spreadsheet of some sort for situational presets for this thing yet? The thing is tiny! Im excited to try it out friday.

I’m not an expert, but I have read a LOT of posts in these threads about people having problems with powering their MixPre3-6’s with various USB-A batteries. The last I looked, Sound Devices was very particular about which batteries these units can utilize so I bought the exact USB-C portable battery which Sound Devices recommends on their website. I personally did not want to take a chance, despite there seeming to be some people who said their battery worked.

https://www.sounddevices.com/tech-notes/mixpre-3-mixpre-6-powering-options
Thank you. Im going to give that anker a try and hopefully it works until the hawkswoods hirose adapter comes in.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: relefunt on August 30, 2018, 02:34:11 AM
Speaking of our friends in Reedsburg, WI, the folks at Sound Devices HQ look like they might be having some concerns about flooding. I have a friend with a mostly submerged farm not terribly far from there, and there are evacuations going on right now in parts of Reedsburg:

http://www.nbc15.com/content/news/Evacuations-happening-in-parts-of-Reedsburg-491941621.html

I suggested to my (very good) friend that he might now consider fish farming — he suggested I get myself over there to help him move some stuff to higher ground, which is what I will likely be doing this weekend in addition to bringing some food for folks in need in the area.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: justme on August 30, 2018, 06:25:57 AM
Mine also vary by a bit

What I meant was that they do not have the same physical position although they are set to the same numerical value.
They all have a slightly different position at any given value except at lowest or highest.

They are off a hair.
Which means I can not look at them and trust their physical relationship to each other. And is forced to nudge them to get the true numerical relationship.

It’s annoying and I believe they should not be that way. :)

Does anybody know the reason yet? As this seems odd, is it just poor quality control on their cheaper units?

Time to give an update.

After a couple of resets and factory restores, Sound Devices support staff and head tech informed me that a calibration process is not available for the end user. They decided I should return the MixPre-3 to the shop for an exchange.

The unit was returned and I placed an order for a MixPre-6 instead.

SD support is top notch and everything went very smooth.
I’m now eagerly waiting for the MP6. :)
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: noahbickart on August 30, 2018, 07:08:38 AM
Using a USB-A battery is a very bad idea.

Follow the SD instructions and use an approved USB-C battery. 
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: dallman on August 30, 2018, 12:25:20 PM
Using a USB-A battery is a very bad idea.

Follow the SD instructions and use an approved USB-C battery.
Correct. It makes no sense to buy or use a battery with underpowered output.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: jcable77 on August 30, 2018, 05:13:03 PM
Using a USB-A battery is a very bad idea.

Follow the SD instructions and use an approved USB-C battery.
Correct. It makes no sense to buy or use a battery with underpowered output.
I realized i got the wrong one last night and changed the order. Thanks guys.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Fatah Ruark (aka MIKE B) on August 30, 2018, 07:45:16 PM
Using a USB-A battery is a very bad idea.

Follow the SD instructions and use an approved USB-C battery.

Why do you say it's a bad idea?

I've run mine with just 2 mics powered by a small USB battery (USB-A > USB-C), in stealth situations. No issues at all. Actually more reliable than the approved battery.

I'm not going to use that battery all the time, but it works. I find the USB-C > USB-C connection on the battery to be less reliable when it's in a pocket, and I only stealth with 2 mics.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: relefunt on August 30, 2018, 07:46:45 PM
Using a USB-A battery is a very bad idea.

Follow the SD instructions and use an approved USB-C battery.

Why do you say it's a bad idea?

I've run mine with just 2 mics powered by a small USB battery (USB-A > USB-C), in stealth situations. No issues at all. Actually more reliable than the approved battery.

I'm not going to use that battery all the time, but it works. I find the USB-C > USB-C connection on the battery to be less reliable when it's in a pocket, and I only stealth with 2 mics.

Just not clear about this... less reliable in what way?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Fatah Ruark (aka MIKE B) on August 30, 2018, 07:49:43 PM
Using a USB-A battery is a very bad idea.

Follow the SD instructions and use an approved USB-C battery.

Why do you say it's a bad idea?

I've run mine with just 2 mics powered by a small USB battery (USB-A > USB-C), in stealth situations. No issues at all. Actually more reliable than the approved battery.

I'm not going to use that battery all the time, but it works. I find the USB-C > USB-C connection on the battery to be less reliable when it's in a pocket, and I only stealth with 2 mics.

Just not clear about this... less reliable in what way?

Sorry. The USB-C connection tends to come loose in my pocket on the approved battery (the connection on the recorder is fine). If I don't notice my stealth mics (Nevaton MCE400) eat through the AA's in about 30 minutes.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: relefunt on August 30, 2018, 08:01:36 PM
Using a USB-A battery is a very bad idea.

Follow the SD instructions and use an approved USB-C battery.

Why do you say it's a bad idea?

I've run mine with just 2 mics powered by a small USB battery (USB-A > USB-C), in stealth situations. No issues at all. Actually more reliable than the approved battery.

I'm not going to use that battery all the time, but it works. I find the USB-C > USB-C connection on the battery to be less reliable when it's in a pocket, and I only stealth with 2 mics.

Just not clear about this... less reliable in what way?

Sorry. The USB-C connection tends to come loose in my pocket on the approved battery (the connection on the recorder is fine). If I don't notice my stealth mics (Nevaton MCE400) eat through the AA's in about 30 minutes.

I see. Yes, I have heard many complaints about the C cable coming loose. One other aspect is the approved battery is super heavy. Not the best for being sneaky.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: noahbickart on August 30, 2018, 09:45:49 PM
Using a USB-A battery is a very bad idea.

Follow the SD instructions and use an approved USB-C battery.

Why do you say it's a bad idea?

I've run mine with just 2 mics powered by a small USB battery (USB-A > USB-C), in stealth situations. No issues at all. Actually more reliable than the approved battery.

I'm not going to use that battery all the time, but it works. I find the USB-C > USB-C connection on the battery to be less reliable when it's in a pocket, and I only stealth with 2 mics.

In my opinion, it's a bad idea because a usb-c device, designed to run on usb-c batteries, will have a much higher likelihood of failure when run off of a usb-a battery. Why risk it?

I'd advise use of a right angle usb-c cable on the battery side. That way you can use a rubber band or gaf tape as a backup there if you still have issues.

