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Offline Brian Skalinder

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JB3 external power
« on: December 04, 2003, 11:14:39 AM »
I've started looking for alternative ways to power my JB3.  Is anyone running their JB3 on external power?  I know some people encountered problems with:

[1] unit locking up when external power finishes recharging the internal battery.

Resolution:  Last night I found out the JB3 will run from external DC power with no battery in the battery bays.

[2] unit operating only within a fairly limited voltage range.

Resolution (theoretical): Running a 9.6v or 7.2v external battery with a 5v voltage regulator (7805) should maintain the voltage within the JB3s operating range.

I was initially thinking of getting a 3AH, 9.6v RC battery.  However, if the current draw numbers from Nomadness are correct (500mA nominal, 1A w/HD activity, 1.5A during HD spin-up), this would still only get me around 3 hrs - no different than the internal LiON batteries.  So...not sure it's worth the extra bulk?  But I think there are several benefits to running external batteries:

[a] can be charged independently of the JB3
may be hot-swapped if the wiring harness is built properly
[c] can be swapped with increased capacity batteries as technology improves
[d] can be used for other devices as well (my wmod-UA5, for example)

If I end up doing this, I'll post my results back here.  Anyway, here's the post from the Nomadness JB3 forum about the JB3 current draw:

Quote
On 2003-06-23 09:58, Vido wrote:
We just did a measurement of the current draw of the JB3.

The nominal current draw is approx. 500 mA, but the current is higher when the harddisk is accessed (approx. 1 A) and peaks when the harddisk has to spin up (up to 1.5A). This test was done with fully-charged batteries (I have 2 inside).  The current draw will be probably even higher depending on the depletion level of the jukebox battery(ies).
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Offline Lee

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Re:JB3 external power
« Reply #1 on: December 04, 2003, 02:45:07 PM »
good luck... there's a fairly extensive post of mine about 6 months ago detailing my attempts.
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Offline dklein

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Re:JB3 external power
« Reply #2 on: December 04, 2003, 03:33:27 PM »

[1] unit locking up when external power finishes recharging the internal battery.

Resolution:  Last night I found out the JB3 will run from external DC power with no battery in the battery bays.

It's actually not from 'finishing the recharge'.  External power seems to always be given the priority in terms of where the JB3 looks for power.  All that's going on here is that recharging the internal battery has depleted the external one.  Then you get the same thing that happens if you run off external power past the safe point.

The solution is to start with the external and internal in place.  Then, at a safe point, pull the external (and switch over to internal).  If you go internal first, the external will use all it's power recharging the internal and you'll lock up as described.

I wouldn't recommend running without the internal battery - it's your safeguard against power interruption (cord gets yanked).  Just make sure it's charged first and you won't have the lockup problem as long as you pull the external in time.

check my last post here http://www.taperssection.com/yabbse/index.php?board=25;action=display;threadid=9872 for some more details

The JB3 battery is only 1600 or 1700 mAh so you should be able to get better battery life from a 3000 pack.  I've used 4 NiMh cells without a regulator to run successfully - other than the slight over-voltage issue right at the start (check that other thread) it works great.  If it's really charged up and won't bring the JB3 to life,  just run a halogen bulb on it for a minute to take it down  to JB3 level voltage.  btw, I just chopped a 9.6 pack into two pieces to do this.

You can definitely run a regulator with a 7.2v pack, but all you do is burn up the extra voltage as heat.  It won't run any longer than running 4 of the same NiMh cells straight in.  In fact, it may be slightly shorter because of the regulator.

Another thing I did was run one pack for the UA-5 and JB3 together.  Just split the power between them - straight for the UA-5, car adapter for the JB3.  I could run both devices for 3 hours on a 3000mAh pack (without the JB3 internal).  So one strategy is to run both for the first hour or two and then unplug the JB3 for a total run time of 4-5 hours when combined with a single JB3 internal battery.

Both of the above are 'hot swappable' as long as you have the internal battery in place.  The only time it will die is if you mess up and hot swap a weak battery in there.  Remember, the JB3 always looks to the external first.

The JB3 is a power pig but it's not quite that bad.  I measured 260 mA with peaks of 800 or so on disc writes.  For battery life calculations you can consider it to be around 600 mA (which conveniently fits the almost 3 hour battery life of the internal).

