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Author Topic: Mixpre-D > M10, best way to set levels.  (Read 7104 times)

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Offline Popmarter

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Mixpre-D > M10, best way to set levels.
« on: March 02, 2012, 03:24:29 AM »
Hi all, just got my new toy (SD Mixpre-D). I have been fooling around with it last night, and wondered what is the best way to set levels in combination with the Sony M10.

The best situation for me would be to be able to set the M10 to a certain level, put some tape over the levelbutton (to prevent accidental movement), put it on record and than put it away deep in my pocket. Not to worry about it anymore. And concentrate on the mixpre-d for accurate levels.

Any comments?
Currently in use:
Recorders: Edirol R44, Sony M10 & Sony D6
Microphones: Milab VM-44 Links (cards), AT853 (cards) & Nakamichi CM300 (all CP-s)
Preamps: JK Laboratories DVC-X-17b, Naiant IPA & Nakamichi MX-100 modded for 9v battery use
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Offline Drgiggles1

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Re: Mixpre-D > M10, best way to set levels.
« Reply #1 on: March 02, 2012, 05:35:01 PM »
On the M10 if going line in put it on level 4, mic in just a hair under 3. The pre will vary depending on the type of show you record.
Mics: CA-14 (o,c,o)
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Offline bryonsos

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Re: Mixpre-D > M10, best way to set levels.
« Reply #2 on: March 02, 2012, 06:35:59 PM »
I set the M10 at 4.5 and adjust my MixPre to get the levels to -12 to -6. It's a pretty hot pre so you'll want to use the pads on the mic for loud shows, or get some inline attenuators. Great clean pre, you're going to love it!
Mics: 3 Zigma Chi HA-FX (COL-251, c, h, o-d, o-f) / Avenson STO-2 / Countryman B3s
Pres: CA-Ugly / Naiant Tinyhead / SD MixPre
Decks: Roland R-44 / Sony PCM-M10
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Offline jbell

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Re: Mixpre-D > M10, best way to set levels.
« Reply #3 on: March 02, 2012, 06:56:00 PM »
I ran an MP-2 for a long time and never needed atteunators!!  It is alittle hotter than the mixpre.
Microtech Gefell M20's> Nbob KCY> Naiant PFA(60V)> Sound Devices Mixpre-6

Offline Popmarter

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Re: Mixpre-D > M10, best way to set levels.
« Reply #4 on: March 03, 2012, 03:39:26 AM »
I set the M10 at 4.5 and adjust my MixPre to get the levels to -12 to -6. It's a pretty hot pre so you'll want to use the pads on the mic for loud shows, or get some inline attenuators. Great clean pre, you're going to love it!

"pads on the mic", you mean the "-20somethingdb" on the mic? (sorry, languagething here). With previous mics I never used that option. I've got Milab VM44-links now that will be connected to this preamp. They do have this option, but again I was not planning on using it as I don't expect i need it.
Currently in use:
Recorders: Edirol R44, Sony M10 & Sony D6
Microphones: Milab VM-44 Links (cards), AT853 (cards) & Nakamichi CM300 (all CP-s)
Preamps: JK Laboratories DVC-X-17b, Naiant IPA & Nakamichi MX-100 modded for 9v battery use
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Offline Popmarter

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Re: Mixpre-D > M10, best way to set levels.
« Reply #5 on: March 03, 2012, 03:43:39 AM »
On the M10 if going line in put it on level 4, mic in just a hair under 3. The pre will vary depending on the type of show you record.

I use line-in all the time. Tried out something with recording sound from speakers in my room, and seems fine.
Currently in use:
Recorders: Edirol R44, Sony M10 & Sony D6
Microphones: Milab VM-44 Links (cards), AT853 (cards) & Nakamichi CM300 (all CP-s)
Preamps: JK Laboratories DVC-X-17b, Naiant IPA & Nakamichi MX-100 modded for 9v battery use
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Offline Popmarter

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Re: Mixpre-D > M10, best way to set levels.
« Reply #6 on: March 03, 2012, 03:48:23 AM »
I set the M10 at 4.5 and adjust my MixPre to get the levels to -12 to -6. It's a pretty hot pre so you'll want to use the pads on the mic for loud shows, or get some inline attenuators. Great clean pre, you're going to love it!