Alternatively, I use this when the big anker is too big: https://www.ebay.com/itm/HyperGear-USB-C-QC-2-0-Power-Bank-High-Capacity-12000mAh-Portable-Battery-and/282902414767?epid=1792348047&hash=item41de4c45af:g:KwUAAOSw6T9auuBy

For OTS, I leave the smaller hypergear in the bag as a backup or to charge my phone. It runs the mixpre6 6 channels for at least 5 hours.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: jcable77 on August 30, 2018, 10:55:59 PM
I picked this up today and its “all green”! https://www.bestbuy.com/site/tzumi-pocketjuice-20000-mah-portable-charger-for-most-usb-enabled-devices-black/6220914.p?skuId=6220914&cmp=RMX&extStoreId=534&ref=212&loc=1&ds_rl=1255843&gclid=CjwKCAjwq57cBRBYEiwAdpx0vb4Bczx-oZhjFCvcMNjVFbd129BMiLPSDBq4hntaHZCgqVQRLDdbsRoCBeYQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds
 
Ordered a suggested SD anker as well. Psyched to test it out tomorrow!
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: relefunt on August 31, 2018, 12:03:29 AM

Noah said:

——————

Alternatively, I use this when the big anker is too big: https://www.ebay.com/itm/HyperGear-USB-C-QC-2-0-Power-Bank-High-Capacity-12000mAh-Portable-Battery-and/282902414767?epid=1792348047&hash=item41de4c45af:g:KwUAAOSw6T9auuBy

For OTS, I leave the smaller hypergear in the bag as a backup or to charge my phone. It runs the mixpre6 6 channels for at least 5 hours.

————


Thanks, Noah, for the great suggestion of the HyperGear!
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: borjam on August 31, 2018, 02:44:54 AM
After a couple of resets and factory restores, Sound Devices support staff and head tech informed me that a calibration process is not available for the end user. They decided I should return the MixPre-3 to the shop for an exchange.

The unit was returned and I placed an order for a MixPre-6 instead.

SD support is top notch and everything went very smooth.
I’m now eagerly waiting for the MP6. :)
Great to know. Beware, will you be tempted to get a MixPre 10T next time? ;)

I had a silly problem with my unit. After fiddling with signal routing when testing a stereo microphone channel 2 would keep the gain raised for more than 10 dB compared to channel 1 and 3. But just doing a reassignation of inputs to Aux In and Mic again solved it.

But it was a software bug in my case. Their software is full of side effects between menu options and it can be troublesome.

Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Chuck on August 31, 2018, 08:12:21 AM

Noah said:

——————

Alternatively, I use this when the big anker is too big: https://www.ebay.com/itm/HyperGear-USB-C-QC-2-0-Power-Bank-High-Capacity-12000mAh-Portable-Battery-and/282902414767?epid=1792348047&hash=item41de4c45af:g:KwUAAOSw6T9auuBy

For OTS, I leave the smaller hypergear in the bag as a backup or to charge my phone. It runs the mixpre6 6 channels for at least 5 hours.


I have two of those. They work great.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on August 31, 2018, 02:16:40 PM

In my opinion this is nonsense.


It works fine in low power mode, just as it's been engineered to.


Volts are volts. Current is current.



Using a USB-A battery is a very bad idea.

Follow the SD instructions and use an approved USB-C battery.

Why do you say it's a bad idea?

I've run mine with just 2 mics powered by a small USB battery (USB-A > USB-C), in stealth situations. No issues at all. Actually more reliable than the approved battery.

I'm not going to use that battery all the time, but it works. I find the USB-C > USB-C connection on the battery to be less reliable when it's in a pocket, and I only stealth with 2 mics.

In my opinion, it's a bad idea because a usb-c device, designed to run on usb-c batteries, will have a much higher likelihood of failure when run off of a usb-a battery. Why risk it?

I'd advise use of a right angle usb-c cable on the battery side. That way you can use a rubber band or gaf tape as a backup there if you still have issues.

Alternatively, I use this when the big anker is too big: https://www.ebay.com/itm/HyperGear-USB-C-QC-2-0-Power-Bank-High-Capacity-12000mAh-Portable-Battery-and/282902414767?epid=1792348047&hash=item41de4c45af:g:KwUAAOSw6T9auuBy (https://www.ebay.com/itm/HyperGear-USB-C-QC-2-0-Power-Bank-High-Capacity-12000mAh-Portable-Battery-and/282902414767?epid=1792348047&hash=item41de4c45af:g:KwUAAOSw6T9auuBy)

For OTS, I leave the smaller hypergear in the bag as a backup or to charge my phone. It runs the mixpre6 6 channels for at least 5 hours.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: jcable77 on August 31, 2018, 03:22:16 PM
Anybody run talentcells with the hawkswoods sd-1 hirose adapter? Hawkswoods site says 10-20v input is good. That was my plan initially when i bought the mp, as i have a bunch of them. Any glitches if anybody has any experience? Seems like a great solid way to go imo.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rippleish20 on August 31, 2018, 04:09:25 PM
Anybody run talentcells with the hawkswoods sd-1 hirose adapter? Hawkswoods site says 10-20v input is good. That was my plan initially when i bought the mp, as i have a bunch of them. Any glitches if anybody has any experience? Seems like a great solid way to go imo.

I have a hawkwoods fake battery sled with 12v adapter (they sold these initially but dropped them in favor of the SD-1 etc) and talentcells work fine. I also have a 10-T and it works with telentcells. The issue I have had with Telentcells is that the 12v port is slightly wider than other batteries I have and both of the hirose to 12v barrel cables I have fit loosely into the talentcell. I actuallu modded one of my my telentcells with a locking 12v connector...
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: dallman on September 01, 2018, 02:36:31 AM

In my opinion this is nonsense.


It works fine in low power mode, just as it's been engineered to.


Volts are volts. Current is current.


I do not disagree, as you are correct, but some of the disagreement may be because we have 2 different situations that people are referring to or thinking about when they talk of their experience or approach to powering the deck:

 If you are running 2 channels, the deck is fine with a USB A battery. Safety mode is safe and fine if the deck is run on 2 channels and that is how it was designed.

I think most people purchase the MixPre 6 with the idea of running multiple channels, and in that situation it is best to use a USB C output battery as it has greater output that the deck requires. So some of the advice given on running the higher output batteries, especially for new users is based on this assumption which may or not be correct. Now too, because there are now plenty of inexpensive and more portable USB C battery options, it makes sense, but may not be for everybody, or surely is not required if you plan to only run 2 channels.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on September 01, 2018, 04:43:55 AM
I had a bad experience with my MixPre6 today. After soundcheck, I returned to my machine in advance of showtime, and the SD gave me a card error. I removed and reinserted the card, then it said BAD CARD.


This is the SD 32 GB card. YEAH, the one with the Sound Devices branding, which is the ONLY recommended card for this unit. I have a spare, but I used a Sandisk today and it seemed to go fine.


But I'm not pleased.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Chuck on September 01, 2018, 09:45:54 AM
I had a bad experience with my MixPre6 today. After soundcheck, I returned to my machine in advance of showtime, and the SD gave me a card error. I removed and reinserted the card, then it said BAD CARD.


This is the SD 32 GB card. YEAH, the one with the Sound Devices branding, which is the ONLY recommended card for this unit. I have a spare, but I used a Sandisk today and it seemed to go fine.


But I'm not pleased.

Whoa... that's not good. :(
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on September 01, 2018, 02:45:11 PM
Whoa... that's not good. :(
I concur. I was able to retrieve the soundcheck track from the "bad card" and my mac OS Disk Utility didn't detect a problem with the card itself.


