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Author Topic: very simple setup for stealth recording  (Read 28412 times)

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Offline wannabetaper

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very simple setup for stealth recording
« on: November 11, 2008, 07:14:17 AM »
Hello all,
I would like to record a concert that I will be attending in a couple of weeks, sitting in the first row. I have zero experience and would like to work with a very simple setup... I want to enjoy the concert and not to have to be paranoid about being caught and don't want to bother with fake earplugs mics, glass clipped mics, or stuff like that. I thought about simply putting a zoom H2 in the front pocket of my shirt but after checking the dimensions it looks like it is a little too big and it wouldn't be discreet enough (remember I will be on the first row!). Then I thought, why not put it in the slightly larger front pocket of a business suit. Yet it will still be obvious that I have something in that pocket. I also checked the dimensions of the Tascam recorder, which is a little taller but also thinner. But I think the metal mics of the Tascam will be particularly obvious, especially for someone looking from above (in particular from the stage). Another possibility would be to wear one of those very thin silk scarves one sometimes wear with suits to hide the pocket. Do you think that makes sense or does it sound like the best recipe for getting something absolutely inaudible? Also what about having the recorder inside a (non closed) bag, on my laps?
Any suggestion is welcome as long as the budget remains reasonable and it's simple enough...
Thanks a lot in advance for your kind help!

Offline Belexes

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Re: very simple setup for stealth recording
« Reply #1 on: November 11, 2008, 07:35:52 AM »
I'd enjoy the front row seat and leave the taping to someone else.  The results using internal mics from a shirt pocket from front row may not be worth the hassle.
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Offline it-goes-to-eleven

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Re: very simple setup for stealth recording
« Reply #2 on: November 11, 2008, 09:11:55 AM »
I would like to record a concert that I will be attending in a couple of weeks, sitting in the first row. I have zero experience and would like to work with a very simple setup... I want to enjoy the concert and not to have to be paranoid about being caught and don't want to bother

Let us know how that works out.  I have a very similar dream about skydiving off the empire state building.  I have never skydived before and don't really want to practice in advance.  I just want to take the elevator up and do it right on my first try.  Preferably on the way out to a nice night out on the town.  I figure I can hide the chute under my dinner jacket and just have someone hold it while I do the jump.   I could waste a lot of time searching the archive and reading the countless posts on how experienced people do this but I don't want to bother.  Just jump and pull the cord, right?  I don't want to be paranoid about this either.   I also want to do this on a reasonable budget.

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Offline Brian Skalinder

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Re: very simple setup for stealth recording
« Reply #3 on: November 11, 2008, 09:44:04 AM »
One interpretation of FL's comments...

Taping, particularly stealth, requires commitment and compromises.  If one wants to get a good recording, one can't:  <a> behave the same way one normally would at a concert, <b> expect to do so perfectly without practice, <c> ignore appropriate placement of the mics to achieve the desired results, and <d> expect the desired results (whatever they are) without allocating an appropriate budget.

FWIW, the front row generally doesn't provide very good sound, as someone else noted already.  Answer a few questions to help yourself decide whether it's worth it:

  • What's your budget?
  • With what quality of result would you be happy?  Maybe download a few stealth recordings, maybe made with just the recorder's internal mics, and others with recorder + external head-worn mics, to determine what quality you find acceptable.
  • Are you willing to remain quiet, in a fixed position, for the duration of the concert?
  • What's your willingness to accept risk, for example getting denied enetry or booted out of the venue if caught?
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Offline wannabetaper

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Re: very simple setup for stealth recording
« Reply #4 on: November 11, 2008, 09:58:19 AM »
Thank you Freelunch for your very helpful post. FYI I have already browsed the archive and read zillions of posts about the not great preamps of the mic input of the zoom, about the various microphone possibilities, with or without battery box, etc. On the other hand I have also read that some people were quite happy with the recordings they got by just slipping the zoom in their shirt pocket. But at the end of the day, I still have no idea what would work for me. It's like reading about cars when you have never driven a car yourself.

I think my question is quite simple. I just want to keep some memories of a particular concert, of course I don't expect to get high quality on my first attempt. But I am just wondering if it is worth trying. Belexes said no. At least he answered the question. To make things even more concrete: if I have a zoom in a front pocket, how is it likely to compare with the sound one would get from a low-end to average camcorder that would be pointed directly to the stage? If it is not worse, then that maybe good enough for me...