It's really a nice unit, nice lights :) Slightly off-topic, but you probably know. What setting is 'best'/'normal' as it comes to this L/C/R setting. Is it ok to use PAN? This way levels on both mics are the same, or will it destroy any (attempt) on a stereo-image?
Currently in use:
Recorders: Edirol R44, Sony M10 & Sony D6
Microphones: Milab VM-44 Links (cards), AT853 (cards) & Nakamichi CM300 (all CP-s)
Preamps: JK Laboratories DVC-X-17b, Naiant IPA & Nakamichi MX-100 modded for 9v battery use
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Offline bryonsos

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Re: Mixpre-D > M10, best way to set levels.
« Reply #7 on: March 03, 2012, 07:57:00 AM »
I set the M10 at 4.5 and adjust my MixPre to get the levels to -12 to -6. It's a pretty hot pre so you'll want to use the pads on the mic for loud shows, or get some inline attenuators. Great clean pre, you're going to love it!

It's really a nice unit, nice lights :) Slightly off-topic, but you probably know. What setting is 'best'/'normal' as it comes to this L/C/R setting. Is it ok to use PAN? This way levels on both mics are the same, or will it destroy any (attempt) on a stereo-image?

I pan one channel left, the other right. Keeps things simple for later.
Mics: 3 Zigma Chi HA-FX (COL-251, c, h, o-d, o-f) / Avenson STO-2 / Countryman B3s
Pres: CA-Ugly / Naiant Tinyhead / SD MixPre
Decks: Roland R-44 / Sony PCM-M10
GAKables
Dead Muppets

My recordings LMA / BT / TTD

Offline Popmarter

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Re: Mixpre-D > M10, best way to set levels.
« Reply #8 on: March 05, 2012, 05:02:11 AM »
@bryonsos

I taped my first show yesterday, and boy...that mixpre is hot! I used Milab VM-44 link mics > Micpre-d > M10.

The -20db setting on the mic was OFF/not in use

The Mixpre-d gainsetting was very low (i mean, almost off). Resulting in perfect (..?..) levels....the green light were around -18/-12, the louder sections made the last orange led (0db) lid up. Never saw a red one.

The M10 (line-in) was set to gain 7. (which probably could have been higher as levels went up to around -18).

I have not been able to check the wav.file.

But, if i had used the -20db setting on the mic, would that have given me the possibilities to set the levels higher on the mixpre? In other words, I could actually twist these knobs on the pre a bit more (they were very sensitive this time)? Feels a bit strange , taking off 20db and putting it on again.... (sorry bit noob, but first time these mics and pre, have to learn things ;)

« Last Edit: March 05, 2012, 05:09:22 AM by popmarter »
Currently in use:
Recorders: Edirol R44, Sony M10 & Sony D6
Microphones: Milab VM-44 Links (cards), AT853 (cards) & Nakamichi CM300 (all CP-s)
Preamps: JK Laboratories DVC-X-17b, Naiant IPA & Nakamichi MX-100 modded for 9v battery use
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Offline bryonsos

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Re: Mixpre-D > M10, best way to set levels.
« Reply #9 on: March 05, 2012, 11:05:04 AM »
Yes, next time turn the -20db switch on your mics. You should be able to set the MixPre ~11:00 then. You're probably going to want to set the M10 lower too, most folks run them at 4-5. Happy taping, it really is a nice unit!
Mics: 3 Zigma Chi HA-FX (COL-251, c, h, o-d, o-f) / Avenson STO-2 / Countryman B3s
Pres: CA-Ugly / Naiant Tinyhead / SD MixPre
Decks: Roland R-44 / Sony PCM-M10
GAKables
Dead Muppets

My recordings LMA / BT / TTD

Offline Popmarter

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Re: Mixpre-D > M10, best way to set levels.
« Reply #10 on: March 05, 2012, 12:36:34 PM »
Yes, next time turn the -20db switch on your mics. You should be able to set the MixPre ~11:00 then. You're probably going to want to set the M10 lower too, most folks run them at 4-5. Happy taping, it really is a nice unit!

It's a great unit! Really love it. I will use the -20db next time. But as for the recorder....i am confused. If the mixpre remains below 0db (no clipping), is it than not possible to turn the m10 up to near -6db? The levels on the m10 were quite steady (no big peak or whatever, so no risk on clipping there). Or am i missing something here?
Currently in use:
Recorders: Edirol R44, Sony M10 & Sony D6
Microphones: Milab VM-44 Links (cards), AT853 (cards) & Nakamichi CM300 (all CP-s)
Preamps: JK Laboratories DVC-X-17b, Naiant IPA & Nakamichi MX-100 modded for 9v battery use
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Offline bryonsos

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Re: Mixpre-D > M10, best way to set levels.
« Reply #11 on: March 05, 2012, 12:47:35 PM »
Yes, next time turn the -20db switch on your mics. You should be able to set the MixPre ~11:00 then. You're probably going to want to set the M10 lower too, most folks run them at 4-5. Happy taping, it really is a nice unit!