I will note that the error occurred right as I pressed the REC button. I let my machine name the files with sequential numbers, and the soundcheck was MixPre-17, #18 does not exist, and then the Sandisk card contains files starting with #19.


No other issues with the deck all night. I will say it was in the hot sun, approx 100 degrees F.


Also, note that if you ever are patching out of a digital mixing console, do NOT leave a towel blocking the fan for the board. The computer in the board will shut down due to heat! (this happened between soundcheck and the set, right before I returned to the card issue)
 :shrug:
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: jcable77 on September 01, 2018, 04:12:54 PM
Anybody run talentcells with the hawkswoods sd-1 hirose adapter? Hawkswoods site says 10-20v input is good. That was my plan initially when i bought the mp, as i have a bunch of them. Any glitches if anybody has any experience? Seems like a great solid way to go imo.

I have a hawkwoods fake battery sled with 12v adapter (they sold these initially but dropped them in favor of the SD-1 etc) and talentcells work fine. I also have a 10-T and it works with telentcells. The issue I have had with Telentcells is that the 12v port is slightly wider than other batteries I have and both of the hirose to 12v barrel cables I have fit loosely into the talentcell. I actuallu modded one of my my telentcells with a locking 12v connector...
Nice. Good news. I already have the hirose cable Ted made me for my sd302 so I know it fits well in my talentcell ports. Maiden voyage last night went well I think. Used the usb c>c with that juice power battery.
https://archive.org/details/KungFu2018-08-31
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Fatah Ruark (aka MIKE B) on September 01, 2018, 04:16:51 PM
I had my first issue with my MP6 last night. Minor, but figured I'd share just in case anyone else has the same issue.

I set up my rig for Phish last night. Probably an hour between when I turned everything on and it was time to hit record. When I did the Record button wouldn't respond. Tried a few times and then power cycled the MP6. After that it worked fine for the rest of the night (I did start it extra early for Set 2 just in case it did it again).
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: jbell on September 01, 2018, 04:35:05 PM
What firmware??

I had my first issue with my MP6 last night. Minor, but figured I'd share just in case anyone else has the same issue.

I set up my rig for Phish last night. Probably an hour between when I turned everything on and it was time to hit record. When I did the Record button wouldn't respond. Tried a few times and then power cycled the MP6. After that it worked fine for the rest of the night (I did start it extra early for Set 2 just in case it did it again).
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Fatah Ruark (aka MIKE B) on September 01, 2018, 04:39:46 PM
What firmware??

I had my first issue with my MP6 last night. Minor, but figured I'd share just in case anyone else has the same issue.

I set up my rig for Phish last night. Probably an hour between when I turned everything on and it was time to hit record. When I did the Record button wouldn't respond. Tried a few times and then power cycled the MP6. After that it worked fine for the rest of the night (I did start it extra early for Set 2 just in case it did it again).

Current. 2.21
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: relefunt on September 01, 2018, 06:22:16 PM
I had a bad experience with my MixPre6 today. After soundcheck, I returned to my machine in advance of showtime, and the SD gave me a card error. I removed and reinserted the card, then it said BAD CARD.


This is the SD 32 GB card. YEAH, the one with the Sound Devices branding, which is the ONLY recommended card for this unit. I have a spare, but I used a Sandisk today and it seemed to go fine.


But I'm not pleased.

Thanks for letting us know about this.

I hope you will contact Sound Devices customer Service and let us know what happens after that. If I were in charge of SD, I would not be happy about something with the name of my company on it failing. I would definitely want my people testing out this particular card to find out (if possible) what happened. They say on their website that they extensively test these cards and it only makes sense that they would.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: junkyardt on September 01, 2018, 09:36:51 PM
yikes...i didn't go with the SD branded card mainly because they only offer 32gb and i wanted more than that in case i would ever record all 6 channels at 24/96 several nights in a row, to not feel like i had to immediately transfer every night. went with a 64gb sandisk extreme pro sdxc and it hasn't given me any issues. the card malfunction plus the unresponsive record button mentioned above are definitely a little concerning.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on September 03, 2018, 08:19:33 AM

I hope you will contact Sound Devices customer Service and let us know what happens after that.


Yes, I am planning to, after the end of the holiday weekend. Just got home from the road trip.


I figure they'll want to look at the card. Maybe even the deck, WTF???
 :facepalm:
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: spyder9 on September 03, 2018, 10:03:26 PM
I've been using Tekkeon MP3300's with my MP6 with great success.  I use the MX-Powersled Hirose adapter to get the job done.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: checht on September 04, 2018, 10:41:00 AM
Has anyone had success using a card larger than 64GB? If so, what card?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: dallman on September 04, 2018, 11:27:01 AM
Has anyone had success using a card larger than 64GB? If so, what card?
I have only used 128gb cards, and have had no issues usually recording 6 channels, with phantom on the 4 channels that supply phantom power at 24/48. I have used
SanDisk Extreme PRO 128GB SDXC Flash Memory Card
Lexar Platinum II 300x SDXC 128GB UHS-I/U1
Sony 128GB UHS-I SDXC Memory Card (Class 10)

There were others, but I don't have the info. Fuji comes to mind, I know I have 128gb Fuji cards. I have never had an issue.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: justme on September 05, 2018, 02:25:30 PM
I received my MixPre-6 as a replacement for the MP-3 which suffered from uncalibrated fader knobs.
The calibration precision on the mixpre 6 is spot on.
The mechanical position and electrical dB values are in perfect sync.

I’m as happy as anyone can be.

Ohh and it came with the latest firmware installed so I guess it’s quite fresh of the production line.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: tgakidis on September 06, 2018, 05:36:39 AM
I've been using Tekkeon MP3300's with my MP6 with great success.  I use the MX-Powersled Hirose adapter to get the job done.

Me too.  I also use a usb a > usb c cable with no issues. For a typically two band gig I use a battery sled with 8 AA rechangables. I use whatever card I have with no issue.  Guess I’m just lucky.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on September 06, 2018, 12:11:10 PM

I just spoke to Nelson at Sound Devices. He said it is a card problem and not the machine. I will return the card to the place I bought it for replacement, and they'll send it in to SD for the company to examine, and then I will not find out what happened.


Hope everyone is satisfied with that.


 :shrug:
I had a bad experience with my MixPre6 today. After soundcheck, I returned to my machine in advance of showtime, and the SD gave me a card error. I removed and reinserted the card, then it said BAD CARD.


This is the SD 32 GB card. YEAH, the one with the Sound Devices branding, which is the ONLY recommended card for this unit. I have a spare, but I used a Sandisk today and it seemed to go fine.


But I'm not pleased.

Thanks for letting us know about this.

I hope you will contact Sound Devices customer Service and let us know what happens after that. If I were in charge of SD, I would not be happy about something with the name of my company on it failing. I would definitely want my people testing out this particular card to find out (if possible) what happened. They say on their website that they extensively test these cards and it only makes sense that they would.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: relefunt on September 06, 2018, 08:56:34 PM
Well, it’s good to hear that it is a card failure.