Update after reading Brian's reply: My budget is that for a zoom or slightly more expensive recorder. I am willing to stay still and keep a jacket even though it will likely be hot but I don't want to take a chance of being caught. I don't think that in this kind of concert people will be checked at the entrance, so it is enough that the recorder is not visible during the concert. Thanks!

Offline J.Maye

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Re: very simple setup for stealth recording
« Reply #5 on: November 11, 2008, 10:39:16 AM »
You might be satisfied with an R-09's internal mics. I think they sound better then a standard camcorder. Download a show and see if it might work for you.
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Re: very simple setup for stealth recording
« Reply #6 on: November 11, 2008, 11:05:28 AM »
If this would be your first experience taping, and if you arn't interested in taping in general since this is a one-off experience, then I (personally) wouldn't.

From a security standpoint, there will be more light on you in the first row (which generally doesn't have very good sound for taping***) then anywhere else in the venue. So your odds of being caught are exponentially higher. So once you mitigate those by conceiling your equipment, the recording that you get out of it, generally isn't worth keeping or listening to again. If it's going to be a fairly large show, consider seeing if anyone else is going that generally stealth tapes and offer to assist in any way they think might be helpful.

So in that light, I think Brian's 3rd and 4th questions are the biggest ones that you should consider, then a 5th would be "what likelyhood do you see yourself taping again". If it's not very much, then I (personally) don't think it is worth the expense and the cost of the experience at the show.

**Orechestral, and other unamplified instruments being the exception.

Disclaimer: I gave up stealth taping and my wife will *never* go to a show again with me if I were going to stealth tape it, it's just not nearly as enjoyable.

Best of luck, take care.
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Offline Belexes

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Re: very simple setup for stealth recording
« Reply #7 on: November 11, 2008, 11:11:27 AM »
Your seat location is troublesome.  Even with an R-09 in your pocket, from the front row it just won't be optimal.  I have downloaded internal mic recordings from Dime and wonder why anyone would bother with the attempt, stealthwise.  If you must tape, I'd move further back in the venue.

Here's a nice-price R-09 in the yard:
http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,112910.0.html

We often see new tapers here that want a good tape, but don't want to sacrifice anything.  You almost have to for good results, meaning sitting further back in the venue, not moving during the performance, and other factors like Brian mentioned.  To me, I think it's all worth it when you get a good capture of one of your favorite perfomers.
« Last Edit: November 11, 2008, 11:19:59 AM by Belexes »
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Offline Church-Audio

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Re: very simple setup for stealth recording
« Reply #8 on: November 11, 2008, 11:20:16 AM »
Hello all,
I would like to record a concert that I will be attending in a couple of weeks, sitting in the first row. I have zero experience and would like to work with a very simple setup... I want to enjoy the concert and not to have to be paranoid about being caught and don't want to bother with fake earplugs mics, glass clipped mics, or stuff like that. I thought about simply putting a zoom H2 in the front pocket of my shirt but after checking the dimensions it looks like it is a little too big and it wouldn't be discreet enough (remember I will be on the first row!). Then I thought, why not put it in the slightly larger front pocket of a business suit. Yet it will still be obvious that I have something in that pocket. I also checked the dimensions of the Tascam recorder, which is a little taller but also thinner. But I think the metal mics of the Tascam will be particularly obvious, especially for someone looking from above (in particular from the stage). Another possibility would be to wear one of those very thin silk scarves one sometimes wear with suits to hide the pocket. Do you think that makes sense or does it sound like the best recipe for getting something absolutely inaudible? Also what about having the recorder inside a (non closed) bag, on my laps?
Any suggestion is welcome as long as the budget remains reasonable and it's simple enough...
Thanks a lot in advance for your kind help!

Take a look at this recorder your not going to find a better deal anywhere and most would agree the r09 is a great recorder.

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nameloc01

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Re: very simple setup for stealth recording
« Reply #9 on: November 11, 2008, 04:23:19 PM »
To be quite honest, seeing as how you don't have any experience or a rig..its gonna be tough for you to pull a recording from the front row. Not to mention, as stated earlier, the sound isn't going to be the best in the front row. If I were you, even though you want a recording of the show, is just enjoy your nice seat and hope someone else is there taping it. You are taking a big chance on being caught and ejected all for (without doing things the "right way" with a somewhat decent rig) for what would probably end up being a - at best,with luck on your side- mediocre tape.

