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Author Topic: fave cdr  (Read 15930 times)

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Offline DSatz

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Re: fave cdr
« Reply #30 on: January 11, 2020, 07:29:11 PM »
Some further notes: Since I no longer have a Plextor drive (which came with special software for bit-accurate DAE), I'm using "Exact Audio Copy" to extract the WAV files from the audio CDs. The program generally works well, except that it seems to be oriented entirely toward "ripping" commercially-available CDs. It continually compares the checksums of my tracks with entries in a remote database, and its responses depend on whether there's a match between my tracks and anything in that database; of course my tracks are never there, except for an occasional "false positive". I wish that I could turn that feature off, but I don't see any way to do so. It also results in the checksums of my tracks being added to that database, which only increases other peoples' rates of "false positives".

Apparently the only tech support for EAC was on a Yahoo user forum, but it is closed now because Yahoo has left that business, and I don't see any replacement for it.

--I used to be concerned about the "timing problems" that the program reports, but am less so now. After one extraction had slowed down noticeably and five or six such "problems" were reported in one track, I cleaned the disc, renamed the extract file, and ran that track again. This time the extraction happened at full speed, and only one "timing problem" was reported. I then did a binary file comparison with the previous extraction, and it was bit-identical throughout.

--best regards
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Offline voltronic

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Re: fave cdr
« Reply #31 on: January 12, 2020, 07:58:13 AM »
DSatz,

AccurateRip is only one component of EAC.  Over the years, I have used it to rip primarily classical CDs, also which often are not in the database.  I don't use that component.

The primary benefit of EAC is that it will read the same sector multiple times if necessary to recover information other programs might read incorrectly or simply report as an error.  That is often why EAC is slower than other ripping programs; it is attempting to be more thorough.
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Offline DSatz

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Re: fave cdr
« Reply #32 on: January 13, 2020, 06:20:12 AM »
Are you able to disconnect or disable the "AccurateRip" aspect of EAC? How, if so?

By now I've used EAC with a long succession of different CD-R, DVD-R and BD-R drives; it behaves rather differently depending on the type of drive you use it with. What I find excellent is the way it susses out the precise capabilities of each type, and takes strategic advantage of whatever capabilities you give it to work with. It's still most efficient, of course, with drives that are well designed for accurate "ripping" of CD audio in the first place.

--best regards
music > microphones > a recorder of some sort

Offline heathen

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Re: fave cdr
« Reply #33 on: January 13, 2020, 09:09:57 AM »
Are you able to disconnect or disable the "AccurateRip" aspect of EAC? How, if so?

By now I've used EAC with a long succession of different CD-R, DVD-R and BD-R drives; it behaves rather differently depending on the type of drive you use it with. What I find excellent is the way it susses out the precise capabilities of each type, and takes strategic advantage of whatever capabilities you give it to work with. It's still most efficient, of course, with drives that are well designed for accurate "ripping" of CD audio in the first place.

--best regards

I believe it's "EAC" menu > "Drive Options" > "Offset/Speed" > "Use AccurateRip with this drive"
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Offline DSatz

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Re: fave cdr
« Reply #34 on: January 13, 2020, 03:44:30 PM »
Hey, yes, it's there of all places. Many thanks; I would never have found it, since there's no logical connection between this functionality and the drive that I'm using.
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Offline seethreepo

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Re: fave cdr
« Reply #35 on: May 21, 2020, 11:17:01 PM »
Thanks for the Rima link. 
ordered enough cdrs to keep me going till the end.  (of time, of me, of music as we know it. )
. Turns out end of time /cds was 2019 when I bought a new car sans CD player

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Offline voltronic

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Re: fave cdr
« Reply #36 on: May 22, 2020, 11:29:13 AM »
Thanks for the Rima link. 
ordered enough cdrs to keep me going till the end.  (of time, of me, of music as we know it. )
. Turns out end of time /cds was 2019 when I bought a new car sans CD player

My new car that I bought last year also was the first without a CD player.  I must say I haven't played a CD once in the 4 previous cars that had them, though.