However, I personally would rather physically mail the card to someone at Sound Devices (Nelson? Yes, you, Nelson. I’m looking at you) so they could check it out, send you a replacement, and keep track of who you are. Let’s say the card checks out perfectly well. Then maybe it might wind up being your deck (or some third explanation). But if you send it into your dealer and eventually it gets checked out by SD and nothing wrong is found, then how are they going to tell you that?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on September 07, 2018, 05:31:07 PM
Well, it’s good to hear that it is a card failure.

However, I personally would rather physically mail the card to someone at Sound Devices (Nelson? Yes, you, Nelson. I’m looking at you) so they could check it out, send you a replacement, and keep track of who you are. Let’s say the card checks out perfectly well. Then maybe it might wind up being your deck (or some third explanation). But if you send it into your dealer and eventually it gets checked out by SD and nothing wrong is found, then how are they going to tell you that?
naw, the card is fucked, it won't be refurbished, it doesn't even read properly every time now.


I left a folder on it, named with my email & phone number and a request for contact, if someone actually looks at the card testing it.
 :help:


My problem now is that I don't know if I can trust the other card I got from the same supplier in the same order!?!
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: justme on September 07, 2018, 06:01:03 PM
My problem now is that I don't know if I can trust the other card I got from the same supplier in the same order!?!

I would never trust it.
The risk of it being from the same bad batch/wafer/serie is way to high.
I would return it as well.

Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: justme on September 11, 2018, 01:22:39 PM
I’m hearing rumors about firmware 3.0 is on the way.
I’ve not received any information about this in my email though.

Any of you?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Chuck on September 11, 2018, 01:24:27 PM
Nope.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: sos on September 11, 2018, 01:31:54 PM

https://www.sounddevices.com/news/sound-devices-news/sound-devices-showcases-the-ultra-versatile-mixpre-series-at-ibc-2018
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Ronmac on September 11, 2018, 01:37:41 PM
“Sound Devices recorders have been used for Ambisonics field recording for many years, so it was a natural progression for us to bring our MixPre recorders into the new world of VR 360 recording,” said Matt Anderson, CEO of Sound Devices. “We are happy to partner with Sennheiser to provide a high-quality VR recording and monitoring option for our MixPre-6 and MixPre-10T customers.”


Support for the free Ambisonics plugin is a key feature of the MixPre version 3.00 Firmware, a free update being demoed at the show. The highly anticipated version 3.00 also enhances the user experience with all MixPre recorders by supporting full integration with four third-party USB fader controllers: Korg’s NanoKontrol Studio and NanoKontrol2, Novation’s LaunchControlXL, and Akai’s Midimix. The new firmware also introduces wireless remote transport control and monitoring of MixPre M models from iOS or Android mobile devices via the Wingman app.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rigpimp on September 11, 2018, 01:47:42 PM
“Sound Devices recorders have been used for Ambisonics field recording for many years, so it was a natural progression for us to bring our MixPre recorders into the new world of VR 360 recording,” said Matt Anderson, CEO of Sound Devices. “We are happy to partner with Sennheiser to provide a high-quality VR recording and monitoring option for our MixPre-6 and MixPre-10T customers.”


Support for the free Ambisonics plugin is a key feature of the MixPre version 3.00 Firmware, a free update being demoed at the show. The highly anticipated version 3.00 also enhances the user experience with all MixPre recorders by supporting full integration with four third-party USB fader controllers: Korg’s NanoKontrol Studio and NanoKontrol2, Novation’s LaunchControlXL, and Akai’s Midimix. The new firmware also introduces wireless remote transport control and monitoring of MixPre M models from iOS or Android mobile devices via the Wingman app.

Well, that is stupid.  Why not just make the transport control device wide instead of just the M models?  How long have we been asking for more features in the Wingman app?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: aaronji on September 11, 2018, 03:48:31 PM
^ Currently, the M versions aren't compatible with Wingman at all. The monitoring and transport they are adding are probably the same ones that are already available for the non-M versions. If they are adding new features (that aren't specific for the M), they will likely add them to the regular models as well.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: justme on September 11, 2018, 04:03:14 PM
Thanks a lot!

Even though I would have liked wireless transport control - at least they are giving us USB faders :)

“Sound Devices recorders have been used for Ambisonics field recording for many years, so it was a natural progression for us to bring our MixPre recorders into the new world of VR 360 recording,” said Matt Anderson, CEO of Sound Devices. “We are happy to partner with Sennheiser to provide a high-quality VR recording and monitoring option for our MixPre-6 and MixPre-10T customers.”


Support for the free Ambisonics plugin is a key feature of the MixPre version 3.00 Firmware, a free update being demoed at the show. The highly anticipated version 3.00 also enhances the user experience with all MixPre recorders by supporting full integration with four third-party USB fader controllers: Korg’s NanoKontrol Studio and NanoKontrol2, Novation’s LaunchControlXL, and Akai’s Midimix. The new firmware also introduces wireless remote transport control and monitoring of MixPre M models from iOS or Android mobile devices via the Wingman app.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: aaronji on September 11, 2018, 06:31:08 PM
For a typically two band gig I use a battery sled with 8 AA rechangables. I use whatever card I have with no issue.  Guess I’m just lucky.

I have also been using the 8 AA sled with Eneloop Pros. Full levels even after a souncheck, opener and main act (two phantom channels and two soundboard channels, plus the mix). And some playback on the train home. I originally bought the 8 battery sled as an interim measure, while I figured out the best powering scheme, but I haven't felt the need to change that up yet. This post (https://www.sounddevices.com/tech-notes/mixpre-3-mixpre-6-maxbatteryruntime) from SD may be informative with respect to this, although I think I probably get better run times with the Eneloops...
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Paul Isaacs on September 12, 2018, 08:10:42 AM
Well, it’s good to hear that it is a card failure.

However, I personally would rather physically mail the card to someone at Sound Devices (Nelson? Yes, you, Nelson. I’m looking at you) so they could check it out, send you a replacement, and keep track of who you are. Let’s say the card checks out perfectly well. Then maybe it might wind up being your deck (or some third explanation). But if you send it into your dealer and eventually it gets checked out by SD and nothing wrong is found, then how are they going to tell you that?
naw, the card is fucked, it won't be refurbished, it doesn't even read properly every time now.


I left a folder on it, named with my email & phone number and a request for contact, if someone actually looks at the card testing it.
 :help:


My problem now is that I don't know if I can trust the other card I got from the same supplier in the same order!?!

As far as I'm aware, we have not had a single Sound Devices SD card failure - that's not to say it is not possible, after all electronics, like anything else can fail - fact of life.
We'd be very interested to take a look at this card. Please contact Tech Support, mention that I suggested we take a look and they'll advise how to proceed. Many thanks.

