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Author Topic: Best Preamp for a Neumann SKM184 > ? > Sony PCM D50 setup  (Read 10816 times)

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Offline Fitz

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Best Preamp for a Neumann SKM184 > ? > Sony PCM D50 setup
« on: December 05, 2010, 11:35:21 PM »
Newbie needing advice.

Have a Sony PCM D50 and just picked up a stereo pair of Neumann KM184's and need to put the rest of the puzzle together.  Is there a good synergistic match that I should be aware of?

Thanks
Fitz

Offline sparkey

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Re: Best Preamp for a Neumann SKM184 > ? > Sony PCM D50 setup
« Reply #1 on: December 06, 2010, 12:09:46 AM »
v2 always sounded great with my 184's
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Re: Best Preamp for a Neumann SKM184 > ? > Sony PCM D50 setup
« Reply #2 on: December 06, 2010, 01:28:04 AM »
v2 always sounded great with my 184's

I would concur, I've heard the neumann line with stuff from Sound Devices, Grace Design, and Apogee, and liked the first two.

Newbie needing advice.

Whats your budget?
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Offline sparkey

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Re: Best Preamp for a Neumann SKM184 > ? > Sony PCM D50 setup
« Reply #3 on: December 06, 2010, 10:00:57 AM »
v2 always sounded great with my 184's

With the way things are parked in the Yard Sale right now, you may be able to get one for $500 if you post looking for one.  Everyone needs cash for the holidays and no one is buying....happens every year.
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Offline Big Perm

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Re: Best Preamp for a Neumann SKM184 > ? > Sony PCM D50 setup
« Reply #4 on: December 07, 2010, 09:38:21 PM »
i personally really like the oade pre's with the neumann 184's...............especially the m148
a
Mics: Schoeps mk22>kcy>vst62iu
         Schoeps mk5> KC5> CMC6Ug
         Schoeps CCM 41V, Neumann TLM 107
Pre’s: Sonosax SX-M2D2; Aeta PSP-3, E.A.A. PSP-2,
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Recorder: SD788t, SDMixPre-10t, SD702, Sony m10

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Re: Best Preamp for a Neumann SKM184 > ? > Sony PCM D50 setup
« Reply #5 on: December 07, 2010, 11:53:11 PM »
Another alternative might be an Oade Warm mod UA-5.  That's what Rob Clarke ran for a few years.  I always thought it made a nice pair.  If there is one in the yard sale, you can probably get it cheap.
Mics: Schoeps MK4 & CMC5's / Gefell M200's & M210's / ADK-TL / DPA4061's
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Re: Best Preamp for a Neumann SKM184 > ? > Sony PCM D50 setup
« Reply #6 on: December 08, 2010, 05:01:08 PM »
I have a Littlebox in the YS that would sound great with these mics.  I also use a D50 for the backend and it has made some Nice recordings.  Sorry for the shameless plug.
Microtech Gefell M20's> Nbob KCY> Naiant PFA(60v) > Sound Devices Mixpre-6 @24/48

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Re: Best Preamp for a Neumann SKM184 > ? > Sony PCM D50 setup
« Reply #7 on: December 08, 2010, 05:03:22 PM »
The UA5 doesn't do 24bit with a D50 due to the flag issue!  Unless you plan on running analog out of the UA5.  Just a heads up

Another alternative might be an Oade Warm mod UA-5.  That's what Rob Clarke ran for a few years.  I always thought it made a nice pair.  If there is one in the yard sale, you can probably get it cheap.
Microtech Gefell M20's> Nbob KCY> Naiant PFA(60v) > Sound Devices Mixpre-6 @24/48

-22        -12         -6        TDS     
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Offline mepaca

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Re: Best Preamp for a Neumann SKM184 > ? > Sony PCM D50 setup
« Reply #8 on: December 08, 2010, 07:23:02 PM »
Sound Devices usbpre2 optical out > d50. At 24/96 the sound is so clean it's ridiculous.

Offline Fitz

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Re: Best Preamp for a Neumann SKM184 > ? > Sony PCM D50 setup
« Reply #9 on: December 09, 2010, 08:56:37 PM »
Thanks for the guidence all !!.. My budget is sub $500 is possible.

jmbell, I appreciate the "shameless plug" as the little box is top of mind for me.. I hear that the "Tinybox" would be underpowered and wouldn't work for 184's .but the littlebox should work... One thing I've been told is that the km184 line has an extremely hot output stage and no -10dB attenuator, so, I guess a need a preamp that has enough padding to be able to attenuate the signal for the recorder.  Any thoughts on how the little box would address that?