Offline Liquid Drum

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Re: very simple setup for stealth recording
« Reply #10 on: November 11, 2008, 05:37:44 PM »
I would like to record a concert that I will be attending in a couple of weeks, sitting in the first row. I have zero experience and would like to work with a very simple setup... I want to enjoy the concert and not to have to be paranoid about being caught and don't want to bother

Let us know how that works out.  I have a very similar dream about skydiving off the empire state building.  I have never skydived before and don't really want to practice in advance.  I just want to take the elevator up and do it right on my first try.  Preferably on the way out to a nice night out on the town.  I figure I can hide the chute under my dinner jacket and just have someone hold it while I do the jump.   I could waste a lot of time searching the archive and reading the countless posts on how experienced people do this but I don't want to bother.  Just jump and pull the cord, right?  I don't want to be paranoid about this either.   I also want to do this on a reasonable budget.


My thoughts exactly. LOL.

Excellent post.

To the original poster: Don't bother. I have one motto for taping, either do it properly or not at all. If you're half-assed about it, you will not get the result.

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Offline rotorvator

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Re: very simple setup for stealth recording
« Reply #11 on: November 11, 2008, 05:48:31 PM »
Hi there, i am also a newbie on here and would like to record the gigs that i go too for listening again at home. generally we are standing at gigs and need a stealth recorder which will convert / record directly to mp3 format. I have done some internet searches and like the look of the Edirol R-09HR which you guys seem to give a good review on this thread. If i were to buy one of these would i also need to buy external mics to go with it or would the internal mics give me a good recording from say inside a shirt pocket to be played on an Mp3 player. also Is there anywhere where i can listen to a recording made on one of these with and internal mic on this forum??
I look forward to hearing your expert help which will be of great benifit to me.

Offline Liquid Drum

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Re: very simple setup for stealth recording
« Reply #12 on: November 11, 2008, 05:56:15 PM »
Hi there, i am also a newbie on here and would like to record the gigs that i go too for listening again at home. generally we are standing at gigs and need a stealth recorder which will convert / record directly to mp3 format. I have done some internet searches and like the look of the Edirol R-09HR which you guys seem to give a good review on this thread. If i were to buy one of these would i also need to buy external mics to go with it or would the internal mics give me a good recording from say inside a shirt pocket to be played on an Mp3 player. also Is there anywhere where i can listen to a recording made on one of these with and internal mic on this forum??
I look forward to hearing your expert help which will be of great benifit to me.

Why waste money on good external mics/recorder to record in mp3...??
Mics:
AT933/C

Batt-Boxes, Pre-amps:
CA-9100

Recorders:
Edirol R-09
iRiver H120 (CF Modded)
Sony MZ-RH910 Hi-MD

Video: Canon HV20 E

Offline rastasean

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Re: very simple setup for stealth recording
« Reply #13 on: November 11, 2008, 05:58:01 PM »
Hi there, i am also a newbie on here and would like to record the gigs that i go too for listening again at home. generally we are standing at gigs and need a stealth recorder which will convert / record directly to mp3 format. I have done some internet searches and like the look of the Edirol R-09HR which you guys seem to give a good review on this thread. If i were to buy one of these would i also need to buy external mics to go with it or would the internal mics give me a good recording from say inside a shirt pocket to be played on an Mp3 player. also Is there anywhere where i can listen to a recording made on one of these with and internal mic on this forum??
I look forward to hearing your expert help which will be of great benifit to me.

If you want reviews of the HR, start here: http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,100541.0.html

it will tell you everything you need to know.
READ

Don't expect to absorb this shit overnight and don't expect to get great results the first time. don't record anything worthwhile in MP3.
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Offline rotorvator

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Re: very simple setup for stealth recording
« Reply #14 on: November 11, 2008, 05:59:50 PM »
Hi there, i am also a newbie on here and would like to record the gigs that i go too for listening again at home. generally we are standing at gigs and need a stealth recorder which will convert / record directly to mp3 format. I have done some internet searches and like the look of the Edirol R-09HR which you guys seem to give a good review on this thread. If i were to buy one of these would i also need to buy external mics to go with it or would the internal mics give me a good recording from say inside a shirt pocket to be played on an Mp3 player. also Is there anywhere where i can listen to a recording made on one of these with and internal mic on this forum??
I look forward to hearing your expert help which will be of great benifit to me.

Why waste money on good external mics/recorder to record in mp3...??


what is the best format to record in then??? long term i will probably end up listening to the recordings on my ipod so will any other type of recording give me any further benefit

 

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