Paul Isaacs
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Paul Isaacs on September 12, 2018, 08:15:45 AM
“Sound Devices recorders have been used for Ambisonics field recording for many years, so it was a natural progression for us to bring our MixPre recorders into the new world of VR 360 recording,” said Matt Anderson, CEO of Sound Devices. “We are happy to partner with Sennheiser to provide a high-quality VR recording and monitoring option for our MixPre-6 and MixPre-10T customers.”


Support for the free Ambisonics plugin is a key feature of the MixPre version 3.00 Firmware, a free update being demoed at the show. The highly anticipated version 3.00 also enhances the user experience with all MixPre recorders by supporting full integration with four third-party USB fader controllers: Korg’s NanoKontrol Studio and NanoKontrol2, Novation’s LaunchControlXL, and Akai’s Midimix. The new firmware also introduces wireless remote transport control and monitoring of MixPre M models from iOS or Android mobile devices via the Wingman app.

Well, that is stupid.  Why not just make the transport control device wide instead of just the M models?  How long have we been asking for more features in the Wingman app?

Not stupid. The Classic MixPre models (non-M models) already have this functionality. v3.00 firmware brings this same bluetooth wireless remote control to the M-models ... for free.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: borjam on September 12, 2018, 09:27:45 AM
My problem now is that I don't know if I can trust the other card I got from the same supplier in the same order!?!

As far as I'm aware, we have not had a single Sound Devices SD card failure - that's not to say it is not possible, after all electronics, like anything else can fail - fact of life.
We'd be very interested to take a look at this card. Please contact Tech Support, mention that I suggested we take a look and they'll advise how to proceed. Many thanks.


The problem in this cases is, sometimes dealers won't forward defective units to the manufacturers. 15 years ago I had a really serious situation with a manufacturer of microwave links. Several units failed in sequence. Several months later I learned that the idiot dealer had not sent the broken units to the manufacturer citing "local policy" despite having been told to ship them back to the manufacturer by the fastest means possible.

Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: noahbickart on September 12, 2018, 09:35:48 AM
Indeed, this is far from stupid, and makes the (less expensive) "m" series fully appropriate for "what we do."

Any chance the wingman app will eventually be able to change gain? I love it and use it for monitoring, but to change levels, one still needs to user the actual knobs....

“Sound Devices recorders have been used for Ambisonics field recording for many years, so it was a natural progression for us to bring our MixPre recorders into the new world of VR 360 recording,” said Matt Anderson, CEO of Sound Devices. “We are happy to partner with Sennheiser to provide a high-quality VR recording and monitoring option for our MixPre-6 and MixPre-10T customers.”


Support for the free Ambisonics plugin is a key feature of the MixPre version 3.00 Firmware, a free update being demoed at the show. The highly anticipated version 3.00 also enhances the user experience with all MixPre recorders by supporting full integration with four third-party USB fader controllers: Korg’s NanoKontrol Studio and NanoKontrol2, Novation’s LaunchControlXL, and Akai’s Midimix. The new firmware also introduces wireless remote transport control and monitoring of MixPre M models from iOS or Android mobile devices via the Wingman app.

Well, that is stupid.  Why not just make the transport control device wide instead of just the M models?  How long have we been asking for more features in the Wingman app?

Not stupid. The Classic MixPre models (non-M models) already have this functionality. v3.00 firmware brings this same bluetooth wireless remote control to the M-models ... for free.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rigpimp on September 12, 2018, 10:14:25 AM
Indeed, this is far from stupid, and makes the (less expensive) "m" series fully appropriate for "what we do."

Any chance the wingman app will eventually be able to change gain? I love it and use it for monitoring, but to change levels, one still needs to user the actual knobs....

“Sound Devices recorders have been used for Ambisonics field recording for many years, so it was a natural progression for us to bring our MixPre recorders into the new world of VR 360 recording,” said Matt Anderson, CEO of Sound Devices. “We are happy to partner with Sennheiser to provide a high-quality VR recording and monitoring option for our MixPre-6 and MixPre-10T customers.”


Support for the free Ambisonics plugin is a key feature of the MixPre version 3.00 Firmware, a free update being demoed at the show. The highly anticipated version 3.00 also enhances the user experience with all MixPre recorders by supporting full integration with four third-party USB fader controllers: Korg’s NanoKontrol Studio and NanoKontrol2, Novation’s LaunchControlXL, and Akai’s Midimix. The new firmware also introduces wireless remote transport control and monitoring of MixPre M models from iOS or Android mobile devices via the Wingman app.

Well, that is stupid.  Why not just make the transport control device wide instead of just the M models?  How long have we been asking for more features in the Wingman app?

Not stupid. The Classic MixPre models (non-M models) already have this functionality. v3.00 firmware brings this same bluetooth wireless remote control to the M-models ... for free.

Sounds like you two missed the point of my post.  Good luck.  I'll go back to lurking
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: noahbickart on September 12, 2018, 10:20:04 AM
I guess I don’t understand your post.

You suggested that this wasn’t a platform wide upgrade. But it is.

What were you trying to say?

Indeed, this is far from stupid, and makes the (less expensive) "m" series fully appropriate for "what we do."

Any chance the wingman app will eventually be able to change gain? I love it and use it for monitoring, but to change levels, one still needs to user the actual knobs....

“Sound Devices recorders have been used for Ambisonics field recording for many years, so it was a natural progression for us to bring our MixPre recorders into the new world of VR 360 recording,” said Matt Anderson, CEO of Sound Devices. “We are happy to partner with Sennheiser to provide a high-quality VR recording and monitoring option for our MixPre-6 and MixPre-10T customers.”


Support for the free Ambisonics plugin is a key feature of the MixPre version 3.00 Firmware, a free update being demoed at the show. The highly anticipated version 3.00 also enhances the user experience with all MixPre recorders by supporting full integration with four third-party USB fader controllers: Korg’s NanoKontrol Studio and NanoKontrol2, Novation’s LaunchControlXL, and Akai’s Midimix. The new firmware also introduces wireless remote transport control and monitoring of MixPre M models from iOS or Android mobile devices via the Wingman app.

Well, that is stupid.  Why not just make the transport control device wide instead of just the M models?  How long have we been asking for more features in the Wingman app?

Not stupid. The Classic MixPre models (non-M models) already have this functionality. v3.00 firmware brings this same bluetooth wireless remote control to the M-models ... for free.

Sounds like you two missed the point of my post.  Good luck.  I'll go back to lurking
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: relefunt on September 12, 2018, 12:01:31 PM
Well, it’s good to hear that it is a card failure.

However, I personally would rather physically mail the card to someone at Sound Devices (Nelson? Yes, you, Nelson. I’m looking at you) so they could check it out, send you a replacement, and keep track of who you are. Let’s say the card checks out perfectly well. Then maybe it might wind up being your deck (or some third explanation). But if you send it into your dealer and eventually it gets checked out by SD and nothing wrong is found, then how are they going to tell you that?
naw, the card is fucked, it won't be refurbished, it doesn't even read properly every time now.


I left a folder on it, named with my email & phone number and a request for contact, if someone actually looks at the card testing it.
 :help:


My problem now is that I don't know if I can trust the other card I got from the same supplier in the same order!?!