Thanks again,
Fitz

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Re: Best Preamp for a Neumann SKM184 > ? > Sony PCM D50 setup
« Reply #10 on: December 09, 2010, 11:01:35 PM »
Thanks for the guidence all !!.. My budget is sub $500 is possible.

jmbell, I appreciate the "shameless plug" as the little box is top of mind for me.. I hear that the "Tinybox" would be underpowered and wouldn't work for 184's .but the littlebox should work... One thing I've been told is that the km184 line has an extremely hot output stage and no -10dB attenuator, so, I guess a need a preamp that has enough padding to be able to attenuate the signal for the recorder.  Any thoughts on how the little box would address that?

Thanks again,
Fitz

for a budget of around 500 or less then is the littlebox (a great economical box imho since the ADC on the D50 is generally considered goo), or if you scrimp and save the usbpre2 which would have optical out that the D50 can take (and the ADC in the usbpre2 is the same used in the 7 series recorders). A used Grace Design V2 would be an option if you hunt and save a bit; usually around $600 but sparkey's right, stuff's a buyers market in the YS now.

The 184s are rated at 15mv/pa, I personally wouldn't consider them hot mics necessarily, but if paired with a preamp that has a high minimum gain or a recorder which has a low max line input before clipping rating, they could pose a problem. For example, I'd have zero worry using the usbpre2 because it's max input signal at the ADC stage is something like +25dbu, and the max mic in is still something like +10db. You could blast a good 25db, maybe 30db of gain and still not clip it in most conditions you'll be in. I can't find the max db line input for the D50 so you might investigate that if your pre-amp is going to be an analog only unit. I think it's more then +8dbu, but that's based on other literature and isn't a confirmation. (check the thread in the recorder section, someone may have figured it out)
"This is a common practice we have on the bus; debating facts that we could easily find through printed material. It's like, how far is it today? I think it's four hours, and someone else comes in at 11 hours, and well, then we'll... just... talk about it..." - Jeb Puryear

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Offline Fitz

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Re: Best Preamp for a Neumann SKM184 > ? > Sony PCM D50 setup
« Reply #11 on: December 09, 2010, 11:58:17 PM »
Thanks Page, great infromation, will have to reread it a coupe time to digest it..  I have a beed on a Lunatec V2, is that considered an Analog Pre Amp in your explaination.

Offline Big Perm

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Re: Best Preamp for a Neumann SKM184 > ? > Sony PCM D50 setup
« Reply #12 on: December 10, 2010, 05:06:43 AM »
the V2 is an analog pre-amp.  the V3 has the AD built in the unit
a
Mics: Schoeps mk22>kcy>vst62iu
         Schoeps mk5> KC5> CMC6Ug
         Schoeps CCM 41V, Neumann TLM 107
Pre’s: Sonosax SX-M2D2; Aeta PSP-3, E.A.A. PSP-2,
         Neve Portico 5012, Oade m248
Recorder: SD788t, SDMixPre-10t, SD702, Sony m10

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Re: Best Preamp for a Neumann SKM184 > ? > Sony PCM D50 setup
« Reply #13 on: December 10, 2010, 07:27:14 AM »
My LB does have input transformers, which adds gain.  I can't imagine that you would have a problem with clipping.  I have run it in loud rooms with higher output mics and never ran into problems. 


Thanks for the guidence all !!.. My budget is sub $500 is possible.

jmbell, I appreciate the "shameless plug" as the little box is top of mind for me.. I hear that the "Tinybox" would be underpowered and wouldn't work for 184's .but the littlebox should work... One thing I've been told is that the km184 line has an extremely hot output stage and no -10dB attenuator, so, I guess a need a preamp that has enough padding to be able to attenuate the signal for the recorder.  Any thoughts on how the little box would address that?

Thanks again,
Fitz
Microtech Gefell M20's> Nbob KCY> Naiant PFA(60v) > Sound Devices Mixpre-6 @24/48

-22        -12         -6        TDS     
]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]][}   
]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]][} 
__________________________
|Record|  Runtime: 4:19.99  {|||] 75%

Offline Fitz

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Re: Best Preamp for a Neumann SKM184 > ? > Sony PCM D50 setup
« Reply #14 on: December 11, 2010, 12:02:09 PM »
the V2 is an analog pre-amp.  the V3 has the AD built in the unit
a

I assume AD means Analog/Digital.. How critical is that for a KM184 > pre > D50 configuration..  As a newbie is it worth the extra 300 or 400 to go that route?  Or will I get everything I need from a V2. 

Opinions welcome.  thanks

 

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