Ever start writing a short post and then before you know it.... (I know this happens to you Brian!)
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Offline Brian Skalinder

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Re:JB3 external power
« Reply #3 on: December 04, 2003, 04:49:37 PM »
David - many thanks for the detailed clarification on the internal/external power issues, I somehow missed your final post to that thread.  Still haven't figured out what I'm going to do...hmmmmmmm...
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Offline elopi

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Re:JB3 external power
« Reply #4 on: December 14, 2003, 06:38:04 AM »
Yet another point of view. I tried a cheap 6v Pb battery with a 7805 but as known from previous posts, it did not work (1v is too low for 7805). Then I tried a different way. I opened the NJB3 and soldered a 3 pole connector on the internal 2nd empty battery. I soldered on the NJB3 wires and not directly on the pins which hosts the battery so this modification can be easily undoed. Then I used a 6v Pb battery (I had an old one, only 4000mA in 10 cm x 4 cm x 7 cm, not so huge) and a adjustable regulator LM 338 (it is rated for 5A, maybe a LM 117 it also good but I never found it on electronic shop near my house). No heat at all! Then a couple of resistors to set the voltage to 3.9 v and all worked perfectly. I just tried to power NJB3 playing MP3 and after 20 hours it was still working. My next trial will be a WAV recording (I expect at least 3.5-4 hours) but I need a fresh battery. Here in Italy it costs 5-10 euros (near 5-10 bucks), quite cheap. The regulator is near 9 euros, then a couple of meters of wire and a comb connector (male+female) make the rest.

Offline Kindguy

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Re:JB3 external power
« Reply #5 on: December 14, 2003, 03:11:57 PM »
Anyone know how long will my 2 JB3 internal batterys run when recording. I've never had to run past 4 hours.
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Re:JB3 external power
« Reply #6 on: December 15, 2003, 01:04:11 AM »
Anyone know how long will my 2 JB3 internal batterys run when recording. I've never had to run past 4 hours.

Come to think of it, neither have I...

I've noticed they're extremely temperature sensitive, if it's really cold, forget about it!
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Offline bagtagsell

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Re:JB3 external power
« Reply #7 on: December 31, 2003, 02:45:36 PM »
10 amp SLA>alligator clips female cigarette lighter thing (radio shack)>Car power kit (with selectable voltage or the creative one)>NJB3.  Power up takes a heavy draw so always power up with only the batteries, then plug up the SLA stuff works like a charm for a long time.
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Re:JB3 external power
« Reply #8 on: March 07, 2004, 04:44:46 PM »




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Offline BJ

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Re:JB3 external power
« Reply #9 on: March 08, 2004, 08:43:09 AM »
would a 4.8V 4000mah not work?  is the .2V that much missing as not to power it??
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Offline John R

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Re:JB3 external power
« Reply #10 on: March 08, 2004, 08:59:32 AM »
i think i'm just gonna get their 12v car kit and hack it to run from a 12v 7.2A/h.  unless i'm using house power, like always ::)

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Offline Brian Skalinder

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Re:JB3 external power
« Reply #11 on: March 08, 2004, 09:01:04 AM »
would a 4.8V 4000mah not work?  is the .2V that much missing as not to power it??

4.8v battery fully charged puts out low-mid 5s voltage.  I've read a couple posts over on the NJB3Tapers Yahoo group and I think there's someone over there using 4 x 1.2v rechargables for external power.  But I also recall seeing someone post over there that fully charged, the 4.8v's actual output was too high and needed to be run down a bit before the NJB3 would run off them.  Give it a try, seems like mixed results so far from what I've read.
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Offline F.O.Bean

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Re:JB3 external power
« Reply #12 on: March 08, 2004, 09:09:10 AM »
could i just buy 2 more batts, and keep em charged outside of the jb3, then throw em in, BAM, 6 more hrs
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Offline Brian Skalinder

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Re:JB3 external power
« Reply #13 on: March 08, 2004, 09:12:58 AM »
could i just buy 2 more batts, and keep em charged outside of the jb3, then throw em in, BAM, 6 more hrs

Yup.  Only catch is - how do you keep them charged outside the JB3?  I've never seen an external charger.  You could charge them up internally before hand.  Sure would be nice to have that external charger, though.
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Offline F.O.Bean

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Re:JB3 external power
« Reply #14 on: March 08, 2004, 09:15:31 AM »
could i just buy 2 more batts, and keep em charged outside of the jb3, then throw em in, BAM, 6 more hrs

Yup.  Only catch is - how do you keep them charged outside the JB3?  I've never seen an external charger.  You could charge them up internally before hand.  Sure would be nice to have that external charger, though.

no doubt, i was meaning charge em in the jb3, then take out, but this isnt really a problem solver because if one was at bonnaroo, they have to charge DOUBLE time to get both sets charged :P

but would be nice if one was taping a bunch of acts in one day :P

yeah, if they only had an external charger, they be MONEY
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