As far as I'm aware, we have not had a single Sound Devices SD card failure - that's not to say it is not possible, after all electronics, like anything else can fail - fact of life.
We'd be very interested to take a look at this card. Please contact Tech Support, mention that I suggested we take a look and they'll advise how to proceed. Many thanks.

Paul Isaacs

Thanks Paul. It’s good to hear an actual response from someone within the company and not the type of hanging-around-the-bubbler-chatting type of speculation about lower quality control, entire batches of cards not working, etc etc
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on September 13, 2018, 05:59:47 AM
As far as I'm aware, we have not had a single Sound Devices SD card failure - that's not to say it is not possible, after all electronics, like anything else can fail - fact of life.
We'd be very interested to take a look at this card. Please contact Tech Support, mention that I suggested we take a look and they'll advise how to proceed. Many thanks.

Paul Isaacs


Too late. Nelson at Sound Devices said to have the retailer replace it. I just got my replacement card in the mail from Location Sound in CA, they have the old hosed card.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rigpimp on September 13, 2018, 11:43:59 AM
“Sound Devices recorders have been used for Ambisonics field recording for many years, so it was a natural progression for us to bring our MixPre recorders into the new world of VR 360 recording,” said Matt Anderson, CEO of Sound Devices. “We are happy to partner with Sennheiser to provide a high-quality VR recording and monitoring option for our MixPre-6 and MixPre-10T customers.”


Support for the free Ambisonics plugin is a key feature of the MixPre version 3.00 Firmware, a free update being demoed at the show. The highly anticipated version 3.00 also enhances the user experience with all MixPre recorders by supporting full integration with four third-party USB fader controllers: Korg’s NanoKontrol Studio and NanoKontrol2, Novation’s LaunchControlXL, and Akai’s Midimix. The new firmware also introduces wireless remote transport control and monitoring of MixPre M models from iOS or Android mobile devices via the Wingman app.

Well, that is stupid.  Why not just make the transport control device wide instead of just the M models?  How long have we been asking for more features in the Wingman app?

Not stupid. The Classic MixPre models (non-M models) already have this functionality. v3.00 firmware brings this same bluetooth wireless remote control to the M-models ... for free.

Sorry Paul and Noah. I thought that M models already had Wingman functionality and when I saw the term "transport control" I figured it was more than just the simple 'Record' and 'Stop' functions.  I too would like to see more features added to the app, hence me blurting out that something was stupid.  I'll just crawl back over to my corner now.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on September 13, 2018, 06:29:29 PM
It would be neat if you could use the Wingman app to monitor levels, but not allow the app to stop your recording.


Either READ ONLY mode or a lock "switch" would do the trick.


Haha, I just realized that I could have really made use of the Wingman app this summer if I had not been scared that it would stop my recordings! It's a good idea.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: borjam on September 15, 2018, 04:20:29 PM
Some good news from IBC :)

Pre record buffer for the MixPres (5 seconds for the 3 and 6, 10 seconds for the 10T)

Full Ambisonics support with some really good features such as direct conversion to binaural.

Controller support for several fader packs from Novation, Korg and Akai.

https://vimeo.com/290032752

Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: down2earthlandscaper on September 16, 2018, 03:15:30 AM
It really would be so useful to be able to adjust levels from the Wingman app!
 :alert:# squeaky wheel
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: relefunt on September 16, 2018, 04:26:57 PM
Some good news from IBC :)

Pre record buffer for the MixPres (5 seconds for the 3 and 6, 10 seconds for the 10T)

Full Ambisonics support with some really good features such as direct conversion to binaural.

Controller support for several fader packs from Novation, Korg and Akai.

https://vimeo.com/290032752

The buffers should really be 3 seconds for the MixPre 3, 6 seconds for the 6, and 10 seconds for the 10. Then people would feel like they are getting a little something extra for buying the next size up. Plus it would be easier to remember. 🤔
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Chuck on September 16, 2018, 05:15:32 PM
Some good news from IBC :)

Pre record buffer for the MixPres (5 seconds for the 3 and 6, 10 seconds for the 10T)

Full Ambisonics support with some really good features such as direct conversion to binaural.

Controller support for several fader packs from Novation, Korg and Akai.

https://vimeo.com/290032752


The buffers should really be 3 seconds for the MixPre 3, 6 seconds for the 6, and 10 seconds for the 10. Then people would feel like they are getting a little something extra for buying the next size up. Plus it would be easier to remember. 🤔

5 seconds will be great. I often need a couple extra seconds when I'm near the recorder, and not watching it when the band walks on stage.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: noahbickart on September 17, 2018, 08:43:31 AM
Any info on when 3.0 will be released?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: tim in jersey on September 17, 2018, 09:04:10 AM
Buffer is nice, but in this day and age where battery life and memory are a'plenty who really gives a shit? I recently recorded a gig where the band dicked around for about 40 minutes before starting.

Recorder was running a full 30+ minutes beforehand. Just had to make slight adjustments to levels once they got going.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: noahbickart on September 17, 2018, 11:00:24 AM
Buffer is nice, but in this day and age where battery life and memory are a'plenty who really gives a shit? I recently recorded a gig where the band dicked around for about 40 minutes before starting.

Recorder was running a full 30+ minutes beforehand. Just had to make slight adjustments to levels once they got going.

I agree, and tend to start the recording as soon as I get everything set up, and create a new track by pressing "record" when the house lights dim.

On the other hand, It's a fairly standard feature for Digital recorders, so it only makes sense for SD to implement it.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: tim in jersey on September 18, 2018, 05:31:27 AM
As an aside: Apparently you know Jamie and Amy B?  J&A are Philly taping buds of mine.
Do you know Kenny and Dee/ or JJ and Margie H.? Also friends...

Hope our paths collide at some point...


Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: microburst on September 21, 2018, 01:45:24 PM
I bought one of the MP-6 decks a few weeks ago and finally took it out of the box this morning. I have been reading through the manual playing with setting up and saving a few presets for different scenarios I encounter regularly.

Stupid question but I can't figure it out:  Is there no way to adjust gain on the individual channels other than in the channel menus?  The knobs seem to be faders only?  Any way to change that in the menus to turn the knobs into gain control?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Gordon on September 21, 2018, 02:00:13 PM
Change it to custom mode.  Then set the gain to basic mode, which will allow you to use the knobs to control gain on the individual channels.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: junkyardt on September 21, 2018, 02:19:41 PM
Change it to custom mode.  Then set the gain to basic mode, which will allow you to use the knobs to control gain on the individual channels.

yeah, set gain to basic but leave everything else advanced (you can set output to basic too if you're not streaming or no one is patching off of you). one thing i'd add is if you're linking stereo pairs of mics to 1-2 and 3-4 and gain is set to basic, then you don't so much control gain for each individual channel with each knob. instead, knob 1 sets the gain for stereo pair 1-2, while knob 2 acts as a fader for that pair. same thing for 3 and 4, 3 is the gain knob for 3-4 while 4 is the fader knob.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: microburst on September 21, 2018, 02:27:03 PM
Thanks guys, that solves it for now.  Pretty simple and intuitive so far other than that one piece. 
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: microburst on September 21, 2018, 02:32:04 PM
I take the above back.  Can't seem to get the wingman app to identify the deck.  Bluetooth is on on both devices.  I setup a password on the deck since i'm guessing in the NYC area I could be in vicinity of multiple decks but I can't seem to locate the deck in the wingman app.  Is there something else I need to do in the app or on my phone?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: jbell on September 21, 2018, 02:37:34 PM
It should just pick up your deck if bluetooth is on!!  Android or ios?