The only optical discs I am buying now are BD-R, which I use for backups since hard drives are unreliable for long-term storage.
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Offline DSatz

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Re: fave cdr
« Reply #37 on: June 09, 2020, 06:32:37 AM »
After a couple of months of other activities, I'm back to transferring the remainder of my CD-Rs and DVD-Rs. It's still going well. I had many more of these things than I'd realized! The collected data is approaching 2 TB now.

- As a comment on "Exact Audio Copy": When it reports occasional "timing errors" during a transfer, I've learned not to be too concerned. As an experiment, with several different discs that had such errors, I've taken the extracted data, then cleaned the discs very thoroughly and run them again (usually getting far fewer if any such errors), then compared the data. So far I haven't found any differences in the actual, recovered data. Of course this could be player-dependent, so YMMV.

- As a further report on media longevity: In addition to the old (green dye) TDK and (gold dye) Kodak holding up the best among the CD-R types that I used, TDK DVD-Rs have been the real "sweet spot" in the collection. Of course they're all data discs, so their contents are transferable without the need for DAE ("ripping"), plus they're inherently much faster to read. They've been rock-solid reliable, with maybe one exception that I fortunately had a redundant copy of.

For certain purposes a somewhat obsessive personality can be an asset, even if it's not considered "cool" socially ...

--best regards
« Last Edit: June 09, 2020, 06:49:36 AM by DSatz »
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Offline heathen

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Re: fave cdr
« Reply #38 on: June 09, 2020, 09:53:46 AM »
I recently finished transferring all my old shn CD-R backups to my hard drive and I didn't have any problems with any of the discs!  Most are the higher quality CD-Rs, but some were run-of-the-mill stuff I probably picked up because there was a good deal.
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Offline voltronic

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Re: fave cdr
« Reply #39 on: June 09, 2020, 10:24:11 AM »
I keep telling people that well cared-for optical discs are going to be more reliable over the long term than hard drives...
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Offline WiFiJeff

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Re: fave cdr
« Reply #40 on: June 09, 2020, 11:51:05 PM »
I keep telling people that well cared-for optical discs are going to be more reliable over the long term than hard drives...

I'd like to believe that.  I also have been spending a lot of isolation time transferring things from CD-R to files, from before I started to archive high resolution files in 2015.  Most of my burns from 15-20 years ago seem fine (except where a disc cracked, or was, I suspect, never correctly burned - copies I sent friends have made up the lacunae).  But I also tried to transfer some CD-Rs from the '90s that I purchased from Truesound Transfers, they did very nice and honest digital transfers of early cylinders and shellacs.  I am finding that most of these are now totally unreadable.  I noticed one or two dying several years back, and got no satisfactory reply from the German company, not even to my offer to repurchase these items now deleted from their catalog.  I am only regretting not ripping them immediately back when I bought them.  I have saved the CDs (with paper labels, maybe the glue did this?) hoping to find something that can read them, but none of my three ripping DVD/BluRay drives nor any CD player from ancient times can get anything.  Rats.

Jeff

Offline voltronic

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Re: fave cdr
« Reply #41 on: June 10, 2020, 09:04:01 AM »
I keep telling people that well cared-for optical discs are going to be more reliable over the long term than hard drives...

I'd like to believe that.  I also have been spending a lot of isolation time transferring things from CD-R to files, from before I started to archive high resolution files in 2015.  Most of my burns from 15-20 years ago seem fine (except where a disc cracked, or was, I suspect, never correctly burned - copies I sent friends have made up the lacunae).  But I also tried to transfer some CD-Rs from the '90s that I purchased from Truesound Transfers, they did very nice and honest digital transfers of early cylinders and shellacs.  I am finding that most of these are now totally unreadable.  I noticed one or two dying several years back, and got no satisfactory reply from the German company, not even to my offer to repurchase these items now deleted from their catalog.  I am only regretting not ripping them immediately back when I bought them.  I have saved the CDs (with paper labels, maybe the glue did this?) hoping to find something that can read them, but none of my three ripping DVD/BluRay drives nor any CD player from ancient times can get anything.  Rats.

