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Author Topic: Recording Level Diffs between Edirol R-09 & Roland R-05? Distortion?  (Read 3834 times)

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Offline borntolose

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Hi,

For several years I have been recording gigs using the Edirol R-09 with a single point stereo mix plugged into the line in via a battery box (mic and battery box from mIcrophone Madness in the US). I would usually recording using the setting level 8 with no problems whatsoever. I replaced everything when I began having problems with the recordings only comig out with one channel and upgraded to the Roland R-05 (I would have bought another R-O9 if it hadn't been discontinued). I have since noticed that, despite using the same settings (Low mix gain, limiter and low cut off, plug in power off etc), you have to use a high input level to get a similar level on the recording and also that on some recordings there is some distortion on vocals despite the level being nowhere near maxed out. Are there any known differences between these 2 recording units that would result in this problem, or could there be a problem with the mic? It is the same design of mic from Microphone Madness.

Offline bombdiggity

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Re: Recording Level Diffs between Edirol R-09 & Roland R-05? Distortion?
« Reply #1 on: August 08, 2013, 01:41:31 AM »
By the specs the R-05 is a considerably better unit than the R-09.  Have you replaced the batteries in the batt box recently? 

I'd expect the levels to be different between different units.  I have an R-05 and tend to set the nominal level pretty high even using a preamp to go line in.  If you're over 50 or so on the nominal levels you may need a preamp with this unit instead of a battery box.  Using a battery box you may need to go mic in rather than line in (which may have a slight impact on fidelity, though I doubt enough to really hear). 
Gear:
Audio:
Schoeps MK4V
Nak CM-100/CM-300 w/ CP-1's or CP-4's
SP-CMC-25
>
Oade C mod R-44  OR
Tinybox > Sony PCM-M10 (formerly Roland R-05) 
Video: Varied, with various outboard mics depending on the situation

Offline yates7592

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Re: Recording Level Diffs between Edirol R-09 & Roland R-05? Distortion?
« Reply #2 on: August 08, 2013, 04:02:41 AM »
I'm probably telling you what you already know, but to avoid confusion, level 8 on the R09 is around unity (range 0-30-ish?), but on the R05 unity it is more like 40 (range 0-80). So of course you will need higher 'numbers' on the R05 to get the same level as the R09. But the R09 takes a much hotter signal than the R05 without distorting.

Offline borntolose

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Re: Recording Level Diffs between Edirol R-09 & Roland R-05? Distortion?
« Reply #3 on: August 13, 2013, 05:58:57 PM »
But the R09 takes a much hotter signal than the R05 without distorting.

Oh, really? That's not very good is it? So basically the Roland unit isn't much good for recording gigs then? Why would they replace the Edirol with a unit that can't handle volume as well, but offers high sampling rates? One step forward, two steps back surely...?

Offline bombdiggity

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Re: Recording Level Diffs between Edirol R-09 & Roland R-05? Distortion?
« Reply #4 on: August 16, 2013, 11:10:40 AM »
But the R09 takes a much hotter signal than the R05 without distorting.

Oh, really? That's not very good is it? So basically the Roland unit isn't much good for recording gigs then? Why would they replace the Edirol with a unit that can't handle volume as well, but offers high sampling rates? One step forward, two steps back surely...?

I've never had an issue with the R-05 overloading, whether going plug-in, battery box or preamp.  I've used it on some loud shows, though my normal ones are pretty quiet.  The levels on the meters reflect what I see in editing the result.  Typically if the levels look OK but you're getting clipping it's the mics.  I don't think the limiter works well but you're not using that so that shouldn't be an issue. 

By most objective measures the R05 is an improvement relative to the R-09:

http://www.avisoft.com/recordertests.htm

YMMV. 


Gear:
Audio:
Schoeps MK4V
Nak CM-100/CM-300 w/ CP-1's or CP-4's
SP-CMC-25
>
Oade C mod R-44  OR
Tinybox > Sony PCM-M10 (formerly Roland R-05) 
Video: Varied, with various outboard mics depending on the situation

Offline Gutbucket

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Re: Recording Level Diffs between Edirol R-09 & Roland R-05? Distortion?
« Reply #5 on: October 23, 2013, 05:06:36 PM »
I'm probably telling you what you already know, but to avoid confusion, level 8 on the R09 is around unity (range 0-30-ish?), but on the R05 unity it is more like 40 (range 0-80). So of course you will need higher 'numbers' on the R05 to get the same level as the R09. But the R09 takes a much hotter signal than the R05 without distorting.

On the original R-09 (not HR) 8 is the minimum input gain below which you will brickwall the input with a hot input, but 10 is a safer setting and was my personal 'not go below' threshold setting.  I typically left both R-09s set at 13 but didn't worry about it as long as it was in the 10-17ish range.

I've never used the R-05.
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