I take the above back.  Can't seem to get the wingman app to identify the deck.  Bluetooth is on on both devices.  I setup a password on the deck since i'm guessing in the NYC area I could be in vicinity of multiple decks but I can't seem to locate the deck in the wingman app.  Is there something else I need to do in the app or on my phone?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: microburst on September 21, 2018, 02:41:41 PM
iOS iphone X.  Being a new phone for me I've never used the bluetooth but it is on. 
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: jbell on September 21, 2018, 02:50:50 PM
I use android and haven't ever had a problem.  I'm sure you've tried, but if not restart the deck and see if that works.

iOS iphone X.  Being a new phone for me I've never used the bluetooth but it is on.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: microburst on September 21, 2018, 02:53:21 PM
Yup I just restarted both devices and I'm in business now.  Should have tried that first
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: jbell on September 21, 2018, 03:47:51 PM

The wingman is a nice feature.  Hopefully they will add level adjustments in future firmware.

Yup I just restarted both devices and I'm in business now.  Should have tried that first
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on September 21, 2018, 10:17:51 PM
Yup I just restarted both devices and I'm in business now.  Should have tried that first
I found wingman fails a lot on both IOS & droid with my old phones. Restarting the phone should be sufficient, though it doesn't always work.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: down2earthlandscaper on September 22, 2018, 04:35:21 AM
I found it pretty commonplace for the Wingman app to drop the connections (or actually just not be able to establish it) without having to turn Bluetooth off and then on again at both phone and recorder. Sometimes even having to reboot the recorder to “wake thing’s up”. Since I updated to the latest firmaware the connection seems to be much more reliable. It’s only happened once or twice since updating the firmware.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on October 17, 2018, 05:48:35 PM
I had a problem with the MixPre6 last week- I think I was trying to make a new project and the display said something like "Could not create folder"


I pulled the card & reinserted it and it seemed to work fine after that but I busted out the spare Sandisk SD card at set break after the opening act.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: checht on October 19, 2018, 05:37:31 PM

The wingman is a nice feature.  Hopefully they will add level adjustments in future firmware.

Yup I just restarted both devices and I'm in business now.  Should have tried that first

Been considering this lately. Perhaps the issue is maintaining the relationship between knob position and gain. Given that the knobs aren't motorized, how might that work?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: checht on October 19, 2018, 05:38:50 PM
Once firmware 3.0 drops, what would be the down side of getting an M-series compared to the regular?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: junkyardt on October 19, 2018, 06:41:07 PM
Once firmware 3.0 drops, what would be the down side of getting an M-series compared to the regular?

fwiw, i reported a bug i've been having a few days ago and they responded that they hoped to get it fixed in either 2.22 or 3.00, so 3.00 might not be the next update.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: morst on October 19, 2018, 07:28:24 PM
Been considering this lately. Perhaps the issue is maintaining the relationship between knob position and gain. Given that the knobs aren't motorized, how might that work?
They could assign the headphone knob position to a slider on the Wingman App screen? Then anything you adjust with a virtual knob could be controlled via Bluetooth?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: vwmule on October 19, 2018, 11:54:19 PM
Do we have a winner on USB c-to-c cable?

I have this Anker and it's solid quality but a bit long. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01GMZP2I6/ref=twister_B07C2Q4XV9?_encoding=UTF8&th=1

Would like something similar but shorter.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Gordon on October 20, 2018, 12:54:51 AM
since it's braided just coil it up and use twist ties on it.  hell mine's 4 feet and it takes up no space at all coiled.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: justme on November 11, 2018, 08:18:40 AM
Just wanted to share some compatibility with Toshiba EXCERIA™ N302 SD cards.
https://www.toshiba-memory.com/products/toshiba-sd-cards-exceria-n302/
64GB UHS-3, Read/Write 90/30MB per sec.

I bought some for use for video and thought they might work in the Mixpre6 as well. But they did not.
2 ch ISO + mix @192KHz and 18.4Mbit/s
was too much and shorty after recording began the mixpre warned about slow card and stopped.
2 ch ISO + mix @96KHz and 9.2Mbit/s worked though.

For video with far higher bitrates I have no problem at all with the same cards. I guess the mixpre can be kind of exigent. :)
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: vwmule on November 12, 2018, 10:12:07 AM
Lost track of the thread about external power options. Can someone help? A friend got a MixPre6 and trying to help get him up and running. The battery I use, the Monoprice type C, appears to be discontinued.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: junkyardt on November 12, 2018, 10:56:20 AM
Lost track of the thread about external power options. Can someone help? A friend got a MixPre6 and trying to help get him up and running. The battery I use, the Monoprice type C, appears to be discontinued.

http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=182362.0
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: vwmule on November 12, 2018, 10:57:30 AM
^ Perfect. Thank you.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: GDfan on November 12, 2018, 10:57:43 AM
Lost track of the thread about external power options. Can someone help? A friend got a MixPre6 and trying to help get him up and running. The battery I use, the Monoprice type C, appears to be discontinued.

From Sound devices website they have a link to the Anker battery that I linked below. I have used this without any issues, and the cable that is linked just above is great.

https://www.sounddevices.com/tech-notes/mixpre-3-mixpre-6-powering-options

https://www.anker.com/products/variant/powercore-20100-usb-c/A1371012
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Gordon on November 12, 2018, 11:55:09 AM
I have 2 of these.  In testing I got about 8 hrs with 2 channel phantom.  Small and light.....;


https://www.ebay.com/p/HyperGear-Usb-c-Qc-2-0-Power-Bank-12000mah-Portable-Battery/768368061
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Chuck on November 12, 2018, 11:57:19 AM
I have 2 of these.  In testing I got about 8 hrs with 2 channel phantom.  Small and light.....;


https://www.ebay.com/p/HyperGear-Usb-c-Qc-2-0-Power-Bank-12000mah-Portable-Battery/768368061

I have two of those too. They both work great.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: junkyardt on November 12, 2018, 12:46:24 PM
I have 2 of these.  In testing I got about 8 hrs with 2 channel phantom.  Small and light.....;


https://www.ebay.com/p/HyperGear-Usb-c-Qc-2-0-Power-Bank-12000mah-Portable-Battery/768368061

would be interested to see how much that changes when running 6 channels. i've been looking for a smaller, lighter alternative to my anker 26800+ PD, which is quite bulky and heavy to stealth with, but i'd also want the battery to be able to survive an entire show while running all 6 channels, while potentially taping 2-3 sets.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Gordon on November 12, 2018, 01:08:57 PM
I run four channel all the time (mics + sbd so not phantom) and have never come close to running out of battery.  I use AA as backup which makes it easy to switch batterys if needed.  That said I only care one in my bag at a time.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rigpimp on November 12, 2018, 02:24:57 PM
Does anyone have a .xml preset file they could share for running all 6 channels?  I'd rather just plug one in and tweak it as needed.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: checht on November 15, 2018, 01:37:43 AM
Confirmed yet another bug in 2.2.1 custom mode. With gain set to basic, stereo outputs can only be set to post-fader, showing blue.