Jeff

That's sad to hear.  I wonder if it is just a case of the recording media that company used was not the best?  I think the oldest CD-R discs I have are some TDK's from the mid-90s, which still work.

Here's just one of several studies that subjected different discs to a torture test, and found that the chemical composition of the layers made a significant difference:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4849567/

Regardless - in general, optical media is going to be stable for much longer than any magnetic media, and with hard drives you have to consider the likelihood of mechanical failure on top of that.  I can reliably read optical backups from 20-25 years ago.  I don't have any hard drives that old to compare against, but my experience as a PC repair tech tells me they aren't going to hang on that long.  Not only that, anything that old is probably an IDE drive, or maybe SCSI if it's an enterprise-class drive.  You would need to purchase an adapter card to even access it.  External hard drives are probably a worse prospect.  They run in a small, poorly-ventilated enclosure, are often oriented vertically (more stress on all moving parts), and are moved around making them more likely to get bumped, dropped, etc.
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I am hitting my head against the walls, but the walls are giving way.    ///    If a composer could say what he had to say in words he would not bother trying to say it in music.
- Gustav Mahler

Offline WiFiJeff

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Re: fave cdr
« Reply #42 on: June 10, 2020, 10:42:37 AM »
I am backing up in triplicate.  I have an older laptop, and cloning my so-far 2 TB of rips takes several hours. When I am done, an optical backup to BluRay (likely to run 4 TB or 200 disks, I have not tried the larger multi-layer ones and the few DVD fails I've had have been double layer 8GB ones) is possible.  A backup to playable CDs would take months and swamp my storage areas.

For the moment optical drives are easy to find, but as we discovered trying to gift a nephew (in the tech industry!) with a music CD, people don't have access to them anymore.  He refused the gift, even his home computer didn't have an optical drive.  I have multiple players for my Edison cylinders and acoustic-era 78s, but I have to repair them myself, and have done so for simple issues.  Not sure any of us is ready to fix an optical drive or would be able to find the parts even if we were capable.

Backing up to Edison cylinders is a fun idea.  It might use all the free storage area in Manhattan, but they have lasted 120 years, even if the recordable blanks tend to be somewhat fragile!


Jeff

Offline DavidPuddy

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Re: fave cdr
« Reply #43 on: June 10, 2020, 10:51:03 AM »
Can anyone recommend a good BluRay writeable drive? My Mac does not have a cd drive. Thanks
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Offline jb63

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Re: fave cdr
« Reply #44 on: June 10, 2020, 12:43:44 PM »
I've had to do with whatever was available at the local stores and always looked for the bargain sales and bought spool after spool in the last 10 years. Mainly DVR because 24/96 archiving doesn't help your budget. I've spent a lot of the quarantine running tape units, hard drives, etc trying to get the stuff done that there never seemed time for. I've found that MOST of the CDRs will still rip no matter how old they are or what brand. Had no problems with DVDR at all.

the only problem I have discovered is when labels were applied to the CDRs they warped them over time and the data is unreadable.

i wish there were a Reader that could read them. I'd buy it in a heartbeat. I've found putting them in the freezer for 10 mins can sometimes get me a few tracks. I've not found a reliable way to get the labels OFF and still save the disc, but I've found that sometimes that unreadable labeled disc will play just fine in the car. WTF.

Anyway, the best CDRs I ever bought were Gold Mitsui CDRs from antiquated internet sources. They made silver ones, too, that have a great top surface for sharpies and can take a beating on the burning side.
this is definitely not normal

 

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