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Author Topic: AT853 > CA9200 3Wire > DR2D or R09HR volume setting advices  (Read 1888 times)

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Offline MLKLuke

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AT853 > CA9200 3Wire > DR2D or R09HR volume setting advices
« on: February 16, 2014, 03:41:38 PM »
hi there,
here is my taping rig:

AT853 (both terminating into Mini-XLR 3 pin connectors) > 2x Mini-XLR 3 pin female to 1x MiniXLR 5 pin breakout cable > CA-9200 3Wire with 4.7k mod siwtch > DR2D or R09HR

I've been told to keep the levels on the recorder @ -12 to be safe and to avoid loss of dynamics or saturation

That said, I've got a couple of questions:

- is it better to keep CA9200 @+10 or +15db with 4.7k mod switch ON and then play with recorder's line-in volume to keep the levels @ -12 or is better to leave recorder's line-in volume fixed and then play with CA-9200 levels (with 4.7k mod switch ON) to keep them @ -12?

- in case it is better to leave recorder's line-in levels fixed, which is the best setting for R09HR (I read about +35 being "unity gain" for it) and DR2D?

thanks a lot

Luca
« Last Edit: February 16, 2014, 04:07:06 PM by MLKLuke »
MLK - Luke
Mics: Schoeps MK4+Nbob Actives / AT853 (H,C,SC) / DPA 4061
Power: Tinybox v2.5 / 3-Wire BBox / CA-9200 3W / CA-UBB
Recorders: R05 / R09HR / Pocketrak C24 / Tascam DR2D
My Recordings

Offline fmaderjr

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Re: AT853 > CA9200 3Wire > DR2D or R09HR volume setting advices
« Reply #1 on: February 16, 2014, 05:03:07 PM »
1) Start out with the recorder's level set at the recorders' unity gain setting.  I know nothing about the DR 2nd, but the R09HR's unity gain is around 38-40. Setting an HR at -12 and bringing up the levels to the -12 to -6 dB range with the CA-9200 is a huge mistake. The recorder's levels will look fine, but you will have to crank up the CA-9200 so high that there's a good chance you will likely cause Ca-9200 itself to to clip and you will never know it until you listen to the recording (or are monitoring with headphones). Never set any recorder's levels way below unity gain and bring the levels way up with a preamp.

2) What you set the CA-9200 to depends on how loud the band is, but unless the band is excruciatingly loud you can normally start out by setting the CA-9200 to +25 dB with the output knob at 100% (since the 4.7 mod reduces the output to the recorder by approximately 10-12 dB). As long as your recorder is set to unity gain, the meters on your recorder will tell you if you need to raise or lower the CA-9200's gain setting.  If you don't get adequate levels at +25, try +30 and if still not adequate +35. If the meters don't indicate going over - 0 dB, your recording will not be clipped. However, if you set the R09HR well below unity gain, you can easily get a clipped recording even though the recorder's meters stay below 0dB.  You can also make minor level adjustments down with the CA-9200's volume control. Just don't make major adjustments with the volume control to keep the levels from going over 0 dB or again you might cause your CA-9200 to clip and the recorder's meters won't warn you.

I've recorded a fairly loud (but not super loud) band with the following settings: AT853's (Cardioiods,) > mini-XLR CA9200 (4.7 mod on) set at +30 with the volume control eventually turned down to 75% > Edirol R09HR set at 38 with the mics about 10 feet from the band's speakers. I got a great sounding recording with peaks about -3 to -5 which is a little closer to 0 DB than I prefer to be. It would have been safer to have the CA-9200 at +25 dB (and turn the volume control down a little bit if necessary).
« Last Edit: February 17, 2014, 11:27:57 AM by fmaderjr »
AT853's (all caps)/CM-300 Franken Naks (CP-1,2,3)/JBMod Nak 700's (CP-701,702) > Tascam DR-680
Or Sonic Studios DSM-6 > M10

Offline MLKLuke

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Re: AT853 > CA9200 3Wire > DR2D or R09HR volume setting advices
« Reply #2 on: February 16, 2014, 08:02:01 PM »
so basically the rule is:

set recorder's levels at its supposed "unity gain" and then manage with preamp's settings to get the right levels on recorder's display

isn't it?

anyone about DR2D line-in unity gain (probably 100)?
MLK - Luke
Mics: Schoeps MK4+Nbob Actives / AT853 (H,C,SC) / DPA 4061
Power: Tinybox v2.5 / 3-Wire BBox / CA-9200 3W / CA-UBB
Recorders: R05 / R09HR / Pocketrak C24 / Tascam DR2D
My Recordings

Offline fmaderjr

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Re: AT853 > CA9200 3Wire > DR2D or R09HR volume setting advices
« Reply #3 on: February 17, 2014, 02:14:18 AM »
so basically the rule is:
set recorder's levels at its supposed "unity gain" and then manage with preamp's settings to get the right levels on recorder's display
isn't it?

Correct. And you can raise the recorder's levels a bit above unity gain at the end if you need to to get proper levels, but I think you should never set the recorder's levels below unity gain. I don't think there's any reason to do this and if the levels are set well below unity gain, the preamp may have to have its gain cranked up so much that the preamp itself distorts.
AT853's (all caps)/CM-300 Franken Naks (CP-1,2,3)/JBMod Nak 700's (CP-701,702) > Tascam DR-680
Or Sonic Studios DSM-6 > M10

adrianf74

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Re: AT853 > CA9200 3Wire > DR2D or R09HR volume setting advices
« Reply #4 on: February 17, 2014, 11:07:27 AM »
fmadejr's got it all right.  Set the decks to unity and drive the mics with the preamp - always the best way to go.

I had a DR-2D for a few weeks.  Unity via Line-In is around 95-96 (never go LOWER than that).  Mic-In unity is around 67-68 (again, don't go lower than that).   That's assuming you're using Mic-In as a second line-level input from a preamp and not PIP.


 

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