SD recommended going to advanced mode, but that would add a gain stage to the recording path. Downside of this issue is that 3.5mm output is post the gain stage, but I think I'll prioritize the recording path and stick with custom.

The tech said it ought to be fixed in 2.2.2.

3 coming soon...
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rippleish20 on November 15, 2018, 09:34:36 AM
Confirmed yet another bug in 2.2.1 custom mode. With gain set to basic, stereo outputs can only be set to post-fader, showing blue.

SD recommended going to advanced mode, but that would add a gain stage to the recording path. Downside of this issue is that 3.5mm output is post the gain stage, but I think I'll prioritize the recording path and stick with custom.

The tech said it ought to be fixed in 2.2.2.

3 coming soon...


This goes back to the fact that they have never really explained the gain stage details. I would think this not actually a bug and just the way it is under custom mode.

Under advanced mode, with two gain stages, which I will call trim and fader, you might want outputs to be pre-fader, so that they reflect the trim level you have set, but not changes you have made for the mix (fader stage). In custom mode, there really is only post fader (fader is effectively trim). What would pre-fader be is this scenario? Just the incoming signal level?
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: Gordon on November 15, 2018, 10:22:17 AM
I don't pretend to know much about "pre" and "post" fade but Jbell and I have our stereo out setup so it's channel's 3&4 so we can patch out of each other for the sbd feed.  With it set to post fade (only option now) it's essentially a line level signal which is what we want when sending each other a sbd patch.  You can still use the front knob to fine tune but no need to set the gain in the output settings.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: noahbickart on November 15, 2018, 10:41:47 AM
This goes back to the fact that they have never really explained the gain stage details.

This. I really want to know how the "taper mode" we've all been using to make this act like a "normal" recorder actually works.
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: dogmusic on November 15, 2018, 02:27:49 PM
This goes back to the fact that they have never really explained the gain stage details.

This. I really want to know how the "taper mode" we've all been using to make this act like a "normal" recorder actually works.

I've been suggesting for awhile that there is actually no control of analog gain on the MixPre3/6/10. The analog input is wide open with excellent analog limiters. But any fader/trim control is of the digital signal post-ADC.

Recently I found this quote on Gearslutz regarding SD preamps from John Tatooles of Sound Devices. In the paragraph near the bottom about the 788T I've highlighted the relevant information:

"Quote:
The 442 preamps are very similar to the 302, MixPre, MM-1, and MP-1 preamps. These are all transformer-based and we take advantage of the passive step-up gain available by the transformer. This allows these preamps to draw very low power. Some advantage of transformers:

- draw low power
- provide galvanic isolation
- excellent sonic characteristics when using quality transformers

The downside of transformers:

- physically large for quality transformers
- poor/small transformers have distortion and limit bandwidth

The Lundahl transformers we use in the mixers are the best available, BAR NONE. That said, we had an opportunity when the 7-Series came out to rethink preamps.

The preamps in the smaller 7-Series, 702, 702T, 722, and 744T use discrete transistors (old school high-current parts). This is a great sounding circuit that we are very proud of. The preamp in these products was designed in 2003.

The preamps in the 788T were designed in 2008, and there are new topologies available that just didn't exist a few years ago. The 788T mic preamps are very similar in noise, dynamic range, distortion, performance etc. to the other design, but they are completely new, and (more importantly) completely digitally controlled. There is no analog audio running through a pot like in the old designs. This allows us precise gain matching between channels and a much more dB-linear gain curve. It also provides for hooks to control them, if we need to in the future.

The 788T preamps are also more power-efficient that the discrete transistors, which is important when you have eight of them.
__________________
Jon Tatooles
Sound Devices"
Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: rippleish20 on November 15, 2018, 07:13:42 PM

"There is no analog audio running through a pot like in the old designs. This "

The problem is that different people are told different things.

^ Based on several e-mails with SD, there are definitely two gain stages: 76 dB at the pre and 20 dB at the fader. They weren't super specific, but my interpretation of their responses is that the pre gain is analog and the fader gain is digital (or, at least, mostly so). In custom mode, with basic gain, they confirmed that it is a mix of the two stages, but wouldn't say where the digital portion kicked in. They did say that, due to their pre/ADC architecture, the analog and digital gain would be indistinguishable both audibly and visually (on the waveform). Not sure if that helps or not!

Title: Re: Sound Devices MixPre-3 and 6, Part 5
Post by: borjam on November 16, 2018, 02:41:59 AM
I've been suggesting for awhile that there is actually no control of analog gain on the MixPre3/6/10.
Not surprising, even the PMD661mkii does it. Did you notice some slow and smooth response when you turn the knob quickly? That's a good thing, a worn potentiometer won't ruin your recorder in the future.

Quote
The analog input is wide open with excellent analog limiters. But any fader/trim control is of the digital signal post-ADC.
I was surprised by the presence of a 32 bit ADC, but I am pretty sure there is a digitally controlled analog gain (pre ADC and pre limiter) in the preamplifier. But it doesn´t make much sense to have a preamp gain after the limiter.

The 8 additional bits are probably helping to reduce the complexity of the analog circuitry by giving more headroom. But instead of reducing the ADC resolution in order to implement a digital limiter, what Zoom does in the F8n, probably they have "split the effort" but without compromising the 24 bit resolution of the ADC.

Quote
Recently I found this quote on Gearslutz regarding SD preamps from John Tatooles of Sound Devices. In the paragraph near the bottom about the 788T I've highlighted the relevant information:

The 442 preamps are very similar to the 302, MixPre, MM-1, and MP-1 preamps. These are all transformer-based and we take advantage of the passive step-up gain available by the transformer.
Beware, there was a mixer only MixPre (no numbers) before our beloved MixPre-number. I guess that description applies to it.

Quote
This allows these preamps to draw very low power. Some advantage of transformers:

- draw low power
- provide galvanic isolation
- excellent sonic characteristics when using quality transformers
And the MixPre's don't use transformers unless I am terribly wrong ;)

https://fccid.io/2AKLX-739M3/Internal-Photos/Internal-Photos-3297643

It would be nice if they posted a broad description of what they've done if only to satisfy our geeky curiosity ;) I am amazed that they managed to do it at its price point.