It's a great unit! Really love it. I will use the -20db next time. But as for the recorder....i am confused. If the mixpre remains below 0db (no clipping), is it than not possible to turn the m10 up to near -6db? The levels on the m10 were quite steady (no big peak or whatever, so no risk on clipping there). Or am i missing something here?

Search "unity gain M10" here and you'll find hundreds of opinions on this topic. There's a general consensus that if you set the M10 in the 4-5 range, then the deck is neither adding nor removing gain. It's neutral. In my hands, setting the deck at 4.5 and setting the MixPre so that the levels on the deck are hitting -12 to -6 makes a great tape. Typically, the levels on the MixPre will be just "tickling" past the green lights to get the deck to those levels. It may be different on the MixPre D, but the concept is the same. Set the M10 and tape the knob down if you want, then dial in the wanted levels with the preamp.
Mics: 3 Zigma Chi HA-FX (COL-251, c, h, o-d, o-f) / Avenson STO-2 / Countryman B3s
Pres: CA-Ugly / Naiant Tinyhead / SD MixPre
Decks: Roland R-44 / Sony PCM-M10
GAKables
Dead Muppets

My recordings LMA / BT / TTD

Offline Popmarter

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Re: Mixpre-D > M10, best way to set levels.
« Reply #12 on: March 05, 2012, 01:31:18 PM »
Yes, next time turn the -20db switch on your mics. You should be able to set the MixPre ~11:00 then. You're probably going to want to set the M10 lower too, most folks run them at 4-5. Happy taping, it really is a nice unit!

It's a great unit! Really love it. I will use the -20db next time. But as for the recorder....i am confused. If the mixpre remains below 0db (no clipping), is it than not possible to turn the m10 up to near -6db? The levels on the m10 were quite steady (no big peak or whatever, so no risk on clipping there). Or am i missing something here?

Search "unity gain M10" here and you'll find hundreds of opinions on this topic. There's a general consensus that if you set the M10 in the 4-5 range, then the deck is neither adding nor removing gain. It's neutral. In my hands, setting the deck at 4.5 and setting the MixPre so that the levels on the deck are hitting -12 to -6 makes a great tape. Typically, the levels on the MixPre will be just "tickling" past the green lights to get the deck to those levels. It may be different on the MixPre D, but the concept is the same. Set the M10 and tape the knob down if you want, then dial in the wanted levels with the preamp.

I did not know it stays neutral at that point, thanks for pointing that out.

What do you mean by: "Typically, the levels on the MixPre will be just "tickling" past the green lights to get the deck to those levels." ?
You mean, try getting the green lights burning most of the time at max between -12 and -6? (and a few orange ones every now and than?)
Currently in use:
Recorders: Edirol R44, Sony M10 & Sony D6
Microphones: Milab VM-44 Links (cards), AT853 (cards) & Nakamichi CM300 (all CP-s)
Preamps: JK Laboratories DVC-X-17b, Naiant IPA & Nakamichi MX-100 modded for 9v battery use
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Offline willndmb

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Re: Mixpre-D > M10, best way to set levels.
« Reply #13 on: March 05, 2012, 02:28:00 PM »

Search "unity gain M10" here and you'll find hundreds of opinions on this topic. There's a general consensus that if you set the M10 in the 4-5 range, then the deck is neither adding nor removing gain. It's neutral. In my hands, setting the deck at 4.5 and setting the MixPre so that the levels on the deck are hitting -12 to -6 makes a great tape. Typically, the levels on the MixPre will be just "tickling" past the green lights to get the deck to those levels. It may be different on the MixPre D, but the concept is the same. Set the M10 and tape the knob down if you want, then dial in the wanted levels with the preamp.
fwiw
when i did a white noise test i found that 4 was balls on perfect for unity
going up/down a number added/took away slightly less then 3db
Mics - AKG ck61/ck63 (c480b & Naiant actives), SP-BMC-2
XLR Cables - Silver Path w/Darktrain stubbies
Interconnect Cables - Dogstar (XLR), Darktrain (RCA > 1/8) (1/8 > 1/8), and Kind Kables (1/8f > 1/4)
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Offline Popmarter

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Re: Mixpre-D > M10, best way to set levels.
« Reply #14 on: March 05, 2012, 03:22:36 PM »
That test you did on the line in?
Currently in use:
Recorders: Edirol R44, Sony M10 & Sony D6
Microphones: Milab VM-44 Links (cards), AT853 (cards) & Nakamichi CM300 (all CP-s)
Preamps: JK Laboratories DVC-X-17b, Naiant IPA & Nakamichi MX-100 modded for 9v battery use
https://archive.org/search.php?query=taper%3A%22Popmarter%22

 

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